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Apple's New Strategy: Sell Pricier iPhones First (wsj.com)

Posted by msmash on from the show-me-the-money dept.

The staggered release gives the company a month to sell higher-end models without cheaper competition from itself. WSJ: This year, according to people familiar with Apple's production plans, the company prioritized production of its two pricier OLED models, the iPhone XS and XS Max, whose prices start at about $1,000. Both will hit stores Friday, followed five weeks later by the least expensive new model, the XR, which has an LCD screen and a starting price of $749. The staggered release gives Apple a month to sell the higher-end models without cheaper competition from itself. It also simplifies logistics and retail demands and could strengthen Apple's ability to forecast sales and production of all three models through the Christmas holidays, analysts and supply chain experts said. "It's sort of a Dutch auction," said Josh Lowitz, co-founder of research firm Consumer Intelligence Research Partners, referring to the practice of starting with a high asking price, then lowering it until a buyer accepts. "The people who are most committed will pay to get early access. Then you get to the people who are making a choice and may settle for the $750 phone. This could become the new normal."

115 comments

  1. It's more about skimming the cream by JoeyRox · · Score: 3, Informative

    This is a standard marketing strategy and not unique to Apple. You charge more for people who are willing to pay more (early adopters), then phase in a lower ASP as the demand curve shifts toward more typical mid and late stream adopters.

  2. It seems like a great idea by SuperKendall · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I don't really see a downside here, to me it seems like an excellent approach - by selling the top end models first, you are treating them as something more special.

    Those who want to wait for the slightly lower priced Xr won't mind a delay much, and they can judge if it's worth spending more to have a nicer model earlier.

    Personally I am really curious to see both the Xr and Xs Max side by side, to compare screens... I don't plan to get a phone update this year but I think seeing those two would be a really good way to contrast a great OLED against a great LCD screen. Some have said OLED screens do not appear to be quite as sharp and I think I can see what they are talking about, but the two latest larger models should present the best side by side comparison to really tell.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're just trying to cash in on the people who can't wait, and who will pony up the extra $250 to get their Apple fix. It's plain and planned greed, don't try to sweet-talk it.

    2. Re:It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're just trying to cash in on the people who can't wait, and who will pony up the extra $250 to get their Apple fix. It's plain and planned greed, don't try to sweet-talk it.

      Good thing you are not greedy. Must be nice.

    3. Re: It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Remind me again whoâ(TM)s forcing all these people to buy the phones right away.

    4. Re: It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nobody. Just like nobody is forcing people to put the bottle to their mouth and drink, or light the next cigarette. But that's not how people work, and Apple knows that people will pay up to get their iPhone NOW, that's why they're doing this.

    5. Re:It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't want to wait for any iPhone of the current ones. The last good iPhone was the 5s - without any of the nfc (which is not so near), and other crap. This year I made a compromise and 3 days ago bought a iPhone SE. And this will be the last iPhone I buy unless they return to a reasonably thick form factor, a reasonably small form factor, remove bullshit as faceid, nfc and add back the headphone jack.
      My Etymotics with custom ear molds come to as much as the SE these days. And no, none of the bluetooth crap out there, or any of the apple pods come any closer, especially for long conference calls or for listening to meeting recordings during plane rides.

    6. Re:It seems like a great idea by hawk · · Score: 1

      Well, they got *me* . . .

      I absolutely need a new phone immediately. As in, ran the last one over with one of my Cadillacs and have been desperately holding out.

      And we've already used up all the older spares.

      So I leave in half an hour to pick up my new nanny.

      And things had been *so* peaceful . . .

      hawk

    7. Re:It seems like a great idea by GuB-42 · · Score: 1

      We can also say that they are making it cheaper for people who can wait. Plain and planned charity. That's just a question of perspective. In reality, it is a mix of both. Well, maybe not the charity part, we are all greedy, including the people who make up Apple.

      Personally, I am in favor of making people pay for privileges, because globally, it makes things cheaper for those who don't need these privileges. For example, I don't mind the variable pricing now common with airlines. For example, when I see a student next to me in the plane, who paid half the price I did, I am happy. Unlike me, he probably planned his trip a long time in advance, probably took a lot of time finding the good deals and had to be flexible in his dates. He did all that because otherwise, he couldn't have traveled. Me, I have a job, more money and less time. The double price ticket is within my budget, so that's fine. If everybody paid the same price, I would probably have saved a bit, however that student wouldn't have traveled. And it is not charity on my part, because if in that case, I am the one who paid more, there are other situations where I benefit from the money of others who paid for a privilege.

    8. Re:It seems like a great idea by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      I see it more as "Apple is prioritizing building the phones people want to buy" which happen to be the newest phones, and which happen to be the most expensive.

