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Charter Launches Mobile Service, Throttles All Video To 480p (arstechnica.com)

Charter Communications launched its mobile broadband service on June 30, and it's throttling all video streams to DVD quality. From a report: "DVD-quality video streaming is supported. Video typically streams at 480p," Charter notes in the "Pricing & Other Info" section of its mobile sign-up page. The quality limit is similar to one just imposed by Comcast, which previously did not impose any video quality limits on its mobile service. Comcast is letting existing customers get 720p video streams "on an interim basis at no charge," and the company announced plans to charge extra for longer-term access to HD quality. But Charter hasn't announced any plans to let customers stream in HD over its mobile service, for free or otherwise. HD video "is not currently an option for Spectrum Mobile," a Charter spokesperson told Ars. Wirefly has a Spectrum Mobile review.

101 comments

  1. I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by RevDisk · · Score: 1

    Was anyone expecting otherwise?

    1. Re:I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by luther349 · · Score: 1

      do you relly care watching your video on a 5 to 6 inch screen. putting these 4k displays in these phones has to be the biggest wast of money ever,

    2. Re: I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      B..b..but the ISPs don't want to run cables to your door because it's too difficult and expensive so you'll have to use mobile broadband for all your devices. Oh my data caps!

    3. Re:I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by MerlTurkin · · Score: 1

      Agreed. Who the fuck can watch TV on those tiny screens? WTF?!

    4. Re:I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by Dinatius · · Score: 1

      do you relly care watching your video on a 5 to 6 inch screen. putting these 4k displays in these phones has to be the biggest wast of money ever,

      Remember, this is a generic internet service. While it may mostly be used by mobile devices a lot of rural areas are forced to use these connections for their home internet connections and that includes providing service to the 70" UHD internet connected, voice activated television that knows when you're fridge ran out of beer.

    5. Re:I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      well..

      mobile should just be data. if it's metered you're getting fucked up the ass.

      and yes I regularly stream 1080p over mobile connections.. both in finland and in thailand. it's not that I "need" to, it's just that it's 2018 and it was something to be expected in 2010 already.

      somehow yanks are still believing the crap about their being so unique market? well it's unique only in that people are willing to pay up the ass for inferior service - while living in the most money per square km market. and fyi I could go into deep lalpand and still stream hd so it's not really about population densities either. it's just about tradition that american market was trained into - paying upwards of 100 bucks per month for joke of a service not worth 10 bucks.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    6. Re: I'm shocked! Shocked! Well, not that shocked. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Itâ(TM)s obvious you do not read ... anything.

      Try it for 3 minutes. Read something on your phone. Then in one eye, stick a fork in it to simulate 480p.

      See the difference? Let us know after the ER.

      Stupid illiterate fuck.

  2. Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1, Insightful

    They are throttling all video. So perfectly compliant with NN.

    Get off your pulpits.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    1. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      They are throttling all video. So perfectly compliant with NN.

      Get off your pulpits.

      That's debatable... At the very least it probably would have been cause for a lawsuit; and Charter might not have risked a potentially expensive legal defence for this.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    2. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Debate it then. You're wrong BTW.

      Anybody can sue anybody else for anything at any time. Means nothing.

      The fact remains NN put the government in charge of the definition of QoS. What could go wrong, putting such a group of competent, trustworthy, freedom loving people in charge of a technical definition that has the potential to break the internet?

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    3. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Network neutrality is the principle that all Internet traffic should be treated equally

      In this case, video traffic is not being treated equal to other traffic, failing the NN test

      It is considered "discrimination by protocol"

      Discrimination by protocol is the favoring or blocking of information based on aspects of the communications protocol that the computers are using to communicate

      I'll refer you to Comcast's intentional throttling of BitTorrent traffic for another example.

    4. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by mlyle · · Score: 1

      They are throttling all video. So perfectly compliant with NN.

      Whaaaaat?

