Justin Ng writes "CNet reports that the 8MB Palm Vx is due October 4th, and as a result Palm V and Palm IIIx models will be slashed in price. Read about it here. " Seems like it will be what the the Palm IIIx was to the Palm III. Wonder what sort of upgrade path will be provided...
Palm entry is fairly easy, I'll be honest. You can (as has already been said) use "Graffiti" (the palm's own text entry system), the onscreen keyboard, or the gotype! or a twiddler. Of these, the easiest are graffiti and the gotype.
Some people think graffiti is "like shorthand", but really, it's very much like regular print handwriting. The odd ones are A, F, K, Q, T, and V. An A is the same as a capital A minus the cross stroke, so it looks like an upside down v. F is an F minus the middle line, K is like the two diagonal lines of the k connected by a loop, Q is like an O with a little line at the top, and V is a U with a line extending to the right (or a backwards U)
Once you learn these graffiti is very fast, often faster than regular handwriting. The gotype is also very nice, since it almost feels like a regular keyboard, but is very thin, has low power consumption, and is nice and handy with quick, customizable access buttons to the major palm apps.
I can write at about 25wpm using graffiti, which is pretty good for handwriting (it's a bit faster than my normal handwriting) and it's MUCH neater since it outputs typed text. On the gotype I can type about 60wpm, compared to 90 on a regular keyboard, but I think 60 is about the limit for the gotype, and I doubt it'll slow down anyone at 60wpm or under.
All in all, text entry is quite easy on the palm devices.. I love my Palm V8! -efisher ---
One of the best uses for an older Palm with IR capability is to use it as the ultimate universal remote control.
The problem I see with traditional programmable remote controls is that they attempt to conform all the funtionality of many remotes into a bunch of buttons. You have to remember that when the remote is in stereo mode, the channel buttons actually control the track number, or that when in TV mode, the fast forward controls the contrast. This "moded method" of control is nonintuitive.
Thinking about it, something like the Palm Pilots would probably be idea. They have infra-red, and you could have a meta-menu on screen from which you could chose which device to control, and sub-menus which are graphical representations of each device's remote. They wouldn't have to look like the true remote, just have clearly understandable functionality.
Chris
Off-topic, but don't hurt me
by
jabber
·
· Score: 3
Alright, so the Palm stuff is really looking good. The Visor is promising, and the PdQ phone is a great hybrid...
The WinCE machines are surging over the retail counters.
Some time ago (a year or so) I bought the Philips Nino... It's a neat little device, and the virtual recognition area really appeals to me. But I think I would like to jump ship to the PalmV or Visor. I hate to just throw the Nino away, and it's not worth half of what I paid for it.
My question to/. then is this: What's there to be done with old PDA's?? They're still functional, they're still potent hardware. The Nino has a 75Mhz chip in it. Can I plug it into my fuse box and have it serve as a power consumption controller?? Obviously, I'm being facetious, but I'd like to dedicate the PDA to a task rather than just pitch it off a bridge - it's a matter of principle - I don't like to throw things out.
What have those of you who didn't throw out or retire the old PDA done with them? Are they of any use? Can my Nino run Linux (and hence be a web server) ? Can I wire it to my car, and have it at least show me what it's computer is thinking - i.e. diagnostics, efficiency, etc??
I'd be much more willing to buy a new one if I didn't feel the old one was going to go to waste.
--
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
> They include the GoType keyboard, wireless modems, voice recorders, vibrating modules, extended IR transmitters (longer range than the dinky port on top), and even thermometers.
All of a sudden those pilot ads with the naked woman and her pilot make a certain amount of sense...
-- I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
Ummm... *all* pocket/palm computers already use variable clock rates. The clock rate drops to almost zero whenever the CPU isn't doing anything special. Then when the CPU does something, it runs at max speed so that the user doesn't have to wait. It's pretty much useless to use a clock rate below maximum.
--Bud
Re:They're really naming it VX???
by
Geek+In+Training
·
· Score: 2
If you think THAT'S bad, talk to Honda about their special edition SUV in Japan, the Honda CRV-EX. (Cervix?)
I find it even funnier, personally, that the new German sportscar from Audi is called the Audi TT.
How many American CPAs are going to buy a car called the AUDITT?:)
-RT
-- SlashSigTheorem: Humorous, Political, Critical, Constructive- If you have a.sig, someone WILL complai
Re:Compact Flash! Palm? Handspring? Anyone but CE?
by
gorilla
·
· Score: 2
So far WindowsCE devices are the only ones that have Compact Flash slots,
I own a Palm III and I've played with every model out there. Its nice for them to bump the memory up to 4MB, but I think the next release needs something a little more than a better screen or memory.