      The Xr is basically a repackabed iPhone X, minus OLED screen (replaced with LCD). If you wanted an iPhone X-style phone, you either want an Xs coming out, or you would've just bought the iPhone X already. Thus really, selling iPhone Xr units on day 1 wouldn't generate a ton of new sales and it takes away from manufacture of the phone people really want - the Xs.

      In a month's time, when the mad rush to buy an Xs is over, you can release the Xr, keeping the production lines busy.

      Likewise, in the meantime, you stopped production of the other phones (the iPhone 7/8 series) because you have a backlog of inventory of them, so those lines are devoted to making the Xs units at first. The inventory will tide you over on sales (because they sell thinly) while you're making everything else.

      It's also a bit of letting the channels sell through as well - carriers with unsold iPhone X stock can sell to those who want an Xs but can't afford it, but don't want an Xr.

      Remember, Apple hates scalpers, and anytime they have to say "Sorry, it's out of stock" to someone, they see it as a lost sale opportunity - they'd rather say "Yes, we have them in stock, which one do you want" rather than have you walk away disappointed (and potentially, buying another phone). They know demand for the very latest unit is always high and while they can sell out on the first weekend, they'd rather sell out on Sunday night than Friday night. So making tons of the one people generally want to keep stores stocked is a good move, while those who want the alternative have alternatives. If you want the Xr now, you'd just go with the X (still obtainable either as refurb through Apple or through your carrier).

    9. Re: It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So buying the new iPhone early each year is a disease- like an addiction?

      I like the way you think!

    10. Re:It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's not really a meaningful comparison since the resolutions are so different. The XS is 458 dpi, while the XR is only 326 dpi.

    11. Re: It seems like a great idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why wouldn't it be an addiction? The people buying those phones get their fix for the year.

  3. Not it isn't like a Dutch Auction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They aren't lowering the price of the expensive phone, they are less expensive one later.

  4. What? by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 2, Funny

    Market forces, affect Apple? Blasphemy!!

  5. $1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Any person that pays $1000 for a phone, Apple or not, is bat shit crazy, or bat shit rich.

    That phones does not make miracles people!!! Wake up...

    A $200 phone does 97% of what an $1000 phone can do.

    1. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Including spying on you.

    2. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1

      If Crapple and Scroogle will both spy on you, might as well get the cheaper handset, because ta hell with giving more money to snooping pigs.

    3. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >including

      Yes, we're aware the entire ecosystem is riddled with metrics. An app is an app. Apps!

      Relevant XKCD - note that it would apply even if it was windows vs *nix
      https://xkcd.com/934/

    4. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by thegarbz · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Any person that pays $1000 for a phone, Apple or not, is bat shit crazy, or bat shit rich.

      Fortunately most of us haven't bought phones for many years. Pocket computers which can make calls on the other hand...

      A $200 phone does 97% of what an $1000 phone can do.

      In terms of dollar per frustration with a slow piece of shit I would say it does more like 297%

    5. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      It really comes down to how long that $200 phone will last you. If it never gets software updates, you probably need to replace it after a few years if you care about security at all. If you can keep a $1000 phone for five years instead of buying a $200 phone every year during that span, there's no difference in cost aside fluctuations in currency value over that time period.

      I think the top end iPhone is probably worth closer to $600, but if Apple can get people to pay $1000 who am I to stop them. No one is going to tell their boss that they'd realistically be willing to work for less than their current salary. Charge what the market will bear and if the competition can't undercut you, that's their failing. However, the notion that you should always buy the absolute cheapest option is foolish in my opinion.

      I've found that spending just a little bit more on appliances instead of buying the cheapest model tends to save money in the long run. Something sold at half the price is not going to have the same level of build quality. If I need to spend an extra $60 so that I won't need to replace the thing after a few years, sign me up. Even with online shopping, you still end up nickle and diming yourself over the long run.

    6. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If you use your phone for a good amount of time every day, why not spend $1/day?

      I guess that's about paying what something is really worth. By your logic, maybe doctors should charge US$ 3000 for an appointment. Why not spend it? It's your health we are talking about!

      I make that much money in like a minute. It's worth it to me.

      Well, then I guess phones could cost 10x more and you would be alright about it. Hey, it's just ten minutes! It's worth it to you!

    7. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by JoeyRox · · Score: 2

      Except you can buy a very fast pocket computer that makes calls for only $379, the current price of an iPhone 7 refurb directly from Apple, which includes 1-year warranty.

    8. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Scarletdown · · Score: 1

      Wake up...A $200 phone does 97% of what an $1000 phone can do.

      And my $60 J3 Luna does 100% of everything I need it to do, and will be in service for me for years to come. Just sayin' :)

      --
      This space unintentionally left blank.
    9. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Any person that pays $1000 for a phone, Apple or not, is bat shit crazy, or bat shit rich.