      As Wikipedia puts it:

      > Network neutrality is the principle that all Internet traffic should be treated equally. Internet traffic includes all of the different messages, files and data sent over the Internet, including, for example, emails, digital audio files, digital video files, etc. According to Columbia Law School professor Tim Wu, the best way to explain network neutrality is that a public information network will end up being most useful if all content, websites, and platforms (e.g., mobile devices, video game consoles, etc.) are treated equally

      Nor would your assertion "They are throttling all video. So perfectly compliant with NN." be compliant with the 2014 FCC Open Internet NPRM or the 2015 FCC Open Internet ("network neutrality") order.

      Which is it? Are you being dishonest about what network neutrality has meant in the past (and means in the present), or are you deeply opposed to it despite not being familiar with its provisions?

    5. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by MasseKid · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Video data is treated differently than data. Treating any data differently than any other data violates the principle of net neutrality.

    6. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Debate it then. You're wrong BTW.

      Well, a legal case could easily be made that by restricting only certain types of data that they are not treating all data equal. They would not be treating video content providers with the same full access as they are other content providers.

      It would be up to the courts to decide; I happen to think they would most likely rule against the company trying to throttle HD video stream if net neutrality were still in place.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    7. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      And... in addition; Charter being a cable company and throttling video, the clear motive behind their actions would be to act in a way to deny access to competing services. This would help push the decision in favour of ruling that Charter was acting against net neutrality.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    8. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      If I paid for the bandwidth, then how I decide to use it should be up to me. If an ISP overprovisioned their network, then its up to them to make it right by upgrading their equipment. I personally don't have issues with a blanketed throttling of all video services, as long as their upfront about what I'm paying for. The problem is, in a year time, they'll probably come back and say you can now get HD quality video on selected services.

    9. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most NN have exceptions for traffic shaping under the stipulation that all of the type should be treated equally and transparently. Slowing down video must slow down all video, and not have exclusions for their own media (for example).

    10. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by plague911 · · Score: 1

      Actually throttling all video is still a violation of NN concepts.

    11. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      https://www.theverge.com/2015/3/12/8116237/net-neutrality-rules-open-internet-order-released

      At least in America, they've modified the definition to allow for "reasonable network management" that still tries to adhere to NN.

      Throttling ALL video (including their own) and completely being transparent about it would seem to be reasonable.

    12. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      Video data is treated differently than data. Treating any data differently than any other data violates the principle of net neutrality.

      Not when you throttle only your own data.

    13. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by mlyle · · Score: 2

      The text of the standard was:

      > A person engaged in the provision of broadband Internet access service, insofar as such person is so engaged, shall not impair or degrade lawful Internet traffic on the basis of Internet content, application, or service, or use of a non-harmful device, subject to reasonable network management

      So, your reading would be --- you can't throttle traffic based on content/type ... except you can for network management. Which in turn neuters the entire standard. In turn, the order has dozens of pages breaking down what was argued in the 2010-2015 to be reasonable network traffic management and how administrative law judges had found.

      So no, just because *you* can call it reasonable network management doesn't mean it was for the purpose of the rule.

    14. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by luther349 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      watching 480p on your 6 inch phone your not going to see the difference.

    15. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by cfalcon · · Score: 1

      The "2015 FCC Open Internet" thing has this under their clear bright-line rules:

      "A person engaged in the provision of broadband Internet access service, insofar as such
      person is so engaged, shall not block lawful content, applications, services, or nonharmful
      devices, subject to reasonable network management."

      The question, then, is whether throttling video- which is a very high bandwidth application- counts as "reasonable network management". That seems very likely. A web page is a large burst of transfer, but with a small amount of total transfer. A video game is a small number of packets that are each pretty damned important and need low latency, but are not much bandwidth. A torrent wants as much bandwidth as possible but isn't a high priority. A video needs a certain amount of bandwidth and doesn't care about latency.

      So no, even under net neutrality as it existed in the USA, videos could be slammed by ISPs under network management, or at least, they'd have a case in doing so.

