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Zuckerberg On Facebook's Role In Ethnic Cleansing In Myanmar: 'It's a Real Issue' (vox.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Vox: Facebook's fake news problems extend far beyond Russian trolls interfering in U.S. elections. Overseas, false stories have turned into tools of political warfare -- most notably in Myanmar, where government forces have carried out a campaign of ethnic cleansing against the Rohingya, the country's Muslim minority group. In an interview with Vox's Ezra Klein, Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg addressed Facebook's role in fueling and inciting anti-Muslim and anti-Rohingya sentiment. "The Myanmar issues have, I think, gotten a lot of focus inside the company," Zuckerberg said. "And they're real issues and we take this really seriously."
He recalled one incident where Facebook detected that people were trying to spread "sensational messages" through Facebook Messenger to incite violence on both sides of the conflict. He acknowledged that in such instances, it's clear that people are using Facebook "to incite real-world harm." But in this case, at least, the messages were detected and stopped from going through. "This is certainly something that we're paying a lot of attention to," Zuckerberg continued. "It's a real issue, and we want to make sure that all of the tools that we're bringing to bear on eliminating hate speech, inciting violence, and basically protecting the integrity of civil discussions that we're doing in places like Myanmar, as well as places like the U.S. that do get a disproportionate amount of the attention."
He recalled one incident where Facebook detected that people were trying to spread "sensational messages" through Facebook Messenger to incite violence on both sides of the conflict. He acknowledged that in such instances, it's clear that people are using Facebook "to incite real-world harm." But in this case, at least, the messages were detected and stopped from going through. "This is certainly something that we're paying a lot of attention to," Zuckerberg continued. "It's a real issue, and we want to make sure that all of the tools that we're bringing to bear on eliminating hate speech, inciting violence, and basically protecting the integrity of civil discussions that we're doing in places like Myanmar, as well as places like the U.S. that do get a disproportionate amount of the attention."
Keep your damn mouth shut!
Zuckerberg's mouth is like on of those gigantic backhoes in strip mines that you see on EXtreme TV documentaries . . .
. . . he keeps digging himself deeper, and deeper . . . and deeper . . .
Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
What a joke. You can't police so called 'hate speech' whatever that is and also protect anything, the more they stick their fingers into things the worse it gets.
Protection of speech means allowing everything and letting us decide for ourselves, we are fully capable of telling the wingnuts and assholes from reasoned discussion.
They are so desperate to control the narrative 'for your protection', its scary. Go ahead and cull the outright incitements to immediate violence but leave the rest and let us decide.
What if the www never existed and the same thing was done through netnews?
Connecting people to engage in war
This is what happens when you destroy the original culture of the internet and replace it with a centralized authoritarian model which by the way is built to feed on narcissism.
Which happens to be exactly what FB did. And what 2 billion people and counting happily voted for.
Same kind of hate in the US led to a Bernie supporter opening fire on a group of congressmen at a charity baseball game.
Zuck's so glib about it.
These people are invaders from another country, and the government has every right to send them back to where they came from. Something goddamn Europe should do with the foreign invaders claiming to be 'refugees'. please!
Much as I dislike Zuck, I do sympathize with him insofar as he is between a rock and a hard place. Keep his mouth shut, and someone else can take control of the narrative and successfully smear him as dangerously uncaring on top of that. Open his mouth, and the issue gets more complicated and stays in the news.
I can't wait until I get a thought filter!
I wouldn't want to say the wrong thing.
Social Justice Hoooooooooooo!
He is probably getting a bit desperate there. Obviously this is one more attempt at distracting people from the extreme political mess he just had a part in. But selecting something this stupid as a distraction is impressive. Well, in the end, the harder he falls, the better for everybody.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
...is to encourage behaviour from its users that is as divisive as possible. Or what Facebook calls "engagement.' Inciting indignant outrage and creating conflict between users and groups of users keeps them on the platform so that they see more adverts and so the money rolls into Facebook's coffers. Facebook's business model is the opposite of the Silicon Valley mantra "Making the world a better place."
