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US' Proposed China Tariffs Would Target Robotics, Satellites (engadget.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Engadget: The U.S. Trade Representative has published the list of Chinese products that would be subject to its proposed tech tariffs, and there are a few clear themes. The move would hike the costs of about 1,300 products, including industrial robots, communication satellites, spacecraft and a slew of semiconductors.The aim, as before, is to punish China for allegedly goading American companies into transferring their patents and technology to Chinese firms for the sake of claiming economic superiority. The USTR claimed the proposed tariffs would stymie Chinese plans while "minimizing the impact" on the American economy. The tariffs are still subject to a 60-day notice process that would include public comments until May 11th and a public hearing on May 15th.
Importing cheap semiconductors to the EU, designing and assembling my technology in Romania and then selling the finished product to the US could well be cheaper and more profitable than producing it in China and importing it directly from China to the US because the tariffs are going to even out the cents I have to pay the Romanians more? And all that without risking having my designs stolen so the Chinese could crank out cheap knockoffs?
On behalf of the EU, I wish to express my gratitude towards dear leader across the pond.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
We are not in a trade war with China, that war was lost many years ago by the foolish, or incompetent, people who represented the U.S. Now we have a Trade Deficit of $500 Billion a year, with Intellectual Property Theft of another $300 Billion. We cannot let this continue!
When you’re already $500 Billion DOWN, you can’t lose!
And this folks, is what leadership has come to mean today.
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The US has a trade imbalance with China... that means the US imports more from China than China does from the US. Therefore, quid pro quo... the US can deny China more revenue than China can deny the US.
Sure, the US can hurt ITSELF by denying ITSELF Chinese goods which the US ITSELF makes more expensive in the US through tariffs. However, with really no exceptions there are comparable trade partners that can offer the same good at either the same or very similar price point.
What is more, there really isn't anything China produces that has to come from China. They don't own any IP that anyone cares about. The only reason anyone does anything in China is mostly due to low labor costs which are less relevant now for two reasons. First, Chinese labor costs have been going up such that labor costs are often cheaper somewhere else if that is important. And second, the rise of automation is rendering the relevance of labor costs of that type... less relevant.
Will tariffs help US producers? Maybe. They can and they sometimes don't. It is complicated. There are countries with very high tariffs that have absolutely flat-lined manufacturing... which results in things being more expensive for consumers without any pay off in terms of domestic production. Then there are places where tariffs are hugely helpful to domestic production.
A big part of the controversy so far as I can see if that there is a myth about "free trade"... that it is "the american way" and that "it actually exists anywhere". Historically, the US Federal Government funded itself principally from tariffs. This didn't really stop until the Cold War when very generous trade deals were offered as an inducement for fence sitting nations to join the "first world". For reference, first world during the Cold War referred to any nation allied with the US. Second world referred to any nation allied with the Soviet Union. Third world referred to any nation not allied with either the US or Soviet Union. Regardless, "free trade" was a marketing term the US used to brand its trade deals. The US was branding everything it did as "free" something. Freedom fighters, Free World, Free Trade etc. US Free Trade doctrine was only created to put pressure on the Soviets and has really no purpose in the 21st century unless again applied to serve some kind of geopolitical agenda. Instead, the US is applying the concept mindlessly with no particular purpose. Its cited as "the american way" like its something essential to American values when any fool that looks at history can see when it came around and why. Second, ACTUAL free trade only exists domestically within certain nations and doesn't really exist in any international context and never did. Trade is conditional. The US doesn't have free trade with Mexico and Canada through NAFTA much less with anyone else. And neither does any other country.
China has higher tariffs on US goods into China than the US does on Chinese goods into the US... and that was before Trump or any of this current bullshit.
Restrictions are happening everywhere all the time for various reasons. Some of the restrictions are a matter of law and policy and some are a subtle consequence of process or relationship. The net effect either way is that goods don't flow freely. They're restricted and regulated and taxed and have quotas applied etc.
US goods when they go nearly anywhere are limited in some way. US goods to Japan for example sometimes ROT on the pier because the Japanese want to protect their domestic market by limiting US trade. Countries come up with all sorts of pretexts to do it. Health and safety is a popular one. Differing regulatory standards which are approved at time X and then suddenly are questioned at X+1 at the worst possible time fucking over who ever chanced the market.
As regards China specifically, their fast and loose treatment of trade agreements, business agreements, licensing, intellectual property... etc is well known at this point. We're due a big shift in trade relationships with
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
Importing cheap semiconductors to the EU, designing and assembling my technology in Romania and then selling the finished product to the US could well be cheaper and more profitable than producing it in China and importing it directly from China to the US because the tariffs are going to even out the cents I have to pay the Romanians more? And all that without risking having my designs stolen so the Chinese could crank out cheap knockoffs?
On behalf of the EU, I wish to express my gratitude towards dear leader across the pond.
Don't discount the economic damage done by the cheap knockoff process - it's so common that it's become a meme. It's nigh impossible for anyone to make electronics in China any more, even small hobbyist designers (think Adafruit and Sparkfun) get their products copied and sold for pennies.
Then there's the direct theft of IP (trade secrets, business practices, and such) that the FBI estimates at $600B/year.
Then there's selling steel and aluminum at below-market prices until our domestic producers go out of business (at last count, we had one steel foundry left that was capable of making the steel plates needed for military hardware).
Then there's the lack of IP enforcement, so that lots of Chinese run pirated code and view bootleg media without paying for it.
Then there's "thousand grains of sand", where Chinese students and scientists (in the US) coming back to their country are encouraged to bring one or two small pieces of technological or scientific information.
Then there's keeping their currency artificially low, so that we always have a trade deficit with them (they end up getting more and more of our money).
China has consistently violated their trade agreement in every possible way, and has done so for decades.
We're *already* in a trade war, it's only just now that we're doing something about it.