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More Are Paying To Stream Music, But YouTube Still Holds the Value Gap (theregister.co.uk)

An anonymous reader shares a report: With Google's user-generated content loophole firmly in lawmaker's sights, global music trade body IFPI has published new research looking at demand for music streaming. The research confirms YouTube's pre-eminence as the world's de facto jukebox. 46 percent of on-demand music streaming is from Google's video website. 75 percent of internet users use video streaming to hear music. The paid-for picture is bullish: 50 percent of internet users have paid for licensed music in the last six months, in one form or another, of which 53 per are 13- to 15-year-olds. Audio streaming is split between 39 percent who stream for free and 29 percent who pay. [...] So what's the problem? European policy makers have become convinced by the "value gap" argument: compensation doesn't reflect usage. Google finds itself with a unique advantage here, thanks to YouTube's "user-generated content" exception, as we explained last year.

43 comments

  1. fr1st ps0t by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    fr1st ps0t

  2. f1rst p0st by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    f1rst p0st

    1. Re:f1rst p0st by davester666 · · Score: 1

      sadly, no.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
  3. Value gap is propaganda by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The only value gap is the price people are paying for streaming, and the actual value of digital files. Which is zero.

    1. Re:Value gap is propaganda by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Does this include people who stream music which is simply the background to a video they happen to be watching. Perhaps people who are watching an add with music content. I find it a bit of an overreach to say that 75% of internet users are using video streaming to hear music. Perhaps 75% hear music when they stream videos but that is not necessarily their intention.

      This is just because youtube is big and everyone wants to get the big guy to pay their bills and milk the big cow to get the money they want. Sorry but if it wasn't for youtube those users would not be streaming a lot of that 'content' get some real figures that are not pulled out of a hat and we might start believing you.

    2. Re:Value gap is propaganda by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the actual value of digital files. Which is zero.

      And by zero, you mean the value you are willing to pay. Typical pirate logic.

    3. Re:Value gap is propaganda by davester666 · · Score: 1

      I believe the revenue model the MPAA/RIAA is going for is "just give us all the money and your child lives".

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    4. Re: Value gap is propaganda by KGIII · · Score: 1

      What's your primary email address and password?

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    5. Re:Value gap is propaganda by JohnFen · · Score: 1

      The only value gap is the price people are paying for streaming, and the actual value of digital files. Which is zero.

      Umm, speaking in terms of market economics, the monetary value of something is exactly what someone else is willing to pay for it. No more and no less.

  4. paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    50 percent of internet users have paid for licensed music in the last six months

    Yes, I've done that.

    None of it has been "pay to hear it once, then pay to hear it again, and the time after that". I've bought non-DRM files outright. I can move them to any device I own, content-shift them as my heart desires, back them up, and bring them forward to future hardware or whatever the next format-of-the-moment turns out to be.

    And they're cheap to purchase outright. Some has also been creative-commons licensed which technically I don't have to pay for, but I do if I like it, to support the artist.

    But then I'm pushing 5 times the age of TFS's indicated demographic, and maybe I don't get the appeal it holds for kids these days to not own things, be they games, music, software, , and generally anything that answers to someone who is not you.

    1. Re:paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I pay legitimately for stuff like Adobe CC. I also have a cracked copy of all of the software in Adobe CC lying around. If Adobe decides to do something shitty or I ever run into that bullshit "you can only install it on two computers" thing in the license, I'll install my cracked copy. I witnessed a shop that had old (pre-CS and CS/CS2 editions) Adobe programs try to install them on a computer after it needed a clean reinstall of Windows...only to have mandatory activation bullshit come up and Adobe told them over the phone: "sorry, we do not activate those programs anymore."

      This is like $1000+ of software that they explicitly paid for a perpetual license on, yet activation allowed Adobe to "take it back." Someone there found and installed cracked copies of somewhat newer versions of the same software as a result. In my opinion, they were perfectly in the right (morally and ethically) to do so.

      Piracy can ensure that we don't ever get fucked by subscription-only software and mandatory activation rendering our software unusable. A lot of people do not think about the fact that they can have $1M worth of work in files on their hard drive and all of it can be brought down to $0.00 in value if they lose access to the software required to work with it. Cracked copies are a form of insurance. There is no reason to accept being held hostage by a company's shitty policy of forcing software activation down your throat.

    2. Re:paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sorry to inform you that moral and ethics have to be decided by a judge. The law does not always feel moral for us non lawyers and non judges. In fact it often seems as moral as the bible seems as true. This is especially the case for many copyright laws.

    3. Re:paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't give a fuck about what judges think.

    4. Re: paid for v streamed by KGIII · · Score: 2

      Until you do...

