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New Autonomous Farm Wants To Produce Food Without Human Workers (technologyreview.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from MIT Technology Review: Iron Ox isn't like most robotics companies. Instead of trying to flog you its technology, it wants to sell you food. As the firm's cofounder Brandon Alexander puts it: "We are a farm and will always be a farm." But it's no ordinary farm. For starters, the company's 15 human employees share their work space with robots who quietly go about the business of tending rows and rows of leafy greens. Today Iron Ox is opening its first production facility in San Carlos, near San Francisco. The 8,000-square-foot indoor hydroponic facility -- which is attached to the startup's offices -- will be producing leafy greens at a rate of roughly 26,000 heads a year. That's the production level of a typical outdoor farm that might be five times bigger. The opening is the next big step toward fulfilling the company's grand vision: a fully autonomous farm where software and robotics fill the place of human agricultural workers, which are currently in short supply. Iron Ox uses software, dubbed "The Brain," to watch over the farm and monitor nitrogen levels, temperature, and robot location. Alexander hopes to automative every process of the farm, but human workers are currently needed to help with seeding and processing the crops. He cites the shortage of agricultural workers and the distances that fresh product currently has to be shipped for reasons why we need automated farming.
"The problem with the indoor [farm] is the initial investment in the system," says Yiannis Ampatzidis, an assistant professor of agricultural engineering at the University of Florida. "You have to invest a lot up front. A lot of small growers can't do that." Currently, Iron Ox is sending the food it produces to a local food bank and to the company salad bar.
"The problem with the indoor [farm] is the initial investment in the system," says Yiannis Ampatzidis, an assistant professor of agricultural engineering at the University of Florida. "You have to invest a lot up front. A lot of small growers can't do that." Currently, Iron Ox is sending the food it produces to a local food bank and to the company salad bar.
These eggheads think they know everything. Oh look, a robot that will feed us! Give me my startup millions, now!
Today: "All we have to do to make more food is make it indoors!"
Chairman Mao: "All we have to do to make more food is plant things closer together and plow deeply!"
Does the wealth go to everyone who actually worked to achieve this, or is it just stolen (aka profit) and put into the pockets of those who do not work (aka managers, board, stock traders, banks, imaginary properly Mafia) (only value-adding work, done by lifeforms counts)?
I've always wondered if robots could patrol for weeds and bugs on a farm ... no idea how it works out (or not) economically though.
While this isn't going to replace industrial farming, it's a small step in the direction of autonomous crop management. However, what we should pushing to build robots to support outdoor horticulture farms. Monoculture is a weakness requiring heavy use of pesticides and herbicides which is harmful and unsustainable.
I for one would like to welcome our robotic farm overlords.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Take it back to /pol/. None of us here cares about your autistic screeching.
Yet people will still claim modern automation has no potential downfalls. What happens to a world when one of the most significant employers of unskilled human labor (the food industry) goes all automated? Will an increasingly automated skilled work force replace it? I seriously doubt it.
Now, I'm not arguing that we should forbid mass automation of unskilled labor because even if we don't allow it here some country with no regards to human rights (China maybe?) will happily allow it to our determent. What I am saying is that we need a game plan for a very probable scenario.
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you mean where there's plenty of people who want to work.. but employers are too cheap to increase wages and benefits to attract them? that "short supply"? there is no labor shortage.. call it a 'wage shortage'.. an 'insurance shortage'.. whatever... but there is definitely not a 'labor shortage'.. the world.. the u.s., even if you want to narrow it down to the country tfa is about, has not 'run out' of people to work. that's complete and total bullshit.
No need to find workers as robots are always ready for work.
Robots do not push up wages.
Advanced computer sorting of what is farmed.
Great new jobs looking after the robots.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Tesla wanted to produce an autonomous car factory.
How did that end up?
The abandonment of expensive robots and tents setup in the parking lot with a lot of humans busy building cars.
While I applaud the effort, don't oversell the abilities of autonomous anything.
"Annual agriculture is all about living through our concepts... our idea we've imposed on reality & when reality doesn't behave according to our idea, what do we do? We input... we can never input enough to make our false concept correct." @RestorationAgD http://bit.ly/1GnbtAA
"Tempers are wearing thin. Let's just hope some robot doesn't kill everybody." --Bender
Isn't this how humanity survived in Idiocracy? The robots did the important stuff.
