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Mars Opportunity Rover Is In Danger of Dying From a Dust Storm (engadget.com)

According to NASA, the Mars Opportunity rover is currently trying to survive an intensifying dust storm on the red planet. "The storm's atmospheric opacity -- the veil of dust blowing around, which can blot out sunlight -- is now much worse than a 2007 storm that Opportunity weathered," reports NASA. "The previous storm had an opacity level, or tau, somewhere above 5.5; this new storm had an estimated tau of 10.8 as of Sunday morning." Engadget reports: The storm was first detected on Friday June 1st by the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter, at which point the rover's team was notified because of the weather event's proximity to Opportunity. The rover uses solar panels, so a dust storm could have an extremely negative impact on Opportunity's power levels and its batteries. By Wednesday June 6th, Opportunity was in minimal operations mode because of sharply decreasing power levels. The brave little rover is continuing to weather the storm; it sent a transmission back to Earth Sunday morning, which is a good sign. It means there's still enough charge left in the batteries to communicate with home, despite the fact that the storm is continuing to worsen.

105 comments

  1. Obligatory XKCD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    "The brave little rover": https://xkcd.com/695/

    1. Re:Obligatory XKCD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, to me that one is only amusing because of how much I find it poignant.

      A very sad meta-humor, indeed.

    2. Re:Obligatory XKCD by Niggle · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's Spirit.
      You want: https://xkcd.com/1504/ for opportunity

      --
      - Blah blah blah, missing scientist. Blah blah blah, atomic bomb. -
    3. Re:Obligatory XKCD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Don't anthropomorphize rovers. They don't like it when you do that.

    4. Re:Obligatory XKCD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I came to shit post, not to feel.

    5. Re: Obligatory XKCD by Z00L00K · · Score: 1

      When thinking about it - that little rover has far exceeded any expectations and done more for the exploration of Mars than most other missions so far.

      How can we top this?

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    6. Re: Obligatory XKCD by MerlTurkin · · Score: 1

      Add some kind of wiper system to the panels to dust them off during these storms. Dust storms are common on Mars, why didn't they think of this when designing them?

    7. Re: Obligatory XKCD by chispito · · Score: 1

      Add some kind of wiper system to the panels to dust them off during these storms. Dust storms are common on Mars, why didn't they think of this when designing them?

      On the contrary, the fact the rovers lasted as long as they did (Spirit)/ have (Opportunity) means that a wiper system would have been a poor design choice.

      --
      The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
    8. Re:Obligatory XKCD by ClickOnThis · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Others have supplied more uplifting endings to this strip:

      https://i.imgur.com/VZvj5S7.jp...
      https://www.reddit.com/r/xkcd/...

      And my favourite:

      https://imgur.com/VbKV9DF

      --
      If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
    9. Re:Obligatory XKCD by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      I was thinking that NASA must be hiring writers who are roughly my daughter's age - when she was growing up, one of her favorite movies was "The Brave Little Toaster" .

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    10. Re:Obligatory XKCD by portwojc · · Score: 1

      He'll be OK. Just art imitating life.

      https://xkcd.com/1504/

    11. Re: Obligatory XKCD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Add some kind of wiper system to the panels to dust them off during these storms. Dust storms are common on Mars, why didn't they think of this when designing them?

      On the contrary, the fact the rovers lasted as long as they did (Spirit)/ have (Opportunity) means that a wiper system would have been a poor design choice.

      Yeah, #598333 is right. The self-clean up tech [if there is such a thing] should be upgraded. The rovers have lasted because no significant storm hit them so far.

  2. Communicate With Home? by bjwest · · Score: 2, Funny

    I wonder how long it could last in standby if someone hadn't been foolish enough to force it to waste power phoning home just to say "I'm still here." That single transmission could possibly be what killed it.

    I'd also like to note that if Opportunity wasn't designed to power down safely (or recover to a working state if someone were foolish enough to not have it power down before completely running out of power) recharge the batteries when there's enough sunlight, then have Opportunity restart, someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

    --

    --- Keep the choice with the user..
    1. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      The more pressing problem isn't that it can't reboot, it's that it won't be able to clean its panels after the storm, and that's assuming it can even do that. Not to mention the drop in efficiency from getting the panels scarred up by abrasive dust.