      The conflict comes from the fact that there's no solidly excellent way to enforce or discover what a given ISP is providing, and as such every ISP lies, and doesn't want to be accountable. Conversely, if two consumbers want to purchase 50 mbs down and 10 mbs up, and one of them streams netflix constantly and the other plays games and does web stuff, these two are going to look completely different from the perspective of the provider- the former is going to be angry if he doesn't get his advertised speeds 24/7, the latter is going to be angry if he doesn't have his comparably few packets privileged over the technology that can buffer, but for each of those who understands that, plenty don't.

      The "correct" thing would be to get better educated consumers while simultaneously forcing the ISPs to be completely honest, giving none the ability to float bullshit and testing them in hard to circumvent ways. The first may be out of our power, the second should not be- but given regulatory capture, it may well be.

    16. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because NN is the problem. Right. The problem isn't idiots watching video on a tiny phone screen. Fucking idiots, ruining things for the rest of us.

    17. Re: Not network neutrality issue. by bobmagicii · · Score: 1

      wouldnâ(TM)t streaming over an encrypted means break their ability to do anything about it? short of just not allowing more than x mbit/s

    18. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by squiggleslash · · Score: 1

      ISPs have been blocking port 25 since the late 1990s and nobody's thought to demand they open that port for network neutrality reasons despite it having far more pernicious and negative consequences (I'm not saying it's not done for good reasons, just that there are also very serious privacy issues with having to route all your email via your ISP) than throttling video to a reasonable rate to ensure a network remains usable for all other users.

      If that's what Wikipedia is claiming, then Wikipedia is just wrong on this issue.

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
    19. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by mlyle · · Score: 1

      You're ignoring the whole next 3 pages which talk about what is "reasonable network management", and the cited rulings that occurred under the previous 2010 regime. You're further ignoring the enforcement actions that the FCC undertook against mobile operators for treatment of video, which the mobile operators settled...

    20. Re: Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      wouldn't streaming over an encrypted means break their ability to do anything about it? short of just not allowing more than x mbit/s

      They can still recognize a 'streaming video' feed by it having a long sustained draw of data. If they allow the first minute of data of a given TCP session to run full-speed but then cap it to a data rate supporting only 480p for the rest of the session, they'll be offering full speed for web surfing or facebook or whatever, but they'll still be able to cap streaming video as suggested. Even if it's through a VPN.

    21. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Solandri · · Score: 4, Informative

      How did this get modded up? Net neutrality is the principle of treating data equally regardless of originating source on the Internet. e.g. You can't throttle Netflix while prioritizing your own video streaming service.

      What you're proposing is content neutrality - treating all data the same regardless of the type of data. If we mandated content neutrality, the Internet would die a horrible death as filesharing, spam, and DDoS attacks got equal priority to video streaming, web browsing, and online game traffic. The only reason the Internet is able to function despite the terabytes of illegitimate traffic being dumped on it is because ISPs and backbones are allowed to lower its priority via traffic shaping to give legitimate traffic first crack at the available bandwidth.

    22. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by farble1670 · · Score: 1

      What could go wrong, putting such a group of competent, trustworthy, freedom loving people in charge of a technical definition that has the potential to break the internet?

      At least we can all agree that the USA has some of the best, and cheapest, internet in the western world, and has the most options when it comes to service providers, right?

      Thank god NN was repealed. That means by this time next year I'm going to have 5 ISPs knocking down my door, begging me use their gigabit fiber. I mean, they haven't done it over the last 10 years, but I'm sure it's coming. We just need to let the free market sort it out.

    23. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by EvilSS · · Score: 1

      So they are throttling their home users video too? Because the article says mobile users, of their new cell service (which is really Verizon that they are reselling).

      --
      I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
    24. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by EvilSS · · Score: 1

      They are throttling all video. So perfectly compliant with NN.

      Get off your pulpits.

      That's debatable... At the very least it probably would have been cause for a lawsuit; and Charter might not have risked a potentially expensive legal defence for this.

      Pretty sure mobile networks (and please don't forget that's what we are talking about here, Charter's new mobile service, not their home service) were exempted from certain provisions to allow for network management. Video throttling was happening under NN rules in the US before they were repealed.

