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Elon Musk Tweets New Details About Tesla's Model Y Electric SUV (mashable.com)

"For anyone who thought that there was too much Tesla news this weekend, I've got some bad news for you," writes long-time Slashdot reader Rei, sharing new information gleaned from a series of tweets.

"Elon Musk just announced the unveiling of the Model Y SUV on March 14th at Tesla's LA Design Studio." A surprising number of details were revealed, including non-falcon doors, a similar appearance to the Model 3, and pricing about 10% more than a Model 3, with slightly lower range, due to the increased mass and cross section.

The unveiling will not include the Tesla pickup truck; that will be later this year. Model Y is to share 75% of its hardware with Model 3 to simplify the development process, with volume production targeted for late 2020, and initial production in early 2020. Musk also stated: "First public Tesla V3.0 Supercharger Station goes live Wed 8pm" (V3 is the much awaited new generation of higher power, cheaper to operate Superchargers).

"Personally, I'm most excited by the Tesla Truck," Musk posted on Twitter. "Maybe it will be too futuristic for most people, but I love it."

204 comments

  1. 3.1415926535897932384626 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    PI Day.

  2. Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Pay not attention to the fact that they have no money to build it and no place to build it. Gotta try to change the subject from last week's disaster. If it ever exist the Y is years from being available. Desperate for reservation deposits.

    I don't think it will work. More likely to hurt M3 demand even more though.

    1. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yet they just paid a 900+ billion dollar convertible bond and have Shanghai going online. Oh, and they also went profitable last quarter. People naysaying every day, but Tesla is doing it.

    2. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're broke now and M3 demand has collapsed. Why do you think they're closing all the stores? If the Shanghai factory is ever completed nothing produced there will be for sale until the 2nd half of 2020 at best.

      If Musk cared about his employees and the company he would've filed for reorg long ago and restructured that debt instead of paying the bondholders. I've always thought Tesla the company would survive after bankruptcy but now I'm not so sure he won't bring about total liquidation in forced Ch. 7 instead of Ch. 11. His ego just won't allow it. With this uncertainty it would be foolish to buy a car that has a very good chance of not being serviceable in a year and has zero resale value.

    3. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is what people short TSLA actually believe...

    4. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They don't "believe" anything, this is just an angle to create uncertainty and volatility.

    5. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What about that post is inaccurate? Low estimates for Tesla run rates are about $600 million per month for operations. Their own reported interest earnings indicate low cash on hand throughout the quarter despite the one-time reported ending cash balances. They sold less than 6,000 cars for February. Demand has collapsed. Tesla is in serious trouble.

    6. Re: Pumper gotta pump by dehachel12 · · Score: 1

      > They sold less than 6,000 cars for February
      is that with or without the cars sold outside the US ?

    7. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Rei · · Score: 2, Informative

      They're only quoting US figures, even though the vast majority of what Tesla has been producing this quarter is going to China and RHD W. Europe + Scandinavia, with around a dozen RO-RO ships sent so far.

      They also of course picked the low estimate for US February figures (InsideEVs), rather than AlphaHat or Edmunds, and then rounded it down.

      They also neglected to mention that January and February are strong annual seasonal low months for Tesla in the US, being in the lowest-volume quarter and with respect to the fact that there's generally a quarterly cycle, with the most US sales in the third month of the quarter.

      They also forgot to mention that Tesla started the quarter with $3,7 billion dollars in cash.

      But apart from that... DOOOOOOOOM!!!!!

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    8. Re: Pumper gotta pump by michelcolman · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yep, they're shipping 3-4000 cars to Europe per week right now, and those are all still the high margin long range version.

      US demand was fully expected to go down to almost zero temporarily when the federal tax credit was cut in half. Many people ordered earlier in december rather than wait for january or february. 6000 cars in february is actually a lot better than I would have expected.

      Meanwhile, I think it's clear that they delayed the short range model not because they couldn't make it, but simply because there was still so much demand for the more expensive version and they would be fools to throw that money away. Looks like that demand was stronger than they had expected, so they kept pushing the cheaper version back until finally, just now, they are reaching the point where demand for the expensive version is less than max production rate.

    9. Re: Pumper gotta pump by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      They did just issue a profit warning though. It seems like their plan to get the $35k Model 3 out the door is to forego profit for now and hope to cut costs enough to get back into the black. Hence the closing of stores, with more cost cutting presumably to come.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    10. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Rei · · Score: 1

      More to the point, IMHO, they had to unveil it before they unveiled the Model Y (which Musk stated nearly a year ago would be unveiled around 15 March). Otherwise, they'd have no credibility when discussing the price point for the Model Y. On the other hand, they very much don't want to delay the Model Y, as SUVs/CUVs are more popular in the US than sedans.

      All that said: the $35k Model 3's unveiling clearly had been planned well in advance. You don't spontaneously generate new vehicle models, new interiors, new websites, and new government approvals, out of thin air; these things take a long time.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    11. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Rei · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The guidance for Q1 was previously "We're not sure if we can turn a profit in Q1". This was not a major revision. It's due to a lot of one-time charges - for example, severance costs, the start of international shipping (which leaves you with more inventory in transit), etc.

      The base model cost $38k to produce in December. They've now trimmed 7% of the workforce (plus more when they close the lower-traffic stores and convert the others to galleries, which should roughly halve their SG&A - although that's not a GM issue), They've had another quarter of general margin improvements. Production rates are much faster, which means lower depreciation per vehicle. Raw material costs are down (check out battery grade cobalt oxide, nickel sulfate, and lithium carbonate price trends). Etc, etc. You don't have to take Musk's word in the reporter call (where he repeatedly used past tense when talking about achieving profitability on the $35k car), it's pretty obvious that they have a positive gross margin on it. The question is how high.

      Of course, almost nobody will choose the base model, which is being backed up by anecdotal reports from the stores. Even someone who's on a really tight budget would be IMHO hard pressed to not splurge on at least the SR+ for $2k more, to get an extra 20 miles and partial-premium interior. The discounts on the higher-end versions appears to have seriously boosted them as well. There appears to be about a 30-40% take rate on the base autopilot (plus a small take rate on FSD), and that's pure margin. Paint colours are margin, wheel choices, interior options, etc. It's looking like an ASP somewhere around $45k.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    12. Re: Pumper gotta pump by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      So it's a compliance car. Losing money on every one unless they upsell, exists purely to fulfil Musk's promise.

      Similar to "Full Self Driving" that is nothing of the sort, and is only called that to try to stave off lawsuits from people who bought it three years ago but haven't had it delivered yet.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    13. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So it's a compliance car.

      "A compliance car is one built for the primary purpose of reducing fleet emissions and complying with the rules.". Your words, not mine. Since as far as I am aware Tesla does not make any non-electric vehicles (please feel free to correct me if I am wrong), I struggle to understand how you can call any of Tesla's cars a compliance car.

      And no I am not a fan of Tesla, I am not even a fan of electric cars in general. Just wanted to nip in the bud any ad-hominem attack you might try.