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    5. Re:paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sorry to inform you that moral and ethics have to be decided by a judge. The law does not always feel moral for us non lawyers and non judges. In fact it often seems as moral as the bible seems as true. This is especially the case for many copyright laws.

      Lawyers and Judges get to decide how laws are interpreted. If humanity depends on them for morals, we'd be in trouble(^^)

    6. Re:paid for v streamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No. Morals are a personal thing, while ethics are a 'societal' thing. A judge's decision is a legal thing, and may or may not reflect morality or wider ethics (something might be legal, but immoral or unethical, while other things may be illegal but morally and/or ethically acceptable).

    7. Re:paid for v streamed by JohnFen · · Score: 1

      Yes, I've done that.

      Me too. On average, I think I spend about $50/mo purchasing music. I won't pay for media I can't have a usable a copy of, though. "Usable copy" means no DRM and in a common audio format.

    8. Re:paid for v streamed by JohnFen · · Score: 1

      I'm sorry to inform you that moral and ethics have to be decided by a judge.

      Morality and legality are entirely different things.

  5. Dear music industry by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    You can either get the ad revenue from YouTube or nothing from when people go back to filesharing. Because 50% is already about 49% more than I'd have expected to pay for something as useless as the audio pollution you sell as music.

    Slaughtering the goose laying the golden eggs may well result in having nothing at all.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  6. "Paying" for music?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    LOL. Did they run the survey on a sample of martians? Or does it come from 1994 maybe?!

    1. Re:"Paying" for music?! by JohnFen · · Score: 1

      It's commonly said that people aren't willing to pay for things (especially music) anymore, but that is demonstrably untrue.

  7. Percentages by mentil · · Score: 1

    50 percent of internet users have [...] of which 53 percent are 13- to 15-year-olds.

    26.5% of internet users are between 13 and 15 years old? That explains everything!

    --
    Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
  8. Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    What we have gotten from fear like this is censorship and the great firewall of the west. We don't need copy"right" and I'd argue the value of music, movies, and entertainment has long been over valued. You can't tell me that a song or bunch of songs is worth millions of dollars. Songs are literally worth little more than a dime a dozen. There is a reason that the industry "needs" copy"right". It really doesn't, but it thinks it does. What it needs are sound business models (which it has with or without copy"right" as evidenced by the fact we have widespread piracy and the industry still exists and is doing better than ever before).

    There was culture before copy"right" and the idea you can't produce films without mega budgets just isn't true. You may have to get creative- but if the movie producers are as good (well, most aren't, but hey-) as they should be they'll come up with better cheaper solutions. The problem we have had until recently is that the entertainment industry didn't have to compete. Copy"right" is a monopoly. That's what it is by definition. It was supposed to be to benefit the arts and sciences for the benefit of the people, but in reality it's a means of funnelling money into the hands of an elite. We need to put and end to copy"right" and look toward competition and a free market. The people living in western countries today have a great advantage in terms of knowledge and education, but we need to end boarders, trade barriers, restrictions on travel (passports, drivers licenses, vehicle registration, license plates, etc), socialism which doesn't work on a massive scale because we have too many poor people trying to get in which leads to armed boarders being a necessity (and haven't really worked anyway), and other inefficiencies in our current system. In the short term its scary- but in the long term freedom creates jobs in the process of "destroying" them.

    1. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Copyright has a purpose. I'm fine with copyright, but it needs to be term-limited in the same way patents are. Copyrights should expire after 10 years or 20 years if the rightsholder files for a renewal. Everything 20 years or more in age should fall into public domain. In fact, the establishment of copyright in the beginning would never have happened without a reasonable time frame being established to have all works become public domain.

    2. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Copyrights should expire after 10 years or 20 years if the rightsholder files for a renewal.

      That's greedy -- content creators don't get paid and you end up with shitty content like youtube videos, that take at most 4 hours to create, instead of a year or two for the typical book.

      Governments own countries forever, business owners own businesses until the business dies, land owners own land forever and pass it to their children. Similarly, copyright should be for infinity, like land ownership. After 100 years, you should be able to make derivative works than can copy at most 50% of the original work.

    3. Re: Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by KGIII · · Score: 2

      You've never made music, have you? I used to earn extra money as a performance artist and, sometimes, studio musician. I play at a very high level (samples available) and can't even begin to enumerate the number of total hours it takes just to master a single song - and I can play at just about the same speed I can read tab. I play classical guitar, but usually earned money by making faithful reproductions (cover tunes). As in, note perfect reproductions of a studio cut and played better than some of the original artists could do while playing live.