      --
      I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
    25. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Green+Mountain+Bot · · Score: 1

      Nope. If they were throttling all data of any sort, you might have an argument. But throttling a particular type of data is very much against the Net Neutrality principle of treating all data the same, regardless of what that data comprises.

    26. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Green+Mountain+Bot · · Score: 4, Informative

      "Net neutrality is the principle that Internet service providers treat all data on the Internet equally, and not discriminate or charge differently by user, content, website, platform, application, type of attached equipment, or method of communication."

    27. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't have one without the other, because there is no reliable way to classify data. You are welcome to do it on your own link, but allowing prioritization on the open internet is not effective or desirable, and just encourages abuse.

      "Net neutrality" that allows loopholes for specific content is worse than useless, and increasingly so with the growth of opaque encrypted traffic, which should be encouraged and welcomed for security reasons. Even beyond that, why should established protocols enjoy priority over emerging protocols?

      Prioritization is fundamentally incompatible with network neutrality, and the idea is both hostile to innovation, and inevitably leads to congestion and a warped incentive to not build out sufficient capacity.

    28. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pretty sure mobile networks (and please don't forget that's what we are talking about here, Charter's new mobile service, not their home service) were exempted from certain provisions to allow for network management. Video throttling was happening under NN rules in the US before they were repealed.

      Indeed, the NN regulations for mobile networks were dysfunctional before. Allowing growing concessions for these abusive entities will not improve the situation. Holding the line isn't good enough; we need to fight back hard and restore network neutrality, before the Internet is balkanized entirely, and utterly ruined as a platform for innovation.

    29. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Illegitimate traffic? Are you the traffic police now? Who are you to say that your shitty korean F2P MMO is more important than my torrent download?

    30. Re: Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      nope that wouldn't work

      Think downloading a game (50GB+ now a days)

      I'd be very pissed if it downloads at full speed for first minute then starts crawling for the rest...

    31. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no the problem is fucking idiots shilling for big companies....ho hello there...

    32. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Throttle phone video to make people use cable instead. If you only get crappy video on your phone then you're more likely to break and spring for cable.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    33. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      This is why we don't want the government in charge of NN.

      Morons like MasseKid don't understand that without QoS the internet breaks, thinks he 'knows'.

      The government is _full_ of technically clueless twits like MasseKid. They would have fucked it all up.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    34. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      All that shows is what's wrong with Wikipedia. Never trust it for anything remotely controversial.

      Wikipedia just broke the net. QoS is _required_ for the net to function.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    35. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Good argument against government regulation of NN. They are too clueless. Want to ban QoS.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    36. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Do you even want your gaming packets treated the same as your video streaming or FTP packets?

      Just in case you ARE that clueless, no you don't. Ping matters for gaming packets, doesn't for streaming video.

      It's called QoS, break it and you break the net. It has never been illegal.

      Your personal definition of NN is broken, simplistic and childish.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    37. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wrong. Net Neutrality also protects from throttling classes of data. That means video streaming can't be treated any differently than downloading or communications.

    38. Re:Not network neutrality issue. by mlyle · · Score: 1

      If the government has effectively given a vendor a last-mile monopoly--- as has historically been the case with franchise agreements and city street easements--- the last thing in the world I want them to be doing is to decide what kinds of traffic are "more important." I have one choice of vendor. If they decide I'm not going to have a great time streaming video and I need to buy TV service from them, too, that's "not cool."

      You can still implement QOS to ensure that every customer has a certain amount of traffic at specified latencies/losses-- not that anyone does. Service providers mostly like QOS to advantage their own services-- using leverage from the state-granted monopoly they have to sell you other things.

  3. Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    This is good. Small mobile screens with higher than perceivable resolutions are fucking retarded and the average phoneposter is on average more cancerous than laptop and computer posters, there's also a higher prevalence of underage on phones than on laptops and desktops.
    All in all, limiting phoneposters from Internet features not only helps websites and servers but also helps the quality of the Internet because phoneposters are worthless scum and need to be put down. Phoneposting is a sin, and i hope Charter Communications continues limiting the abilities of phonecancer and all other companies take up its philosophy as well.