      That phones does not make miracles people!!! Wake up...

      A $200 phone does 97% of what an $1000 phone can do.

      I think $70,000 trucks and $1000 video cards are stupid too, but Texas and PCMR would disagree.

    10. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Powercntrl · · Score: 2

      Any person that pays $1000 for a phone, Apple or not, is bat shit crazy, or bat shit rich.

      This meme (yes, millennials, I'm using the word correctly) goes around every time Apple releases a new phone. $1,000 is roughly about a year's worth of cable TV, or a pack-every-other-day cigarette habit, or a $4.25 Starbucks latte every weekday. In the grand scheme of things people spend money on, a new smartphone that you'll use for at least a year, is not really that expensive.

      --

      ---
      DRM is like antifreeze, to the MPAA/RIAA it's sweet, to the consumers it's poison.
    11. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thanks Tim

    12. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I got my phone for $8 during a Black Friday sale. It does everything I need, but has the benefit of the shittiest camera on the planet.

    13. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by Pascal+Sartoretti · · Score: 1

      A $200 phone does 97% of what an $1000 phone can do.

      Like a $20'000 car does 97% of what a $100'000 car does, yet some people still buy luxury cars.

      I spend more time in front of my phone than sitting in my car, so spending an additional 800$ each 3 years on my new phone doesn't feel so surreal.

    14. Re: $1000 phones are surreal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      A junky rationalizing his addiction.

      I only spend $ on drugs.

    15. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by torkus · · Score: 1

      I was OK with the $500 phones, tolerated the $600 phones...kind of suffered through the $700 phones because they we're mini tablets (Galaxy Note)...

      But this new $1k+ standard for a phone is utterly, completely ridiculous. It's a mini computer, I get it...but nothing it does is so much more fantastic than a much more basic phone (except the camera).

      iOS 11 -> 12 is MUCH more of an improvement than iPhone X -> XS ... and even that is pretty minor. It's not about being a Luddite here, it's the simple truth that there's such small incremental benefit to new phones that it's really, really stupid of people to go out in droves to buy them.

      --
      You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
    16. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by torkus · · Score: 1

      "most of us" includes a ton of people who just have a phone because they need one...not because they use any of the features.

      If "most of us" is meant to include the tech-friendly generations then upgrades are about every two years.

      --
      You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
    17. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Define very fast. I bet you mine is faster. Can it multitask as well as mine? Does it playback 6K videos smoothly? Will it chug trying to find text in a 450 page PDF document?

      If you answered no to any of the above then you don't have a "very fast" pocket computer. You have a basic one suitable for plebs who treat it like a phone with a Facebook app.

    18. Re:$1000 phones are surreal. by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      "most of us" includes a ton of people who just have a phone because they need one...not because they use any of the features.

      Then my friend you bought the wrong device. May I suggest next time you send $1000 my way and I'll send you a $300 device back.

  6. Re:Blackberry! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No, they're not mainstream anymore.

  7. Re: Blackberry! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It is fitting that you put Linux in the same category as VCRs.

  8. What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fuck? by Seven+Spirals · · Score: 1

    Smartphones are devices for consumers. I'm a maker not a taker. I've got no use for a spying, expensive, closed-source, sealed battery, crippled computing device with no keyboard. I'd rather carry a flip phone or "dad" phone or whatever. Hell, I'd rather have people have to call my home phone at the house and get the fucking answering machine and I don't eve know they called until hours later when I *might* feel like calling them back (maybe). Da fuck do I want to give every spammer and griefer instant access to me for? Lastly, FFS, why would I pay $1000 for the privilege of being harassed and spied on?

  9. So what the GPU manufacturers have been doing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So what the GPU manufacturers have been doing forever?

  10. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1

    Get a low-end Moto smartphone. Unlocked bootloader, so you can install a custom ROM/OS. They also often have (in case of G4 Play, G5, and E4(?)) removable batteries and SD cards, not sealed junk.

  11. I do miss my flip phone. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If it rings, open it and talk. Close it when you're done.
    To make a call, open it and press 1 for wife, 2 for home,
    on the actual buttons that can be located by feel.
    All can be done without looking at it.

    I'd still have it but for being a map junkie.

    1. Re:I do miss my flip phone. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why not have a separate phone?

  12. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You sound like a bitch, also a poor

  13. Smaller phones? by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Every company seems to be in love with big phones. Can anyone recommend an Android phone with a 4” (or thereabouts) screen? My wife currently has an iPhone SE, and she’s adamant that she doesn’t want a phone larger than that.

