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US Warns on Russia's New Space Weapons (reuters.com)

The United States voiced deep suspicion on Tuesday over Russia's pursuit of new space weapons, including a mobile laser system to destroy satellites in space, and the launch of a new inspector satellite which was acting in an "abnormal" way. From a report: Russia's pursuit of counterspace capabilities was "disturbing," Yleem D.S. Poblete, U.S. Assistant Secretary of State for Arms Control, Verification and Compliance, told the U.N.'s Conference on Disarmament which is discussing a new treaty to prevent an arms race in outer space. A Russian delegate at the conference dismissed Poblete's remarks as unfounded and slanderous. Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, at the Geneva forum in February, said a priority was to prevent an arms race in outer space, in line with Russia's joint draft treaty with China presented a decade ago.

27 of 179 comments (clear)

  1. Oh, by msauve · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While you're at it, please ignore our new Space Force.

    --
    "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    1. Re:Oh, by Nidi62 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      While you're at it, please ignore our new Space Force.

      You do understand that the "Space Force" thing is likely a reaction to this kind of activity from the Russians and Chinese right? As campy as it sounds, it sure seems like an idea who's time has long since come.

      The "Space Force" thing is likely a reaction of a person with declining mental faculties (see the very name "Space Force" as an example) who is determined to put his name on things and is unable to understand the bureaucratic inefficiency, financial strain, duplication of effort, and wastefulness that creating another military branch would bring. Especially one as ill-defined and rudimentary technologically as space warfare/space combat. Leave it under the auspices of the Air Force until technological capability or operational necessity warrant it's own independent command structure.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    2. Re:Oh, by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The political pull to the left is strong with this one... Why must you see collusion and conspiracy around every corner?

      Because I'm paying attention.

      I see good reasons to move this function away from the Air Force,

      Name one.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Oh, by Jason+Levine · · Score: 2

      Either that, or to send a whole bunch of (more) money to defense contractors to get specific "Space Force" ships created, crew trained, etc. The actual "Space Force" needs within the Air Force are minimal - with the Russian and Chinese threats best handled through diplomatic channels at the moment - but making it its own separate "Force" will increase pressure to funnel more money to it and beef it up as much as possible even if there isn't a threat worthy of the Space Force.

      Of course, the third option is a combination of the two. They could be making a Space Force that's essentially the TSA In Space. A lot of money being sent to companies to create complex systems, but in the end an ineffective operation that doesn't actually stop any threats.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    4. Re:Oh, by Nidi62 · · Score: 2

      yes, because the US also do not have any satellite destroying weapons too (please ignore that little secret satellite and those ground-space missiles)

      Anyone who thinks the X-37B doesn't have a weapons payload package is deluding themselves.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    5. Re:Oh, by Nidi62 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Interesting issue you bring up, but you need to divorce yourself from the political considerations on this.

      There are reasons to create a new branch of the armed services that go beyond costs. The mission and budget of the Air Force is quite big, as is their command structure. Carving out a new branch, much like the carving out the Army Air Corps, does have it's advantages. Flattening the command structure allows more flexibility and faster response times, allows for specialized training and skills to be closer to the top of the command structure, and allows for focusing appropriated budget and resources on specific areas of the mission.

      Of course, there is a down side to everything. But in my opinion this idea has merit. It flattens the hierarchy at the Pentagon, allows the development and advancement of resources with specialized skills. And creates a sharper focus on a specific problem set. Rockets and satellites go one way, things that depend on wings go another. It's a natural division and there is very little overlap, so it actually makes sense to me.

      Remember what happens when you flatten something: it gets wider. Have space forces be a subsidiary command of the Air Force makes sense right now because the technology simply isn't mature enough to warrant in independent command. As an independent command you add senior command staff at the political level (think White House/Pentagon) and the support staff that goes with it, scientific staff, support and logistical staff, training facilities for both basic and advanced training, OCS/academy locations, etc. So you are either relying on contractors for staffing (very expensive but politically attractive) or robbing from other branches/setting up your own training pipeline or manpower pool.