Well it's indoors so that's a big bonus.* Weeds and insects easier to control. Vertical farming better use of land. This will also fit when we go into space, or underground. Also with developments like fogponics, and aquaponics, easier and more diverse foodstuffs. CRISPr makes things more interesting.
*Greenhouses, or cheap solar powering LEDs.
Shai Schticks:"You don't make peace with friends, you make peace with enemies"
5 * 8000 = 40,000 sq. ft. = 1 acre. Thats a pretty small farm. Real farms nowdays can produce much more food than such indoor facilities.
What does that mean? Is there a missing or extra word? Maybe "flaunt its technology" or "flog you with its technology"? ...Honestly I'm curious what the author meant to say.
I can understand that the high cost of start-up of indoor food production discourages many owners. So why not build smaller modules and do both indoor and outdoor crop production and gradually build more automated units so that the income flow is steady while the modernization takes place. Also, we can hope that an automated, indoor farm will be able to contain any chemical pollution instead of letting it run off and contaminate waterways etc..
Think of all the unemployed Mexicans!
What happens to a world when one of the most significant employers of unskilled human labor (the food industry) goes all automated?
This has ALREADY HAPPENED in much of the world. 150 years ago, 70% of Americans worked on farms. Today 2% do. The world didn't end.
Will an increasingly automated skilled work force replace it? I seriously doubt it.
Why do you doubt it? It has ALREADY HAPPENED to over a billion people ... who have become the richest billion.
What I am saying is that we need a game plan for a very probable scenario.
You should start by reading a history book. For the last two centuries, moving a country's labor force off the farm and into the cities has be the key to prosperity, economic development, and higher living standards. It happened in the developed world long ago, and it is happening in China now.
Believing that agricultural automation somehow causes poverty, is astoundingly ignorant.
Why does every farming automation/urban/indoor/shipping container/etc./etc. project grow leafy greens?
Is there really a huge demand or profit in that?
How about:
- orange and purple cauliflower
- asparagus
- berries (out of season)
- morel mushrooms
- dragonfruit
- avocados
In other words, the expensive shit?
Amazingly, they said seeding was a human intensive thing. When planting wheat, those John Deere planters use GPS and microchips to decide where precisely to put each seed (programmed taking into account changing soil type, etc.). While driving over a many acre farm.
Your ad here. Ask me how!
Indeed. It probably began with Jethro Tull.
I am not interested in articles about life extension advancements.
That says more about Tesla than automation. There are plenty of fully automated factories out there, if Modern Marvels episodes are to be believed.
Free Software developers of the world, open your eyes! Our communities are being raped, our work pillaged.
Detestable villains - mean spirited, belligerent, racist, unprincipled - are using underhanded tricks to force hypocritical "Codes of Conduct" on the projects we built.
The only purpose of these CoCs is to allow so-called "Progressives", who have contributed nothing to the project, to conduct witch hunts against anyone who opposes them. Thereby they plan to steal our work for their shadowy corporate paymasters.
You can readily tell these CoCs are not about "just being nice" - because they are ALWAYS supported by the very LEAST NICE, most aggressively mean, hate-filled, and shamelessly bigoted people you can imagine.
If a project to which you contribute has been raped by CoC-mongers there is a simple solution: WALK AWAY. Never contribute again. If you have a patch almost ready, count the time you spent on it as a loss and throw it away. If you see a security issue, remain silent and do nothing. IT'S NO LONGER YOUR PROJECT. YOU ARE NOT WELCOME THERE.
If you are evaluating new software, don't even consider any projects burdened under the tyranny of a CoC. Their technical attributes do not matter - just don't consider them. Never be openly political, always make up a technical reason for rejecting CoCed projects.
Don't argue in public about the CoC. Doing so only exposes you to needless risk. You might be dis-employed, blackballed, and even set up for a #MeToo purge. Just stay far away.
Comrades: Individually we are powerless, and easily crushed beneath the iron boot of Corporate Social Just-Us. But together in solidarity we are millions and we are strong. The Internet itself depends on our collective labor. If we stop working, the internet stops working.
Free Software developers, save yourselves and save your communities! Just WALK AWAY from any project with a CoC. Without our labor they are nothing.
