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'Women At Microsoft Are Sexualized By Their Male Managers,' Lawsuit Alleges (arstechnica.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: According to a newly unsealed court filing, women at Microsoft who work in technical jobs filed 238 internal complaints pertaining to gender discrimination or sexual harassment from 2010 through 2016. The new document was first reported Monday evening by Reuters. The figures were revealed as part of a proposed class-action lawsuit originally filed in 2015 (Moussouris v. Microsoft). The female plaintiffs argue that the company's internal rating system discriminates against women and disfavors professional advancement for women.

As part of the class certification process and civil discovery, Microsoft handed over years of records to the plaintiffs' lawyers. In the Monday-released filing, which was originally submitted to the court in October 2017, Moussouris' lawyer, Michael Subit, wrote that "Microsoft's Culture is Rife with Sexual Harassment" before continuing: "Company records indicate that women at Microsoft are sexualized by their male managers and coworkers, leading to a substantial number of incidents of alleged sexual harassment, and even several incidents of sexual assault, that often go unpunished." Specifically, Subit continued, Microsoft's internal unit (known as "ERIT") received 108 complaints of sexual harassment filed by female US-based technical employees, 119 complaints of gender discrimination, eight complaints of retaliation, and three complaints of pregnancy discrimination. Out of all of the claimed instances of gender discrimination, Microsoft's internal investigation only found that one such complaint was "founded."

18 of 181 comments (clear)

  1. Rife? by Richard_at_work · · Score: 5, Insightful

    238 complaints is, based on Microsofts current employee count of around 124,000, one complaint per 521 employees. Over a 6 year period. While a zero rate would be nice, I don't think that's too bad either.

    Plus we seem to be getting to that stage where some people consider allegations to be enough that action simply has to be taken, screw the investigation and screw the evidence. An allegation has been made, so punishment must be enacted.

    While a world where women are considered a lesser species is certainly a world that needs to be eliminated, a world where mere allegations are enough is not the world we should be aiming to replace it with.

    1. Re:Rife? by quantaman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      238 complaints is, based on Microsofts current employee count of around 124,000, one complaint per 521 employees. Over a 6 year period. While a zero rate would be nice, I don't think that's too bad either.

      Plus we seem to be getting to that stage where some people consider allegations to be enough that action simply has to be taken, screw the investigation and screw the evidence. An allegation has been made, so punishment must be enacted.

      While a world where women are considered a lesser species is certainly a world that needs to be eliminated, a world where mere allegations are enough is not the world we should be aiming to replace it with.

      The number seems low but 1/119 (or 238, I'm not confident how we're supposed to read the number) seems lower.

      I suspect the vast majority of problems go unreported even when management is responsive. And if there's a perception that management is burying problems then women are going to be even more reluctant to come forward.

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    2. Re:Rife? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Those are complaints that were recorded, and not to mention all those who were to afraid to complain to begin with... see the Iowa legislature for a recent example of people in power not getting in trouble for being a*holes.

    3. Re:Rife? by the_skywise · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I suspect the complaint isn't that there were so FEW reports - but that out of the 238 complaints only 1(?) was considered actionable.

    4. Re:Rife? by Richard_at_work · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Its the same issue - 238 complaints were made, therefore 238 complaints *have* to be acted upon regardless of evidence and damn you if you dismiss them.

      237 complaints were dismissed - is there any evidence that they were incorrectly dismissed?

    5. Re:Rife? by Solandri · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I suspect the vast majority of problems go unreported even when management is responsive.

      Why are we basing this on number of complaints? Anyone can file a complaint. One person with an overactive imagination can file multiple complaints without merit. The stat is already skewed far in favor of exaggerating the scope of the problem, and you're proposing skewing it even more. I thought one of the basic premises of our society was innocent until proven guilty?

      If you truly want to gauge the scope of the problem, the number you should be looking at is the number of unique persons who were investigated and found to have committed sexual harassment. That eliminates the complaints found to be without merit. And it eliminates multiple complaints against a single individual. So the problem is likely much smaller than one complaint per 521 employees.

      Even if 100% of the complaints are legit, the actual problem is probably on the order of one individual being complained against per 2000-5000 employees. If you base it on the number of accusers Bill Cosby has, the problem ends up being one individual in 15,000. Meaning of Microsoft's employee count of 124,000, there are probably only 8 individuals guilty of sexual harassment. And if 9 out of 10 people experiencing harassment don't report it, that still means it's being perpetrated by fewer than 100 individuals. The other 99.9% are innocent.

    6. Re:Rife? by quantaman · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I suspect the vast majority of problems go unreported even when management is responsive.

      Why are we basing this on number of complaints? Anyone can file a complaint. One person with an overactive imagination can file multiple complaints without merit. The stat is already skewed far in favor of exaggerating the scope of the problem, and you're proposing skewing it even more. I thought one of the basic premises of our society was innocent until proven guilty?

      If you truly want to gauge the scope of the problem, the number you should be looking at is the number of unique persons who were investigated and found to have committed sexual harassment. That eliminates the complaints found to be without merit. And it eliminates multiple complaints against a single individual. So the problem is likely much smaller than one complaint per 521 employees.

