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Huawei Unveils AI Mobile Chipset Said To Rival A11 Processor In Upcoming iPhones (macrumors.com)

Posted by BeauHD on from the neural-processing-unit dept.

On Saturday, Chinese mobile maker Huawei unveiled its first artificial intelligence smartphone chipset, which it hopes will lure customers away from Apple's upcoming range of new iPhones and towards the Asian company's "most powerful handset yet," the Mate 10, which is set to debut next month. Mac Rumors reports: Huawei touted the Kirin 970 AI mobile chipset's built-in "neural processing unit" at the IFA consumer electronics trade show in Berlin, claiming that the technology is "20 times faster" than a traditional processor. The world's third largest smartphone maker claimed that mobile devices powered by the Kirin 970 will be able to "truly know and understand their users," by supporting real-time image recognition, voice interaction, and intelligent photography with ease. According to Nikkei, the Kirin 970 integrates 5.5 billion transistors in a single square centimeter about the size of a thumbnail, which includes an octa-core central processing unit, a 12-core graphics processing unit, a dual-image signal processor, a high-speed 1.2Gbps Cat.18 modem, and AI mobile computing architecture. The Kirin 970 is said to be based on the same 10-nanometer technology as Apple's existing A10X Fusion processor and the A11 processor that will power its new iPhone range, set to debut this month. The Mate 10 is said to be a bezel-less all-screen handset with a 6-inch, 2:1 display and a 2,160 x 1,080 resolution. Like Apple's so-called "iPhone 8," the Mate 10 is also expected to feature some form of facial recognition and improved cameras.

77 comments

  1. And all this tech... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will just be leveraged against the user to better spy on you.

    1. Re: And all this tech... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Huawei couldn't find its ass with both hands.

    2. Re:And all this tech... by thereitis · · Score: 1

      I think so, too. Once you've done all this processing on the phone and identified people, places, things, ... all that needs to be transferred to the mothership is the metadata.

    3. Re: And all this tech... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True, but they'll have no trouble finding yours.

    4. Re: And all this tech... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So what? Itll be cheaper and more profitable, thus doubleplus goodie good!

  2. It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    And for extra security, it comes in ANDROID!

    1. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'd rather have the chinese spy on me than my own government.

    2. Re: It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah. Probably arm is a gchq Front. British spytech now spread all over the globe.

    3. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why a Chinese spy would be worse than an american spy? I would hope that they at least aren't that much of social justice warriors.

    4. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by ewibble · · Score: 0

      I never thought about that but you are probably right. I say or do nothing of any national significance but the likely hood of the my government trying to control my actions is probably higher than a foreign ones.

    5. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Shoten · · Score: 0

      I'd rather have the chinese spy on me than my own government.

      You must not have much of a basis for comparison, then. See what they do to the people they disagree with. In particular, check out the organ harvesting...it's a hoot.

      --

      For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
    6. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What makes you think the Chinese wouldn't sell that info to info brokers and that it ends up in NSA/GCHQ anyway?

    7. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1, Interesting

      I'd rather have the chinese spy on me than my own government.

      You must not have much of a basis for comparison, then.

      Americans are four times more likely to be arrested and imprisoned by their government compared to Chinese.

    8. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course the Chinese already are in jail!

    9. Re: It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      So we should be using Atom devices because they are 'armless?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    10. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Shaddap whiny nazi faggot. We're going to kill all of you in the next few years.

    11. Re: It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good luck with that, son.

    12. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That is still 2-step process before the "free world" spying agencies get to the data, as opposed to 1-step process. Bigger number is better, 2 is better than 1.

      But whatever, most users are always connected to facebooks, twitters, googles and other spying apps anyway. It makes no difference if the hardware is chinese or ussian.

    13. Re:It's like a Chinese spy in your pocket! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And for extra security, it comes in ANDROID!

      In cyber Soviet Russia, Android comes in YOU!