      Godspeed little rover, keep up the fight!

    2. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      It needs battery to keep the internal components at safe temperature levels. It is not about calling home; it is about not freezing.

    3. Re:Communicate With Home? by dgatwood · · Score: 1

      I'd also like to note that if Opportunity wasn't designed to power down safely (or recover to a working state if someone were foolish enough to not have it power down before completely running out of power) recharge the batteries when there's enough sunlight, then have Opportunity restart, someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      The funny thing is going to be when that storm clears the panels on Spirit enough that it starts phoning home again. :-)

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    4. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're an armchair Mars rover design expert - otherwise known as a fucking idiot!

    5. Re:Communicate With Home? by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      I wonder how long it could last in standby if someone hadn't been foolish enough to force it to waste power phoning home just to say "I'm still here." That single transmission could possibly be what killed it.

      Um, no.

      --
      No sig today...
    6. Re: Communicate With Home? by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      I'm sure one of the dust devils will come along and clean the panels.

      --
      No sig today...
    7. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

      This isn't the first time we've heard that it won't be able to clean it's solar panels after the dust storm.

      What happen all the previous times was that the storm blew the dust away from the solar panels, so they ended up cleaner after the storm.

    8. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      ...someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      Someone needs to remember this hardware was originally expected to last 90 days. It's been running for over fourteen fucking years.

      This would probably be one of those times where you should STFU about failures in engineering and design, as the statistics tend to speak for themselves.

    9. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd also like to note that if Opportunity wasn't designed to power down safely (or recover to a working state if someone were foolish enough to not have it power down before completely running out of power) recharge the batteries when there's enough sunlight, then have Opportunity restart, someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      More like someone needs an engineering degree (you) because they make way too many assumptions about what they know about a complicated machine: First the computer(s) are able power down and reboot into a functioning state... Second, it cannot stay completely off for long periods of time due to the extreme temperatures that would physically damage certain components:

      In order to survive during all of the various mission phases, the rovers "vital organs" must not exceed extreme temperatures of -40 Celsius to +40 Celsius (-40 Fahrenheit to 104 Fahrenheit).

    10. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      Someone needs to remember this hardware was originally expected to last 90 days. It's been running for over fourteen fucking years.

      This. It's on day 5252 of a 92.5 earth day mission.

    11. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The problem is when the rover runs put of power, the heaters shut off and the systems can't survive that. The amount of energy to send a uhf data burst to the satellite is trivial compared to what the heaters need to keep the rover alive.

    12. Re:Communicate With Home? by GuB-42 · · Score: 5, Funny

      That's 14 earth years, not 14 fucking years.
      That being said, I didn't know that fucking was a planet, we should let more people know, it would really help build interest in space exploration.

    13. Re:Communicate With Home? by psycho12345 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      On one hand, I think those engineers need a discussion about underestimating capabilities.

      On the other, I think they need to be given god damm medals for making a project beat its lifespan estimates, not by 10%, not by 100%, not by 1000%, but by 5500%.

    14. Re:Communicate With Home? by Spinlock_1977 · · Score: 1

      If you think they didn't think of that, then *you* should lose yours.

      --
      - The Kessel run is for nerf herders. I can circumnavigate the entire Central Finite Curve in a lot less than 12 parse
    15. Re: Communicate With Home? by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      I thought it was dust devils cleaning the panels. I presume the issue here may be the severity of the event combined with the coming winter.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    16. Re:Communicate With Home? by lordlod · · Score: 2

      Someone needs to remember this hardware was originally expected to last 90 days. It's been running for over fourteen fucking years.

      This would probably be one of those times where you should STFU about failures in engineering and design, as the statistics tend to speak for themselves.

      As a mass-production engineer I would be asking serious questions about the design process and quality controls.

      Having a product last for over 56x longer than its designed and projected lifespan suggests that there is some serious over engineering involved. Are all those solar panels really needed? What if we added some lightening holes to the neck, the solid piece of aluminum seems like overkill and the weight savings will help lower distribution costs.

      Honestly though, how can anyone pass judgment on the quality of engineering without seeing the design brief?

    17. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's 14 earth years, not 14 fucking years.
      That being said, I didn't know that fucking was a planet...

      It's not well known outside of the underground space community, but after Pluto was kicked out of the gang, a few decided to rename it to Fucking, in recognition of those who continue to question its planetary status.

