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Mazda Says Its Next-Gen Gasoline Engine Will Run Cleaner Than An Electric Car (popularmechanics.com)
schwit1 shares a report from Popular Mechanics: Mazda is staking much of its future on the continued existence of the internal-combustion engine, with clever tech like spark-controlled compression ignition set to debut in Mazda's next-generation production-car engine, Skyactiv-X. But the automaker is already thinking even further into the internal-combustion future. Automotive News reports that Mazda is working on a new gas engine, Skyactiv-3, which the automaker says will be as clean as an electric vehicle. Speaking at a tech forum in Tokyo, Mazda powertrain chief Mitsuo Hitomi said that the main goal with Skyactiv-3 is to increase the engine's thermal efficiency to roughly 56 percent. If achieved, that would make the Skyactiv engine the first internal-combustion piston engine to turn the majority of its fuel's energy into power, rather than waste due to friction or heat loss.
To date, the most thermally efficient automotive internal combustion engine belongs to Mercedes-AMG's Formula 1 team, with an efficiency of 50 percent; AMG hopes the F1-derived engine in the Project One street-legal supercar will achieve 41-percent thermal efficiency, which would make it the most thermally efficient production-car engine in history. Automotive News says Mazda's 56-percent goal would represent a 27-percent improvement over current Mazda engines. Hitomi didn't provide a timeline for when Skyactiv-3 would reach production, nor did he specify how Mazda hopes to achieve such an improvement. Mazda's claim, that Skyactiv-3 would be cleaner to run than an all-electric vehicle, is a bold one, and requires some unpacking. Mazda bases the assertion on its estimates of "well-to-wheel" emissions, tallying the pollution generated by both fossil fuel production and utility electricity generation to compare Skyactiv-3 and EV emissions. Such analysis reflects the reality that, currently, much electricity is generated through fossil fuels. In regions where electricity comes from wind, solar, or hydroelectric, the EV would clearly win the argument, but that's not the case for many customers today. If Mazda can make a mass-production internal-combustion engine that achieves more than 50 percent thermal efficiency, it will be an incredible feat -- and would likely help guarantee the piston engine's continued survival.
To date, the most thermally efficient automotive internal combustion engine belongs to Mercedes-AMG's Formula 1 team, with an efficiency of 50 percent; AMG hopes the F1-derived engine in the Project One street-legal supercar will achieve 41-percent thermal efficiency, which would make it the most thermally efficient production-car engine in history. Automotive News says Mazda's 56-percent goal would represent a 27-percent improvement over current Mazda engines. Hitomi didn't provide a timeline for when Skyactiv-3 would reach production, nor did he specify how Mazda hopes to achieve such an improvement. Mazda's claim, that Skyactiv-3 would be cleaner to run than an all-electric vehicle, is a bold one, and requires some unpacking. Mazda bases the assertion on its estimates of "well-to-wheel" emissions, tallying the pollution generated by both fossil fuel production and utility electricity generation to compare Skyactiv-3 and EV emissions. Such analysis reflects the reality that, currently, much electricity is generated through fossil fuels. In regions where electricity comes from wind, solar, or hydroelectric, the EV would clearly win the argument, but that's not the case for many customers today. If Mazda can make a mass-production internal-combustion engine that achieves more than 50 percent thermal efficiency, it will be an incredible feat -- and would likely help guarantee the piston engine's continued survival.
but not for long. even IF they achieve this.
They are defining the scope of "clean" pretty narrowly here to get this win. One admittedly important metric only -- CO2e, and the comparator is an EV running off a grid that looks like today.
Obviously,
1. there are many other important metrics: particulates, particulates at street level, NOx, NOx at street level, noise, vibration damage, etc.
2. EVs get less carbon intensive over time without doing anything as the mix of power sources shifts more and more towards low-carbon.
On whether the germans or the japanese get there first - at least to a production vehicle, the article states that Merc-AMG have already made it with F1, but the japanese are persistent.
This will be an interesting contest to watch.
They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom
He is right in one thing, and that is the scandal that isn't - how we still burn coal to generate electricity. Thanks to green party opposition to nuclear power, we are still burning coal (which creates more residual radioactivity than nuclear, but that's another story).
Had we embraced nuclear energy, we would not have coal, oil or gas power plants anymore. They would simply be too expensive. But nuclear has this atomic bomb associations, while coal gives us mental pictures of hard-working people.
By the time their super-efficient cars hit the roads, we will hopefully be more advanced and the "cleaner than EV" claim is ancient history.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
Why is this desirable? A heavy noisy motor with lots of moving parts - decreasing reliability - requiring harmful chemicals and kicking out pollution at street level.
Not criticising the concept. It's good to see improvements, and the internal combustion engine was an impressive invention, but I think after a century and a half, we should expect it to be replaced with better technology.
The elephant in the room is: regardless of whether EV from green sources or super-efficient ICE, we have too many cars, and they are too big.
I watched in horror at Dieselgate, where folks were quibbling about a minor cheat in small automobiles while they were buying SUVs to go buy their groceries or bring their prole to the school.
I mean: VW (and many others!) cheated on the emission values of their cars and desserve a serious spanking on that (much more than they actually got!), but are making a killing selling SUVs to people that don't really need them: the real problem are we, the customers!
On a long term forecast, electric vehicles will be very very cheap to produce, not just the components are way less, the supply chain and quality control will be way more reduced. There is no way any fossil fuel will ever be more efficient from an energy prepective than a eletric engine. We are at infant stage of tech, and cars are getting has low as 12 kwh per 100 km, I can't even imagine anything better than this. This Mazda engine relies on extreme compression, don't expect the engines to last long
I'm seriously sick and tired of the bullshit definition of thermal efficiency cycles. You need to have your cold side sink at absolute zero, this limits any practical process to a low efficiency, and is technically correct but horribly misleading. Moreover it's bullshit because after your exaust dips below ambient temperature you are actually throwing away useful energy, no one pays for the base thermal energy in the atmosphere so the dollar cost is zero and most textbooks argue this energy is unavailable (ironically). More emphasis needs to be put on the upper bound of possible efficiency using the actual thermal resivoirs at hand and rating efficiency as a percentage of the theoretical maximum given those constraints. It's like when they teach you in 1st year mechanical engineering where the isothermal expansion of a cylinder is efficient. Great! But seriously emphasize the fact it's efficient because you are taking thermal energy you didn't pay for from the atmosphere (most new students leave it off the energy balance lol). Car engine is 18% efficient? Great! But a better way to say it is 42% utilization of available thermal energy.
The whole "EVs can't handle extreme climates or places with low population density" thing is just plain silly.
I've always suspected that the people bringing up that argument live in places like Sothern California or Florida.
Because they don't seem to have ever experienced the fun of keeping IC engines running in the extremes - usually cold
Block heaters, battery heaters,oil pan heaters, parking meters with electrical outlets for the heaters, and heaven help you if you let that diesel engine come to winter temp.
I haven't seen it in person, but people do start fires under diesel engines. https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Next time someone whines about a cold Tesla, versus reliable IC vehicles, let them see that video
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.