Slashdot Mirror


Judge Won't Let FCC's Net Neutrality Repeal Stop Lawsuit Alleging Charter Throttled Netflix (hollywoodreporter.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Hollywood Reporter: [I]n the first significant decision referring to the repeal [of net neutrality] since FCC chairman Ajit Pai got his way, a New York judge on Friday ruled that the rescinding of net neutrality rules wasn't relevant to an ongoing lawsuit against Charter Communications. New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman filed the lawsuit almost exactly a year ago today. It's alleged that Charter's Spectrum-TWC service promised internet speeds it knew it couldn't deliver and that Spectrum-TWC also misled subscribers by promising reliable access to Netflix, online content and online games. According to the complaint, the ISP intentionally failed to deliver reliable service in a bid to extract fees from backbone and content providers. When Netflix wouldn't pay, this "resulted in subscribers getting poorer quality streams during the very hours when they were most likely to access Netflix," and after Netflix agreed to pay demands, service "improved dramatically." This arguably is the kind of thing that net neutrality was supposed to prevent. And Charter itself pointed to the net neutrality repeal in a bid to block Schneiderman's claims that Charter had engaged in false advertising and deceptive business practices. New York Supreme Court Justice O. Peter Sherwood isn't sold.

He writes in an opinion that the FCC's order "which promulgates a new deregulatory policy effectively undoing network neutrality, includes no language purporting to create, extend or modify the preemptive reach of the Transparency Rule," referring to how ISPs have to disclose "actual network performance." And although Charter attempted to argue that the FCC clarified its intent to stop state and local governments from imposing disclosure obligations on broadband providers that were inconsistent with FCC's rules, Sherwood notes other language from the "Restoring Internet Freedom Order" how states will "continue to play their vital role in protecting consumers from fraud, enforcing fair business practices... and generally responding to consumer inquiries and complaints."

33 comments

  1. Charter's response.. by sconeu · · Score: 1

    "Dammit, Pai! Why did you put that note into the order? What the hell do you think we're paying you for?"

    --
    General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    1. Re:Charter's response.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He did his job. He refrained from meddling in the private sector.

    2. Re:Charter's response.. by _Sharp'r_ · · Score: 0

      Wow, it's almost like the FCC repeal of Net Neutrality rules didn't end the Internet, nor enforcement of stuff like this. Amazing, wonder who might have predicted that outcome?

      --
      The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
    3. Re:Charter's response.. by Shikaku · · Score: 3, Informative

      Yeah no. It works both ways: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      You can't make a law retroactively, it's in the constitution. Neither to punish nor permit something.

    4. Re:Charter's response.. by Mattcelt · · Score: 1, Informative

      I don't see a "/s" at the end of your post, but I'm going to assume you're being sarcastic.

      Because if not, you're an idiot.

      The only reason Charter's motion didn't cause the suit to be tossed was that it was filed before the repeal was enacted.

      In other words, if the lawsuit were to be filed today, the repeal of Net Neutrality would have allowed Charter to throttle Netflix traffic without consequence.

    5. Re:Charter's response.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Basically, moron, Ajit Pai failed at his gambit if this suit pans out for Netflix and you didn't predict jack shit with any specificity.

    6. Re:Charter's response.. by dgatwood · · Score: 1

      Wow, it's almost like the FCC repeal of Net Neutrality rules didn't end the Internet, nor enforcement of stuff like this by companies big enough to hire a team of lawyers.

      FTFY. The purpose of net neutrality laws was never to prevent companies from suing other companies for abusive behavior, but rather to provide a regulatory framework by which the FCC could crack down on companies for abusive behavior even if the only people affected are small companies and individuals that are not readily able to hire a team of lawyers big enough to extract a meaningful settlement from companies the size of Charter.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    7. Re:Charter's response.. by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

      No, it's more like the repeal of a regulation last month didn't prevent Charter from operating in a manner that was against regulations a year ago.

      Or, more succinctly: the repeal of Net Neutrality didn't all of a sudden stop someone from violating regulations a year ago. Just the same as if the Clean Air Act was repealed for some insane reason tomorrow, it wouldn't have all of a sudden made smoke stacks stop belching terrible things in the 1950s.