The famous philosopher of science who gave us the modern scientific method, Karl Popper, had a great insight into intolerance, i.e. that we should be intolerant of intolerance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... I think we can arguably view Facebook's business model as just one gigantic "meta-troll" that cultivates troll-like behaviour in its users (Not everyone becomes a troll but everyone is exposed to extreme, divisive troll-like episodes).
If we want to have more constructive public discourse in areas of conflict, it's probably better to ban Facebook in them. And if we want to make the world a better place, how about banning Facebook altogether. Let's be intolerant of a platform that breeds intolerance.
Debate is a form of harassment. Do not question my truth.
He recalled one incident where Facebook detected that people were trying to spread "sensational messages" through Facebook Messenger to incite violence on both sides of the conflict. He acknowledged that in such instances, it's clear that people are using Facebook "to incite real-world harm." But in this case, at least, the messages were detected and stopped from going through.
Hang on there, I thought that Messenger was end-to-end encrypted. Someone help me out here—I can see how FB could become aware of these messages (abuse reports), but how could messages in an end-to-end encryption setup be 'detected and stopped from going through'?
Crumb's Corollary: Never bring a knife to a bun fight.
Facebook spreads hates and help militias
Zuckerberg gets richer by the day
As Muslims oppress the Rohingyas
Burma-Shave
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
Protection of speech means allowing everything and letting us decide for ourselves
Go ahead and cull the outright incitements
Contradicted yourself within 3 sentences. Good job.
Captcha: connect. lol facebook.
What a joke. You can't police so called 'hate speech' whatever that is and also protect anything, the more they stick their fingers into things the worse it gets.
Protection of speech means allowing everything and letting us decide for ourselves, we are fully capable of telling the wingnuts and assholes from reasoned discussion.
They are so desperate to control the narrative 'for your protection', its scary. Go ahead and cull the outright incitements to immediate violence but leave the rest and let us decide.
We have a natural right to make use of our pens as of our tongue, at our peril, risk and hazard. - Voltaire
Pretty sure "Here's a pen, some letterhead with my name on it, and borrow my soapbox too." was said by no one, ever.
Until the Internet Entitlement Age it was also not expected.
Awesome memo, dude!
God damn you are an idiot! Death squads motivated by facebook fueled messaging are still fucking death squads!
Karma, and such...
Boz says that death squads shooting and raping and torturing is a small price to pay for the De Facto Good of connecting the world under the caring wings of FB. In fact, it is so good that FB will cheerfully swindle users out of their personal data with purposefully confusing language around permissions and authorization. FB lies to us for our own good. We should be grateful...
This is just one example of the actual impact of enabling the spread of hate to a ready-made audience. Terrorism groups use marketing techniques the same as Apple, and due to the crimes committed as result that marketing must be subject to controls. Moral leadership of a large company requires recognizing these issues and treating them in a way that keeps the core business intact. If they are the core business then the firm itself is illegal, immoral, and deserves destruction. Facebook isn't evil though, and this is a sign that the firm recognizes its influence and limits it to prevent hate-fueled murders. These techniques must be developed, implemented, and used to keep Facebook a tool for communication not murder and violence.
Rather then take the position that social media had nothing to do with ethnic cleansing, this douche not only acknowledged his role in it but the need for further control to prevent such speech. The two are not related. Curtailing speech would NOT have changed this.
Guy is a virtue signaling asshat.
Ethnic cleansing in Myanmar: oh no!
Ethnic cleansing in South Africa: ?????
All you bleeding hearts getting but hurt about genocide need to pull the logs out of your eyeballs. You probably have a clean house. A clean house means you just waged a genocidal war against germs. If you can so glibly kill billions of germs with you industrials strength genocidal disinfectant, why are turnuou being so hard on people that want to cl3anse the world of undesirable people (such as people that look different than you)
Germ lives matter explanation point.