    1. Re:Good by dasmoscas · · Score: 0

      Go back to 4chan, asshole.

    2. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, i have no wired internet. I only have my phone and i use wifi hotspot from my phone to share my connection to my laptop. So how do you suggest i'd watch videos at higher resolution with my laptop with the connection from my mobile phone?

      Luckily i don't have such retarted limitations in my plan and i pay shit loads less than you do. No artificial data caps, no retarted throtling.

    3. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Those who speak of it belong there, take your homeless 3rd world ass back there phonecancer.

    4. Re: Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tether and if your TV co allows time shifting then torrent the shows.

    5. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Simple. You stop being underage, get a job, get a home, and browse the Internet like a proper civilized human then.
      Or you remain a homeless wireless NEET member of the lower class.

    6. Re:Good by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

      VPN. That should do it.

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    7. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      None of that is right, don't know what NEET means, except i'm sure i'm not a proper human being.

      But i ended the wired internet, because i don't need it. I can use my mobile plan just as well. I have no limits. But you can't. The point was to show this know-it-all, that there's more to this world than just schlis own needs and thoughts.

    8. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You fucktard, why would you spend $40-100 more? Just to line the pockets of the 1%? LOL Even if I was making $100,000, why would I pay for something I don't have to?

      There's many other options for him, like using another service that doesn't downsample video.

  4. Is this a Net Neutrality thing? by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 1

    In the previous article reporting on the downfall of the internet, I asked a simple question: Would the Net Neutrality rules in place before the recent rollback have prevented this?

    I got both "yes" and "no" (*) answers.

    So let me ask the question once again: would the Net Neutrality rules put in place during the Obama administration have prevented this?

    (*) Answer phrased as "probably not"

    1. Re:Is this a Net Neutrality thing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      For Comcast, yes, NN would thwart what they are doing. Their plans include services stream HD at an additional charge to customers, which in itself doesn't violate NN but the selectiveness on which service providers are permitted to stream HD under that plan is what violates NN.

      But the people have spoken, they'd prefer an demagoguery over consumer protection. We have a broadly supported pro-oligarchy contingent that works hard to paint the opposing centrists are far-left Marxists. Propaganda obscures truth, and a culture of identity politics thwarts reason.

      We're making our bed and we will soon lie in it.

    2. Re:Is this a Net Neutrality thing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exceptions for "reasonable network management". Is demanding 4K on a 6 inch phone reasonable? Probably not.

      Actual answer depends on how they are limiting it. If you hit YouTube via SSL, I'm not sure how to technically limit it. If you hit one of their servers hitting one of their shows, easy to limit and not a NN problem.

      I'm going with, not likely depending on actual details. It may not even affect you if you use their network and not hitting content they provide.

    3. Re:Is this a Net Neutrality thing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There isn't enough data on Charter's plans and policies to say for certain if they will violate Net Neutrality or not. Currently they don't, that's a fact. I don't have a crystal ball but it seems likely they will violate it in the future.

    4. Re:Is this a Net Neutrality thing? by luther349 · · Score: 1

      nn never covered the mobile space.

  5. Meh by iMadeGhostzilla · · Score: 1

    If my provider, AT&T, reduced video streaming to my phone to 480p I wouldn't care. I don't see HD on mobile as an essential service. Though I imagine there may be cases where it is.

  6. better than dvd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    i think dvd was 480i so this is better

    1. Re:better than dvd by sexconker · · Score: 0

      Your typical NTSC DVD movie comes from 720x480 progressive frames that interlaced at the end of the authoring process and can be recreated perfectly.
      Early DVD players only output an interlaced signal. Later DVD players supported progressive output, some with 24 FPS playback (built-in IVTC).

      If it's animated, good fucking luck. You're often trying to create a 24 or 30 FPS progressive video from something that started as 12 or 15 FPS and was abused into 24 FPS before being telecined into 30 FPS (or vice versa). And there's often mixes of both directions on a scene-by-scene basis. Oh, and during scene cuts the field order can flip so you'll get a blended frame of misaligned fields from two scenes. To fix it you'll need double one field to create a half resolution frame then drop the other field (and the frame it would have produced). Or encode the whole thing at 48 / 60 FPS instead so you don't have to drop shit. And don't forget the problems that occur when the framerate itself changes.