      Use your brain.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    8. Re:Charter's response.. by dryeo · · Score: 3, Informative

      Did you read the article you linked to? First there is nothing about passing a law, such as legalizing pot and retroactively remove the criminal status of offenders and the idea that it is against the Constitution to undo an unjust law seems like a pretty large infringement on the rights of those who are being punished by an unjust law.
      What the article does show is how the Supreme court reinterprets the Constitution and reality. First, it now only applies to criminal law where the Constitution just says "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed. and then how the Supreme Court has ruled that things like being put on a sex offender list and having to post your personal information on the internet is not a punishment and I guess the ruling implied it is not a Bill of Attainder either (in my country, a Judge has to put you on the list as part of sentencing).
      There's also the example of the child molester who had finished his sentence and being committed due to a law being retroactively applied was not a punishment so fine. I'd think it would take a Judge, on the advise of experts to commit someone rather then a broad law, so once again touching on both parts of "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed."
      There's also the "Domestic Violence Offender Gun Ban" which besides obviously going against the 2nd amendment, the Supreme Court considered the possibility of 10 years in jail for your previous legal gun and the fact that 10 years in jail is not a punishment but rather regulatory. In my country, where firearms aren't even a right, it once again takes a Judge to ban someone from owning firearms and is usually part of sentencing though I'd think it could be in the form of a restraining order.

      So there you have it, at least according to the Wiki article, that part of the Constitution only applies to criminal law that is punitive and the punitive part is pretty flexible. It's amazing how your Supreme Court can interpret pretty clear language, especially if it means punishing someone that everyone hates.
      This discussion is about a lawsuit against a company that isn't facing jail time so Article 1 Section 9 doesn't even enter into it according to precedent.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    9. Re:Charter's response.. by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I think the people supporting this repeal weren't concerned with companies suing companies, but that the government should not be involved. These are the hardcore anti-government people who feel government has no place doing anything that isn't the military, and the true believers that the free market solves all problems. As such, they're not really beholden to corporations anymore than they are beholden to the people, they goal is to dismantle regulations.

    10. Re:Charter's response.. by _Sharp'r_ · · Score: 1

      Did you even read the Judge's ruling? It stated Net Neutrality being repealed didn't matter in terms of if this was against the law or not, because of the other regulations which applied which aren't net neutrality.

      If you can't follow the logic, at least try and keep from making a fool of yourself about it.

      --
      The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
    11. Re:Charter's response.. by _Sharp'r_ · · Score: 2

      Did you even read the second paragraph of the summary? The Judge ruled that it was against current regulations and that the FCC repealing Net Neutrality doesn't affect the regulations this is in violation of.

      --
      The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
    12. Re:Charter's response.. by _Sharp'r_ · · Score: 1

      If you look at my pre-NN repeal comments on the subject, I made the point several times that repealing NN doesn't repeal all the other regulations which existed pre-NN (like the one at issue in this case) which were what had solved these kinds of problems before.

      --
      The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
    13. Re:Charter's response.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "which were what had solved these kinds of problems before." Wrong, and you still have zero specifics to point to.

  2. Comcast by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Should be next for throttleing everyone with their shitty service.

  3. Re:You lost, idiot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    whats a arab bizx?

  4. Re:You lost, idiot by Hetero · · Score: 1

    Arabs purchased Slashdot about two years ago as some sort of "investment" and threw the site under the bus. It is being actively neglected and has lost most of its user base. They hired two or three monkeys who push about half a dozen topics from "Russia" to "Net Neutrality" to "AI" and little more. It looks as though the site was either purchased to be run into the ground in a big portfolio (look at the SEC filings), or they are taking big bucks from someone to do some SEO black hat magic.

    HTH

  5. Re:You lost, idiot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    we give people the right to opt-out of having data collected on sites and apps off Facebook being used for ads.”

    And Tesla and SpaceX. I hardly every see anything Blue Origin or any of the other private space firms.

  6. NO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    no, fuckhead, nothing about the never in force net neutrality regulations affect this at all. False advertising is still against the law.

  7. This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by SlaveToTheGrind · · Score: 5, Informative

    As explained in the complaint, there are two primary allegations:

    1. That "Spectrum-TWC promised Internet speeds that it knew it could not deliver to subscribers."
    2. That "Spectrum-TWC promised reliable access to online content that it knew it could not deliver to subscribers."