      Keep it as part of the Air Force and you keep the vertical efficiency the Air Force already has. Pull from Air Force enlisted and officer recruits or existing unit, rely on the technological and institutional knowledge the Air Force already has from decades of cooperation with NASA and working on Star Wars, X-37, etc. Until it reaches a critical mass it is too inefficient and expensive to have it operating by itself.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    6. Re:Oh, by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

      Please explain to me what this "space force" would accomplish, which nuclear ballistic missile submarines and existing reconnaissance satellites don't already do at a fraction of the cost, and have been for decades.

      Orbiting weapons platforms can be tracked with radar, and destroyed with systems that exist today - China proved this when they blew up a satellite years ago. Silent missile submarines can still be 50 miles off your coast and you won't know where it is until it's already launched, and then it's too late. They also have the effect of being proven, buildable technology that actually works, and has known costs - all of which are a really good thing if you're looking for a true deterrent, and not bad science fiction from the 1970s

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    7. Re:Oh, by gosand · · Score: 2

      I see good reasons to move this function away from the Air Force,

      Name one.

      There's no air in space.

      That's all I got.

      --

      My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

    8. Re:Oh, by Nidi62 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Sailors are not generally trained, organized, equipped, or doctrinally inculcated to serve as 'soldiers'. Likewise 'soldiers' are not generally trained, organized, equipped, or doctrinally inculcated to serve aboard ship, perform amphibious operations, or participate in naval expeditionary campaigns. Because of this the Marines exist.

      Exactly my point. The Marines serve a very niche, specialized, and important role. But, that role is not large enough to warrant it's own, independent branch. The Marines rely on the Navy for medical, logistical, and even training support (Naval Academy for Marine officers), and the Navy uses Marines for certain functions as well, such as guarding conventional and nuclear weapons aboard ship. If anything, the Space Force should have a Marine-Navy relationship until it grows too large or becomes operationally necessary to be independent. At that point it would have organically grown most of the logistical and command structure necessary to be an independent branch, making for a relatively easy transition. Right now, it's just forced.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    9. Re:Oh, by TomGreenhaw · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Just like star wars in the 1980's, this whole thing is a ruse. If the U.S. military is doing something in space, what makes anybody think it wouldn't be a well guarded secret? The US is either goading them into wasting money on something that doesn't matter, or creating an enemy to justify increased military spending, and probably both.

      A quick internet search indicates that the US "black budget" for the military is more than $50 Billion US dollars annually. The entire Russian Federation military budget is much less than $100 Billion - probably closer to $70 bilion. Additionally, there's the $600 billion the US spends in its public military budget numbers.

      Arms race - LOL.

      --
      Greed is the root of all evil.
  2. Not a Russia appologist but really? by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

    With the US creating a whole new military branch (or at least the executive trying to) why would be surprised other quasi hostile nations with the capability of doing so would NOT be preparing space based counter measures?

    Space Force aside what did people think was going to happen everyone was just going to play nice and abide by already 40 year old treaties to not put more than 10 warheads on an ICBM for all eternity?

    Time marches on folks - technology improves.

    --
    Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    1. Re:Not a Russia appologist but really? by rickb928 · · Score: 2

      China did not 'shoot down' one of their satellites in 2007, they destroyed it in orbit. And they did so with technology not terribly advanced even in 2007.

      The primary aftermath was a debris cloud that still is largely in orbit, and will probably pose a threat to various other objects over time. Indeed, debris is likely going to be an actual weapon type in space.