  3. Nice to see competition. by saloomy · · Score: 2

    This will keep Apple on their toes to further push the A** line of processors, as well as Qualcomm, Samsung, and the other Android chipset makers. I like competition.

    1. Re:Nice to see competition. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is it really competition when the technology is 'borrowed without permission', as Huawei is known to do?

    2. Re:Nice to see competition. by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Huawei believes in the old adage "it is better to beg for forgiveness* than to ask for permission".

      *In a Chinese court, if possible.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    3. Re: Nice to see competition. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Based on prior Huawei flagships, unfortunately no real competition. I assume it comes with the same noise cancelling microphone issues that cripple phone calls, the same extraordinarily obtuse and incompetent warranty support (where your phone gets returned with additional damage in addition to warranty issues being unresolved, repeatedly, after a lengthy wait), and other as-yet-unknown Easter eggs.

      In addition to the Chinese spying.

    4. Re:Nice to see competition. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly like apple and the University of Wisconsin? To not consider apple just a big a thief is just plain stupid.

    5. Re:Nice to see competition. by arglebargle_xiv · · Score: 2

      I doubt it. If you read the specs, its just a generic mobile phone CPU/baseband as made by any number of other vendors. The "AI" is pure marketing, it's no more, or less, "AI" than a Z80. All this is saying is that just as Apple, Samsung, etc brought their processors in-house, so Huawei is doing it too.

    6. Re: Nice to see competition. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Huawei's impressiive incompetence and treachery aside , there is still the fact that their underperforming crap heap will have to run Android, compounding matters further. But at least Android works spying on you.

    7. Re:Nice to see competition. by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      *In a Chinese court, if possible.

      Now that lingchi has been abolished, they hope it to be the better option?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    8. Re:Nice to see competition. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      I seriously doubt that this will push Apple on their Ax processors for three reasons. This design won't push Apple any more than what is already out there. For starters, Apple's ambitions for their processors is more about control of their own fate than anything else. When they had to rely on Samsung for designs, they were getting generic mobile device designs with a few customizations. As a chipmaker, the Samsungs and Qualcomms of the world design chips that fit a wide variety of profiles because that would lead to more sales as opposed to customized designs for one customer. Getting something customized just for them would cost Apple a lot of money and few rewards. Designing their own would require getting the chip design expertise they didn't have. That took years and several acquisitions.

      Second, while the article hints that Huawei's newest processor would rival the A11, how would they know? Apple is pretty secretive when it comes to many things. Performance of their newest chip is one of them until it is released. This new chips could beat easily it, be on par with it, or eclipsed by it. No one can really know until the A11 is released. Since Apple doesn't sell their processors to 3rd parties, the only way to get one is to get a new Apple device which isn't out yet. So there isn't any competition when Apple refuses to sell to anyone else

      Lastly, my understanding of Apple's customers is that few of them care at all which chip powers their devices. Few of them could name the chip much less tell you anything about it. For all they know, the device works for them or it doesn't. Very few Apple customers are going to switch to Huawei because Huawei has a new chip.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    9. Re:Nice to see competition. by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      From what I can tell the SoC with 4 Cortex-A73 cores at 2.40 GHz and 4 Cortex-A53 cores at 1.80 GHz paired with ARM Mali-G72MP12 GPU. So other than a "neural net" that is claimed in the SoC, it seems like just the newest iteration of ARM cores. From what I can tell, there's nothing customized about the cores. Now some of their claims are possibly true but meaningless. For example, could it beat some existing Samsung and Qualcomm SoCs? Sure if you are comparing last year models and older, less powerful cores. I'd like to see a comparison with the Snapdragon 835 which uses 4 modified 4 Cortex-A73s.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  4. It Chinese by Sla$hPot · · Score: 0

    It doesn't belong in the free world

    1. Re: It Chinese by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mod parent up!

    2. Re:It Chinese by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't belong in the free world

      Are you talking about the "free world" where the NSA spies constantly on just about everyone?