    18. Re:Communicate With Home? by Joce640k · · Score: 4, Informative

      someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      I don't know about that but somebody definitely needs to learn to spell "lose".

      It's only four letters, FFS.

      --
      No sig today...
    19. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The Internet: passing judgement on others without all the facts is kind of our thing

    20. Re: Communicate With Home? by careysub · · Score: 4, Informative

      At the moment the problem is not how much dust will be on the solar panels after the storm. It is that it will lose all power during the storm, the heaters will stop working, and will then be unable to reactivate afterward.

      The story reports an optical depth of the dust storm of tau=10.8. This is astoundingly dark. The transmittance of light through the atmosphere is 1/e^tau so that only 1/50,000 (0.002%) of the sunlight is getting through! It is effectively perpetual night there right now. This is probably darker than even the heaviest storm clouds on Earth (which only go up to blocking 1/20,000 of the sun light). Thus far the storm has cut off power for six days.

      Although the storm also moderates temperature, since it prevents radiation cooling at night, it also means that the day time high temperatures are not reached either, so that the heaters have to be cranked up constantly (though not to the level of coldest night chill), with no power replacing what is being drained from the batteries.

      It the batteries drain to the level that they can no longer supply the heaters then whether there is dust on the panels after the storm ends will be moot. Opportunity will be dead.

      --
      Starships were meant to fly, Hands up and touch the sky - Nicky Minaj
    21. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd also like to note that if Opportunity wasn't designed to power down safely (or recover to a working state if someone were foolish enough to not have it power down before completely running out of power) recharge the batteries when there's enough sunlight, then have Opportunity restart, someone needs to loose their engineering degree.

      It was requested, designed, and intended to function up to April 2004.
      You may note that 2004 has come and gone a long time ago.

      As you stated, the engineers should keep their degrees, since they did exactly as you stated through out their entire life time.

      Imagine if you were contracted to work for three months writing a program to accomplish a task, which you did, and did within the three month dead line.
      Then 14 years after the job is complete, after you haven't been paid by said company a decade and a half after your contract was up, that you should lose your programming degree because you are no longer maintaining the software?

      Or for a car example, you filled up the gas tank Monday expecting the fuel to last only through the week, yet 7 months later the car is still driving you to work and only just then runs out of gas... You are claiming the car somehow failed in all ways because it worked for 7 months day in and day out without its weekly fuel up?

      I think someone here needs to "loose" their math degree :P

    22. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm surprised that they didn't engineer some way to at least superficially clean the panels. The panels are hinged and they were folded in transit. Obviously something so delicate wasn't spring loaded to smack open. Could they really not reprogram the servos to have the panels tilt up and down to let the sand fall off?

    23. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's 14 earth years, not 14 fucking years.
      That being said, I didn't know that fucking was a planet, we should let more people know, it would really help build interest in space exploration.

      And the basement dwelling, nut butter encrusted, mouth-breathers that populate the internet would do exactly what when presented with an entire "fucking" planet?

    24. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Having a product last for over 56x longer than its designed and projected lifespan suggests that there is some serious over engineering involved. Are all those solar panels really needed? What if we added some lightening holes to the neck, the solid piece of aluminum seems like overkill and the weight savings will help lower distribution costs.

      Then you need to involve all costs from developing, sending it out, and maintaining it. I doubt what you said is actually even a fraction of the whole cost you are thinking about.

    25. Re:Communicate With Home? by DRJlaw · · Score: 1

      As a mass-production engineer I would be asking serious questions about the design process and quality controls.

      But the charges for return shipping, or sending out a field tech, would be a real bitch.

      The acceptable risk of failure was a bit lower for this hardware. You wouldn't want to be that guy.

    26. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They mean "loose" as in "to set loose".

      If you love your engineering degree, let it go. If it comes back, it was meant to be.

    27. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The fact that the rover has been operational for so long seems to show that somebody has already loosed their engineering degree into the cosmos.

    28. Re:Communicate With Home? by omnichad · · Score: 1

      You must work for a smartphone manufacturer. Please quit your job and let me decide when to retire my electronics.

