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VW Plans A $ 22K Electric Car To Compete With Tesla, Transition From Combustion Engines (reuters.com)

An anonymous reader quotes Reuters: Volkswagen intends to sell electric cars for less than 20,000 euros ($22,836) and protect German jobs by converting three factories to make Tesla rivals, a source familiar with the plans said... Plans for VW's electric car, known as "MEB entry" and with a production volume of 200,000 vehicles, are due to be discussed at a supervisory board meeting on Nov. 16, the source said... The November 16 strategy meeting will discuss Volkswagen's transformation plan to shift from being Europe's largest maker of combustion engine vehicles into a mass producer of electric cars, another source familiar with the deliberations said.

VW's strategy shift comes as cities start to ban diesel engine vehicles, forcing carmakers to think of new ways to safeguard 600,000 German industrial jobs, of which 436,000 are at car companies and their suppliers.... The shift from combustion engines to electric cars would also cost 14,000 jobs at VW by 2020 as it takes less time to build an electric car than a conventional one and because jobs will shift overseas to battery manufacturers.

22 of 317 comments (clear)

  1. Lol. by WindBourne · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yes, VW, Daimler, BMW, GM, Ford, fiat-chrysler, Nissan, etc have spent the last 5-7 years telling us how they would beat Tesla. Now, like cold fusion, it will happen real soon.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re: Lol. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Nissan is already beating Tesla.

    2. Re: Lol. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      True, their days are numbered starting at 1 on January 1st and reaching 365 or 366 by December 31st. Similarly, their weeks, months and years are also numbered.

    3. Re: Lol. by lazarus · · Score: 2

      Ya, I totally agree with you. The word vaporware needs to be used on the endless stream of press releases from mainstream auto manufacturers about their real-soon-now EVs. âoeWeâ(TM)re going to do this too, real soon nowâ was a Microsoft tactic back in the day when they needed time to build a competing product with their slow moving monopolistic behemoth of a company.

      Big changes are coming to the auomotive market over the next few years. Not going to be pretty.

      --
      I am not interested in articles about life extension advancements.
    4. Re:Lol. by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      And some of them actually have.

      Hyundai has the Kona out, which has better-than-Tesla range and much higher spec at a fraction of the cost. Includes reliable autopilot and better driving aids. Kia is releasing their Niro soon too, which is similar but a bit larger.

      Outside of the US Nissan and Renault really pioneered EVs. The widespread charging networks in Europe and Japan are mostly down to demand that they created with the Leaf and Zoe. Tesla is a small player in those markets and the M3 isn't anywhere in sight for them.

      In China you have BYD. As well as some very good long range cars, they have a massive business supplying commercial vehicles like busses and trucks. Again, they really pioneered it and something like 80% of new busses in China are pure EV now thanks to them. Whole cities have moved to pure EV public transport.

      Don't get me wrong, Tesla make some nice if unreliable cars, but they are not at all affordable or even that big of a deal outside of the United States. And I don't think their Model 3 platform will ever really get down to truly affordable levels, like the $20k range, while Renault are already there with a pretty decent (if small) 40kWh car.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  2. More power to them! by FrankSchwab · · Score: 3, Funny

    If they build a $22,000 car that has 300 miles of range, does 0-60 in 5 seconds, and carries 4 adults comfortably, they'll sell millions of them.

    And Tesla will have won.
    https://www.tesla.com/blog/sec...

    --
    And the worms ate into his brain.
    1. Re:More power to them! by bob4u2c · · Score: 2

      Yes, bring on the EV's. The more companies making EV's mean the more they have to complete with each other and the lower the price will become. That whole supply and demand thing.

      So sure, bring it on VW. If the car turns out to be a lemon, well at least it will still bring down the price of other cars.

    2. Re:More power to them! by xlsior · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yes, bring on the EV's. The more companies making EV's mean the more they have to complete with each other and the lower the price will become. That whole supply and demand thing.