    I’m going to keep using my 6S for as long as I practically can... but then I’ll probably move on from Apple too. Smartphones are basically commodities at this point... paying the ludicrous premium for any of these companies’ flagship phones is not something I’m willing to do.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
    1. Re:Smaller phones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Apple doesn't even sell the iPhone SE directly on their website anymore and is suggesting if users want one to buy it elsewhere? Are they dropping the cheaper iPhone alternatives? I haven't heard much on their direction regarding the SE. Dropping it would fit with this strategy - only offering an iPhone 7 or 8 for more money than an SE.

    2. Re:Smaller phones? by CastrTroy · · Score: 2

      The iPhone SE has dimensions of 123.8 x 58.6 x 7.6 mm

      You can use the Phone Finder at GSM Arena to find a phone that matches your criteria. There really aren't many current phones that are the same size or smaller than the iPhone SE. Don't look at screensize though. Look at actual phone dimensions, because bezels have become a lot smaller in recent years. Something like the Sony Xperia XZ1 Compact is probably going to be about as small as you can get.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    3. Re:Smaller phones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow.. I've looked up the precise dimensions for the iPhone SE (in the form of this comparison below).

      https://www.phonearena.com/phones/compare/Sony-Xperia-XZ2-Compact,Apple-iPhone-SE,Nokia-1/phones/10834,10001,10811

      What impresses me is the weight, 113g.

      Pretty funny how the Nokia 1 is highly similar to the old Samsung S3 in size (slightly narrower and longer), shape, and same weight. (also CPU, RAM and battery)
      https://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9300_galaxy_s_iii-4238.php
      The Nokia 1 would be a phone you get because you need a phone, not because you want a great one. I've not held one but the shape should make it nice to handle, while not a true small phone. (well maybe it's not a very good phone and a follow up version will do better)

      I guess you can plan for battery swap if/when needed on the iPhones then as the SE is thoroughly deprecated there'll be more chance to see a vendor coming up with something very roughly similar.

    4. Re:Smaller phones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This. I have an SE, and I love it, because it's four inches. I would love to have a 3.5" phone like the older iPhones. There's no way I'm carrying a six-inch phablet: I don't think that would even fit in my pockets.

    5. Re:Smaller phones? by Tjp($)pjT · · Score: 1

      Apple of late reduces the price of previous generations phones instead of engineeering an entry level device, like the SE. So hang on to your 6s for a few more years, the when the iPhone 12 is out, upgrade to the iPhone X.

      Personally I want a simplified “dinner out” iPhone ... 640x960 real pixels but 3 inch diagonal screen. No camera, or rear camera only. Edge to edge OLED no home button, so using the modern gesture interface only, speakers and microphone through the bezel. WiFi and Bluetooth. Wireless charging, and 2-3 day battery life. Over the air sync only.

      Only available with a sapphire glass front and DLC black case. So rugged. eSIM with the ability to clone the eSIM from your “day phone”, and 2-4GB Ram, 32GB flash.

      This allows Retina display with the same “point” count as the original iPhone, and could be made with a BOM cost of well under $100 and sell for around $250 and be profitable. GPS May be a must have, but really is nearly 0 cost considering the reuse of chipsets would be the cheapest way, rather than supporting a non-GPS ‘cell’ chipset.

      Fits in a Jean watch pocket, fits in a waistcoat watch pocket.

      --
      - Tjp

      I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!

    6. Re:Smaller phones? by hawk · · Score: 1

      > an iPhone SE, and sheâ(TM)s adamant that she doesnâ(TM)t want a phone larger than that.

      Indeed, the reason that the iphone stayed so small so long, and then first grew only taller, was to that a woman's thumb could reach the entire screen . . . (leaving folks with hands like mine unable to tap the near side; every strategy has holes . . .)

      hawk

    7. Re:Smaller phones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's complicated.
      You might remember that all original iPhone apps were flushed down the gutter retina or not with the 32bit phase out.

      eSIM cloning is both the greatest idea ever and a daft one - can you imagine instant SIM cloning, credit card cloning, smart card cloning, key fob cloning supported and advertised to the user and at zero cost and zero delay? But would be a great idea carrier side and would work between SIM and eSIM and between two physical SIM as well.

      Call your idea the "iPhone Nano". I can see where you going at. Mid 2000s we could have tiny shit (even Nintendo released the "Game Boy Micro" although I've never seen one. Maybe it's a good idea to ebay one)

      Mine now : make a 4G dumbphone with retina 1.77" or 2" (2.4" is too big on a dumbphone with keypad!), no Internet access (no web or facebook!), USB 2.0 instead of 1.1 (I kid you not), companion apps for Windows/OSX/Linux/BSD to get the contacts out (there you can put cloud shit, only if enabled) . Serviceable camera like 5MP, 8MP or 13MP.

    8. Re:Smaller phones? by Powercntrl · · Score: 1

      Can anyone recommend an Android phone with a 4” (or thereabouts) screen?