I guess I have two points to make. One is that I also own a Philips Velo 1 (one of the first CE machines), and my roomate is on his second Casiopiea (first one was stolen, and was the E-10. The new one is an E-100; color version). While I dislike the CE operating system for numerous reasons (real reasons), I do find one thing pretty cool: you can load an MP3 on it, plug headphones in, and listen away. Pilot has no such ability. Yes, I own a RIO, but that's not the point.
The second point I want to make is that recently I have also had an opportunity to play with a new type of PDA; the Motorola StarTac add-on organizer. One of the big complaints of some of my coworkers is that they have to carry around their pager, cell phone, pilot, etc. With the StarTac add-on, they can merge the pilot and cell phone into one device. The limitation is that there is no PocketChess on the train ride home nor can you really do much else other than the standard apps, but for most people, the Schedule, Contacts and ToDo list are all that matter. Additional bonus is that you can use the synchronized contact list to dial the cell phone.
Currently I carry around a pager, Nokia 6120 cell phone, Palm III and the occasional Rio. Now wouldn't it be nice if some of those could merge together? At the least, I'd like it if I could make my cell phone and pilot synchronize their contact lists. I've heard that there is something sort-of out there that lets you do that, but the cable appears to cost as much as a pilot.
Nice improvement on the Vx, but some other features might be nice. --
--
Never hit your grandmother with a shovel, for it leaves a bad impression on her mind...
Re:Better, but we need more
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2
You'll like the Visor. It looks almost exactly like a Palm (uses the same OS too), but can have a module plugged in. One of the planned modules is a 48? MB MP3 unit (which apparently can also be used as a voice recorder).
Check out www.visorcentral.com -- they have a lot of those addon modules listed. Of course, it doesn't appear until somewhere in the year 2000...
They're really naming it VX???
by
mattdm
·
· Score: 2
VX, as in the poison gas ?!? That might not be the best product naming strategy we've heard recently....
--
Moore'sLaw(Palm Devices)=1
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2
If I had to create a wishlist for the next Palm, it would be: Unbreakable (titanium case and some kind of bulletproof screen), more memory (around 8-10 mb would be fine), waterproof (I don't want to have to worry about it getting damaged), and I want it to be equipped with the ability to receive content via RF (such as the continually updated slashdot content or the NY times on the web (two sites which constitute 70% of my web browsing))).
I don't think that we should worry about being able to send anything with it yet, mostly because it isn't a great text-input device...
I do, however, want it to double as a hammer, crowbar or frizbee... or at least I'd like to be able to sit on it or throw it in my bag without worrying about it breaking.
Why No Variable Speed CPU?
by
Deslock
·
· Score: 2
Everyone remember the ITSY? It's a handheld computer prototype with a 200 MHz StrongARM CPU that had active down-clocking software to save battery life. I runs Linux too. It's not being mass-produced, however.
Well, what I want to know is, why doesn't anyone else use a "variable-speed" CPU so that you can run your CPU intensive apps with decent performance, but still get good battery life when running PDA apps?
Imagine EPOCH32 or PalmOS running on one of those... WinCE could use it too I suppose, though you'd have to run at the fastest CPU speed most of the time anyway, so why bother?:-)
Anyway, adding the above CPU and a color 320x320 resolution screen to the Palm (thus allowing the old 160x160 apps to run) would make it a tough act to follow.
Is there a reason why it can't be done with the Palm?
Re:Why No Variable Speed CPU?
by
Tim+Moore
·
· Score: 2
Is there a reason why it can't be done with the Palm?
Better combination of functions?
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2
I like the handspring device, but it's not quite as sexy as the Palm V, you know. And let's face it, unless you're a true geek and will accept a less sexy look in order to be able to tinker with it, looks and size are going to be high on the priority list (which sounds like how we evaluate our fellow human beings:-)
What I'd suggest is a dual mode device as a better compromise. What I'd like is a pair of devices that maintain all of the functionality of both a Palm V and a cell phone, while allowing the two to be combined at will to allow for wireless Net access. Simply put, sometimes I just need the capabilities of a cell phone, sometimes I just need the capabilities of an organizer, and sometimes I'd like quick e-mail access through a Palm device. But I generally don't need one device that can do all of these things at once. Plus, if the devices can be decoupled, then one piece can go in one pocket, the other can go in another pocket, which I think is better than one bulky device that won't fit in ANY pocket. Also, this may allow a person to separate the providers of various services. My understanding is that with the Palm IIIx, you're kind of limited in the ways that you can access the wireless Net. Why not leave that up to a dedicated third party telecom company, and allow people some choice in the matter?