    14. Re: Pumper gotta pump by skullandbones99 · · Score: 1

      You mean LHD (Left-hand drive) in Western Continental Europe. The UK is still waiting for RHD (Right-hand drive) Model 3s to start production which is expected to start in the 2nd quarter this year.

    15. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tesla sold less than 6000 in AMERICA. The reason is that all of the cars are being made, configured, and shipped to Europe and China. Demand is great. Once China is up and running in mid summer, Tesla will likely have 500K in America/Europe, and 300K in China.

      Windbourne (moderating).

    16. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      very few 4-doors in europe. station wagons and hatchbacks are everywhere.

    17. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep, they're shipping 3-4000 cars to Europe per week right now, and those are all still the high margin long range version.

      Yep, incremental demand in America is nonexistent for the Model 3 if as you say "3-4000 cars to Europe per week right now".
      Model 3 production rate has not increased from ~4000/week, so nobody in America wants to buy the Model 3, BINGO "3-4000 cars to Europe per week right now".
      You just proved AC's contention that "demand has collapsed" for Tesla cars (Tesla is just scrambling to ship back orders before Hyundai/Nissan/Volvo/.../Mattel (OK maybe not Mattel) eats its lunch).

    18. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL.

    19. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL.

      You are such a liar. No one believes you. Your source of a compliance car links to a slashdot post. LOL fuck off.

    20. Re: Pumper gotta pump by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You.. you realize I was both replying to and quoting AmiMoJo, right? And that I was not calling anything a compliance car but rather was pointing out what AmiMoJo considers a compliance car?

      I really hope you do and this was just a failed attempt at an insult, because otherwise you've just royally failed at reading comprehension.

  3. I hope its better than the Model X. by AlanObject · · Score: 0

    If I am annoyed at Tesla for anything it is calling the Model X an "SUV."

    * No roof rack capability. Lots of storage space but where goes the windsurf board, the hang glider, the canoe?

    * No trailer hitch.

    * No ability for off-road (clearance of a sport sedan).

    * No ability to carry a spare tire.

    Great for soccer moms. Great for sales execs to drive clients around in. It is not an SUV it is a minivan.

    I hope the model Y is better but I doubt it.

    1. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Kotoku · · Score: 4, Informative

      You can add a roof rack and tow kit. Videos are on YouTube of Model X pulling an aircraft.

    2. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      People like to actually haul stuff with an SUV. What will the weight of whatever cargo is on the roof do to the range? SUV's aren't really meant for short commutes either. Who wants to wait 1-2 two hours to charge every 200 miles?

    3. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

      You can find Youtube videos of people pulling aircraft, too... That doesn't make the person an SUV.

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    4. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You can drive most cars off-road. It's getting them back on the road afterwards that's challenging.

    5. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can also find people in videos with disgusting chronic yellow fever.

    6. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If I am annoyed at Tesla for anything it is calling the Model X an "SUV."

      Dude, calm down. The Model X is the epitome of a Somewhat Useless Vehicle.

    7. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Model X tow package here.

    8. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hope they get a new CEO so the company isnâ(TM)t run like the mafia! Crime doesnâ(TM)t pay!

    9. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Funny

      Why would anyone want to take their SUV off road? It might get scratched.

    10. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Type44Q · · Score: 0

      What will the weight of whatever cargo is on the roof do to the range?

      What will the drag resistance of whatever cargo is on the roof do to the range?

      Mass will impact a vehicle with regenerative braking negligibly and even less so if your tires have the correct inflation for the given load.

    11. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My X has a trailer hitch, factory option
      Bike and Board racks fit, 5 ton structural though highway rated for half that. Not a SUV, a CUV. Frame differences, it’s a roll cage on wheels.

    12. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Hey grandpa! Top 5 SUVs last year:
      1) Toyota Rav4
      2) Nissan Rogue
      3) Honda CR-V
      4) Chevrolet Equinox
      5) Ford Escape

      It's not the 80s anymore. Only poor people take their SUVs off road.

    13. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Warranty doesn't cover any damage that occurs while towing.

    14. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by jonwil · · Score: 2

      The Model X is hardly unique in terms of being labeled an "SUV" even though it has no off-road capability and no roof racks and no towing...

    15. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Losses on the road are due to air resistance and the friction force, smartass. While air resistance is for most of the time proportional to the square of the speed, the friction force is directly proportional to the mass.

    16. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      there's a video on youtube with an X pulling a trailer with a sportscar on it, racing it against another instance of that sportscar, and winning the dragrace ...

    17. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the jaguar one takes the cake though.

    18. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doesn't matter much, dumb ass. A model X weighs in excess of 6000 lbs. no weight on the roof is going to affect its' friction force by anything substantial. This goes for most cars, since they aren't rated (in axels or frame or tires) to handle more than at most half that.

    19. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by dehachel12 · · Score: 1

      yellow headed monster in chief disagrees.

    20. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rei · · Score: 2

      Model X is very popular for towing, and frequently fitted out with a roof rack. No, it's not good for offroading - but neither are most SUVs today. It has by far the largest interior space of any of the EVs today calling themselves "SUVs", and in the mid-to-upper range of the interior space of SUVs in general.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    21. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 1

      People make all sorts of weird videos on Youtube.

      Emphasis on the word 'weird.'

    22. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Rei · · Score: 4, Informative

      Where in the warranty does it say that? Under "Warranty limitations", "Towing the vehicle" is an exclusion, but not "Towing with the vehicle".

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    23. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      Please don't use that example. Pretty much anything can tow an aircraft including a person. Better to point to actual specs such as the shitton of torque (that's metric for "a lot") the Model X produces.

      Also good is more calling out of bullshit from the GP. The Model X has a spacious boot so you can carry a spare tire. The Model X has general ground clearance of 8 which can be electronically raised an inch as well putting it inline or exceeding the clearance of other SUVs to say nothing of the fact that a standard sedan has a clearance of 6" and a sports sedan even less.

    24. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      No off-road capability except for 2-3" more clearance than the GP suggests as well as 4WD and the option to add roof racks, add a tow hitch and a lot of spare space in the trunk if you want to carry a tire.

    25. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by michelcolman · · Score: 1

      Yep, here is the link.

      And here's another link without the drama, just the launch seen from next to the starting line.

    26. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by michelcolman · · Score: 1

      The point is that they do have a trailer hitch (as an option), and a roof rack. And I bet it outperforms a lot of other so-called "SUV"s off road.

    27. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I'm curious how far it could actually tow something like a camper without having the battery totally die on it anyway. Most camp grounds worth my while are over 200 miles away with no place to charge.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    28. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I drive my SUV in 2-3 feet of snow regularly without a problem. Would I have a problem with a model X?

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    29. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rei · · Score: 2

      One of the largest markets for the Model X is Norway. Is your weather worse than Norway's?

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    30. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 0

      You're saying Norway doesn't have plowed roads? When it snows in Norway they drive through the snow out of necessity?