      Android phone manufacturers abandoned smaller phones with decent hardware specs ages ago. Apple just recently did it. I'm personally not a fan of gargantuan screens, either. My recommendation would be get an iPhone 8 and drive it until the wheels fall off. Hopefully by then, "small" might come back into style.

      --

      ---
      DRM is like antifreeze, to the MPAA/RIAA it's sweet, to the consumers it's poison.
    9. Re:Smaller phones? by antdude · · Score: 1

      No kidding. I don't want big smartphones, Apple. I love 4S' size to fit in my small hands and pockets.

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    10. Re: Smaller phones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yea, but what does your wife think.

      *pushes her head back onto my raging cock*

  14. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You sound like a bitch, also a poor

    Don't say "a poor".

    That makes you sound like "a dipshit".

  15. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1

    The "poors" are the ones who covet the latest iBaubles. Want to know what the rich are like? Look at Warren Buffet. He lives in the same house he bought in the early 60s, drives a 15 year old car. He doesn't need "bling" to prove how rich he is to others, and he didn't get rich by spending on crap that will be obsolete in 6 months.

  16. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 0

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  17. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by mbkennel · · Score: 1

    Most billionaires are not like Warren Buffet. But you're right, they don't covet the latest iBaubles. They covet the latest congressDroids.

  18. No complaints about the Model 3? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Teslaâ(TM)s doing the same thing. No outrage there?

    Theyâ(TM)re doing it because it *makes sense.*

    1. Re: No complaints about the Model 3? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pop quiz hotshot.

      Open up any article on slashdot about Tesla. They get called out constantly for their shortcomings.

      But this isn't a story about Tesla now is it? So fuck off and stay on topic.

  19. The why not buy an iPhone? by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm a maker not a taker.

    If you were really a maker you would seek great tools.

    I've got no use for a spying

    Apple does not spy. They do not need to as they sell hardware, not you.

    , expensive

    Even $1k for a powerful computing device you keep at your side for three+ years is not expensive.

    closed-source

    Sigh.

    sealed battery

    All batteries are sealed, or else there would be quite a mess.

    Or did you mean you could remove the battery? Funny, you claim to be a "Maker" and yet you are afraid to open a phone case to change a battery manually (which you'd only have to do every 2-3 years)??

    Or did you mean you want a second battery, again if you were actually a maker you'd appreciate the flexibility of carrying around an external battery that could recharge any number of different USB devices instead of some lame proprietary internal battery that you have to throw away with your phone.

    crippled computing device with no keyboard.

    In what way crippled? And rather than "no keyboard" is has an infinite number of keyboards.

    If you really have to have a physical keyboard for a phone then why not get one? That's the nice thing about buying popular hardware, is that you can expand it almost in whatever way you like.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Seven+Spirals · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Wow, Apple fanboy much? Suckin' the big apple, eh? You are a fucking idiot if you think iOS is 100% open source. Why should anyone fight the vendor to service something they paid for? They make it intentionally difficult, speaking from the experience of actually replacing sealed-in batteries. It's cute (and ignorant) that you think Apple is an innocent lamb that doesn't spy. Of course, the rest of the ignorant Apple apologist blather in your post should have presaged that. Guess you've been living in a cave and you missed the zillions of news stories about them being a giant spying corporate asshole. Speaking of seeking great tools, I've already got that nailed (things like compilers and *real* tools that produce real results). So, that's why I didn't need to fork over $1000 and a bunch of personal liberty to Apple for an inferior, overpriced, spying, sealed-in battery, no headphone-jack, opaque OS, Chinese made, corporate ass-phone. If it means I don't have to put up with some asshole's horn-rimed glasses and Apple-latte attitude, then so much the better!

    2. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Megol · · Score: 2

      So where exactly is the iOS source? Or do you think for instance MS open sourcing something (they have) makes them open source?

    3. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by ljw1004 · · Score: 1

      Or did you mean you could remove the battery? Funny, you claim to be a "Maker" and yet you are afraid to open a phone case to change a battery manually (which you'd only have to do every 2-3 years)?

      I like taking spare batteries for my gadgets on adventures (backpacking, sailing, long-distance cycling or swimming). They're more compact than external battery top-up devices, and they mean you can get full charge instantly rather than keeping the two things tethered for hours. This last point can be important depending on your holster/mount for your gadget.

    4. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by SuperKendall · · Score: 3, Funny

      Appleopen sources Xnu, the kernel. They open source Webkit, they open source Swift, they open source LLVM...

      It's not just one or two things, it's almost everything except for Springboard (the iOS app launcher).

      No it's not all open source. But it's also not even mostly closed source, so it's wrong to claim that it's a closed-source system when so much of it is open.

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    5. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So basically apple open sources their junk.