God damn you idiots need to get some actual education or at least a desire to search for information rather than support for preexisting biases. You could, easily, click on the damn link for the article! There were instances of specific messaging found using Facebook services to commit crimes, violating terms of use even before the moral impact is observed. Facebook as a company doesn't exist it enable murder, and you need to remember that you exist as part of a society subject to self-preservation such that enabling murder is universally immoral.
Is conveniently ignored, guess it's because the people being cleansed are white.
Short of Facebook withholding all posted content from view until it's reviewed and approved by staff, they can't prevent this misuse of their service.
Mark Zuckerberg never imagined that his creation would or even could be used in this way. It was never a consideration. The reason Facebook has no plan is because there's no plan to be had.
I think the violence against Muslims in Myanmar needs to be covered much more thoroughly in world media. I mean, we've got cameras rigged to give you the same view of a professional football game as the players, but I can't get a highlight reel of Rohingya women and children getting 360 no-scoped by Buddhist monks on the nightly news? I thought we were still operating under "if it bleeds, it leads", how am I supposed to watch things die from a good, safe distance if the news won't cover it?
Bad guys use infrastructure.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro" -- HST
Keep your damn mouth shut!
Zuckerberg's mouth is like on of those gigantic backhoes in strip mines that you see on EXtreme TV documentaries . . .
. . . he keeps digging himself deeper, and deeper . . . and deeper . . .
Zuck called me a minute ago. He says that's a real issue.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Much as I dislike Zuck, I do sympathize with him insofar as he is between a rock and a hard place. Keep his mouth shut, and someone else can take control of the narrative and successfully smear him as dangerously uncaring on top of that. Open his mouth, and the issue gets more complicated and stays in the news.
Poor lad. He took the worst of both. He is dangerously uncaring, has lost control of the narrative, and isn't going to be out of the news for a long time. If he hasn't spoken to Mueller's team yet, I'm sure he will be summoned soon. He's probably a bit frightened, and he almost certainly has a damn good reason to be.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
What a joke. You can't police so called 'hate speech' whatever that is and also protect anything, the more they stick their fingers into things the worse it gets.
Protection of speech means allowing everything and letting us decide for ourselves, we are fully capable of telling the wingnuts and assholes from reasoned discussion.
They are so desperate to control the narrative 'for your protection', its scary. Go ahead and cull the outright incitements to immediate violence but leave the rest and let us decide.
Doesn't work that way laddie. That nasty accessory to a crime is kinda a sticky point. Remember that free speech allows you to say anything you want. But people have free speech to react, and free speech is not an insulation for breaking laws. Or extradition to a country where you enabled it. Has very little to do with protecting "us"
Bummer that, but hey, he took the money for the news and ads.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
... those data provided to a FB game called Serialkiller.com which correlate to actual murders.
Yes Zuck, what next ?
Doesn't work that way laddie. That nasty accessory to a crime is kinda a sticky point.
What does this mean? How specifically is "hate speech" an "accessory to a crime"? What crime?
and free speech is not an insulation for breaking laws
What laws?
Meanwhile, Facebook provides a ready-made toolkit with staff support, to anyone who wants to harass and silence LGBT people: Report an innocuous photo of two gay men, or a homoerotic drawing, and Farcebook's often-homophobic censors will respond by blocking the user who posted it, for "nudity" or "sexual content". Each subsequent report silences the targeted user for an increasing period of time: 1 day, 3 days, 7 days, 30 days. And since these blocks cannot be appealed by anything less than a personal Act of Zuck, there's no way to get them overturned or the reporting accounts reprimanded, let alone to get the complicit censors – who are violating official FB policies – fired.
Does he though?
It's literally all in the terms and conditions that the idiot's accept so that they can share cat photos and talk about what they had for lunch.
It's kind of tiring to see fads make such impact because lol farmville like omg.
There is not escaping the reality. It was a plan to push the truthiness of Facebook, a reality social media forum, pushing it's users to accept Facebook content as real and true, so the users accept the idea and put more of the real lives onto Facebook, so that the content could be data mined and to hook people into keeping logged in as much as possible to keep up with what is going on in their digital lives. They pushed hard to make Facebook reality based for datamining and to create a real sense of consequence and risk of loss in not keeping up to data and continually posting, a pretty sick plan.