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    31. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Lol it only goes down to -3C in Norway; that's going to melt just from the tires. I'm talking about -40C!

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    32. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rei · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Welcome to Slashdot, where mountainous, arctic Norway is treated as a tropical paradise, if that's what you need to make an argument against Tesla.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    33. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      So it goes below -3? Because to me that is tropical. Just speaking from personal experience.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    34. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Heck, regular salt works at -3.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    35. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 2

      Sorry for the multiple posts, but I did some research. This is how winter driving is in Norway:

      Make sure to a have full thank of fuel, there are no petrol stations on convoy stretches
      Bring rope, flashlight and shovel
      Bring food and warm drink
      Bring winter clothes and shoes
      Flash the emergency light when the convoy starts moving
      Keep close to the car ahead
      Stay in the convoy, keep a steady speed
      Don't leave the convoy or try to turn back
      Stay in the car if the convoy halts
      Don't stray from the car if you to stop

      Are you saying people are driving their Model X's through there? Because I sincerely doubt it. They are driving their Model X's where it is maintained like everyone else.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    36. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I used to work for a Swedish company and as a result spent a fair amount of time in Stockholm. The first time I there in January I was surprised by how warm it was. It's significantly further north than where I live, yet significantly warmer (It's currently roughly -20C). I barely needed a coat. Now, admittedly I've not been to Norway, but I'm going to guess it's not terribly different than Sweden. Now, from what I understand, you go to the northern portions of the Scandinavian peninsula, it gets quite cold, but the thing is, some 90% of the population lives further south where it doesn't really get cold.

      So your whole statement mocking people saying how warm Norway is, from my personal experience, yeah. Where most people live on the Scandinavian peninsula, it's not that cold. Try out central Canada if you want cold. If you're near large bodies of water like the Baltic, it just doesn't get that cold.

    37. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rob+Lister · · Score: 2

      I'm curious how far it could actually tow something like a camper without having the battery totally die on it anyway.

      That's close to a non sequitur as it depends on the normal range of the Electric and the curb weight of the camper. Same as with an ICE.

      Most camp grounds worth my while are over 200 miles away with no place to charge.

      Most RV campgrounds have at least 30amp service, and usually 50.

    38. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I'm not talking about a campground though. I'm talking about wilderness.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    39. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rob+Lister · · Score: 2

      I drive my SUV in 2-3 feet of snow regularly without a problem.

      Dude, stop. Unless you're SUV is a Monster Truck, you're lying.

    40. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      No, Ford Explorer, tires with teeth. 2-3 feet easy.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    41. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      i'm not saying it *clears* the snow. I'm saying it can pull itself through.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    42. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      The point is that they do have a trailer hitch (as an option), and a roof rack. And I bet it outperforms a lot of other so-called "SUV"s off road.

      The gull wing doors make the Model X unfortunately an impractical vehicle for a lot of things on roof-racks. It's a case of trying to make the vehicle look fancier and taking away functionality. Tesla has done some great things, but unfortunately, I think they sometimes place style ahead of function.

      I'm excited about the new Rivian models as they look decidedly practical. (but still not bad-looking).

      Not that I can afford a Rivian or a Model X.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    43. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by michelcolman · · Score: 1

      I must say I agree with you on the impracticality of Model X vs. Rivian. Although most actual owners do seem to be fond of their gull wing doors. Target audience, I suppose.

    44. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by dfghjk · · Score: 2

      That's because you misunderstand what an SUV is. SUV did not originally mean "off-road".

      The SUV was born with the Ford Explorer, not especially an off-road vehicle, where the "Sport" was in contrast to its most obvious competition---minivans. At the time, station wagons fell out of favor due to government regulations that favored truck platforms. Families started buying minivans and the SUV was born as a "sporty" alternative.

      Once the category mattered, true off-road vehicles were lumped into it. Jeeps never defined the SUV, masculine station wagons did. Companies like Volvo literally converted their wagons to SUVs by jacking them up a few inches and slapping new skins on them. Companies that entered the category, like MB and VW, with true off-road worthiness soon learned that was a disadvantage and removed the "truck" from future models.

      So the Model X is an SUV in the classic definition of an SUV and you suffer from a history deficit. No, the biggest problem with the Model X is that it is the worst eyesore on the road today. It is brazenly the minivan that all SUVs are and lacks the masculine styling that differentiates them.

    45. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rei · · Score: 2

      Are you saying people are driving their Model X's through there? Because I sincerely doubt it. They are driving their Model X's where it is maintained like everyone else.

      Yes, they do, despite your disbelief. Around 50% of all vehicle sales are now electric in Norway. Model X is one of the more popular models.

      Your refusal to believe something doesn't make it not real.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    46. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Then if the passes are less then 200 miles and there are EV charging stations in between it's not really that bad or remote there. We have already ascertained that they are still within a temperature range that doesn't take 40% from the battery.

      In -40 an EV would make it through a range of 150km at best, then you're stranded. If you look at a mountain highway like the Ququahalla in BC it is mostly all treacherous in the winter and is 543.3 km long.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    47. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Coquihalla* Lazy spelling.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    48. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's great and all, but for the money you pay, it is not a great SUV. If you wanted an actual SUV, you'd would buy something used that you don't care about scratching the paint or worrying that the part that just broke is only at the dealer...which are the only ones who can do the repair.

    49. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Density of people in Norway is 14.34 / sq km! That's pretty high for a geographically small country. Canada is 3.7 / sq km by comparison. Of course you're never far from a plug in Norway.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    50. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let me guess, you also think every pick up with an 8 inch lift can off road...

    51. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by moschner · · Score: 1

      Why would anyone want to take their SUV off road? It might get scratched.

      Given the condition of most roads in the US, going off road is likely the safer option.

    52. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Furthermore, pretty sure -3C won't kill people. You can wait for hours for help.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    53. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Khyber · · Score: 1

      "The Model X has general ground clearance of 8 which can be electronically raised an inch as well putting it inline or exceeding the clearance of other SUVs:

      In other words, fucking up that center of gravity even more and making the vehicle even more prone to flipping over.

      There is a reason most SUVs are dropping the ground clearance, and it ain't because of grannies buying them.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    54. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Khyber · · Score: 1

      "no weight on the roof is going to affect its' friction force by anything substantial."

      Says the chair-bound idiot that has never loaded a couple of tons of rocks onto an SUV after a nice rockhounding trip.

      Only dumb ass is your dumb ass. Go outside and try doing something with your pathetic life.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    55. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, the biggest problem with the Model X is that it is the worst eyesore on the road today.

      The worst eyesore on the road today is the Hummer in all its incarnations. And stretch vehicles. And there is a stretch Hummer...

    56. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Khyber · · Score: 1

      Never heard of knobbies and chains, retard?

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    57. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rob+Lister · · Score: 2

      Most camp grounds worth my while are over 200 miles away with no place to charge.

      I'm not talking about a campground though. I'm talking about wilderness.

      Sorry, your use of the word camp ground made me think you were talking about a campground. My bad.