      Thanks apple

    6. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would second all of that. Louis Rossman made a video that described Apple's engineering fails over the last decade:
      The horrible truth about Apple's repeated engineering failures

      I thought the opening remarks were insightful, regarding how any other company that made products like this would get a truckload of hate. But in Apple's case the fanbois just keep forking over more and more cash and buying into the same poorly engineered crap.

      But there is a way to capitalize on all this - buy some Apple stock and use an Android phone, thereby letting the fanbois funnel money into Android...

    7. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by fred6666 · · Score: 2

      closed-source

      Sigh.

      Just because Apple releases some open source software doesn't make iOS open source. It is not only closed source like Windows, but unlike Windows, Apple does everything it can to ban sideloading of software, or at least mass market distribution through that channel.

    8. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by fred6666 · · Score: 1

      Where is the source code for their camera, fingerprint, wifi or cellular network drivers? It must be part of that XNU kernel source, right? Have you actually tried to compile that kernel and run it on an iPhone? It must work, right?

    9. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They are NOT in the hardware business any more.
      They sell hardware to sell the services.
      It's not the hardware that you are buying.
      You are buying it for iOS, for iTunes and Music, for iCloud, for Messages, for Apple Pay, for FaceTime, for Siri, for apps.
      All of which will also keep you in the Apple ecosystem.
      Hardware is just the bait.

    10. Re: The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Facts.

    11. Re: The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually it's not even their projects. The main thing they created an open sourced is swift.

    12. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      in Apple's case the fanbois just keep forking over more and more cash and buying into the same poorly engineered crap.

      Really? That sounds much more like the Microsoft fanbois who keep buying their crap when they've always been late to the game.

      DOS when unix already existed.
      Windows when X11 already existed
      Networking - how long did you have to use Trumpet Winsock well after the "network is the computer"
      Byte: Is NT the death toll for Unix? Yeah, right.
      Zune? what is that?
      Pay by the month OS - yeah, the fanbois will continue to pay Microsoft their money so that Gates can give it to someone else to show just how charitable "he" is.

      fsck off.

      --XYZZY--

    13. Re:The why not buy an iPhone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hope Apple is at least paying you to be a shill.

  20. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

    `They have phones for the home now? And what on earth is an "answering machine"?

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
  21. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by Seven+Spirals · · Score: 1

    Interesting. I'll have to check them out, especially if there are alternative operating systems. Right now I alternate between a Blackberry and an old Sony Walkman phone running Symbian (and no IP stack) Thanks!

  22. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by Seven+Spirals · · Score: 1

    You sound like an H1B faggot who used Google translate just to post this out of your native monkey language. Now go dispose of yourself, quietly, Coward.

  23. Market research? by zarmanto · · Score: 2

    I think it might be noteworthy that they did exactly the opposite last year, with the iPhone 8/8+ available on 9/22 and the iPhone X available on 11/3. The most obvious explanation in that particular case was production delays... but what if it was less about practical issues and more about exploring the market? I mean, I know that I for one pre-ordered an iPhone X straightaway, and ignored the iPhone 8 entirely... but I dunno; maybe that mode of thinking only matches the crazy ones. (Or maybe not.) Perhaps most people want either whatever is available immediately (instant gratification) or whatever is cheapest. Last year, you could get both of those things at once... this year, you have to choose... but you can get their best options straightaway.

    And both last year's roll-out and this year's roll-out are perfectly valid marketing methodologies.

  24. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 1

    Congressworms. FTFY.

  25. No, I am a homo sapiens. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We havr this weird thing called empathy, that is almost dead in the US.
    It prevents us from harming others, like stealing from them, including profiting (also no-work money), because we feel what our victim would or does feel, and do not like if it hurts.
    That gives us the strategic advantage of teamwork.

    Unlike homo psychopathis that rules the US, which has no such feature, and must enforce teamwork with violence. Which always fails in the end, because selfish greed wins, and they bash each others heads in.

    1. Re:No, I am a homo sapiens. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I dont know if homo psychopathis is a US thing but it is sure is a apple sheep thing.

  26. The secret is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    ... don't play this stupid game in the first place. I feel sorry for dumb bastards who bought an iPhone all those years back and are now locked into constant upgrade cycles. The REALLY stupid ones even appear on /. and elsewhere to justify why patently anti-consumer practices such as proprietary connectors, sealed in batteries, removal of features of headphone jacks etc are somehow a really good idea.

    1. Re:The secret is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm an Apple hater, but the idea of getting a phone that is still current after 5 years is good (by that I mean software, which is afterall what is important). The connector is proprietary but USB-C would piss me off about as much, or even special "supercharge" micro-USB power supply. Using an old Android high end phone, which can be flashed easily enough to Lineage, and it's hilarious how it can barely maintain charge while using it computer-style off 500mA USB.