As a further extension, I would like to see a device like this in a form that one could strap around one's wrist as a replacement for the wristwatch. Kind of like the doohickey that appears in Reboot and its cousin in Futurama. If you keep the telecom and messaging device funcions in separate devices, then perhaps you end up with the best of all possible worlds. A complex of devices that could be attached to the "top" and "bottom" of a wrist mount (to keep it from being too bulky on one side of your arm) or that could be combined in a handheld configuration, or ultimately used in separate handheld configurations.
What the Palm Pilot component of this system needs is a lot more memory, for which I would be willing to trade a little bit of size considerations. With more memory and a headphone jack, the Palm has the potential for MP3 play without memory add-in cards, and also to store electronic books for reading on planes, bus stops, etc, etc. (for the e-book function, I can see a need for a slightly better screen - however, it is not inconceivable even now). Plus, the addition of a headphone jack introduces the interesting possibility of adding a small microphone to the headset and allowing one to use this in place of the speaker/microphone incorporated into the cell phone unit (assuming that the cell phone has been attached to the Pilot unit, which has the headphone jack). Why would this be a good thing? Well, I'd love this capability in a wrist-mounted configuration, simply because it separates the cell phone's transmitter and its questionable brain cancer risk from the side of my head and moves it to my wrist, which has minimal delicate tissues, and can be held away from the body if one is really paranoid. Or, put a tiny CCD camera in the Pilot unit, and you could hold the combined Pilot/cell phone in front of you to acquire the occasional still snap while the headset/microphone picks up your voice.
I think that this configuration of devices would allow for maximum functionality as well as maximum degrees of freedom for the use of these functions. The only thing I'd add is that I'd like to see a standard interface line to the Palm Pilot and other handhelds pop up everywhere. Hanging from every pay phone, bank machine, restaurant table, etc., allowing me to carry my information with me in my Pilot and using its interface wherever I go.
The WinCE machines don't get it. The Windows UI doesn't scale down gracefully, and trying to force that paradigm on to a palm computer doesn't work gracefully. PalmOS, for all its flaws, is light and responsive. And, the minimalist UI philosophy is far better suited to the size of the device.
You have basicly three options for text input. First is handwriting recognition, sorta. It's called "graffiti". To save processor power and increse acuracy you write differently (an a is an upside down v like/\. it sounds odd and some don't like it but I can write with it almost as fast as I can write with a pen on that flat white stuff.
The second is an onscreen keybord. That sucks.
The third is an external addon (70USD?) keybord that is about twice the size of the palm. I havn't used one but there was a favorable review of it on ugeek.com
IMHO all of these beat the rest of the PDAs (winces have tiny keybords or none at all and/or they have onscrene keybords/handwriting...
--Ben
Compact Flash! Palm? Handspring? Anyone but CE?
by
Bocaj
·
· Score: 2
On a related note; why haven't Palm or especially Handspring come out with support for Compact Flash cards? There is the obvious power strain, but is that enough to rule it out? Why did Handspring use the same connector and almost the same form factor as CF, but it's not CF compatible? So far WindowsCE devices are the only ones that have Compact Flash slots, but perhapse thats because you need that extra 96 megs of ram for the MS-BLOTE factor. Anyway, there are lots of useful devices built on the CF platform. Why is MicroBorg the only one taking advantage of it? I for one could live with the tiny added weight and power drain of a CF card on a PalmV.
Take a look at the Qualcomm PdQ PDA... It's a cell phone, pager and Pilot all in one.
But I agree with your statement. Integrated functionality, and modular items, are sorely needed. Hopefully this new Handspring Visor - with it's expansion slot - will spurr the other vendors to get on the bandwagon.
Of course we will see a bunch of competing standards until either a de facto standard is chosen for technological superiority, or more likely a consortium forms, and royalties are paid.
In any case, in about three years, there's sure to be a PDA bus standard, for which expansion modules, port duplicators and such are available. Hopefully the modules will be intelligently enough designed that their functionality will be software definable - so the MP3 player will be able to do multi-duty as a voice recorder & speach-to-text convertor etc...