    The specific legal theories are fraudulent misrepresentation, deceptive business practices, and false advertising.

    It's completely unsurprising that the judge would conclude Net Neutrality or the lack thereof has no bearing on this case.

    1. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      Interestingly enough, literally every single other cable provider that also provides internet service is guilty at least of point #1, and in most cases probably #2 as well.

    2. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interestingly enough, literally every single other cable provider that also provides internet service is guilty at least of point #1, and in most cases probably #2 as well.

      Which is why many if not all ISPs include the words "up to" in their terms of service.

    3. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Obfuscant · · Score: 1

      As AC points out, that's why they say "up to". And anyone who has any knowledge of how the net actually works knows that ISPs cannot guarantee the throughput for any destination that is not controlled by them, even if it is on their own network, and especially if it is not on their network. Had Charter actually made promises about everyone being able to reach Netflix at full speed they'd be committing false advertising. Charter doesn't sell Netflix service and makes no claims about Netflix service.

    4. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not so much a matter of 'could not'. They could, as they demonstrated after getting paid off, they just chose not to. They promised and 'would not'.

      AC

    5. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      weird it improved netflix access after getting paid it's blackmail fee?

      hope you work for a company that get blackmailed by an isp and then sacks you to pay the fee

    6. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by Razed+By+TV · · Score: 1
      Industry shill? This shouldn't be modded +5.

      Start reading on page 57. For the lazy, start on page 61.

      For the even lazier:

      Our interconnect strategy these days, is more about how we manage our backbone and especially edge resources with the enormous growth in content. The transit costs are rounding errors compared to impacts to the edge of making the wrong decisions. We really want content networks paying us for access and right now we force those through transit that do not want to pay.

      Their strategy was to neglect network upgrades so that they could hold the feet of content providers over the flames until they gave in and paid. This did result in the literal "Spectrum-TWC promised reliable access to online content that it knew it could not deliver to subscribers." However, it is also clearly a net neutrality issue as well.

    7. Re:This has nothing to do with Net Neutrality by SlaveToTheGrind · · Score: 1

      Industry shill?

      Read the article. The "industry" wanted this to be a Net Neutrality issue so that the lawsuit would be preempted by the FCC's rollback of same. I'm not sure you really thought that one through.

      Their strategy was to neglect network upgrades so that they could hold the feet of content providers over the flames until they gave in and paid. This did result in the literal "Spectrum-TWC promised reliable access to online content that it knew it could not deliver to subscribers." However, it is also clearly a net neutrality issue as well.

      I have to say this is the first time I've heard someone seriously suggest that Net Neutrality forces an ISP to pay for enough external bandwidth to guarantee that all subscribers can simultaneously saturate their pipes with external content. I'm not sure you really thought that one through either.

  8. Re:You lost, Trump traitor faggot, see u @ prison by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually shitforbrains maybe you didn't notice somehow but Russia got themselves into the news quite significantly on the tech side of things... and you seem to cry and pout on every other article no matter what it's about. Nice rant. Nobody cares though, go whine on Fox News with Hannity about how the Russia thing won't go away. Or just go work for Trump, he needs whiners to play the plausible victim also. Anything to distract from prison.

    Meanwhile I guess you can bow to your unnamed "arab" overlords stupid cunt lol.

  9. Re:You lost, #HillaryForPrison, murderous Hillary by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Being paid, what, 30 cents per post now? Keeping you on retainer for the next DNC "election" cycle?

  10. FUD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't let facts cloud the issue here. Net neutrality regulations said fuck all about peering agreements. The simple fact is that if you have dedicated bandwidth to a network which there is incentive for both parties to upgrade at the first sign of high utilization, the traffic across that path will on average have better performance than if it had to compete with other traffic flows across a shared path like a transit provider. Comcast and TWC and other MSOs won't freely peer with content providers because they see free peering as a missed opportunity in revenue and they have captive eyeballs... given a lack of competition they have no fear of their subscribers leaving for another ISP because of poor performance. But I'll say it again, the net neutrality regulations DID NOTHING about this issue... the best you can argue is that they called for ISPs to be more transparent about points of congestion in their network. That doesn't solve much of anything given a lack of a competitive marketplace.