    29. Re:Communicate With Home? by eaglesrule · · Score: 2

      Of course there is some serious over engineering involved. The design process and quality controls could likely be summed up as "It just has to work",regardless of the mission's expected duration. There is just too much at stake to even care about minimizing materials beyond the defined mission requirements.

      90 days is likely to be the warrantee period for a cheap motherboard. If you think getting an RMA for one of those is a pain, try getting an RMA for a product delivered to MARS.

    30. Re: Communicate With Home? by slew · · Score: 1

      I'm surprised that they didn't engineer some way to at least superficially clean the panels. The panels are hinged and they were folded in transit. Obviously something so delicate wasn't spring loaded to smack open. Could they really not reprogram the servos to have the panels tilt up and down to let the sand fall off?

      Dust sticks electrostatically. I think the panels are fixed, but the rover can tilt. Unfortunately you really you can't shake it enough to overcome the electrostatic attraction of the dust.

      To actually clean the panel (rather than just leave it to occasional opportunistic car washes by martian dust-storms) the only ways appear to be: to actually smack it (vibrate it) enough to overcome the electrostatic dust attraction OR use some sort of electric field to manipulate the dust.

      https://www.technologyreview.c...

    31. Re:Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But Fucking is *on* Earth... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fucking,_Austria

    32. Re: Communicate With Home? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its ~400 lbs and engineered with 90's hardware. Its average speed for the past >5000 days has been about 0.0002 mph, or about 1 foot per hour, not exactly a RC car. They planned them it to last 90 days, they had no idea what kinda stuff might happen, if it might just get stuck somewhere or what.

    33. Re: Communicate With Home? by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      This is astoundingly dark. The transmittance of light through the atmosphere is 1/e^tau so that only 1/50,000 (0.002%) of the sunlight is getting through!

      The analogy I've been using is of being under a volcanic ash cloud. Literally turning day into night.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    34. Re:Communicate With Home? by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Unlikely - the electrolyte in the batteries is almost certainly trashed. Even if the panels produce decent power, without the battery the re-boot process will draw more current than the panels can produce.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  3. Tau by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Since this article doesn't explain it, an optical depth tau value of 10.8 means approximately 0.002% of the sunlight is reaching the rover, compared to 0.4% for the last storm. It's really, really dark out there.

    1. Re:Tau by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dark and cold.

    2. Re:Tau by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      % = 100/e^Tau
      Tau = ln(flux ratio)
      flux ratio = reception / transmission

  4. I came here to read this. :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Precisely.

    As far as we know, this is a non-issue and a non-story.

    1. Re:I came here to read this. :) by Joce640k · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You know how I can tell that neither of you actually read the article?

      The main concern here isn't the dust storm itself. It's the need to keep the rover's heaters operational while maintaining a minimal power level in the batteries.

      --
      No sig today...
    2. Re:I came here to read this. :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The rover has radioisotope heaters that one would assume protect the most vital components.

    3. Re:I came here to read this. :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, NASA is worried about it, so I am going to go with the rocket scientists, mmmkay?

  5. next time they build a rover for mars by FudRucker · · Score: 1

    they should build it to look like a GIANT beetle, and build the solar panels like the wings that can fold out when the conditions are good and when not so good fold in and collapse flat with a hard weather-proof outer shell that covers and protects them (like some beetles that can fly)

    --
    Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
    1. Re: next time they build a rover for mars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Or maybe they should build the next rover so it doesn't need solar panels. Maybe use a nuclear power source like an RTG. How cool would that be? They could name it Curiosity.

    2. Re:next time they build a rover for mars by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 1

      they should build it to look like a GIANT beetle, and build the solar panels like the wings that can fold out when the conditions are good and when not so good fold in and collapse flat with a hard weather-proof outer shell that covers and protects them (like some beetles that can fly)

      That is not a bad description of the Soviet Lunakhod rover design, which enclosed the array at night.. Although most people say that they look more like a giant bathtub than a beetle.

      --
      http://www.geoffreylandis.com
  6. It doesn't have any system to clear its panels by robbak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Opportunity and Spirit are not fitted with any mechanism to clear their solar panels. Originally, it was assumed that dust on the panels would be what would end the mission. But winds and whirlwinds were found on the planet, these occasionally blew dust from the panels, and the mission was extended.