      China certainly used space weapons in 2007. We are behind in only now focusing on space warfare.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    2. Re:Not a Russia appologist but really? by higuita · · Score: 2

      what free world? the one there the president says that everything that he do not agree is fake news and boycott then (at least do not arrest then... for now), one where he fires everyone who disagree with him (even if he hire him a few months before saying he was perfect for the job), where he promises no wars but break a peace and anti-nuclear treaty because he wants to control the other country... and send all CAPS threats via twitter. Finally, the same president (administrative branch) that demands that the judicial branch to stop investigation about him? yes, that free world

      Pro tip: they are all the same

      --
      Higuita
    3. Re:Not a Russia appologist but really? by Enigma2175 · · Score: 2

      Sure, China deployed an antisatellite weapon in 2007 but the US has been working on weapons like that since the 1950s and has also destroyed satellites in orbit. To claim the US is "behind", at least in antisatellite weapons systems, is just simply wrong - they have a number of different antisatellite weapons in their arsenal.

      The purpose of "Space Force" is simple, it's just another conduit for politicians to funnel public money to their cronies. This "news" is just propaganda to justify it. Nothing new.

      --

      Enigma

  3. Well Kent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    What do you think a secret phase conjugate tracking system is for?

  4. Joke's on them by belthize · · Score: 4, Funny

    We have a Space Farce so ha.

  5. Re:What did you think would happen? by Train0987 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The US star wars program was the final nail in the communist Soviet Bloc's coffin. Money well spent even if it were "fake" (which it's not).

  6. Made up names by Zaiff+Urgulbunger · · Score: 2

    The name "Yleem D.S. Poblete" sounds like the type of name a race of alien lizard people would choose as sounding nice and inconspicuous!

    And that's coming from me!!

    1. Re:Made up names by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 2

      The name "Yleem D.S. Poblete" sounds like the type of name a race of alien lizard people would choose as sounding nice and inconspicuous! And that's coming from me!!

      Like "John Bigboote" or "John Smallberries"?

    2. Re:Made up names by White+Yeti · · Score: 2

      It's an anagram for "Embed soy pellet".

      (That's a lot of useful letters.)

  7. Re:What did you think would happen? by bobbied · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It was neither fake nor about this kind of thing. It was a missile defense system. And it actually developed into multiple working weapons systems. Patriot missile systems are one example, and there are more.

    However, one cannot deny that the prospect of such a system was partially responsible for the fall of the Soviet Union as they economically couldn't manage the R&D work required to "keep up" with all that was going on. They tried, but it only hastened their economic collapse. So, Star Wars actually was successful as a strategy, even if it didn't produce a weapon system that achieved all it's stated goals. It was pretty good propaganda if nothing else.

    --
    "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  8. We cannot allow a fake laser satellite gap!!! by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 2

    >> United States voiced deep suspicion on Tuesday over Russia's pursuit of new space weapons, including a mobile laser system to destroy satellites in space

    Clearly, the red-blooded Men of America cannot allow a fake laser satellite gap - open the nation's pocketbook now!!!

  9. Re: What did you think would happen? by mrchew1982 · · Score: 2

    You know what else was good propaganda? Mickey mouse and McDonald's.

  10. Re:Timely justification for the space force... by Nidi62 · · Score: 2

    I'm sure the name "Air Force" seemed silly when it was broken off from the Army to become it's own military branch in 1947.

    Not really. The RAF (Royal Air Force) had already existed since the end of WWI, and it a logical step to go from the Army Air Corps to simply Air Force. Space Force does sound like a name straight out of a campy 50's pop novel, though.

    --
    The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
  11. Russia is ready to respond to any provocation, but by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    "Russia is ready to respond to any provocation, but the last thing the Russians want is another war. And that, if you like good news, is the best news you are going to hear."

    A whiff of World War III hangs in the air. In the US, Cold War 2.0 is on, and the anti-Russian rhetoric emanating from the Clinton campaign, echoed by the mass media, hearkens back to McCarthyism and the red scare. In response, many people are starting to think that Armageddon might be nigh—an all-out nuclear exchange, followed by nuclear winter and human extinction. It seems that many people in the US like to think that way. Goodness gracious!
    The curtain is falling on a country in serious trouble

    But, you know, this is hardly unreasonable of them. The US is spiraling down into financial, economic and political collapse, losing its standing in the world and turning into a continent-sized ghetto full of drug abuse, violence and decaying infrastructure, its population vice-ridden, poisoned with genetically modified food, morbidly obese, exploited by predatory police departments and city halls, plus a wide assortment of rackets, from medicine to education to real estate That we know.