      Do you find many gas stations in your wilderness?

    58. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Rob+Lister · · Score: 1

      Link to a pic of your magic SUV. I think you're lying.

    59. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by RhettLivingston · · Score: 2

      Torque is just one aspect of a tow rating. Though your example is one that doesn't actually require a lot of torque and is only good for show to the naive, EVs do have much better low-end torque than other technologies. This is one of the reasons virtually all trains are diesel-electric hybrids.

      But, the towing capacity is also dependent on how much weight the vehicle can hold and control at the hitch when doing crazy things like slamming on the brakes while going around sharp curves or weaving left and right at speed to go around an obstacle that suddenly appears. Towing more than your capacity can allow for things like side-to-side oscillations to start up while driving down the highway that can eventually go out of control and jackknife your vehicle. Or there may be braking situations that cause the weight to bear down on the hitch and pop your front wheels off of the ground causing immediate loss of all steering control.

      I suspect Teslas with their low center of gravity and the high mass of the batteries will also be king in these areas, but not so much that you could ever have a true tow rating of something ridiculous like 100K pounds from a Model Y, X, or even the upcoming pickup truck.

    60. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by RhettLivingston · · Score: 1

      What you need is a camper made for a Tesla. It could have its own battery pack. Of course, Tesla would have to provide some sort of kit to allow the connection of a trailer battery somewhere near the hitch. But, it would be cool.

      Speaking of campers, every time I pass a camper struggling on a grade or pulled-over to cool the transmission and/or brakes, I scratch my head as to why the great American motor home was not the first type of vehicle to go full-on EV. Neither weight nor space is near the concern that it is for smaller vehicles. Many of them cost enough that a 250+ kWh battery pack wouldn't be much of a blip in their cost. They don't go very far on most days. They tend to park every night at a site that already has a 50A plug. They desperately need a torque upgrade for the mountains their owners always love to take them over. They could regain a lot of that energy from going up when they go down the other side, etc. etc.

    61. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No roof rack for the X. This is 1 of 1.5 that you got correct.
      X can be ordered with a hitch. Not a problem.
      The X is taken off-road by a large number of ppl.
      No spare tire, though you can take one with you when off-roading. So, half point.

      This vehicle is SUPERIOR as an SUV, compared to other luxury 'SUVs', such as Cayenne, After all, these are SPORT UTILITY vehicles, not necessarily major off-roaders.

      Windbourne( moderating ).

    62. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by polar+red · · Score: 2

      and making the vehicle even more prone to flipping over.

      except that the model X is very resistant to flipping over. https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

      --
      Yes, I'm left. You have a problem with that?
    63. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      really? U put a couple of tons of rock on a SUV's roof-rack? I would like to see a pix of that. I'm betting that you did NOT put a couple of tons of rooks on a roof-rack, but instead, put them inside the SUV,or in a trailer.

      Windbourne( moderating ).

    64. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by polar+red · · Score: 1
      --
      Yes, I'm left. You have a problem with that?
    65. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Ferocitus · · Score: 1

      Until he read that he thought gimp was a graphics editor.

      --
      USB, USB, USB!
    66. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I did use the word camp grounds, but even then often you end up in overflow without an electrical hookup.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    67. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      With no electrical*

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    68. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Seeing as they get 2MPG on gas, they may get 50 miles on a battery and then need a fill. No one is going to want to go a long distance that way.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    69. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What? Are you that fucking stupid that you don't think an SUV can drive in 2 foot of snow? If it has the right tires it will plow along fine.

    70. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are such a shill it isn't even funny. You are paying 100k for a 50k SUV. The reality distortion field is strong.

    71. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Pascoea · · Score: 1

      Says the chair-bound idiot that has never loaded a couple of tons of rocks onto an SUV after a nice rockhounding trip.

      Really? A couple of tons? I smell bullshit!

      Cargo capacity of a model X is around 1900 lbs, that's people gear, and cargo. Most SUVs I searched are right around 2000, and again, that's people, gear, cargo, and fuel (where applicable). In order to get anywhere near "a couple of tons" capacity you need to get into a 3500 class pickup truck. Towing is a different story, but then we have to figure out how a couple of people hand loaded two tons of rocks onto a trailer. And if we somehow managed to convince a bunch of people how much "fun" that was, we have to figure out where we can go where we can remove two tons of rocks without getting arrested. (Hint, don't go to Arizona)

      Ok, so actually on topic... Unless you are literally putting 250 pounds of material on your roof (which is well above what a standard roof rack is rated for) you're not going to affect the friction force.

    72. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by samwichse · · Score: 1

      No true scotsman...

      My 66 VW did just great off road without any extra lift or anything. It just got some more aggressively-treaded tires.

      The Model X has a little better clearance and shares a nice, flat undercarriage. Unless you want to define "off road" as some arbitrarily difficult to overcome hurdle, the X should be fine off road.

    73. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by samwichse · · Score: 1

      The Subaru Crosstrek is just an Impreza with a 2" lift and some widebody-style extenders on the wheel arches.

      Cracks me up every time I see one. The only advantage it has over an Impreza for 95% of the drivers is it looks cool. And the lift and ridiculous wheels cost you about 10% of your gas mileage.

      Look at them side by side, they barely even tried to make them different:
      https://pictures.dealer.com/p/...

    74. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed... all of the reviews I've seen of towing a camper with a Model X show it's basically a non-starter. Plus, they use a european style hitch, so no weight distributing hitch, and you have to disconnect from the camper every time you want to charge. :P

    75. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wait, is this a case where Farenheit is the preferred scale? 0..100F is survivable, outside that range, seek shelter ... easy!

    76. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by mlyle · · Score: 1

      Almost all of the Canadian population is in a narrow southwards populated band, though, with a much higher density. That is, Canada has a bunch of land with basically no people in it.

    77. Re: I hope its better than the Model X. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The falcon-wing doors were one of the main reasons we went with a Model X (along with the very high windshield, another feature that people often trash). I'm very tall, and the falcon doors make getting things in and out of the back seats (especially kids in carseats) much easier. The high windshield means I can actually see the stoplight I'm waiting at without craning my neck.

    78. Re:I hope its better than the Model X. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Right, but if I want to drive an EV through that land I still need charging stations every 200 miles or so, on every highway. There are also ice roads only open in winter to consider. the longest one in Canada is 467m/752km.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  4. Pickup Truck? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1
    Now you have my undivided attention, Mr Musk.

    Next, do a partnership with Jeep and build a trail rated Jeep/Tesla doodad.

    --
    The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    1. Re:Pickup Truck? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      An electric 4WD should use wheel motors and completely avoid the whole differential and drive shaft clearance issues.

    2. Re:Pickup Truck? by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      An electric 4WD should use wheel motors and completely avoid the whole differential and drive shaft clearance issues.

      Imagine the extra clearance - damn.