    The pressing problem is that there won't be enough energy to keep the heaters running, the electronics will cool down to -50C, and either the heaters won't turn back on when the sun returns, or, if they do, the electronics won't work when they defrost.

    --
    Prediction for end of Universe #42: Fencepost error in Quantum_bogosort.cpp
    1. Re: It doesn't have any system to clear its panels by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      R u f-n kidding?!? They sent these things to another PLANET without even sending, like, a pack of lemon scented wet naps, or some solar panel windshield wipers?!? OMFG, my old pickup truck is more technologically advanced than what they sent to mars... Sad.

    2. Re:It doesn't have any system to clear its panels by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      The pressing problem is that there won't be enough energy to keep the heaters running, the electronics will cool down to -50C, and either the heaters won't turn back on when the sun returns, or, if they do, the electronics won't work when they defrost.

      IIRC, the temperature concern isn't just about the electronics - it's also the cameras. The glass in the lenses has a lower coefficient of expansion than the metal rings they're mounted in. This means the metal shrinks faster, and may crack the lenses even at temperatures the electronics could survive. (The electronics ae buried away in an insulated box in the rover body, the camera lenses are directly exposed to the atmosphere and thus cool much faster.)

    3. Re:It doesn't have any system to clear its panels by RockDoctor · · Score: 1
      That's the first time I've heard that concern, and I speak to past and present rover drivers on a routine basis. They've never mentioned it. They're not particularly worried about the absolute temperatures, because the presence of all that atmospheric dust prevents the ground from seeing outer space and so the temperatures dno't get absolutely low. What they're concerned about is that the power available is unable to keep the liquid electrolyte in the batterieswarm, and the batteries will either develop copper internal short circuits when the panels start re-charging them, or the electrolyte will actually start to electrolyse, damaging the batteries capacity and cycle lifetime. That's what they think killed Spirit.

      A complete power-down, losing even the clock, will make the re-start process much more complex. Which means it is more prone to failure, retries, more battery cycles ... the drivers are optimistic, but strained.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    4. Re:It doesn't have any system to clear its panels by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      That's the first time I've heard that concern

      It's discussed in Roving Mars by Stephen Squyres. (You might have heard of him - he's the PI for the MER program.)
       

      They're not particularly worried about the absolute temperatures, because the presence of all that atmospheric dust prevents the ground from seeing outer space and so the temperatures dno't get absolutely low.

      They're absolutely worried about absolute temperatures - because those temps affect the current draw of the heaters.

  7. OK - so the darkness isn't really relevant. by robbak · · Score: 4, Informative

    0.4% of the sunlight wouldn't have be enough to make the solar panels work. So a greater darkness than that doesn't really make any difference. It might as well be pitch black if the intensity is below 1%.

    What is important, then, is how long this dust storm will last.

    --
    Prediction for end of Universe #42: Fencepost error in Quantum_bogosort.cpp
    1. Re: OK - so the darkness isn't really relevant. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My solar panels generate power under a full moon. Every little bit helps.

    2. Re: OK - so the darkness isn't really relevant. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My solar panels generate power under a full moon. Every little bit helps.

      The full moon can reflect between 3% and 12% of the sunlight hitting it, which is certainly above the ~1% threshold needed, and can be quite a bit above it enough to get plenty of "work" out of the panels.

      Many people are more familiar with the darkness caused by clouds rolling in with a thunderstorm, which would be a much nicer comparison if only there was some better numbers to go along with it.
      But if I had to guess, even normal thunderstorm clouds seem to allow more light through than a is reflected by a full moon, and these mars dust storms block much more light than even that.

      Quite amazing to think about!

    3. Re:OK - so the darkness isn't really relevant. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From the last storm, even at 4.7 tau (a little under 1%, although that's ignoring scattered light) the rover was generating a small amount of power, but not enough to run the 60W heaters for an extended period of time.

      Based on https://planetary.s3.amazonaws.com/image/Horizon_Survey_1205B_1235B.jpg it seems like 4.7 is not pitch dark, but 10.8 very well might be.

      But yeah, length of the storm and the temperatures is going to be a big factor.

  8. climate change! by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 2

    "The storm's atmospheric opacity -- the veil of dust blowing around, which can blot out sunlight -- is now much worse than a 2007 storm that Opportunity weathered," reports NASA.

    The storms are getting worse ... what do you Martian "deniers" say now, eh???