  7. It's the airspace, stupid! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Two or three HD streams destroy bandwidth for any given cellular tower.
     
    Have you ever tried to use LTE in a crowd that's all uploading or watching video? It's typically dial up speeds. MVNO's have it worse due to default deprioritization, but even 1st party, post paid verizon and AT&T throttle to shit under any amount of congestion. Video throttling is the only answer until the FCC gets off their ass and deregulates the airwaves.

  8. Citizen protection by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 0

    But the people have spoken, they'd prefer an demagoguery over consumer protection. We have a broadly supported pro-oligarchy contingent that works hard to paint the opposing centrists are far-left Marxists. Propaganda obscures truth, and a culture of identity politics thwarts reason.

    We're making our bed and we will soon lie in it.

    It wasn't consumer protection, it was citizen protection.

    Don't forget that NN wasn't repealed because of its technical merits - everyone largely agreed that NN was a good thing to have.

    You can hypothesize and opine about peoples' motivations and thought processes, but in the final analysis it was protecting citizens from runaway government agencies making up law out of whole cloth.

    It has been proposed several times that congress should pass a net neutrality law, and it has been proposed that tech companies could come up with a draft bill (*) to submit to congress, and it has been proposed that whining and moaning efforts could be better spent by taking these simple actions.

    Google, Facebook, Twitter, and the the other big players are four-square on board with Net Neutrality.

    Where is their proposed solution?

    (*) Many companies make draft bills that are introduced into congress, it's not at all uncommon.

    1. Re:Citizen protection by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It has been proposed several times that congress should pass a net neutrality law, and it has been proposed that tech companies could come up with a draft bill (*) to submit to congress, and it has been proposed that whining and moaning efforts could be better spent by taking these simple actions.

      True.

      Congress, however, wasn't going to take action due to lobbying efforts. While the U.S. Senate is more prone to political party levers and controls, they occasionally get things right. The other, lesser branch of Congress is bought and paid for because reps have to constantly campaign and get run out every two years.

      A possible solution is to lengthen House member terms to three or four years. That could weaken the wield of political parties on the reps and other special interests a little and allow them to vote more freely before they're sent back daily to their "campaign funding caves" to beg for more money all afternoon.

  9. Charlize Video Mode by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I prefer my resolution at a rate where you can't see facial blemishes under the makeup.

  10. Some people use mobile for home internet. by TomBauserman · · Score: 2

    That's where this becomes an issue. There's areas near me where the only provider available is a shitty dsl provider whose service isn't much better than dialup. People are paying for 4Mb but get closer to 1 or less. So people use their cell phones for internet. Would this include streaming video going through a hotspot? If so that's a problem.

  11. Driving Consumers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some manufacturers and Google have clearly been preparing for this with the Go edition and the low cost hand-sets. FWVGA displays are the future!11!

  12. What video streams? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't really understand these articles. What video streaming are they talking about?

    Are they actually manipulating data to such an extent, that if I load up youtube, they perform some kind of man-in-the-middle manipulation of the youtube UI so that the options for higher quality video are removed?

  13. Sounds about right. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Cable companies....need I say more. Well yes, if you are stupid enough to still be doing business with them you get the shitty service you deserve.

  14. It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Tighe_L · · Score: 0, Troll

    If you don't like to the service don't buy it. Net Neutrality is a scheme for Google and Netflix to get "free" internet to consumers. They use more than 90% of the internet's bandwidth, if the consumer can get cheaper internet by being capped to 480p that's good for the consumer. More choices.

    1. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Net Neutrality is a scheme for Google and Netflix to get "free" internet to consumers.

      Oh wow, I had no idea! And here I thought they paid their ISP just like I pay mine. Tell me, how does one get in on some of that sweet sweet "free" bandwidth?