      Even if 100% of the complaints are legit, the actual problem is probably on the order of one individual being complained against per 2000-5000 employees. If you base it on the number of accusers Bill Cosby has, the problem ends up being one individual in 15,000. Meaning of Microsoft's employee count of 124,000, there are probably only 8 individuals guilty of sexual harassment. And if 9 out of 10 people experiencing harassment don't report it, that still means it's being perpetrated by fewer than 100 individuals. The other 99.9% are innocent.

      You math.... strangely.

      Lets just look at Bill Cosby for a moment, he raped dozens of women. And the vast majority of victims didn't come forward until decades later when everyone else started coming forward. If rape victims weren't reporting you think victims of sexual harassment are? If you were a woman being sexually harassed at work don't you think your first instinct would be to tough it out and not cause a scene?

      It's the pattern that shows up with the majority of the #MeToo cases, one or two women come forward and then half a dozen more suddenly pop up to credibly corroborate their story. And in most of those cases I suspect there's a ton more who never come forward.

      It's not surprising when you think about it, would you really want to call up a reporter to talk about getting sexually harassed? Would you want to risk having your name thrown all over the internet as a victim of sexual harassment?

      So yes, most workplaces have a lot more than 1 sexual harasser in 521 employees, they probably have a lot more than 0.1% of employees harassing. The question with Microsoft isn't whether this is the tip of the iceberg, because it most certainly is. The question is whether their iceberg is unusually large compared to any other organization.

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    7. Re:Rife? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "So yes, most workplaces have a lot more than 1 sexual harasser in 521 employees,"

      I see you subscribe to the Anita Sarkeesian theory of "Everything is sexist."

      The majority of #metoo cases, as far as I'm aware, have no evidence whatsoever. So the dozen who pop up suddenly to corroborate the story aren't really proving anything, they're just agreeing. A suprious claim corroborated by 10 other spurious claims doesn't make it truth.

  2. Idiots make thigns worse by gurps_npc · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I have attended sexual harassment classes. They almost always make things worse.

    The typical problem is described by the words "sexualized their male managers".

    It indicates a huge abuse of the english language, and makes sexual harassment MORE likely, not less. A literal explanation of the meaning is "make sexual". That's simply not true - the men are not taking asexual creatures and making them more sexual.

    Instead, the author is trying to say that the men have no respect for the women and are sexually harassing them. But instead of taking the time to say it clearly, they take a shortcut. But the short cut sounds STUPID to the target market. The evil men do not think their behavior is inappropriate and when you use this short cut, they do not understand what you are saying.

    It's the liberal equivalent of saying "I have a black friend". It makes the speaker look stupid rather than convincing people of the truth.

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  3. Re: First poster to mention SJW gets smacked by Train0987 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And because of that you're going to see a dramatic decrease in the number of women hired in tech.

  4. Re:Women are sexualized by males by gweihir · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It happens to be hardwired in the male brain and it is the central reason the human race still exist. Expecting anything else is pretty stupid. Now, a decent male is polite about it and a decent female understands and forgives the occasional mistake. Decent people of either sex seem to be getting harder to come by though.

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  5. Re:Internal complaints? really? by Comrade+Ogilvy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It is really important to keep changing the rules so we can label the women as always in the wrong.

    If they do not go nuclear by hiring a lawyer and getting the feds involved, instead of attempting to work through company channels, we can cast doubt about whether they "truly believe" there is a problem.

    If they do go nuclear, we can just call them disgruntled employers who never really stood up for themselves and tried to work things out like adults fit to live in the real world.

    The women always lose. That is what is important.

  6. Re: First poster to mention SJW gets smacked by Calydor · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I still think it's a terrible injustice that there are so few female garbage collectors. Where's the feminine outrage that driving garbage trucks is primarily a male-dominated job?

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  7. That would be you by raymorris · · Score: 4, Insightful

    > First poster to mention SJW gets smacked

    That would be you.

    > Nothing more ridiculous than fat, well-paid white men

    The first person to make a racial comment - also you. The first person to disrepair and insult people based on their gender? You. Just put get it over with an put on your KKK hood already since you clearly have no shame about being a racist and a bigot.

  8. Re:Internal complaints? really? by yndrd1984 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If they do not go... If they do go...

    Well, since it's impossible to please everyone, suggestions on both ends of the spectrum will inevitably be made, and you can use this logic to dismiss all of them as stemming from bigotry. All you have to do is pretend that the same people are making both arguments.

    The women always lose. That is what is important.

    Any statement you don't like is misogynistic. That is what is important.

  9. Re: t!ts and d!cks by dbialac · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Honestly, this lawsuit has little to no merit. 125000 employees and there are less than 300 complaints in total over 7 calendar years. That's not a systemic problem. It's a greedy lawyer hoping for a settlement... who forgot Bill Gates was at Harvard studying law.

  10. Re: First poster to mention SJW gets smacked by Dog-Cow · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Actually, men are incentivized to take up nursing as a career. There are perennial complaints of too few male nurses. But of course, you are a knee-jerk asshole who never actually talked to a nurse.

  11. Re: t!ts and d!cks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Bullshit. If they're not reported how do you know?

    You make it up. That's how.