I wonder what sort of problems will crop up on a project like this? How do you repair a worn-out guide-rail? How do you clean the berry pincers? Are there wi-fi problems? What about condensation on the lenses? This is a system that will have a lot of potential use in the future. If it can work on a farm, then it can work on sailing cargo ships growing potatoes. Or on space ships, presumably. Automated food shipments grown, and frozen, on a slow boat to Mars.
We're getting somewhere.
Indoor farming has to replace free and clean solar energy with grid energy ( ie. mostly coal ). Using solar power electricity in this instance would be very inefficient. Convert sun to electricity (loss), transmit over grid (loss), run grow lights (loss), is a horribly lossy system. Maybe 10% or less efficient system? So you replace 10 acres of lettuce farms with 2 acres of lettuce buildings. But you still need 10 acres worth of solar energy and you have to account for the loss. So you replace 10 acres of lettuce with 102 acres of solar and lettuce, but you didn't have to pay any lettuce pickers!
Nuclear is taboo, so it's going to be coal. It's not necessarily all bad though. If this uses less energy versus planting, weeding, and shipping to market, which are also fossil fuel based, then it would be a net improvement. However, it's very hard to capture all the externalities of the two approaches to get an accurate comparison. A grad student is probably writing their thesis on this topic right now.
Meat, and Fish, and Protein from the sea!
This isn't new. There are 'container' hydroponic boxes the size of semi trucks that can do this. So what. Lettuce is easy, not like the AI needed to find the fruit of the plant, then determine if it's ripe and then pick it, pack it and ship it. No one has been able to do that. It also seems to be a long way off before that is even possible.
This is true, but look a where those people went: the people freed up from agricultural work found new jobs in factories, warehouses, offices and the like. Now, even those fields are being automated at a fast pace. You're correct when you say:
But the problem scenario we're facing is different. Automation as its currently being developed takes jobs away not just from agriculture, but from the people who've moved to the cities as well. China is automating production at a rapid pace, replacing massive factories of hundreds of people working in assembly-lines and warehouses with semi-automated facilities staffed by few dozen engineers and programmers. In 20-30 years it's likely for example that nearly all warehouses will be almost completely automated, as will most production, this change has already begun. There are obviously new job description that have and will be created by this, but the general problem is that those positions generally require high education, and are not as abundant as the current low-skill jobs in manufacturing or logistics.
Cities have been the driving force of an increasing standard of living for the last century throughout the world as you pointed out. Here in Finland we were still heavily an agricultural society post WWII, after which we stared a rapid catch-up as people started flocking to the cities fast, as the rebuilding effort after the war created a lot of demand for labor in all kinds of industries. It was possible for someone from the countryside with very little existing education to move to a city and and find a job that, albeit monotonous, paid better than work in the countryside and allowed fast upward mobility, moving people from poverty or near-poverty to the lower middle-class.
We currently have about 200 000 more unemployed (mostly educated as we have a universal education system) people than open positions, because we've experienced a radical shift in the economy during the late 90s and 2000s: we stopped being an industrialized society and moved to a post-industrialized service and knowledge economy. Heavy industry is mostly gonei to countries with cheaper labor and what remains of it is highly automated and doesn't provide nearly as many jobs as it used to. The fall of Nokia was massive shock to the entire economy because its significance as an employer and a driver of growth was immense, even though most of the phones weren't even manufactured here. So we know have plenty of unemployed former industrial workers, engineers and so on that have had their jobs eliminated by the changes that have occurred.
The economy is not doing too bad though, we've got new companies mostly in software, like games companies (think Rovio (Angry birds etc) and Supercell (Clash of Clans)) and others that have done well and benefited the economy a lot, but the kicker is here: these companies employ nowhere near the amount of people that industrial positions used to offer, and competition for those positions is fierce. Even on the office side automation is cutting into many tasks like data entry that still employs a lot of people, but that is already changing. Programming and related fields are in high demand, naturally, but for the people whose jobs have disappeared, it's not feasible for all of them to retrain themselves as programmers, especially as even the ones who do will end up competing with a high number of younger people who're often more experienced in the field tha
"It is the business of the future to be dangerous" -Alfred North Whitehead
"Alexander hopes to automative every process of the farm"
Who writes this crap?
What happens to a world when one of the most significant employers of unskilled human labor (the food industry) goes all automated?
Unskilled human labor will be used to produce Soyent Green.
Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
That's too many words. You should have just said, "I'm worried because I don't learn from history and I like to worry." It would have been clearer.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Runaway starts out with the farm machines going crazy. They don't say whether those machines were manipulated by the terrorist or simply decided to go off on their own, but can we take a chance?
^^That's the first thing that came to mind
Plenty backed by SoftBank among competition. These can help supplement traditional farming and less exposure to extreme environmental impacts so welcome diversity to food supply options.
Without a well paid middle-class consumption will come down which will start hurting all companies: companies are able to prosper because of consumers with high amounts of disposable income, and since less and less people will be able to get money from their labor, economies globally will be facing large scale issues unless we put serious time and effort into solving the demand-side challenge created by increased and improved across the board automation.
I completely agree with your conclusion. What's more, even the top 1% need to have that consumption base, because they also want the things that the middle class wants. They want gas and roads and airports and movies and food and a financial system that benefits them.
Those things largely exist because of the consumption of the middle class. And yes, while you can hire people to create your own boutique versions of some of those, if the farmer in France can't afford to force-feed his ducks, you don't get pate. And if there's not enough goods to export, that cashmire sweater you paid $500 for isn't going to come across on the boat. Unless you're king-level rich, you just can't own enough land and hire enough people to get all the things you want. At some point, even a billionaire balks at the thought of paying hundreds or thousands of times more for something than it used to be worth.
The robust economy that makes the ultra-rich rich requires the consumption of the middle class. I'm a little blown away that they don't realize that, and continue to squeeze it. At least Warren Buffet gets it. I just wish more did.
Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
The illegal alien mexicans go home?
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Food gets cheaper, and one of humanity's most ancient enemies (famine) is finally defeated.
We have one. The game plan is to continue enjoying the benefits of technological progress.
Maybe because nobody has thought of a downside yet. Obviously people should be cautious about everything, but that doesn't mean paralysis is the right move either. People have had over a century (actually, people have had several millennia) to find some kind of downside increased farming efficiency. If someone eventually comes up with an idea, I'm not saying don't think about it! Go ahead and think about it. Go ahead and try to think up problems that might emerge down the road. But after so many people have tried so hard to find a downside and they all failed, the reasonable default assumption is that there simply aren't any downsides. But you're right, it's just an assumption.
We haven't found an exception to relativity or evolution either, but ask any scientist and they'll tell you maybe it could happen.
Tesla just isn't at the volume where fully automated is the right solution I think. They produce an expensive luxury car in small amounts, human labour is a good option. Even in a high wage country.
CP: We're going to put you county bumpkins out of business with farms that are FIVE times more productive and require no human labor!
CC: Change bad! Me no like change! My Granddad changed his haircut once and died in a thresher accident!
CP: We can build it better, faster, stronger!
CC: So where was that new farm you were talking about?
CP: The founder is in jail, turned out to be a ponzi scheme to bilk investors.
CC: Oh you city folk!
In the 1940's, my grandfather had a device for his farm tractor that would allow him to plow one furrow around a field. The device then took over, guiding the tractor in tighter and tighter circles until the field was completely plowed. People would stop by the side of the road just to gawk. Somehow, it never really caught on! I wonder if these new-fangled robots will do any better.
That's because not that many people are willing to work for $3 an hour, except for illegal immigrants whom Trump has forced out.
Astounding ignorance is believing that such a major disruption in such a massive employer in the third world ( https://data.worldbank.org/ind... ) and yet one that needs to make truly massive efficiency gains to feed everyone ( https://www.cnbc.com/2014/10/1... ) will be compensated for by "progress".
Western agriculture is already massively automated and using up most of the available land it has for agriculture which means the real gains in food production will necessitate the sudden adoption of ultra modern tech in third world agriculture. When all these third worlder's suddenly become unemployed what are they going to do? These are people from countries that can't afford to properly educate their own people, there's no way the vast majority of them will just magically "adapt" and create the needed economic growth to employ themselves in other industries.
Meanwhile, white collar jobs are being increasingly automated which in the past is where manual laborers went when they were displaced by technology.
Sorry, but believing in historic pasterns in the face of overwhelming contrary data is what is astoundingly ignorant. In other words it's really astounding ignorant to think that society will always be able to keep up with Moore's Law. Society needs to start planning for this shit.
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