      ...Except it may actually increase the cost, since there's only so much Lithium available to make batteries with. Almost 50% of the global lithium supply is bought up by battery manufacturers already, to handle the current demand. Not a ton of room for growth there.

    3. Re:More power to them! by whoever57 · · Score: 5, Informative

      More Lithium can be mined. The global supply can be increased.

      Cobalt is the element that battery manufacturers worry about.

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    4. Re:More power to them! by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2
      Do you know how much money has been spent in prospecting for oil?

      Do you know how much money has been spent in prospecting for Lithium ?

      Do you think the known lithium reserves are all the lithium there is in the world?

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    5. Re:More power to them! by geoskd · · Score: 4, Informative

      I don't think people quite grasp the absurd amount of electricity an electric car uses. Charging an EV requires something crazy like 400V at 35A. Charging a few of them won't be an issue - but if everyone were to switch over to electric vehicles, we'd need to start building more power plants, fast.

      Ok, I have heard this stupid rhetoric more than enough. Its time that people stop spouting about shit they do not understand.

      I have two electric cars. They are each driven daily as commuter vehicles. Each draws about 5kwh per day, and are charged at night. One uses a 30A 240V charger, the other uses a good old fashioned 15A 110V outlet. Neither requires any more charging than that for the vast majority of driving.

      To put that in perspective, a single window air conditioner for a medium sized room uses about 7-10kwh per day during heavy use. My household uses an average of 32kwh per day of which less than 30% goes to the vehicles.

      When you realize that the vast majority of EV charging will happen at home, at night, then there is no problem with electricity shortages or infrastructure limitations. Night time electricity usage is sufficiently lower than daytime usage that there is plenty of excess capacity available to handle EV charging, even if 100% of all vehicles sold from today forward were pure electric vehicles. In fact, the amount of electricity saved by switching from incandescent bulbs to LED bulbs, actually offsets around half of the entire increase that would result from a switch to 100% electric ground transportation. Because of that transittion, and the scaling up of solar power, there has actually been a glut of electricity which has been keeping electricity prices artificially low. This artificially low cost was part of the stimulus that drove the sharp increase in the cryptocurrency mining which has absorbed most of the excess electricity capacity.

      --
      I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
  3. Re:EVs are so cheap to make. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    You dont need a big car with the knew batteries.

    How would you no that?

  4. It's happening, whether you like it or not by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The end of the internal combustion engine as a staple of ground vehicles is in progress, like it or not, and the age of the ubiquitos electric vehicle is dawning, like it or not. I, for one, think it'll be great; I've worked on ICE-based vehicles, in one form or another, my entire life, and let's face it: after a certain point in time, they became a real pain in the ass to deal with, both in complexity and in cost, even if you do the work yourself. Also, front wheel drive ICE vehicles with a manual trainsmission, replacing a clutch? Step 1: 'remove engine from vehicle'. That kills it for most home mechanics. Automatic transmissions? Over-complicated and expensive, and you can't rebuild one at home. And so on. I've never owned an electric vehicle yet, but I can just imagine how much less messy, complicated, and expensive they'll be to maintain, and with so many fewer moving parts, how little maintenance and repair they'll actually need.

    Someone will now inevitably come along and point out how much it'll cost (at current prices) to replace all the battery packs in an EV. To that I say "So what?" As EVs become more and more ubiquitos, and battery technology and manufacturing techniques improve, as well as volume manufactured (and re-manufactured) increase, the price will go down, not up. At-home high-capacity charging stations will be more and more common in public places, and I'd imagine become a standard amenity when new homes are built (if not mandated in some states; California, I'm looking at you when I say that).

    You can't even complain that they're slow. There'll be a new age of high-performance in the form of souped-up EVs.

    The more big companies that get on board with this, the better.

    1. Re:It's happening, whether you like it or not by geoskd · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Only a retard would buy an electric car.