      I managed to get high centered in my wife's Jeep a couple days ago. Her interior is similat to mine, but she has less clearance.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    3. Re:Pickup Truck? by hackertourist · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Wheel motors are a terrible idea. What you gain in clearance, you lose in on-road handling because you've added a great big block of of unsprung weight to each wheel.

    4. Re:Pickup Truck? by Rob+Lister · · Score: 1

      Wheel motors are a terrible idea. What you gain in clearance, you lose in on-road handling because you've added a great big block of of unsprung weight to each wheel.

      None of the big makers are using wheel motors. But I think that is more because wheel motors are more costly and susceptible to damage.

      I agree that unsprung mass is an issue but not an insurmountable one; increased damping and the ability to control each wheel independently probably adds stability in the long run.

    5. Re:Pickup Truck? by dasunt · · Score: 2

      An electric 4WD should use wheel motors and completely avoid the whole differential and drive shaft clearance issues.

      You could place the motors in the rear and have a short axle shaft, which would also avoid the whole differential and drive shaft clearance issues.

      Depending on the design of the vehicle, the axle shafts and rear motors may have their own clearance issues.

      But lets be honest - a pickup is a symbol of a certain type of lifestyle, more than it is actually used as a truck by most people. As a cargo hauler, one would want the opposite features of most trucks - lower bed (easier loading/unloading), better gas mileage (cheaper to haul cargo), full 8'+ bed. Lower profile and better gas mileage would also apply to hauling a trailer.

      With modern trucks, they are mostly sold to people who don't want to drive a car. They should look big, look like they could go off-road, and sit higher up, because that's what the market wants. It's about as useful as a peacock's tail, and probably serves the same purpose (signalling your fitness by having something impractical that you have to support).

    6. Re:Pickup Truck? by Khyber · · Score: 1

      "What you gain in clearance, you lose in on-road handling because you've added a great big block of of unsprung weight to each wheel."

      Your handling is determined almost entirely by your frame, sway bars, shocks, and struts, plus your tire spacing (and tread type) and size.

      Wheel motors tend to weigh less than the fucking rotor they'd replace on most vehicles.

      Try again when you actually work on vehicles.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    7. Re:Pickup Truck? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can’t remove the brake rotor you fucking stupid retard.

    8. Re:Pickup Truck? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think that the group buying pickup trucks as a status symbol is quite as large as you indicate. There is certainly a market for the pickup truck including the off-road versions where it is a necessary vehicle.

      I do currently live in a suburban community. Of the five trucks that park in the same lot that I do every night, four are owned by construction workers. They are very useful for carrying loads to the door on barely graded lots that often do not have driveways yet. The fifth is indeed a grocery store supervisor who is just compensating.

      In the past, I have lived in a rural state that had one of the highest percentages of truck ownership in the country - mostly 4-wheel drive and many with the off-road packages. The region was extremely hilly, wooded, and many of the roads were gravel. Several times a year, there would be major storms that would either soak the ground too much or produce too much ice and the trees would start coming down all over. It would have been ridiculous to wait for the county to clear things. Most people carried a chain saw and chains with them just to be prepared. There were many times that I pulled up to a downed tree and, with the help of whoever else drove up, either pulled my chain saw out to cut it up or grabbed my log chain and hooked it to my truck to drag an already cut log off the road. Also, because the gravel roads were often not scraped for as long as a week after a snowstorm, we had to be able to just drive through heavy snow and deep potholes. In other words, our roads weren't really any better than off road at times.

      Not all of the country is neatly paved city squares and four lane highways.

    9. Re:Pickup Truck? by dasunt · · Score: 1

      I do currently live in a suburban community. Of the five trucks that park in the same lot that I do every night, four are owned by construction workers. They are very useful for carrying loads to the door on barely graded lots that often do not have driveways yet. The fifth is indeed a grocery store supervisor who is just compensating.

      Look closely at those four trucks. Are they the sort of vehicles optimized to make the owners money? Or the sort of vehicle optimized to make the dealer money?

      I've lived in the country before, btw. Down a twisty windy dirt road that extended for several miles. Not bad with a FWD and snow tires, even in a car.

      Funny enough, I have had more problems in the city, but that's partially because I don't have snow tires anymore, and partially due to record snow fall in February (39").

    10. Re:Pickup Truck? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So as a country redneck with a truck I would love to find a vehicle that can meet my towing requirements (bumper pull trailer with (tractor|bobcat|ATVs) ~10k), 5th wheel ~14k) and can carry 2 adults + 2 carseats + two dogs. I do

      I tow the above about 15-20 times a year, most of those trips are ~160 miles one way with no electricity at the destination. For actual vacation trips the first day out and last day back are usually longer distances 500+ miles, after that it is maybe a couple hundred miles when relocating.

      The 5th wheel never sees much worse than something between crappy gravel roads and good logging roads. The other trailer has been in bad enough terrain that the tractor comes off and drives itself or you'd probably break a leaf spring or hanger.

      As far as truck height, some of it is dictated by the trailers. My F350 doesn't have a lift kit or anything, but I still have to raise the 5th wheel hitch to the highest position to get the trailer level. For the bumper pull I think my hitch is a 4" drop, if the truck at 8" lower and I used a 4" rise I doubt I could open the tailgate.

      Every couple of years I run the numbers to see if it makes sense for me to have more special purpose vehicles. Maybe a little 2 seater to commute to work on nice days, or a awd sedan, or a minivan...etc. I could make the justification if it were only fuel charges vs ost of the extra vehicle it is close to a wash but once insurance and other maintenance comes in it doesn't make sense.

  5. fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Rei and her other 30 paid shill accounts rejoice.

    Welcome to /. where we advertise directly from inside the corporate Tesla toilet.

    1. Re: fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Elon is taking credit for goatse now?

    2. Re: fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Absolute criminal! Canâ(TM)t wait for him to be in handcuffs.

    3. Re: fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, but his biggest achievement is being the Pedo Guy.

    4. Re:fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Rei · · Score: 1

      I'm everywhere.
      I'm everyone.
      I'm you yourself.
      The matrix is real.

      --
      When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
    5. Re:fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're a trolling farm, paid for with Tesla money, so yeah, there's a whole bunch of you.

    6. Re:fElon Musk tweets another picture of his anus by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Shurahelop' faggot.

  6. V3 is not going to help that much. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2
    The charging rate for Tesla in the current superchargers is 128 kW till the battery is charged to 50% capacity. Then it follows linearly to 12 kW when the battery is fully charged. The supercharger V3 is going to 256 kW. Cars can this rate only for 10 minutes or so.

    But, when the Tesla Semi hits the roads, it might be able to soak it all up. Semi is supposed to be 600 mile range on a 1 MW battery. It could soak up SCV3 at full blast for 2 hours may be.

    It would be better if Tesla designs a charger that send down super chilled coolant and the battery gets a heat exchanger to keep it cool. That can charge 325 miles in 35 minutes. But very complicated, and will involve lots of expenses.