Even Facebook had chosen to go more fun, more make believe, more pleasantly social, social media, the hooks would not have dug as deep, the reaction to content would mostly be humour and they would have had a whole lot less to data mine. Facebook was made as dangerous as it is, on purpose as a business model, to sell the mind control of it's users to advertisers. Now it is trying to whine about how what it set up on purpose to do, was abused by others, yeah, they were not meant to do that, by design only Facebook executives and the advertising department were meant to do that.
Facebook ain't a social media company, it is a psychopath media company, a company run as psychopath alternate reality media company, an extremely dangerous and disruptive media company. Remember MySpace, that was just ugly on the outside, horrible to look at, clearly Facebook is ugly on the inside, looks pretty but seriously socially ugly on the inside. A closet supporter of terrorism because it generates huge numbers of page views, likely a criminal closet supporter of terrorism, I wonder if they have numbers for how much profit, what kind of terrorist attacks generate, so many died, so many views, so many ads served, most profitable attack locations, most profitable methods of attack.
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
I don't like Trump much, but as far as I can tell this is far worse. Whatever happened in the US did not cause the military and para-military death squads to start killing all the Mexicans or force them back over the border and burn their neighborhoods.
Does he though?
It's literally all in the terms and conditions that the idiot's accept so that they can share cat photos and talk about what they had for lunch.
It's kind of tiring to see fads make such impact because lol farmville like omg.
It's what people do with the data. Let's say I'm a Typical Youtube user. So I've given them my age, where I went to school, my address, my interests. Now this is probably not too good, but it is what it is.
So now Facebook has that data. They sell the data to people. So let's say they sell data to Cambridge Analytica. The issue was that the 2016 election wasn't the first time FB and CA were in bed together. And CA was supposed to wipe the data. They didn't. And they targeted ads to specific places and people.
So now we have two things going on here. Unlees you believe in the opposite of Occams razor, Cambridge Analytica has been caught red handed in bragging about their tactics wiht a plant hwo was posing as a potential customer. So now the evidence is pretty clear that Ukrainian hookers are a part of the package, and that's pretty sleazy, along with their other tactics.
So here in the US, Betty Q Public and her neighbor Joe Wedgie might have not cared if their data was used to let Proctor and Gamble know what type of soap, Oil companies what kind of oil, and even sex toys, start to feel really uncomfortable. Some of the rest of us start to feel uncomfortable about an English company working to influence elections, and companies not wanting any part of that crap. When some outfit leaves a turd in th punchbowl, it kinda screws up all the punch.
So yeah, There are some thorny legal questions here in the US that have to be settled. In addition, there is an investigation that has only trickled out just wht it knows. That's part 1
Next, remember that not every country is the Us of A. So If some country finds that he's the provider and enabler of fomenting discord, they might just want to talk to him with great vigor.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Does the ToS mention genocide?
Go look up incitement to violence and conspiracy to crime.
fuck off ivan
In theology, there allegedly is an agent of incitement to sin. However, the $Deity doesn't persecute the agent, nor the agent bears any guilt. The potential (or actual) sinner has full responsibility, having an independent free will.
Criminalizing incitement is just an attempt to get back to annoying and malicious people, as well as to cut some slack to criminals deemed unlikely, to remove some burden of responsibility from their shoulder. Or maybe the lawmakers just don't want people to become more weary of manipulation and distrustful of influencers, so instead they choose to go after opportunists, wolves, who take advantage of that trait nourished in the sheepish by the shepherds.
There is no actual evidence that diversity is a strength(or positive) and in fact many examples of just the reverse..
Diversity is toughness against tailored attacks. Nothing more, nothing less. However, there has to be at least a minimal common base of cohesive attitudes among all elements of diversity for it to show the benefit. Intolerance, and attempts to segregate and purge, damages those cohesive attitudes if they existed. However, in some cases it is doubtful and subject to controversies if that minimum was there to start with, or if it is possible to build it. Most everyone, knowing nothing in advance, assumes that others are essentially, or mostly, having same core values as themselves. However, some discrepancies are insurmountable. And I am not talking about cultures here. We can witness here on this forum that among people of the same culture there are major differences.