    2. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by mystik · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Google + Netflix do not get "free" internet.

      They pay handsomely for their interconnects, infrastructure, caching edger servers + what not.

      Consumer ISPs do not get to charge them twice for connections + data customers are requesting.

      --
      Why aren't you encrypting your e-mail?
    3. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Stan92057 · · Score: 1

      Citations on Google and Netflix getting free internet access please.

      --
      Jack of all trades,master of none
    4. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Net Neutrality is a scheme for Google and Netflix to get "free" internet to consumers.

      How much do you make posting on /.? Google and Netflix pay for Internet access I assure you. What you mean is that ISPs want to charge not only their customers, but the party on the other end of the connection as well.

    5. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by luther349 · · Score: 1

      most mobile providers do the same. relly nobody throws a fit because its easy to get around and on your 6 inch phone 480p looks just fine.

    6. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by thule · · Score: 2

      Actually......

      Back in the days when Yahoo! was the biggest thing on the Internet, there was an article talking about how Yahoo! was only paying for around half of the cost of their total bandwidth usage. How? Instead of sending all of their data over transit, around half of their data went over links directly connected to large ISPs (peering links). At the time, transit was common. Only large telecom (backbone) providers were well peered across the nation. More and more content providers started doing this. For example, AOL bought a national network from IBM so they could do the same thing. Peering. Peering was the thing that saved the Internet. Robert Metcalfe's famous prediction that the Internet would collapse due to all the traffic on the backbone networks didn't happen because of the growing popularity of peering.

      A lot has changed since then. Peering very common and the business of peering has changed. A important part of a CDN is peering. Peering went from something that is a win-win for a content provider-ISP to a service a last mile can charge for (last mile networks are valuable). Note the fee for peering is still cheaper than transit. That is what makes it attractive to companies like Netflix. I can't imaging what Netflix's bandwidth bill would be if they were ONLY using transit. Peering saves them a TON of money.

      The reason Net Neutrality is brought up in the context of peering is that NN first started as a discussion of traffic shaping/filtering/blocking. Then the Netflix issue with their CDN (Cogent) hit the news and everyone seemed to treat it as a NN issue. It wasn't a NN issue, it was a peering issue. My fear is that NN would encompass peering. When all this was going down the FCC make a statement that they were watching the Netflix situation, but didn't consider peering part of NN. Unfortunately, some people disagreed (IMHO, mainly due to ignorance). If peering were to be part of NN, then, yeah, large content providers (e.g. Netflix, Google) could demand cut rate deals on peering. Or, like the initial post argues, "free bandwidth", which has NOTHING to do with the ORIGINAL intent of NN.

    7. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Tighe_L · · Score: 0

      Are they paying the ISPs for their customers to access their services? If you are a cable company and you are losing TV subscriptions to Netflix and Youtube through connections you built? Did Youtube and Netflix run wires to the customers homes? Internet, Phone and TV as a package offset the actual costs of operating all the equipment and employing the people necessary for this business, meanwhile Netflix and Google are siphoning customers off all they have to pay for is their connection to the internet. Nothing to the ISPs who's networks are getting saturated.

    8. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Tighe_L · · Score: 1

      Exactly, a friend of mine worked for a local ISP and they had Netflix CDN boxes in their datacenter.

    9. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Tighe_L · · Score: 1

      If said entity is consuming most of the bandwidth they really should share the costs.

    10. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're right, the content and the delivery mechanism should be separate!

    11. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Are they paying the ISPs for their customers to access their services?

      Customers are paying their ISPs to access their services. Wtf are you talking about?

    12. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by AvitarX · · Score: 3, Informative

      And here I thought I was paying for the wires to my house.

      I should pay for my heavy peak use, sure, but it shouldn't matter what I'm doing with it, be it Netflix, Youtube, Hulu, some other on demand.

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    13. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Net Neutrality is a scheme for Google and Netflix to get "free" internet to consumers.

      But what about your personal scheme to get free Internet to post to slashdot?