      I sure would want the iOS store rather than the Google app store. I refuse to use the latter so I have F-droid. Effectively I have a big dumbphone with a serving of geeky shit on the side (with no Internet on the go because calls and SMS are an order of magnitude cheaper for me)
      But I'm new to this smart phone shit, I found an old dumbphone which should be good enough but has proprietary Samsung connector.

      Yes if I find myself needing a smart phone with internet, not because I need it but because I'll otherwise go homeless or be sent to the gulag I will consider iPhone 8, original X or Xr. Especially if it has to be on the duopoly app store.

  27. And your point is...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    What part of "for profit private corporation" do you not understand? They want to maximize revenue, and there's nothing wrong with that as long as they're not breaking laws to do so.

    1. Re:And your point is...? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I prefer tech companies that try and maximize technology. And that is definitely not apple.

  28. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by Seven+Spirals · · Score: 1

    Hehe, it's a steam powered device from before your time. Yes, home phones are an anachronism. Mine costs $16 a month, though. It's worth paying it just to hear people flip out over the fact that I still have one. They also tend to lose their minds that they have to leave a message or just fuck off. People are so used to instantly being able to yank someone chain. They have a conniption fit when they can't do that and I enjoy every second of their discomfort like an alien protoplasm that feeds on hate. I do carry an ancient symbian cell phone for my job, though. They pay for the service.

  29. If they wanted to be somehow evil... by registrations_suck · · Score: 1

    If they wanted to be somehow evil, they'd not say ANYTHING about the XR until it was released.

  30. The problem with this argument ... by Tjp($)pjT · · Score: 2

    The problem with this argument is the predecessors are still for sale. The model 7 and 7 plus, as well as the 8 and 8 plus. And at reduced prices over their introduction, and for the 7s a further reduction.

    --
    - Tjp

    I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!

    1. Re:The problem with this argument ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well yes, they want to sell their old iPhone 7. and then have these people frustrated eventually of having an old style 2010s iPhone.

  31. Re:Blackberry! by TheCastro1689 · · Score: 2

    Once Blackberry gave up their secure messaging service cracks to Governments they immediately became less popular.

  32. I was an Apple fanboy. Now ? FUCK APPLE. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Apple continues to insult its customers as though Apple was the dominant entity in a BDSM relationship.

    Most of us only have one way to vote, which is with our wallets.

    I will never buy an Apple product again, as a direct result of various things Apple has done with its hardware and software.

    This is not a trivial choice for me, but Apple has made it a painfully obvious choice.

    Thanks, Apple, for preventing me from wasting any more money on your crap.

  33. Re: Blackberry! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No, like Betamax VCRs, that could only hold 60 minutes on a tape.

  34. Wrong, external chargers way better by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    I like taking spare batteries for my gadgets on adventures (backpacking, sailing, long-distance cycling or swimming). They're more compact than external battery top-up devices

    I don't see how you can say that when external batteries come in any form factor you like, from incredibly small to large but extremely powerful.

    I like external chargers more because they give me way more options for act I might need to do than carrying around extra phone batteries ever did. They can also support fast-charge so while not instant, they can give you a huge amount of power in just minutes.

    If you think you'll be in a situation where you can't easily plug in for even a little while, well that's why they make battery cases... again external batteries allow for a huge range of form factors and use cases.

    Not to mention that for me, external phone batteries would die and need to be replaced way more often. And when you were done with the phone all of those external batteries were worthless. I greatly prefer the sealed batteries even though I spend a lot of time hiking or away from power.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  35. They are Such Capitalists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Such Capitalists thing to do.

  36. Find a prepay/unlock with lineageos support. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Those phones are usually 2.8-4.6" screensize. But you only have options under 100-200 dollars USD to choose from. Most lack NFC, high resolution cameras, etc.

    But if your phone is just a phone and a one page at a time web browser, these devices work just fine with dual or quad core processors, plus 1-2GB of ram. Make sure you check gsmarena, phonearena, or similar for documented specs. The only real problem is few people put effort into lineageos ports for the low end phones, even if they are easily and fully rootable/unlockable. If more of those phones had good software support many of the flagship phones would start appears far less useful in comparison.

  37. Normal by nospam007 · · Score: 1

    Etruscans and Romans also sold their expensive apples first, thousands of years ago.

  38. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by Powercntrl · · Score: 1

    Smartphones are devices for consumers.

    Oh, the old "I'm saving money using a dumbphone" argument. I assume you must never buy anything retail or dine out, right? My phone has likely paid for itself several times over in terms of looking up deals (slickdeals/retailmenot), comparison shopping/price matching while in a store, finding the cheapest gasoline (yeah, there's an app for that), and promotional freebies (I've gotten Amazon gift cards from Coke, free food from Chick-Fil-A, etc.)