    --
    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    1. Re:V3 is not going to help that much. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They already supercharger is for non commercial use only. Semis are commercial

    2. Re:V3 is not going to help that much. by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

      The supercharger V3 is going to 256 kW. Cars can this rate only for 10 minutes or so.

      That's 43kWh, good for 300km or so. Not bad on a 10 minute charge. Plus, every minute you shave off a top-up charge brings you closer to the current petrol experience. 10 minutes still constitutes a wait, but if you get that down to 7 it's more like a regular stop at the petrol pump. Hook up, visit the restroom, grab something from the forecourt shop, and by the time you're back the car is ready for the road. In Europe, a few companies are already upgrading CCS charging stations to 175kW, with a few at 350kW, even if there's not that many cars that can take advantage of that yet. Because that's where the future is.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
  7. Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

    It is not 110% of 35K version. SUVs are dual motors. So we are looking at 45K for model Y. Plain ICEV Rav4 is 24K, fully loaded Rav4 hybrid is 35K. Still it will sell well. It can probably sell as much as Rav4.

    --
    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    1. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by dehachel12 · · Score: 1

      EV's cost a lot less to drive (electricity is only 1/5 to 1/2 the cost of gas, maintenance is a lot cheaper), so you can't compare the price 1 to 1.

    2. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      Model Y is a near luxury SUV. It should be compared to RX 330, RX330h. That sells in the range of 45K to 55K. So it is price comparable off the dealership. All savings in running costs are just icing on the cake.

      Model Y and higher trims of Model 3 will provide the margins to sustain the operations, and the 35K Model 3 will provide volume and the economy of scale. It will eventually get the cost of basic to 28K. The leaked email of Oct 2018 said it is 38K. I would guess it is probably at 35K right now or a shade less. It needs to shave 7K off. I think it can, over the next two or three years. Model Y will provide the margins needed to make base model 3 get a 20% gross margins. That number is the key. 20% gross margin is what it needs to pay off the debt, invest more in factories, stabilize its credit ratings and become a stable auto maker. That is why Y is a game changer.

      Hats off Tesla, it has shown no compromise electric cars will win.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    3. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 0

      People keep saying that, but the extra trips I need to make because of charging in between, the rentals for long trips, and the air travel for places I could have driven will easily eat up the money saved on an EV.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    4. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      That is what most people think when they are buying every mile they drive in a gas station. In the BEV world, 90% of the miles you drive come from an outlet in the garage. You save 10 minutes every week avoiding gas station trips. You never break an urgent errand to stop to fill gas. In fact a few months on BEV you get annoyed when it happens in a gas car.

      At minuscule market share Tesla has (200K total sold in USA that has 300 million vehicles) its network is vast. There is a supercharger within 60 miles for 95% of the US population. Tesla is not optimizing based on population centers. It has billions of miles of trip data. It is optimizing based on detour distance from trips. Already it is close to less than 10 mile detour for 98% of the trips. It needs to quadruple its network to make it 5%.

      There are 60,000 motels and hotels in USA. 15,000 offer level 2 charging. 240 v outlets with wi-fi are so cheap to build overnight charging will become ubiquitous and free on almost all motels, like your free breakfast.

      You will not rent gas cars for long trips. You will hate gas cars and their tepid handling once you drive BEV.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    5. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      I've never seen a hotel in Canada with a charging station, and I'm too polite to just plug into any outlet in the wall. Besides, how do I know there aren't more hotel guests than there are chargers? I'll go to a gas station thanks.

      My biggest worry is that I will detour and the charging station will not be there, will be broken, or there will be someone else ahead of me already. Yes sometimes it happens with gas stations but not very often. The wait for the fill automatically increases the risk of having to wait. If I have to wait, I'd rather put up with the inconvenience of regular fills with gas.

      Even Norway, which heavily subsidizes charging stations, is having a lot of people wait for charging and no chargers in remote areas.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    6. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      is having a lot of people wait for charging and no chargers in remote areas.

      Can you provide us with a link ?

    7. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      First some terminology. Level 2 is simply a 240 volt outlet used by your electric clothes washer, stoves, cooking ranges etc. It is limited to 12 kW. Level 1 is the 120 v 15 amp outlets we normally in homes/offices. Tesla calls these L2 chargers "Destination Chargers". They are meant to be used when you sleep. Tesla has a program and gives Tesla branded connectors for these charges free or at a low cost to hotels, restaurants etc. It is very inexpensive to offer a 240 v outlet for guests. The Level 2 chargers provided by the hotels will not be a big prominent pedestal or anything. It will be an inconspicuous outlet on the wall or a post, ask the desk they will show you. You probably did not notice them or did not realize they can charge an EV for 300 miles over night. Tesla owners of Canada rely completely on destination chargers, because the supercharger network there is not as good as it is in the USA

      Now L3, Level 3 is the supercharger for Tesla, Direct current charging for Electrify America etc. Tesla goes to 128 kW. Electrify America has mostly 50 kW chargers. These are meant to be used to charge your car while you wait. Typically less than 1 hour. Typically you get 200 miles in 30 minutes, 280 miles in one hour. These are the ones that get ICEd, crowded, creates waiting lists, gets vandalized etc. Only Tesla is doing serious network and expansion in America. In Europe many competing vendors, utilities and municipalities provide a decent L3 charging options.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    8. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Ok but if it's so easy, why aren't there any?

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    9. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      There are many. They are so common, it does not stand out and you dont notice. Any place an RV can plug in, an EV can do level 2 charge. Campgrounds, parking lots, so many hotels, truck stops, ... Your home already has a 240 volt connection and probably a few 240 volt outlets. They are the Level2 charger the EV folks are talking about.

      Putting on 300 miles of charge when you sleep is easily done. It takes a sudden flash to realize, in the BEV universe, every outlet is a gas station.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    10. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by Hadlock · · Score: 1

      looks like there is a solid route between Vancouver and Edmonton, and also Ottowa and Quebec. Toronto to Calgary is a bit of a dry stretch though. Their map shows the rest of that section should be complete sometime by the end of this year, supposedly.

      --
      moox. for a new generation.
    11. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      A solid route where you have to stop at certain places, in certain intervals. No thanks.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    12. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Ok at -40C 300 miles is going to be more like 120 miles. That means a charge every 2 hours. No way.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    13. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      No 180 miles. So a stop every 3 hours of driving. 6 hours and you may as well stop for the night. I just couldn't do a long trip that way.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    14. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      your electric clothes washer, stoves, cooking ranges etc.

      A) you probably mean clothes dryer
      B) I have natural gas you insensitive clod

    15. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      You win. All the driving at -40 deg C will forever be done on an ICEV. OK?

      Tesla will sell to other people who dont drive at -40 deg c.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    16. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by swillden · · Score: 1

      Ok but if it's so easy, why aren't there any?

      https://www.tesla.com/findus/list/chargers/Canada

      Those are just the ones that have chosen to affiliate with Tesla. There are more independent ones. If you really want to see what's available, look on plugshare.com. But, don't worry, if you start to get enough chargers near you to make a BEV practical for you, I'm sure you can move further into the sticks and get away from them. Just as there are places that gasoline vehicles aren't practical, there will always be places and lifestyles that are incompatible with BEVs.