      Does that not too make you a bad person for stealing Internet service by paying your ISP only?
      After all by only paying your ISP and not all of the hosting providers for the traffic you send to those hosting providers, you too are getting "free" internet.

      I'm also reading your post, and you haven't paid for my Internet bill either, once again stealing free Internet from me.

      Until you are willing to put your checkbook where your mouth is, you clearly do not have the moral or legal high ground to even judge anyone else for paying for Internet service exactly how you do.

    14. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google + Netflix do not get "free" internet.

      They pay handsomely for their interconnects, infrastructure, caching edger servers + what not.

      Consumer ISPs do not get to charge them twice for connections + data customers are requesting.

      How much on average, does the "what not" cost?

    15. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Stan92057 · · Score: 1

      First don't answer a question with a question. Answer ,mine then i will answer YOURS. So again Citations on Netflix,Google getting free internet access..

      --
      Jack of all trades,master of none
    16. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by SNRatio · · Score: 1

      Google + Netflix do not get "free" internet.

      They pay handsomely for their interconnects, infrastructure, caching edger servers + what not.

      Consumer ISPs do not get to charge them twice for connections + data customers are requesting.

      I think consumer ISPs get to try to do that. What I am really hoping for is the day Comcast or one of the others tries to charge their own customers more for access to Youtube and then Alphabet announces "In the future, we will only work with neutral platforms. Google's products and services -all of them, from Android to Youtube-, will no longer be available via Comcast."

    17. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by SNRatio · · Score: 1

      Said entity is providing the content and is already paying the costs necessary to get it to the ISP's.network.The ISP's customers are the ones consuming the ISP's bandwidth by requesting that said content be delivered to them. If the ISP doesn't want their bandwidth consumed, they should get different customers who don't consume so much of it.

    18. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ISPs (of all kinds) make money at both ends of their pipes, from the commercial content providers to the consumers at the other end.

    19. Re:It's just one way to get mobile internet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      nope, the isp customers are consuming the bandwidth they paid for, google and netflix are merely sending what the isp customers want and already paid for.

      Telcom companies dont want to carry data only as that is less profitable than charging 100 times the price for voice (which is just a very narrow data link), so they invent excuses like this shit...

  15. How? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    With all these stories about video being throttled to a specific resolution, I am curious if they actually mean that, or if what they really mean is that video is throttled to a specific bandwidth, and any HD content that can fit that bandwidth will still play as HD.

  16. Oh no by ArchieBunker · · Score: 1

    Can you even tell 480p video from 720p on a four inch phone screen?

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    1. Re:Oh no by luther349 · · Score: 1

      no sir you cant. its like buying a 19 inch 4k display you just threw your money away.

    2. Re:Oh no by SmaryJerry · · Score: 1

      If you tether your phone you could use the extra pixels. People shouldn't have to be forced a certain quality when they can chose their GB limit also. Is charter say "unlimited internet, as long as we tailor it to minimize data" That's just silly. Charge for what people need, don't limit everyone's quality.

    3. Re:Oh no by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe we need a VR/AR-Compatible logo for the carriers in the future. Charter prepares to not to be one.

  17. ISP mobile exists thanks to regulation. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Xfinity and Charter haven't deployed their own cell towers. Instead they've formed MVNOs which provide service by piggybacking on towers of the big four carriers.

    Now if only someone would craft some legislation so third parties could also access all the infrastructure ISPs have laid out...

  18. Not about data usage by ddtmm · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is definitely not about data usage because if it was then they would be restricting bit rates. But they're instead restricting resolution.

    1. Re:Not about data usage by EvilSS · · Score: 1

      Do you not understand how video streaming works?

      --
      I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
  19. Comcast is letting existing customers get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Comcast is letting existing customers get 720p video streams "on an interim basis at no charge."

    No additional charge.

    1. Re:Comcast is letting existing customers get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well thank God for that! I was afraid I was going to have to pay more for what I was already doing. Now that you have enlightened me that this will never change, ever... I'm forever thankful! Perhaps you should look up "interim". And by chance did you write the "plethora of colors" article a few days ago?