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Creeping Lava Now Threatens Major Hawaiian Power Plant (gizmodo.com)

Posted by BeauHD on from the steady-as-she-goes dept.

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Gizmodo: Molten lava from Hawaii's Kilauea volcano has entered the grounds of Puna Geothermal Venture, a geothermal power plant that provides about 25 percent of the Big Island's power. The 38 Megawatt Puna Geothermal Venture (PGV) power plant, which is located in the east rift zone of the Kilauea volcano, was shut down soon after the eruptions began on May 3. Yesterday, lava from Fissure 22 came to within 820 feet (250 meters) of the plant's nearest well pad before stalling, as Reuters reports. Overnight, workers managed to cap the 11th and final well at the facility in anticipation of the lava eventually reaching the facility, and to prevent the uncontrollable release of toxic gases. Mercifully, the lava flow stopped at a ridge near the PGV plant, but as the events of the past two weeks have shown, Mount Kilauea is in an extremely volatile state. The HCCD said Fissure 22 is producing most of the lava feeding the flows, so the situation near the power plant remains precarious.

40 of 68 comments (clear)

  1. To be expected by Mal-2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Geothermal power always has the liability that it sits on geologically active ground. Sure the lava will go some other direction most of the time, but the law of averages says it's always going to be a risk.

    --
    How is the Riemann zeta function like Trump rallies? Both have an endless number of trivial zeros.
    1. Re:To be expected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, but as Americans we get no such luck.
      Unlike the Icelanders, Americans lack the cool and efficient northern European efficiency and deliberation.

    2. Re:To be expected by NicknameUnavailable · · Score: 1

      Geothermal power always has the liability that it sits on geologically active ground. Sure the lava will go some other direction most of the time, but the law of averages says it's always going to be a risk.

      It's not even the law of averages - it's inevitable if there is lava flowing. Lava flows downhill, it then solidifies and "downhill" is redefined relative to the point from which it flows for the next eruption. Very rarely do volcanic islands form with a moving hotspot powerful enough to ensure an island forms and that it only grows on one side.

    3. Re:To be expected by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Informative

      But that has always worked for Iceland.

      You can't directly compare Hawaii and Iceland. Iceland's volcanoes are more "felsic", which means they contain more silicates and are more viscous. So they flow more slowly and this makes them easier to divert by ditching, and cooling with hoses to create walls of solidified lava.

      Kilauea in Hawaii is a classic "mafic" volcano. The lava is low in silicates, and less viscous. It flows like water, very rapidly. It also is harder to solidify. Kilauea's lava solidifies into basalt at about 985 C. Iceland's lava will solidify at about 1200 C, and will start to get gooey at even higher temps.

    4. Re:To be expected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, but as Americans we get no such luck.
      Unlike the Icelanders, Americans lack the cool and efficient northern European efficiency and deliberation.

      The good news is that being so close to an active volcano means that Hawaii has a convenient place to dump all its fat chicks!

    5. Re:To be expected by jfdavis668 · · Score: 2

      Welcome to Earth. Local time is 10:37. We know you have your choice of portals, so thank you for choosing the Burns Hellport, a division of Gulf and Western.

    6. Re:To be expected by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

      Well duh, just look at a globe they're on the top of the world, the lava always flows away, downhill!

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    7. Re:To be expected by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Informative

      You joke, but I'm wondering why they couldn't have built it on higher ground.

      A big reason is that the upper slopes of Kilauea are inside a national park. Only the lower areas around Pahoa are private land available for commercial development.

      Volcanoes National Park

    8. Re:To be expected by Mal-2 · · Score: 1

      I get a vision of the bomb-riding cowboy scene in Dr. Strangelove, only it's Dr. Smallglove atop the bomb being dropped into the portal in the White House lawn.

      --
      How is the Riemann zeta function like Trump rallies? Both have an endless number of trivial zeros.
    9. Re: To be expected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The powers that be wanted PGV in the rift zone. Locals taught for years to place it in a safer location. But they were ignored.

    10. Re:To be expected by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

      The higher you go - the closer to the volcano you get. That's the way the lava flows!

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    11. Re:To be expected by mnemotronic · · Score: 1

      But that has always worked for Iceland.

      You can't directly compare Hawaii and Iceland. Iceland's volcanoes are more "felsic", which means they contain more silicates and are more viscous.

      ... snipsnip...

      So if I wanted to try glassblowing techniques with lava, would the felsic be better? Never mind the obvious gas and heat exposure for now.

      --
      The Russians have won. They have made the world a cesspool of distrust, greed, fear and hate.
    12. Re:To be expected by cheekyboy · · Score: 1

      Dont you mean the FBI informants who are comitting treason?

      https://www.zerohedge.com/news...