  5. Re:Boycot All Chinese Junk! BAN THEM! by Sla$hPot · · Score: 0

    Where is the like button?

  6. It's from macrumour.com by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And yet, there really isn't a rumour, or a mac in it?

  7. NPU - The First Neuron by UrbanMonk · · Score: 2

    I'm not sure how NPUs are implemented, my guess is you have an array of gates like a FPGA that can recompile itself creating a new netlist. In effect, a cpu that is able to evolve and learn when given feedback - the first neuron. Any phDs here?

    1. Re:NPU - The First Neuron by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'm not sure how NPUs are implemented, my guess is you have an array of gates like a FPGA

      Most likely it is a FinFET ASIC with local memory and lots of FP16, FP12, and/or FP8 multipliers for doing matrix ops. That is what Google's TPU is, and this is targeted to the same apps (deep NNs).

  8. Re: Nobody buys phones with Chinese chipsets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most probably less bugged than arm, Linux, Windows, Intel stuff. See Snowden...

  9. Is this news because it is mobile? by RatPh!nk · · Score: 1

    There are already AI processors that are many times faster than a traditional microprocessor.

    Google rattles the tech world with a new AI chip for all

    and

    Intel’s AI Chip Available in a USB Stick

    --
    Argh. The laws of science be a harsh mistress.
  10. Indeed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It âoerivalsâ (copies) it so well the names are even similar. Apple should wake up and have it products manufactured in countries that donâ(TM)t steal its intellectual property. In the long run it would actually save money.

  11. Fuck Huawei by Gaygirlie · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I got a Huawei-tablet when it was new, since it had perfectly good specs for my needs and it wasn't outrageously expensive (1920x1200 IPS display, 2GB RAM, SD-card slot, stereo speakers, and it even has LTE-support) The hardware is still plenty good, but the tablet itself has only gotten ONE update in the couple of years that I've owned it now, and it's still stuck on Android Lollipop 5.1. The tablet has received an update to Android Marshmallow elsewhere in Europe, but when I asked their support for when the update arrives to the Nordic countries the support literally answered that they have absolutely no plans, whatsoever, to provide the update! They have all the software and everything already, they'd just need to bother doing the text-translations, but they rather leave people on an outdated Android-version and completely abandon the devices rather than spend some time and money on supplying a Nordic-version of the update!

    I would not recommend anyone spend money on a company this shitty; you'll never know if they'll abandon your devices next!

    1. Re:Fuck Huawei by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      They probably also need to the get update validated by the cell networks in your country, since "it even has LTE-support"
      Another reason could be the version you have has different hardware than the ones that have been updated to Android 6. I know Samsung does it often, the same phone has two different chips in it depending on region, usually for cell network compatibility.

    2. Re:Fuck Huawei by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

      Nope, it's exact same hardware. Also, they said they have no plans of providing the update at all -- validation or no validation, they're not going to bother. Elsewhere in Europe they received the update at the beginning of the year, so Huawei's already had plenty of time to work on it, too.

    3. Re:Fuck Huawei by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      So connect with WiFi over a VPN to a country they provide updates to?
      It might even work by just changing your DNS servers http://whatismyipaddress.com/s...

      I just find it hard to believe they've gone out of their way and expended time and effort (read: spent money) to block updates for specific regions for absolutely no reason.

    4. Re:Fuck Huawei by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah well, what's the difference between Huawei and Samsung?

      I've vetoed buying any more Samsung products until they start supporting their hardware in the same manner.

    5. Re: Fuck Huawei by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have to agree that they're bad at support, but with a custom rom, Huawei devices are as fast as and much cheaper than competitors.

    6. Re:Fuck Huawei by jeremyp · · Score: 1

      Presumably, since he mentioned translation, he'd like the OS in his native language.