  9. Wait... by sycodon · · Score: 1

    ...how many stories have we read about dead rovers that miraculously come back to life after a mysterious "cleaning event"?

    But here we are pronouncing the death of a rover due to a dust storm.

    --
    When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    1. Re: Wait... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The death of the rover will surely be due to an accidental forced upgrade to Microsoft Windows 10 rovers update edition.

  10. Re:istanbul guzellik merkezi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    He also finished deploying 750 PCs and 1,500 monitors ahead of schedule, ending his 12-month contract after nine months.

    You delusional piece of lard!

    I had to redeploy those 750 PCs by myself after paying you to do it. That's why I let you go early so you wouldn't be in the way!

    I redeployed everything in 3 months and met the deadline but the money we gave you is a total lost.

    You also threw away a bunch of valuable spare parts in your genius closet cleaning and we had to buy new ones, further adding to the bill. You are a disaster.

    Fuck you!

  11. Come on people.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We have to do something about climate change, these extreme weather patterns are getting worse all the time.

  12. Re:istanbul guzellik merkezi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You also threw away a bunch of valuable spare parts in your genius closet cleaning and we had to buy new ones, further adding to the bill. You are a disaster.

    CROFLOL! He most probably ate those spare parts and farted as he was going...

  13. Job well done and then some... by The+Cynical+Critic · · Score: 3, Informative

    Considering how the two solar powered rovers (Spirit and Opportunity) that touched down in January 2004 were originally only expected to survive for a few months only to have one finally go out in March of 2010 and the second finally in real peril of going out in June of 2018 it shouldn't be too much of a loss for the second one to finally go out. Both of them spectacularly outperformed what was expected of them and it's probably time for the last of them to quit it with the victory laps. Not that Curiosity, their bigger nuclear-powered older bother, isn't doing well for itself either. It touched down in August 2012 and it's too still going despite an originally planned two year mission length. I'm interested to see if it'll last even longer or if the decay of it's Pu238-dioxide power source will be what keeps it from extending it's mission beyond the original goal by as much as Opportunity has.

    --
    "Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
    1. Re:Job well done and then some... by necro81 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Not that Curiosity, their bigger nuclear-powered older bother, isn't doing well for itself either. It touched down in August 2012 and it's too still going despite an originally planned two year mission length. I'm interested to see if it'll last even longer or if the decay of it's Pu238-dioxide power source will be what keeps it from extending it's mission beyond the original goal by as much as Opportunity has.

      The decay of Pu-238 will not be what limits the Curiosity mission. It has a half-life of 87.7 years. The RTG that uses that decay to produce electricity (and, perhaps more importantly at the moment, heat to keep the electronics happy) decays more quickly than that. But the Voyager probes still have enough electricity to communicate with earth forty years after launch.

      The limiting factor for Curiosity will probably be its moving parts. Specifically, its drive motors and wheels. The wheels have taken quite a beating, and may eventually be so damaged that they can no longer provide adequate traction. The JPL guys are really clever, and can probably drive Curiosity even with the complete loss of one wheel.

      But even if Curiosity stopped moving tomorrow, it would almost certainly still be useful for stationary science. It can continue to gather weather data (including measuring atmospheric methane, which hit the news recently), take pictures, shoot lasers, and sample rocks, probably for years. One of the Viking landers lasted 6 years on the surface, and that mission ended only after a bad software update.

    2. Re:Job well done and then some... by The+Cynical+Critic · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The problem with the RTG isn't that it's going to decay completely, it's that being about the size and weight of car it's packed with way more power hungry systems the RTG may not be able to power anymore once it's been going around for the better part of a decade. Sure, it's got batteries to cover for peaks, but those have been needed from the start and will probably decay faster than the RTG and a battery failure was after all what killed Viking 2 despite also being RTG powered.

      Solar panels definitely also decay over time, but those on the Mars Pathfinder mission saw a long term degradation of only about 0.15% per (earth) year. Their decay doesn't also require more energy to be used for heating due to less waste heat being produced.

      I'm probably worrying too much and the thing that kills Curiosity probably is the environment with the way the soil is rich in really corrosive substances like perchlorate.