      Yeah, I have to say that I made a poor decision: I am really getting fed up with not having to do any maintenance on my ten year old electric car. Not having to get oil changes several times a year is killing me, and I absolutely regret not changing the serpentine belt at 100k miles. I worry that the huge bills I can expect for replacing the fuel pump and muffler are going to break my budget next month, and now that the head gasket is leaking oil, I don't think the car will pass inspection either. Most of all, I miss standing next to my car for 10 minutes in -5 degree January weather putting gas in it.

      On the plus side, my 20 mile commute every day costs me 50 cents in electricity...

      Who's the retard?

      --
      I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
    2. Re:It's happening, whether you like it or not by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I dunno about you, but I remember when 'trolling' actually meant something. These days, the vast majority of them just sling baseless insults and utter nonsense around, am I right? Seriously, they're not even trying anymore, and they're unfunny to boot. Sad. There used to be an art to it. Now it's about as interesting as a dumpster fire.

    3. Re:It's happening, whether you like it or not by serviscope_minor · · Score: 2

      I used to think it was just trolling until I actually met one of these guys.

      Some (many) of them are simply that stupid, arrogant and angry. But there have definitely been trolls in the older, better sense of the word. You have a rather low UID. Perhaps if you were on usenet, you remember this chap, an elegant troll from a more civilised age:

      https://groups.google.com/foru...

      Egg Troll was IMO a master of the art. Possibly one of the finest trolls on the internet. It's delightful, his posts are very very carefully written to wind up people on both sides of several debates (C vs Java, Linux vs Windows, etc) and despite transparently trolling (his name is a bit of a clue), he still got people to rise to the bait like a shoal of little fishes.

      I miss that guy and I miss the dulture where that was trolling.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
  5. Re:Kudos to VW by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

    They are waiting for a breakthrough technology in cheat devices.

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    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  6. Re:Ludicrous mode? by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

    Definitely it will have a cheat mode.

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    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  7. They should out Elon Elon himself. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 3, Funny
    It is lame to announce 22K Battery car in 2020. Come on, you need to out do Elon.

    Announce a 15K car in 2025 that runs on Atmospheric Engine, that gets free energy using the magnetic monopole and tapping into the zero point energy and the critical ingredient for the project, the red mercury has been secured. Then you are talking.

    Er, what? no one would take such an announcement seriously?

    Well, what makes you think they think other announcements and promises from that diesel cheat device innovator seriously?

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    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    1. Re:They should out Elon Elon himself. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

      Very clearly Tesla has more credibility with the people. They lined up to pay the deposit. 80% of them are patiently waiting. Can any legacy car maker boast such faithful customer base? The valuation of TSLA stock is based on that.

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      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  8. Re: 'Tesla rivals' by thestuckmud · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Tesla is not competition for the big auto makers. Tesla is just an ego project for a man-child with too much money and time with nothing better to do. A pet project some chuckleheads take seriously for no logical reason. Pure emotion.

    I tend to agree with you with regards to competition: Electric is going to be a big part of the future transportation and Tesla will find they are not alone in the performance electric market: Porsche is touting their coming E-Performance cars in a big bold announcement at the front of their web site; Jaguar's I-Pace SUV is on offer. And VW is the by far the biggest carmaking enterprise.

    As for Tesla's leader, Elon Musk, I happen to think that promoting electric cars to help us kick the fossil fuel habit is one of the better things a person could offer humanity. So, yeah, there is literally not much that would be better to do.

    If you read Slashdot, you should know that smart, technically savvy people oftan have their quirks. It's can be easy to make fun of such people, but they also deserve credit where credit is due.

  9. plans by Tom · · Score: 2

    are due to be discussed at a supervisory board meeting

    That is all you need to know.

    They have plans. They don't have a prototype yet, nor a factory setup, nor a delivery schedule nor final pricing or performance numbers. Any or all of those can still change dramatically.

    We will see what happens when you can actually buy this car. Until then there is nothing to see.

    --
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