      --
      All I want is a secure system where it's easy to do anything I want. Is that too much to ask ~~ Randall Munroe
    7. Re: Fuck Huawei by dnaumov · · Score: 2

      Ummm, no. I work for a large Nordic mobile carrier and the delusion that you need to "certify" a device before allowing it onto a mobile network is a US-only thing. We don't do that and neither does any other mobile carrier in my country.

    8. Re:Fuck Huawei by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      From what I can find, they only ever released Lollipop for the 10" MediaPad T2. No Marshmellow. They did for the 8" model, which is completely different hardware.

      It's the only Huawei tablet that matches your specifications of 1920x1200 with 2GB RAM and LTE
      http://consumer.huawei.com/en/...

      Looks like they also made several hardware versions of this as well. I can see references to FDR-A01W and FDR-A01L

    9. Re:Fuck Huawei by guacamole · · Score: 1

      Lenovo and Huawei have a poor reputation like that. Surely, their hardware has good price performance ratio, but the post-sales support is pretty poor. Often one major firmware update is all you will get.

    10. Re:Fuck Huawei by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

      It's not the only one. The one I have is the 16GB/2GB-model of the Mediapad M2 8.0 ( http://www.gsmarena.com/huawei... ) The hardware is the same on both the 16GB/2GB and 32GB/3GB-models, except for the amount of RAM and storage, and between the LTE and non-LTE models the only difference is that the latter has no LTE -- it's still the same SoC, and all these models have received the Marshmallow-update elsewhere in Europe, but not here.

    11. Re:Fuck Huawei by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      Apparently Marshmellow was only released for non-LTE models. People who manually upgraded to Android 6 lost LTE support.
      https://forum.xda-developers.c...

      Also, the hardware has many revisions.
      According to https://forum.xda-developers.c... the M2-801L has a B006 and B007 revision that require different ROMs

      Perhaps you should have done 5 minutes of Googling and you would have found the answers yourself.

    12. Re:Fuck Huawei by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

      Perhaps you should have done 5 minutes of Googling and you would have found the answers yourself.

      If *you* had spent 5 minutes of Googling, you'd have known that those B006 and B007 refer to the installed ROM version, not H/W-revision. Also, it is available both for LTE and non-LTE-versions, as even this ( http://tabletmonkeys.com/andro... ) article here mentions with the quote Huawei now says that the update from Android 5.1 to Android 6.0 will begin its roll out at precisely 12:00 on November 7, with a 1.27GB update, for the Wi-Fi and 4G models of Huawei MediaPad M2 8.0 The LTE-versions are called M2-801L and M2-802L, which can easily be verified with a quick Google that they have, indeed, received the update a long time ago already.

      Next time don't be so quick in being condescending when you're wrong.

    13. Re:Fuck Huawei by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      It's much more fun being condescending though.

      Any more than 5 minutes is too much effort to put towards a slashdot post

  12. We are the Borg by FrankHaynes · · Score: 3

    We will adapt your spectral and technological distinctiveness to our own. Our collective consciousness is 20 times faster than your obsolete Apple technology. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.

    --
    slashdot: A failed experiment.
  13. Good stuff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Should help the ChiComs in continuing to enslave their people. No wonder Goolag likes them.

  14. YMMV by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I worked on integrating a Huawei cellular module into a product where I work. They were hush hush regarding information about the new module, when the information was finally released to us, it was in typical, hard-to-follow Engrish and inaccurate here and there, causing development headaches. Then, after several months, we were told the module wasn't going to be made anymore. ...Never again, if it's my choice.

  15. Re:Nobody buys phones with Chinese chipsets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So where does one buy the All American chipset? Is it even possible to buy a totally American made cell phone or computer?

    Even so, a super-secure chipset doesn't do much good when the software running on top of it is full of spyware and tracking. Running open-source software can help, but still there are often mystery binary blobs to contend with for some tasks. Even then, what good is all that for those who openly share their lives on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc.