> we are fully capable of telling the wingnuts and assholes from reasoned discussion.
Evidence on the ground refute this observation. But I suppose you are in that group that does not care about anything other that your right to be a windbag.
No doubt this is bad. But FB did not cause it, it had a small part in some of the propaganda that was used to start it and purely as a communications platform. You are missing the point here.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
And if that were true, it would be really bad. But the idiot here is you: FB had a very small part in this thing and it did not really play an active role. Hence it is fundamentally different.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
the idiot's accept
Oh dear.
I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
And of course, most "hate speech" laws just turn out to be used against those the government just does not like, by redefining its meaning at their convenience.
At the end, it's not worth the risk. Let the devil talk, and I'll just ignore him.
If someone writes a threat on a piece of paper, is it that paper manufacturer who is to blame? Or the store that sold the paper? Of the company that made the pen? No, it is not.
I for one welcome our new I.T. closet cleaner overlord.
Free speech is free speech. People just need to grow smarter.
If someone is swindled by fake news itâ(TM)s just their own dumb fault. Donâ(TM)t blame Facebook the day you lose your freedom. Donâ(TM)t blame Russians.... blame your own stupidity.
Question.... would you sacrifice Free Speech to Stop Fake News?
Is Facebook doing the right thing by implementing censorship?
If Facebook is now the primary way we communicate then doesnâ(TM)t censoring Facebook violate our rights?
"t's say I'm a Typical Youtube user. So I've given them my age, where I went to school, my address, my interests"
I am an idiot, please help me nanny state. I stubbed my little toe.
By their new standards, it seems like the Declaration of Independence, the Federalist Papers, or the Lincoln - Douglas debates would need to be censored for our protection.
Well, I don't know who you are, so I can't judge the truth of the statement that "we" are able to tell the difference between reason and hate-mongering propaganda, but if by "we" you mean "people in general", your argument doesn't hold up.
When I was a teenager I had dinner at the house of an older Jewish couple; the other guests were an elderly German couple who knew my Jewish friends through classical music circles. The German couple was old enough to remember living under the Nazis, and when the conversation turned that way these very nice people made it very clear that in the 1940s they'd have turned in any Jews they'd known were hiding. They wanted me to understand that even respectable, cultured, intelligent people can be brainwashed.
Look around you. People are perfectly willing to go along with stupid, vicious, even incoherent ideas as long as there are a lot of other people doing it. Most people's behavior isn't governed by religion, or their professed philosophical principles; it's governed by what appears normal to them.
The reason that government censorship doesn't work isn't because people are wise and thoughtful; it's because government censorship spitting into the wind of perceived normalcy. However, shaming racist bullshit and shunning the people repeating it is very effective.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Salty Hillshill is salty. It was #HERTURN!!!!!11111
The problem in this case is not that he spoke... the problem is that he's shit at it.
Frightened of what? He isn't going to get dragged away in handcuffs, that doesn't happen to C-level people.
And if Basefuck went tits-up tomorrow he's probably got more money down the back of the couch than most people make in a lifetime.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
(a) Whoever aids, abets, counsels, commands, induces or procures the commission of an offense, is punishable as a principal.
(b) Whoever willfully causes an act to be done which if directly performed by him or another would be an offense, is punishable as a principal.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
How utterly pathetic. What "elections" were those? (Plural). What does "interfering" mean?
Why has none of the news media ever posted pictures of these "interfering" Facebook posts? Strange that, isn't it...
What "ethnic cleansing" in Myanmar are they talking about? Do they mean "millions of muslims forced themselves into Myanmar and committed endless crimes against the indigenous population, who eventually got fed up and started fighting back"?
'The Rohingya Psyops: Waging Covert War on Myanmar':
https://off-guardian.org/2017/09/19/the-rohingya-psyops-waging-covert-war-on-myanmar/