      My pedal station totals a half sheet of plywood. My choice of guitars numbers well over 100. I practice with a metronome just to ensure my timing is exact. I no longer play professionally, but I still try to get two hours of practice in, every single day. I've played for more than 45 years.

      If you think it is four hours of work, you've never made music. If you need proof of my skill level, and thus my ability to speak authoritatively, I'm more than happy to provide that proof, in this public space. It takes more than four hours, just to master a fairly simple song. Yeah, there is shitty music but evennshitty music, and shitty artists, take quite a bit of time to create the music you like.

      However, as I have no financial worries, I don't actually sell my work and don't try to make money with it. So, I don't have any personal qualms about putting my work into the public domain.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    4. Re: Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by BlueStrat · · Score: 1

      You've never made music, have you? I used to earn extra money as a performance artist and, sometimes, studio musician. I play at a very high level (samples available) and can't even begin to enumerate the number of total hours it takes just to master a single song - and I can play at just about the same speed I can read tab. I play classical guitar, but usually earned money by making faithful reproductions (cover tunes). As in, note perfect reproductions of a studio cut and played better than some of the original artists could do while playing live.

      My pedal station totals a half sheet of plywood. My choice of guitars numbers well over 100. I practice with a metronome just to ensure my timing is exact. I no longer play professionally, but I still try to get two hours of practice in, every single day. I've played for more than 45 years.

      If you think it is four hours of work, you've never made music. If you need proof of my skill level, and thus my ability to speak authoritatively, I'm more than happy to provide that proof, in this public space. It takes more than four hours, just to master a fairly simple song. Yeah, there is shitty music but evennshitty music, and shitty artists, take quite a bit of time to create the music you like.

      However, as I have no financial worries, I don't actually sell my work and don't try to make money with it. So, I don't have any personal qualms about putting my work into the public domain.

      Long time (45+ years) professional musician (guitarist, session/live-performance) here as well.

      The original purpose of copyright was to make certain that new music steadily entered the public domain instead of either never being created or never made public at all. To that end, they incentivized the creation and publication of music by trying to guarantee creators a reasonable time within which they could exercise exclusivity and profit. "We'll allow you a small window within which to profit, and in exchange, your works will enter the public domain at the end of that limited period." However, modern copyright has destroyed the bargain by making the term of copyright effectively "eternity minus a day" and preventing music from entering the public domain.

      I create commercial music for TV series, advertisements, promotional/corporate videos, etc for a set price through a bidding process. That's the "bread & butter" part.

      I also play live performances with a band. I/we produce recordings of the live-performance band and hand them out for free for promotional purposes. It's the actual live performances that generate money.

      The reality is that times & technologies have changed but the "music industry" business model has not. Artists' recordings have become merely a promotional tool for actual live performances, but the industry refuses to acknowledge this fact and attempts to have laws created and/or altered to deny reality and preserve their 'buggy-whip factories'.

      This only turns otherwise honest & law-abiding people into criminals for doing what comes naturally and creates other negative societal and cultural distortions.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    5. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      > ... socialism which doesn't work on a massive scale because we have too many poor people trying to get in ...

      The actual problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money.

      i.e.
      You can only rob Peter to pay Paul for so long.

      --
      "To robbe Petyr & geve it Poule, it were non almesse but gret synne." -- Jacob's well: an English treatise on the cleansing of man's conscience, 1450

    6. Re: Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Absolutely, I agree with everything you said. My contention was mostly that it took a mere four hours to create music.

      Here, I'll show off. ;-) As stated, I'm a trained classical guitarist. However, nobody pays for a classical guitarist. So, I learned to play rock. Which is how you end up with something like this:

      https://vocaroo.com/i/s0j5qxFp...

      Yeah... That's pure unadulterated ego. I'm pretty sure it's note-perfect. I am a bit fond of Malmsteen. That's played on a Malmsteen edition with the scalloped frets. Gotta tell you, that took longer than four hours to make. I'd guess I had a hundred hours just in learning it. It's an exercise in ego, really.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    7. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by JohnFen · · Score: 1

      Yes, I'm entirely fine with the concept and original purpose of copyright.

      Copyright law as it exists currently, though, is an abomination.

    8. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by justthinkit · · Score: 1

      "at most 4 hours to create"

      Here's a couple of my videos -- both around 80 minutes -- that took about 50 hours each to make:

      COASALT 6: 222 Answers

      Toxic: How Science Measures Harm

      Boggles my mind why anyone would pull an arbitrary fixed number out of their hat...