    --

    ---
    DRM is like antifreeze, to the MPAA/RIAA it's sweet, to the consumers it's poison.
  39. Re:Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Shouldn't you be ass fucking APK instead of posting about how to pronounce phone names?

  40. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Man, you are an advertisers dream. I bet they know everything about you, even your condom size.

    Keep thinking free means free.

  41. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    LOLOLOLOL. Wow, if I looked like that I would not be posting YouTube videos. Holy shit, you legit look like a fucking transsexual with that bucket hat on.

    Holy fuck you are ugly. I can't watch more than 10 seconds without wanting to punch you in you ugly ass face. You truly are a disgrace.

  42. Re:What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a fu by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Old man yells at cloud.

  43. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Creimy Dumpty sat on the wall,
    Creimy Dumpty had a great fall.
    All the king's horses
    And all the king's men
    Couldn't put Creimy Dumpty
    Together again.

  44. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Creimy Dumpty sat on the wall,
    Creimy Dumpty had a great fall.
    All the king's horses
    And all the king's men
    Couldn't put Creimy Dumpty
    Together again.

    Hahaha, I'am sure creimer well knows that URL by now:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    The video that seriously gets 1,000,000 views a day!

    Salivate creimer, salivate, that's all you'll do for ever!

  45. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hello Chris,

    I just found out that most of those hits on your following videos were caused by one of my nerds using my click-bot resources to nag you:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    and many ones before the latest published date in the list above.

    I am partly responsible because I mentioned your case in a corporate meeting but I wasn't aware that there was anybody on my staff still dedicated to your case.

    Anyway, most of the views you brag about are caused my click-bots I control.

    I offerered you partnership in the past but you never even replied to me.

    If find it an unacceptable behaviour.

    Chris, my team has just updated me with your new contact info. It is nice to hear from you again and to see that you have managed to get a new Slashdot account.

    *** Chris, contact me ASAP please. I have AI click bots that don't get detected by youtube algorythm! :) -2 subscribers and 10 views a day for you is sad.. -love granny XX ***

    Dear Team Creimer,

    I just noticed that the Humpty-Dumpty video has 435+ millions views, that should make you salivate!

    I have plenty of ideas to make the views on your own youtube channel skyrocket but you didn't contact me yet. Is it because I am a lady? Ethell says that you are sexist but I hope it isn't true.

    Anyway, I will give you a free hint anyway: Dress-up as Humpty in your videos, you shouldn't need that much makeup making this a money saving situation in your own case.

    My YouTube channel has 222K subscribers and many videos with hundreds of thousands of views:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    Now, with some slight adjustments, I think that together, we could make the view count skyrocket on your very own Team Creimer youtube channel :)

    Please feel confident to contact me if you want me to coach you, we aren't living so far away from each other so we could even easily meet.

    Love XX,

    --
    -Granny

  46. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Do you have any essperience with roaming numerals?

  47. Re: Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Someone told me that — like 70 videos ago.

    You were ugly the 69 other times too.

    Haven't been to San Francisco much?

    What the hell is that even supposed to mean? You agree with him? Typical Chris strategy: when trapped, make no sense!

    You're like one of those lizards that breaks off its own tail when a bird catches them!

  48. Re: What? Smartphones? Did I mention who gives a f by Powercntrl · · Score: 1

    I bet they know everything about you, even your condom size.

    Major retailers will probably find a way to do this even for the cash-carrying luddites, using facial recognition (utilizing the many security cameras already present). The privacy ship has sailed, may as well make the best of it.

    --

    ---
    DRM is like antifreeze, to the MPAA/RIAA it's sweet, to the consumers it's poison.
  49. 7 years ago by uniquemac · · Score: 1

    Apple Fanboy current and since 1981 here.
    Even check my stupid username.
    Fuck Apple.
    FUCK APPLE.
    Apple died as Steve Jobs was dying.
    One proof among hundreds:
    2011.
    Mac OS X 10.7 Lion.
    No "save as" function.
    SMFH.

  50. Re:Never mind... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Do you have any essperience with roaming numerals?

    Chris is currently indisposed and can't reply to your post at the moment.

    Granny PottyMouth has just revealed to Chris (see https://slashdot.org/comments....) that most of the views on our YouTube channels were caused by one of her employee using her click-bots.

    She says she instructed him to stop immediately and what she says must be true since the views stopped on our channel and we have only 12 views since last week on our latest video "How to Pronounce The New Apple iPhone XR, XS & XS Max (September 2018)". Note that the pronunciation might change in December so make sure to keep watching our channel!
    --
    Ethell, Team Creimer Administrative Assistant.
    How to Pronounce The New Apple iPhone XR, XS & XS Max (September 2018)