      --
      "Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
    3. Re:Job well done and then some... by tlhIngan · · Score: 2

      , it's that being about the size and weight of car it's packed with way more power hungry systems the RTG may not be able to power anymore once it's been going around for the better part of a decade

      And the goal is to simply not power everything at once. There's a minimum amount of power it needs to run the basics, yes, and that minimum is probably served by the RTG for decades

      All the power hungry science packages can simply be turned off when they're not needed or used, conserving available power as it decays. As it decays further, it means one has to be even more careful.

      The Voyager probes are in the same boat - at first they had all the equipment powered up, but now as the RTG output decays more and more of the equipment has to be turned off.

      The advantage Curiousity has is it's a rover. If you can't do everything at once, you can simply stop and do everything one at a time, or do what you can simultaneously within the power budget, then do other science when you're done with the first set. It may take longer, but that's how it rolls.

    4. Re:Job well done and then some... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Curiosity's heating comes from a pump that uses liquid to reuse part of the RTC waste heat, if that stops working everything is lost.

    5. Re:Job well done and then some... by DerekLyons · · Score: 2

      The decay of Pu-238 will not be what limits the Curiosity mission. It has a half-life of 87.7 years. The RTG that uses that decay to produce electricity (and, perhaps more importantly at the moment, heat to keep the electronics happy) decays more quickly than that. But the Voyager probes still have enough electricity to communicate with earth forty years after launch.

      Not true. Loss of power generating capacity is already limiting what the Voyager probes can accomplish - and they're only 41 years old. While they retain the ability to communicate, they no longer have the ability to operate all the surviving science instruments simultaneously. Half life only determines the slope of the power output curve, total viable lifetime is determined by using that slope to determine when total output will fall below minimum requirements. (About another seven to eleven years in Voyager's case - still well short of the half life.)

    6. Re:Job well done and then some... by necro81 · · Score: 1

      I agree that the decay of the RTG's capacity is limiting the voyager probe. But, it has been 40 years, and well past even the "extended" mission out to Neptune. My broader point with Curiosity was this: what is more likely to give out and end the mission, the RTG or some other component? My bet is that it won't be the RTG; something else will fail first.

    7. Re:Job well done and then some... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      One of the Viking landers lasted 6 years on the surface, and that mission ended only after a bad software update.

      Windows 10?

  14. radio transmitter is a heater by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Furthermore, most of the power consumed by the radio transmitter actually goes into heat. Out of the 25 watts or so it takes to run the Electra (relay) or the SDST (Direct to Earth), most of that power winds up heating the radio. The solid state power amplifier is about 20% efficient.

  15. re: designed to last 90 days by King_TJ · · Score: 4, Informative

    Seriously, you have to take those claims of "designed for 90 days of operation" with some big grains of salt.... There's no way they'd spend all the money, time and energy on R&D to get something like this put on Mars, when they REALLY only expected it would be used for a few months.

    That might be the length of time they NEEDED to complete the original planned research project, so in a worst-case scenario, NASA doesn't have to say they failed. But I'm quite certain this thing was engineered with the hopes it would run for years and years -- as it has done.

  16. Tau [Re: Communicate With Home?] by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 2

    ...The story reports an optical depth of the dust storm of tau=10.8. This is astoundingly dark. The transmittance of light through the atmosphere is 1/e^tau so that only 1/50,000 (0.002%) of the sunlight is getting through! It is effectively perpetual night there right now....

    Note that the e^1/tau factor is for direct beam. What this means is that almost all of the light that gets through to the surface is scattered light.

    The tau for a rainy day for earth is very high too. It doesn't mean that the surface is completely dark, it just means that the light that does get through has scattered many times-- you can't see the disk of the sun, but some light does reach the surface.

    10.8 is a record for the highest tau measured from the surface of Mars, though.

    --
    http://www.geoffreylandis.com
  17. pointless article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    what the fuck is the point of this article

    "in danger"?

    Slow fucking news day?

    How about you just fucking let us know the outcome when it happens?
    Y'know, WHEN THERE IS FUCKING NEWS.

  18. Windy [Re: Communicate With Home?] by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 1

    I'm sure one of the dust devils will come along and clean the panels.

    This location, on the rim of Endeavour crater, has been pretty windy. So if the rover calls home after the dust storm, there's a pretty good chance that the winds will clean the panels.