      --
      I come here for the love
    9. Re:Entertainment industry is destroying freedom by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I watch a lot of youtube videos and most of them are less than 10 minutes. In that 10 minutes, at least 5 minutes (or more!) you have to stare at the content creator's close-up face, in a single angle (very tiring/unpleasant). These video creators are seriously narcissistic. The actual visual content is probably only about 30 seconds.

      4 hours is a very generous estimation of how long it takes to create these videos. If they adlib it, it probably takes 30 minutes, total!

  9. Damn it EU... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If EU policy makers believe this crap is bad for the music industry, they are injecting some bad stuff into their skin. Soon Britain won't be the only former member of the EU.
    Thanks Policy Makers !!!!1!!1

  10. GOOGLE! LISTEN UP!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What you need, nay MUST do is to create your own music for youtube that your users can then select (royalty/royaly free based on monetisation terms of the video) to be played, in part, or its entirety.

    Then abolish 3rd party music beats that have not been registered by the user (may be own content creator of the piece)

    Fucking profit!!!

    Youtube music will fan to the top with user voting for either inhouse music or original youtuber. Screw the music industry and their fat chubs into the earth about 6feet will do.

  11. Google? IFPI? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    While I think Google has become far too powerful to be healthy for society, I wish that corrupt IFPI to shrivel up and die, barupting some of its shills and lobbyists in the process.

    Perhaps Google and IFPI (and the *AAs) can annihilate each other in one last, fiery embrace? Bliss.

  12. '53 per'...? by dohzer · · Score: 1

    53 per? I feel like there may be a certain symbol that could shorten that grouping of symbols even more, but I can't seem to remember which. it is.

    1. Re:'53 per'...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ha - from 'per' alone you assume 'per cent'. This is statistics, and statistics lie!
      Per haps they intended to say 'per mille', or per haps 'per duecent' or 'per 54'?

  13. Internet Radio? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I see no mention of Internet Radio which is all I listen to. Real radio stations with live hosts and music. Excluding Beats One as it is nothing more than a kid-friendly hip-hop station. Might as well describe itself as "Urban Social Pop Status Music".

  14. A terribly biased article by jediborg · · Score: 1

    That completely downplays the costs associated with filtering content. Youtubes ContentID system is far from perfect. It doesn't even hit 80% accuracy. Trying to auto-detect and ban ALL uploads of a single song is just ridiculously hard to do. And when I take a song like the beatles 'revolution' and layer it over my own unique video, basically making my own beatles music video, the resulting content should be considered 'fair use' since its a remixed work, the new work is my own. Music labels decry this as piracy but it should be considered a legitimate form of art expression, and therefore protected by free speech. ALSO: the article completely ignores the fact that music services such as spotify and Pandora are paying TOO MUCH to license music from labels. They used to have to pay one royalty to play one song on their service. Then the music industry manipulated the government and now Pandora has to pay one royalty to play one song FOR EACH USER. When you have thousands of users listening simultaneously, thats a LOT of royalty fees.

    From my point of view, its not that youtube isn't paying enough, its that everyone else is being forced to pay too much.

  15. 128 GB phone - I'm not a slave to bandwidth. by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    Buy disks, rip, compress, keep it with you. (disks are super cheap on the used market these days)

    Streaming = Provide me bandwidth random store or eatery so that I may stream music into my head for your roof is metal and my phone signal does not penetrate well.

    Storing your own music = Hackers took down the ENTIRE INTERNET and cellular network? LOL I've got this.

    --
    The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
    1. Re:128 GB phone - I'm not a slave to bandwidth. by umafuckit · · Score: 1

      Buy disks, rip, compress, keep it with you. (disks are super cheap on the used market these days)

      Which used markets are those? Certainly not e-bay or Amazon.

    2. Re:128 GB phone - I'm not a slave to bandwidth. by pecosdave · · Score: 1

      I used to hit used media stores like Hastings and FYE those stores seem to be going out of business. Half Price Books is still around and has a good selection. I've bought music at garage sales and thrift shops.

      There's at least 7 good ones here, I couldn't read all the titles due to the glare - Buy it Now price $15, free shipping, take the ones you don't like to Half Price Books or give them away otherwise. http://r.ebay.com/rUsgkB

      --
      The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
    3. Re:128 GB phone - I'm not a slave to bandwidth. by MitchDev · · Score: 1

      THIS.

      Used CDs are dirt cheap (not just used music stores, but Garage sales, etc). Plus you have the CDs as back up, you rip the tracks snas any DRM.

      You get to choose the play order, the songs in the list, no censorship, etc...AND no monthly fees. Plus you don't need cell signal or WiFi and don;t have to worry about connection speed from overuse of the bandwidth...