      --
      Liberty freedom are no1, not dicks in suits.
  2. Emergency Power Ship by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    How about it Tesla? Batteries, ready to spread solar power plant, multiplicity of connector types on a ship, always ready go in the case of a emergency. Cities are hard to keep safe if the water pressure drops enough for a week or more.

    1. Re:Emergency Power Ship by Solandri · · Score: 2, Informative

      How about it Tesla? Batteries, ready to spread solar power plant, multiplicity of connector types on a ship, always ready go in the case of a emergency.

      Geothermal has a capacity factor of about 0.7. So the 38 MW the plant is rated for generates on average (38MW)*(0.7) = 26.6 MW.

      Solar at Hawaii's location (96704 zip code) has a capacity factor of about 0.124 (this takes into account night, seasons, movement of the sun, weather, maintenance, etc). So generating 26.6 MW would require (26.6 MW)/(0.124) = 215 MW of installed nameplate capacity. That would make it the 18th largest PV solar plant in the U.S.

      Assuming you're using commerical 180 W/m^2 panels, this would mean 1.195 million m^2 of solar panels, or 1.195 km^2 of panels alone. Or 67 Panamax-size container ships ( 66 meters x 49 meters) completely covered on PV panels to replace this single geothermal plant.

      If you allow space to account for maintenance and tilt to the angle of the sun, the PV solar plants in this capacity range seem to cover about 5-10 km^2. So now you're talking about 280-560 Panamax-sized ships with solar panels on them to replace this single geothermal plant.

      Or put another way, a single Panamax-sized ship with every upward-facing surface covered in solar panels would only generate (366 meters)*(49 meters)*(180 W/m^2)*(0.124) = 400287 Watts = 0.4 MW on average at this location. The average U.S. home uses 10,766 kWh per year, or an average of (10766 kWh) / (1 year) = 1481 Watts. So your one ship would be enough to power about 270 homes. There are already 10,000 people evacuated, which if you assume 4 per home is 2500 homes.

      People *vastly* overestimate the power density of solar. Mobile solar is stupid unless you can drastically reduce your power consumption. Effective use of solar requires large areas of cheap land.

    2. Re:Emergency Power Ship by Dare+nMc · · Score: 1

      Your link shows new panamax as 366 m long, so you could put 3 MW of panels on each one of those, with all of the maintenance area under the deck, I feel like this would still be pretty awesome setup, to have but yeah rediculous.

      Because it would still be 100 of those to meet this capacity, even if you could do these for $3 M each, it would be a $300 M fleet.

      I think a diesel tanker is more reasonable for about $6M you would have a much easier time strapping a 7 * 3MW diesel gene-sets, that can be bought commercially probably for a little over $500k each and put on a diesel tanker that would then have no problem producing the needed power for a month.

    3. Re:Emergency Power Ship by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      Solar at Hawaii's location (96704 zip code) has a capacity factor of about 0.124

      Different areas of Hawaii have dramatically different capacity factors. Some of the cloudiest and wettest places on earth are just over a mountain range from some of the clearest and driest. Just on the Big Island, Hilo has rain almost every day, while just 20 miles away is the Pohakuloa Plateau, in the rain shadow of Mauna Kea, which is arid desert.

    4. Re:Emergency Power Ship by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Solar at Hawaii's location [nrel.gov] (96704 zip code) has a capacity factor of about 0.124 (this takes into account night, seasons, movement of the sun, weather, maintenance, etc).

      Of course, when you intentionally pick one of the worst places on the island, naturally you get such a mediocre result.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    5. Re:Emergency Power Ship by Erikderzweite · · Score: 1

      On the other hand, "Akademik Lomonosov" powership has twice the needed capacity (2x 32 MW reactors).

    6. Re:Emergency Power Ship by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      I found another non-top-of-a-volcano place with +50% percent generation compared to the originally proposed place. Maybe one could start with that?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    7. Re:Emergency Power Ship by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Geothermal has a capacity factor of about 0.7. So the 38 MW the plant is rated for generates on average (38MW)*(0.7) = 26.6 MW.

      Probably because people at night need less power and hence the plan is not running with full load during that time.
      No idea why people throw the "dreaded CF" around when they have no clue what it means and what can calculate from it.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
  3. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I don't know... If I was going to encase critical uranium inside something to contain the radiation, underneath hundreds of tons of molten rock seems like a pretty safe place to put it.

  4. Re:I saw that movie by bobbied · · Score: 1

    It was just CGI over a model doused in gasoline and set alight...

    --
    "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  5. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by mark-t · · Score: 1

    Where had you heard that the geothermal plant had triggered it?

    --
    File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
  6. Re:I saw that movie by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 1

    too.

      It blows up real good!

    Spoiler alert: Most of the cast gets away on a re-floated pirate ship, buoyed by air pumped in from Captain Nemo's submarine. Sadly, the captain himself meets his demise, still manning the air pumps as his submarine is destroyed by the volcanic eruption.