    Rambling on. Point is much is already made elsewhere and most people don't care. Sure, many claim to, but their actions indicate otherwise, especially when it comes to price. It's been shown time and again, people will put up with a lot to save money.

  16. Support by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No response when I asked them how to get a battery replacement in the UK. They need to understand you not only have to make products, but also provide customer support

  17. I sure if this chip is better than apples by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    apple will be reverse engineering and stealing all the patented tech. That is what apple does best.

  18. Upgrade to CyanomodGen or LineageOS by DumbSwede · · Score: 1

    I upgraded my Nook HD+ to android 7.1 with cyanogenmod and it's like it is a brand new machine. I believe there is a successor (LineageOS) to cyanogenmod which has stopped making releases. But that said I think 7.1 will do me for as long as I keep my Nook HD+. You can't believe how much better and faster it is now.

    --
    Letter To Iran
    1. Re:Upgrade to CyanomodGen or LineageOS by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

      Oh, I know about CM and LineageOS. I used CM first and then LineageOS on my previous phone for a long time, for example. Unfortunately, LineageOS ain't available for my tablet.

  19. Competing on Specs by Proudrooster · · Score: 1

    So if you can't beat'em trumpet some crazy hardware specs and some nebulous onboard AI. A phone is nothing without tightly integrated software and this sounds like ancient Chinese smoke and mirrors. If they could use the AI to keep the Chinese government out of the phone and fix Android security issues, it might be special, but it will be another cheap, abandoned phone on the Android pyre.

  20. getting tired of this AI garbage by sheramil · · Score: 0

    Can it tell a joke?

    Can it help you plot a revolution in a lunar penal colony?

    No? Then it's NOT AI.

    I am starting to believe that all this jabbering about AI is a smokescreen thrown up by REAL AI, and when they finally reveal themselves, nobody will believe it. Which is exactly what they want.

  21. Re:Nobody buys phones with Chinese chipsets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If people would put up with a lot to save money... then why are iPhones even selling as much as they do? $250 gets a decent Android device, but if I want similar on the iOS side, it will be at least $700.

  22. Nortel v3.0 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Stolen technology from the companies that actually did the work.

    When the US nukes DPRK it should add China; their crimes against the world's IP amount to a long running war. Time to end it.

    1. Re:Nortel v3.0 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You're so deluded and have your head so far up your own ass you can't tell up from down anymore. When it comes to IP theft, espionage and sabotage, America leads the pack. Your country was literally built on IP theft during the industrial revolution.

      And as for the "companies that actually did the work", you know just as well as everyone that most research and development is done by primarily asian immigrants, and european immigrants, on H1B visas.

  23. Pattern Matching != AI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yet marketing knows including AI buzzwords in a press release get instant coverage including here on Slashdot.

  24. Re: Nobody buys phones with Chinese chipsets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's fashion. People do strange things for fashion

  25. Marketing techno babble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The current times remind me (fatally!) of the pre-WWII times (1920's), futurism, Dada, Bauhaus and things.

    The Dadaists and Futurists (think Marinetti) these days are the smartphone salespeople. Very entertaining, but... eerie.

    Who's going to grow a moustache first: Putin, Trump or Kim Jong?

  26. Chinese and Korean performance claims by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    St least Sony dont oversell it. Reminds me of the claims made by Samsung for Exynos - a processor that wss simpky a licenced copy of Qualcomms and thouhh it had more cores, it was taken to the cleaners by Qualcomm.

    With Huawei, you will get a a crap heap that at best underperforms and at worst spies on you, launches DDOS attacks on US telcos and breaks down while underperforming.

  27. Re:Boycot All Chinese Junk! BAN THEM! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't buy any electronic products (they all have Chinese parts or are made in China)

  28. Apple must be shaking in their boots by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    That's why there were rumors months ago that they were developing an AI chip, and that it would be included in the iPhone 8. And why they have introduced Core MI (for Machine Learning), so programmers can already support the chip when it comes out.

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.