    --
    http://www.geoffreylandis.com
  19. Moonlight is nice, but not bright by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 1

    My solar panels generate power under a full moon. Every little bit helps.

    Enough to detect, maybe.
    Enough to charge a battery, no.
    The full moon isn't bright enough. The full moon gives 400,000 times less light than the sun.

    --
    http://www.geoffreylandis.com
  20. wall flower culture shock by epine · · Score: 1

    ... originally only expected to survive for a few months ...

    I think you're abusing the word "expected".

    There was a high-likelihood failure mode (involving dust accumulation) which was baked into the mission parameters, whose budgetary concerns centered around achieving a minimum sufficient return on investment (the worst outcome of all in space exploration is no learning).

    But if you'd asked anyone involved with a clue, they'd have said that the uncertainty around the dust accumulation model was high, and that most of the engineering had been done to a standard where a decade of nearly fault-free operation would be considered normal (otherwise the sum of parts wouldn't outlast xmas morning).

    In NASA planning culture, the word "unexpected" doesn't convey the sad punter baggage you're implying out of context. In NASA planning culture, foreseeable adverse events get all the hasty index cards. They don't tend to invest up front in thick mission planning binders for unexpected (meaning: pleasant surprise) thin-atmosphere windfall. NASA doesn't plan for the worst, and hope for the best. 99% of the time, NASA plans for the worst, and then re-plans for the worst.

    And then when the day comes and there's an eerie adversity absence, and everyone is standing around with not much to do and a blank look, it's not so much a mental surprise (unexpected) as an emotional shock.

    Dance with the one that brung ya is strangely discomfiting on emotional terms when the one that brung ya is total institutional paranoia, with thick binders devoted to taking a single careful step.

    Unexpected dance floor vacancy rate? Hardly at all.

  21. Not necessarily by nospam007 · · Score: 1

    If I remember correctly, one such sandstorm also _cleaned_ the solar panels in the past.

  22. Re: designed to last 90 days by psmoot · · Score: 1

    Seriously, you have to take those claims of "designed for 90 days of operation" with some big grains of salt....

    Good point. I didn't see the project requirements. My guess is the actual requirement was something like "99% chance of operating for at least 90 days." It wasn't "10% chance of operating 90 days." That's a pretty big difference. I might be able to build the latter. I have no chance on the former.

  23. Didn't I just see this? by psmoot · · Score: 1

    There was a book or movie about this. We need to ship Opportunity some potatoes and duct tape, something like that.

  24. Re: istanbul guzellik merkezi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It isn't trolls. It is creimer talking to himself 75% of the time.

  25. Easy to solve by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    If NASA was like really smart,they could have equipped the rover with flashlights that would shine on the solar panels when the sun is obscured by a dust storm. Problem solved! But noooo, NASA is of course full of liberal elitists who just use equations to explain why something cannot get done!

  26. Re: designed to last 90 days by HeckRuler · · Score: 1

    There's no way they'd spend all the money, time and energy on R&D to get something like this put on Mars, when they REALLY only expected it would be used for a few months.

    Why not? The first month of operation was likely the most insightful and it did most everything it was going to do and flexed all of it's scientific equipment. It got pictures, dug a trench, analyzed the air, and did spectrometry. It also traveled to a location with hematite, which geologists were eager to study. That's all in month 1.

    Given a set of tools, there's only so much science you can do. Rovers can move around and use the same tools and more locations, which is awesome, but eventually there will be diminishing returns on variance in what those tools find. There's bound to be some long-term studies, like comparing the seasonal changes in the findings. And more refined models of daily temperatures.

    It's not like we're getting 2x the scientific insight if it lasts another 15 years.

  27. The little rover that could by whitroth · · Score: 1

    15 YEARS into its 90 DAY mission.

    IthinkitcanIthinkitcanIthinkitcan.

  28. One Moon Theory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Its time to take a BIG LOOK at changing Mars. These crazy dust storms are due to the wobbly axis of Mars. In order to fix this wobble and give Mars a more stable climate (like Earth) , you're going to have to apply Dr Robyn Canyup's "ONE MOON THEORY". We are going to have to push both of Mars' moons together to form one big supermoon (just like Earth) The single gravity pull from one bigger satilite will eventually pull that axis nice and tight. No more wobble. This may take 500 - several thousand years, but its worth it !