  7. Hot Java by Tablizer · · Score: 1

    I misread it as "creeping Java", and thought it was about a software boondoggle for power plant infrastructure control.

    Here's a fun conspiracy: the PHB's are trying to hide their software flub but triggering a volcano to cover it up: literally and figuratively. Kind of a HI version of Office Space.

    --
    Table-ized A.I.
  8. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    big island could of become big Chernobyl

  9. Bulldozer? by OYAHHH · · Score: 1

    Um, Why hasn't a concerted effort been made to build a berm uphill from the power plant to divert the lava?

    --
    Caution: Contents under pressure
    1. Re:Bulldozer? by bobbied · · Score: 1

      Um, Why hasn't a concerted effort been made to build a berm uphill from the power plant to divert the lava?

      Well, I'm guessing it's an environmental concern.... :)

      Actually, I don't think a berm would be fully effective. Lava does flow down hill, but it is pretty viscous and solidifies as it cools so it tends to fill up channels it's flowing in over time. So if the berm was slowing down the flow enough, it could pretty quickly get topped, making the effort useless..

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    2. Re:Bulldozer? by painandgreed · · Score: 3, Informative

      Um, Why hasn't a concerted effort been made to build a berm uphill from the power plant to divert the lava?

      Soon after the eruption started, there was an article that discussed this and the answer is probably that it wouldn't do any good. Lava is more like a wall of rock coming at you than a wave of water. It will push through or over most anything in its way. The amount of work needed to build a berm that would have a suitable enough chance to divert the lava flow is probably not possible in the time given or worth the effort needed.

    3. Re:Bulldozer? by sphealey · · Score: 2

      http://www.civilbeat.org/2018/...
      Lava erupting from the Kilauea volcano has reached the property of a geothermal power plant where toxic gas lurks in underground wells, the head of the state emergency management agency said Monday.

      So far, a berm has halted the advance of the lava at about 200 to 300 meters from the wells of Puna Geothermal Venture.

    4. Re: Bulldozer? by Nidi62 · · Score: 1

      Should obviously do what Tommy Lee Jones did. Use concrete highway barriers to build a wall held up by firetrucks and people to stop the lava, then use controlled demolition on a skyscraper to reroute the lava into the ocean. Doesn't anyone pay attention to history?

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    5. Re:Bulldozer? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Then there is the legal system. Lava flowing naturally is an act of god. Lava flowing after diversion is someone's fault.

    6. Re:Bulldozer? by mu51c10rd · · Score: 1

      Hmmm...someone watched the movie Volcano too many times.

      The lava in Hawaii can run over any obstacle...including its own walls. These are the "breakouts" you may hear about...when the lava pours over the solidified wall it built earlier. Creating a dirt or rock berm is not going to stop the lava flows.

  10. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1

    Or Big Bikini. The atoll, not the mammary support garment.

  11. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by Sloppy · · Score: 2

    I'm just glad it's not a puppy preserve! Imagine cute little puppies running around yelping as they burn to death. Ugh. We really lucked out this time.

    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
  12. Re:Good thing it's not an Nuclear power plant! by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

    It's only logical... If YOU had a big thick pipe rammed into your side, wouldn't you be upset?

    --
    Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
  13. Re:respect Pele, haole! by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

    But 'Murikans can enrol into the Elf School on Iceland, can't they? (Of course it costs some $$$, but hey...)

    --
    Ezekiel 23:20
  14. Much useful information at Civil Beat by sphealey · · Score: 3, Informative

    Much useful information in this article at Hawaii Civil Beat: http://www.civilbeat.org/2018/...

    Short quote (there's a lot more at the link):

    Over the past two weeks, 10 wells have been quenched, and capped with a heavy steel plate. The work required removing the massive wellhead valves tested to resist 3,000 pounds per square inch of pressure, something that will now be accomplished by a column of water more than a mile high to resist lava entry into the well underground.

    That’s the working theory anyway, and company and government emergency management officials consulted experts worldwide from New Zealand to California to Iceland on the best response to imminent lava inundation.

    The trouble is, “to our knowledge, no one’s faced this before,” Travis said.

    The last wellhead – Well 14 – stymied all efforts Monday to quench and cap the well. More than a mile of cold water was not enough. Ditto more than a mile of denser salt water.

    “Something has happened down there in the last two weeks that won’t let it (quench),” Travis said.

    Drilling mud, a highly complex and heavyweight chemical compound used extensively in oilfield drilling, is the next line of attack. Travis was confident the mud would work because it hardens and thickens under heat and pressure, he said.

    1. Re:Much useful information at Civil Beat by Harlequin80 · · Score: 1

      At a guess because the well walls will fracture before the top pops off. Steam will push through the rock fracturing it as it goes and diverting the pressure to other areas.