      --
      Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
    17. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Plugshare is a third party site. Meaning the plugs are not necessarily there.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    18. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the BEV world, 90% of the miles you drive come from an outlet in the garage. You save 10 minutes every week avoiding gas station trips.

      So 140ManDickInMyAss262Jamuna you're saying a BEV driver will be searching for a plug once every 10 days or so.
      Let's say that cost you an extra 30 minutes every 10 days driving around the gay bar you frequent looking for a plug.
      Except half the time other faggots already plugged in the available stalls.
      You're at least 30 minutes unplugged every week to the ICE stud's 10 minutes every week. That sounds about right if I understand you correctly?

    19. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      When I travel I often have kids and pets. I make a schedule. I'm not going to hinge everyone's security on a third party site. Also I can't see myself ever being able to afford a Tesla.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    20. Re:Model Y is a game changer. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maintance of Tesla’s is way more expensive than a gasoline car due to Tesla’s shit engineering.

  8. Perhaps by onyxruby · · Score: 1

    Perhaps this means they are finally going to admit that the Model X is a minivan? Let's just say that a search of pictures of the Model X actually being used off road results in a lot of very flat terrain...

    1. Re:Perhaps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      fElon and Rei say it is an SUV, their 50 paid mod accounts say it is an SUV, on /. it is an SUV.

      You got nothing against the advertising dollar.

    2. Re:Perhaps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it is an SUV.

      Really, I thought it was an attempt to manipulate their stock price since it tanked again.

    3. Re: Perhaps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Elon Musk is clearly a psychopath.

    4. Re: Perhaps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Spot on! Felon is correct.

      Elon Musk will be in handcuffs in no time.

    5. Re:Perhaps by Erik+Hensema · · Score: 1

      It's a crossover.

      The whole "an suv is not a car"-thing is stupid anyway.

      --

      This is your sig. There are thousands more, but this one is yours.

  9. Juvenile CEO by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 0, Troll

    Seriously... S3XY? Beavis and Butthead give it two thumbs up...

    --
    Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    1. Re:Juvenile CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Richard Branson says 'sup.

    2. Re:Juvenile CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seriously your yellow fever is disgusting.

    3. Re:Juvenile CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Eglon the Mollusk style 1337.

    4. Re:Juvenile CEO by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Seriously... S3XY? Beavis and Butthead give it two thumbs up...

      I think I read an article a long time ago where Musk was interviewed about his planned vehicles- and he always planned it that way- and for exactly that reason. The 3 was originally going to be an E.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    5. Re:Juvenile CEO by Whorhay · · Score: 1

      And it fits with the planned objective of starting Tesla to begin with. That is making electric vehicles sexy enough for the mainstream.

    6. Re: Juvenile CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The base model 3 comes with cloth and manual seats. It's ugly as fuck.

  10. Not unexpected... by cliffjumper222 · · Score: 4, Funny

    S 3 X Y

    1. Re:Not unexpected... by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1

      It was planned this way. But Elon could not register Model E, Ford had already registered. That is why it became Model 3.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    2. Re:Not unexpected... by AdamStarks · · Score: 1

      Does that mean the Truck will be Model ; and the Semi will be Model D?

    3. Re:Not unexpected... by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 4, Funny

      No the semi is model M (seMi). The pickup truck is model U(tility). The new roadster is S (roadSter) again. The van will be K (Kids). Finally the lineup will spell S3XY MUSK

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  11. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Rei, we need you to step in here and explain why Tesla is doing great, why closing stores is good, why having no cash is good, why all the big auto makers are running scared, why Tesla getting down graded in consumer reports is good, why Musk antagonizing the SEC and getting his ass a step closer to jail is good.

    Help us, Rei, you are our only hope!

    -Musk fanboy

  12. He just needs to stop by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    He's too much of an egomaniac. Just let Tesla's PR department tweet about the company for fucks sake.

  13. Re:Snore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You heard it here first, with 1101010101's endless posts about how they'd never have a profitable quarter, or 101010101's endless posts about how the $35k version would never get released.

  14. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When they do finally go bankrupt Rei will be here claming it’s just his genius to drive the company into bankruptcy.

  15. To futuristic? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    All that comes into the equation for buying commercial trucks is capital cost, running cost and logistics.

    I think logistics will hurt Tesla, as the range and charge time put it at a disadvantage. Diesel trucks can be run 20+ hours a day, everyday.

    1. Re:To futuristic? by jonwil · · Score: 2

      Truck drivers are generally only allowed to drive a certain amount of time before they have to take a break and rest.
      If Telsa can put a big enough battery in the truck to last the full distance before the driver has to pull over (or close enough) and build these super-fast superchargers at truck stops everywhere so the driver can pull in, plug in and take their break before moving on, I bet the Telsa Truck will be popular. (I dont know all that much about long haul trucking but I do know that an electric truck that has much lower fuel and maintanence costs than a conventional diesel-powered big-rig will definitely get people interested)

    2. Re:To futuristic? by Rob+Lister · · Score: 1

      Electric cars can be a smart solution. Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.

      Musk promised the Tesla Semi top-line trucks would have a 500-mile range and an 80,000lb maximum load. But working the math a good while back it seems to me only 40,000lb is usable after subtracting the 40,000lb weight of the battery pack, assuming the current energy densities. And let's not point out the energy costs of hauling that 40,000lb' battery pack around.

      Most conventional semis have only to carry a 3,000 lb engine and a 1000-2000 lbs of fuel worst case.

      I think a better case can be made for semi hybrids, especially for city use where regenerative braking can be a huge advantage.

    3. Re:To futuristic? by eth1 · · Score: 1

      If Telsa can put a big enough battery in the truck to last the full distance...

      It would be silly to put a massive battery in the tractor. They won't need nearly as much juice as when they have a trailer, and there's room on (most) semi trailers for several enormous battery modules in front of the trailer wheels. Bonus: From that location, they'd be easy to forklift in and out in a few minutes, and the trailers tend to sit around somewhere they can charge a lot more than the trucks do.

  16. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Anyone claiming to be for Tesla's mission and caring about current vehicle owners should be in favor of a Chapter 11 reorg. That's the only way the company survives, service/warranty promises will be honored and existing vehicles maintain any resale value. Existing equity will be wiped out though, so that says all you need to know about the people pushing back against it. They're just as greedy if not more so than the evil shorts they constantly rail against.

  17. Has anyone noticed the model names for the Tesla? by mark-t · · Score: 1

    S, 3, X, Y..... I wonder if Musk is trying to send a subliminal message here.

  18. Re:Has anyone noticed the model names for the Tesl by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes, this is also why he's got the hair implants.

    When men get older and no amount of sildenafil helps them anymore, they do really desperate shit.

  19. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    *kicks a Tesla* just you reconsider playing that message for him!

  20. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Of course, that is what the Reis did when Solar City collapsed and was bought out by fElon with other people's money.