    We also know how painful it is to realize that the US is damaged beyond repair, or to acquiesce to the fact that most of the damage is self-inflicted: the endless, useless wars, the limitless corruption of money politics, the toxic culture and gender wars, and the imperial hubris and willful ignorance that underlies it all This level of disconnect between the expected and the observed certainly hurts, but the pain can be avoided, for a time, through mass delusion.

    This sort of downward spiral does not automatically spell "Apocalypse," but the specifics of the state cult of the US—an old-time religiosity overlaid with the secular religion of progress—are such that there can be no other options: either we are on our way up to build colonies on Mars, or we perish in a ball of flame. Since the humiliation of having to ask the Russians for permission to fly the Soyuz to the International Space Station makes the prospect of American space colonies seem dubious, it's Plan B: balls of flame here we come!

    And so, most of the recent American warmongering toward Russia can be explained by the desire to find anyone but oneself to blame for one's unfolding demise. This is a well-understood psychological move—projecting the shadow—where one takes everything one hates but can't admit to about oneself and projects it onto another. On a subconscious level (and, in the case of some very stupid people, even a conscious one) the Americans would like to nuke Russia until it glows, but can't do so because Russia would nuke them right back. But the Americans can project that same desire onto Russia, and since they have to believe that they are good while Russia is evil, this makes the Armageddon scenario appear much more likely.

    But this way of thinking involves a break with reality. There is exactly one nation in the world that nukes other countries, and that would be the United States. It gratuitously nuked Japan, which was ready to surrender anyway, just because it could. It prepared to nuke Russia at the start of the Cold War, but was prevented from doing so by a lack of a sufficiently large number of nuclear bombs at the time. And it attempted to render Russia defenseless against nuclear attack, abandoning the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty in 2002, but has been prevented from doing so by Russia's new weapons. These include, among others, long-range supersonic cruise missiles (Kalibr), and suborbital intercontinental missiles carrying multiple nuclear payloads capable of evasive maneuvers as they approach their targets (Sarmat). All of these new weapons are impossible to intercept using any conceivable defensive technology. At the same time, Russia has also developed its own defensive capabilities, and its latest S-500 system will effectively seal off Russia's airspace, being able to intercept targets both close to

  12. Re:"Only we are allowed to weaponize space." by Nidi62 · · Score: 2

    if someone else does it, then they're bad people. Waaah-waaah-waaah. The corrupt, dishonest and hypocritical war-mongering shithole of America complaining again.

    Let's really freak people out: We need a treaty that the only vessels allowed to be armed in space must be under the control of UN, staffed by a multinational crew and composed of a command crew made up primarily of people from each of the UNSC member states(for example French captain, Russian XO, American Chief engineer, Chinese Senior NCO, etc).

    --
    The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
  13. Re:No, you can't answer him, you have TDS by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Informative

    He asked intelligently, you failed to respond intelligently.

    Point to the intelligent part of his comment. Even Trump's legal counsel has had to walk back from "no collusion" to "collusion is not a word in the code so it can't be a crime" which is, of course, a load of horse shit. We therefore know that there has been collusion, since they have shifted to attempting to justify it, and the only question is what the scope of the collusion was/is. Hence, anyone who has been paying attention knows that there was collusion. They claimed they were talking about adopting orphans, now they've admitted that was not the case, etc etc.

    I can't tell the difference between someone with TDS and a paid writer on here,

    I can't tell the difference between idiots who believe in TDS, and the paid writers they got the idea from, and neither can anyone else — especially when they post as AC. You could be anyone, including a sock puppet or a paid agitator, and you probably are.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"