  21. Will the model Y kill people too? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

    How about that autonomous level 5 self driving?

    Hey Rei, will Y launch at level 5 and get upgraded to level 6 by year end//

    Level 6: it knows you are low on milk and goes to the store without being told to fill your fridge. I bet Musk is in late beta testing on level 6 autonomy right now!

    Sarcasm aside, I do wonder what the Musk worshipping sheep like Rei will say when Tesla finally goes under.

    1. Re:Will the model Y kill people too? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      short much ? don't stain your pants ...

    2. Re: Will the model Y kill people too? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've made a killing shorting so far. It's down -10 today. Or 3.7%.

      You were saying?

  22. Re:Has anyone noticed the model names for the Tesl by mentil · · Score: 2

    Elon wanted to call the Model 3 the 'Model E' but Ford complained about trademark infringement so he compromised with the number 3 instead. He explicitly said at the time that he wanted the initialism to spell 'SEX'.

    --
    Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
  23. more nuclear/coal powered oversized vehicles by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So cool, more nuclear/coal powered oversized vehicles on the road, with drivers thinking they are greener than anyone.

    1. Re:more nuclear/coal powered oversized vehicles by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      So cool, more nuclear/coal powered oversized vehicles on the road, with drivers thinking they are greener than anyone.

      Nuclear IS greener than ICE. Even coal power-plants are. It is much more efficient to produce power at a centralized location than individually in each little car on the road. Not to mention, most are charged during off-peak hours when excess production would have meant wasted energy anyway. (you can't just turn power plants on and off exactly at peak demand).

      That's not to say that there are not ecological problems associated with producing power of any kind. Certainly the batteries themselves aren't entirely without ecological blame. It's a matter of degrees.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    2. Re:more nuclear/coal powered oversized vehicles by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Off peak". Has now changed from night time to day time in this area. As the Utility company added solar energy sources, both residential and theirs, it is now more expensive to use electricity in the evenening and night than during the day. Let me repeat...cheapest energy, off peak, is now during the DAY; so all those night time charging is now more expensive!

  24. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Rei · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Yes, companies with billions of dollars of cash on hand and expanding much faster than even Amazon did into a market that most people consider to be the future of transportation and energy storage should totally declare bankruptcy. That makes a ton of sense; I don't know why we didn't think of it before!

    --
    When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
  25. Using it wrong by DrYak · · Score: 1

    he's got the hair implants.
    When men get older and no amount of sildenafil helps them anymore

    If you're trying to solve your hair problems by using Sildenafil , I think you're doing it wrong.

    --
    "Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
  26. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So, just like Solar City, eh?

  27. Re:Snore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    After YOU're caught lying saying you're no jew but are quoted years before saying you are https://hardware.slashdot.org/... ? Game over for you JEW liar.

  28. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Rei · · Score: 1

    What about Solar City? Did Solar City have a cash pile of billions of dollars and no looming major debt payments?

    BTW, I never cared about Solar City (their business model was fundamentally based on the concept of solar panels being expensive, which is sort of an anti-cleantech-advancements play). Not that you care, of course. I do like the solar roof idea a lot, however. But obviously vehicles get first dibs on investment money, since they're higher margin.

    --
    When was the last time you ran anywhere? I mean with your own legs, not by pressing 'X'?
  29. SUV or CUV? by rsmith-mac · · Score: 1

    If this is going to be based on the Model 3, then is it actually going to be an SUV, or a CUV? Even the "SUV" Model X had rather unimpressive ride height and ground clearance. It was much closer to a CUV than a proper SUV in that respect.

  30. Re:Snore by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 2

    Sorry Rei, Tesla is done. Game over man.

    To be fair, I think you also predicted Tesla would never produce the model 3: would be bankrupt within a year (years ago), the electric car would never take off, no one besides rich people would buy electric cars...etc

    You've been wrong on every other prediction about Musk and Tesla so far.

    --
    "That's the way to do it" - Punch
  31. Re: Rei, you have failed us all! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So many questions, so few answers!

    How will I debate with my short selling, Tesla hating friends who are armed with facts that demonstrate Tesla is rapidly swirling down a financial toilet bowl when you just deflect and dissemble?

    My Elon/Tesla local fan club is in full on panic mode! We are relying on you, Rei!

  32. Re: Help me, Rei, you are my only hope! by Khyber · · Score: 1

    "Yes, companies with billions of dollars of cash on hand and expanding much faster than even Amazon did into a market that most people consider to be the future of transportation and energy storage"

    Energy Storage and generation - NO. Tesla couldn't even get us to produce their utter garbage panels. We took one look at their shit roof tile design and laughed them off our production floor. So much blank space in those panels that you'd need $20,000 of their shit to match $2,000 of ours.

    No wonder Solar City is swirling around the toilet.

    --
    Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
  33. Range Wankery by Uberbah · · Score: 1

    Even a puny Nissan Leaf will do most daily driving for most people. If you're like some people and have a four hour commute each day - any Tesla should get you there and back on a single charge. A Tesla will help you plan longer trips, with routes and stops for charging stations. The rest is the fallacy that EV's have to be all things to all people. But you wouldn't rubbish a Honda Civic just because it can't drive you through foot deep snow on a trip to the Northwest Territories, would you?

    1. Re:Range Wankery by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Why do you people keep talking about this? I buy a vehicle to fulfill my needs every day I own it, not just most days I own it.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    2. Re:Range Wankery by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am not wasting the ongoing expenses for gas and such running a gigantic pickup truck because on one day out of five years I may need to move some furniture.

      I am not buying a million-dollar house with a gazebo on a lake because on one day my daughter may want to get married in the perfect back yard.

      I am not getting an apartment in New York City because one week a year I need to be there for business.

      It is generally a poor investment to buy really expensive things to cover 100% of your needs, because the price difference between 99.5% and 100% is so very high.

  34. Make the Truck! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've been holding out for a truck for the same reason I didn't own a sedan since before the electric sedans started hitting the market: I need a TRUCK!

    Call me when you make a truck.

  35. Re: Snore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Tbf, the model 3 took so long, has so many issues, base model with cloth and manual seats. It's a piece of shit. And if you think by owning one you are somehow saving the world, well then you are a cunt.

  36. More excited by the Rivian electric off-road truck by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

    It's got a 410 mile range (+400 if you replace the tool box with a spare battery), a real winch, and is designed to actually work in off road conditions.

    A real truck, not a city truck like Tesla will have.

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  37. Eating Pi at the Y by Tree131 · · Score: 1

    Anyone else make the "Eating Pi at the Y" connection, or am I the only one in the gutter here?
    3.14... model Y....

    1. Re:Eating Pi at the Y by Tree131 · · Score: 1

      I wonder if the demo model will be pink....

  38. ugh.. by SuperDre · · Score: 1

    'like a model 3', sounds to me nothing like a real SUV, just as ugly/boring as the Model X which was also just a morphed upwards Model S. Wake me up when they release a real SUV.