This way we'll be able to buy the hardware option that matches all the software options we are interested in (storage, special purpose processing, DSP, opticals, audio I/O...). That Transmeta chip might be in for a broader market then they realize.:)
--
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
Slashdot Mirror
Palm entry is fairly easy, I'll be honest. You can (as has already been said) use "Graffiti" (the palm's own text entry system), the onscreen keyboard, or the gotype! or a twiddler. Of these, the easiest are graffiti and the gotype.
Some people think graffiti is "like shorthand", but really, it's very much like regular print handwriting. The odd ones are A, F, K, Q, T, and V. An A is the same as a capital A minus the cross stroke, so it looks like an upside down v. F is an F minus the middle line, K is like the two diagonal lines of the k connected by a loop, Q is like an O with a little line at the top, and V is a U with a line extending to the right (or a backwards U)
Once you learn these graffiti is very fast, often faster than regular handwriting. The gotype is also very nice, since it almost feels like a regular keyboard, but is very thin, has low power consumption, and is nice and handy with quick, customizable access buttons to the major palm apps.
I can write at about 25wpm using graffiti, which is pretty good for handwriting (it's a bit faster than my normal handwriting) and it's MUCH neater since it outputs typed text. On the gotype I can type about 60wpm, compared to 90 on a regular keyboard, but I think 60 is about the limit for the gotype, and I doubt it'll slow down anyone at 60wpm or under.
All in all, text entry is quite easy on the palm devices.. I love my Palm V8!
-efisher
---
this
The problem I see with traditional programmable remote controls is that they attempt to conform all the funtionality of many remotes into a bunch
of buttons. You have to remember that when the remote is in stereo mode, the channel buttons actually control the track number, or that when in TV mode, the fast forward controls the contrast. This "moded method" of control is nonintuitive.
Thinking about it, something like the Palm Pilots would probably be idea. They have infra-red, and you could have a meta-menu on screen from which
you could chose which device to control, and sub-menus which are graphical representations of each device's remote. They wouldn't have to look like the true remote, just have clearly understandable functionality.
Chris
Alright, so the Palm stuff is really looking good.
/. then is this: What's there to be done with old PDA's?? They're still functional, they're still potent hardware. The Nino has a 75Mhz chip in it. Can I plug it into my fuse box and have it serve as a power consumption controller?? Obviously, I'm being facetious, but I'd like to dedicate the PDA to a task rather than just pitch it off a bridge - it's a matter of principle - I don't like to throw things out.
The Visor is promising, and the PdQ phone is a great hybrid...
The WinCE machines are surging over the retail counters.
Some time ago (a year or so) I bought the Philips Nino... It's a neat little device, and the virtual recognition area really appeals to me. But I think I would like to jump ship to the PalmV or Visor. I hate to just throw the Nino away, and it's not worth half of what I paid for it.
My question to
What have those of you who didn't throw out or retire the old PDA done with them? Are they of any use? Can my Nino run Linux (and hence be a web server) ? Can I wire it to my car, and have it at least show me what it's computer is thinking - i.e. diagnostics, efficiency, etc??
I'd be much more willing to buy a new one if I didn't feel the old one was going to go to waste.
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
> They include the GoType keyboard, wireless modems, voice recorders, vibrating modules, extended IR transmitters (longer range than the dinky port on top), and even thermometers.
All of a sudden those pilot ads with the naked woman and her pilot make a certain amount of sense...
I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
Ummm... *all* pocket/palm computers already use variable clock rates. The clock rate drops to almost zero whenever the CPU isn't doing anything special. Then when the CPU does something, it runs at max speed so that the user doesn't have to wait. It's pretty much useless to use a clock rate below maximum.
--Bud
If you think THAT'S bad, talk to Honda about their special edition SUV in Japan, the Honda CRV-EX. (Cervix?)
:)
I find it even funnier, personally, that the new German sportscar from Audi is called the Audi TT.
How many American CPAs are going to buy a car called the AUDITT?
-RT
SlashSigTheorem: Humorous, Political, Critical, Constructive- If you have a
Actually Psion's 5 & 7 range both support CF disks. Psion uses their own OS, called EPOC, and this OS is supported by most of the mobile phone manufacturers through an aliance called Symbian
I guess I have two points to make. One is that I also own a Philips Velo 1 (one of the first CE machines), and my roomate is on his second Casiopiea (first one was stolen, and was the E-10. The new one is an E-100; color version). While I dislike the CE operating system for numerous reasons (real reasons), I do find one thing pretty cool: you can load an MP3 on it, plug headphones in, and listen away. Pilot has no such ability. Yes, I own a RIO, but that's not the point.
The second point I want to make is that recently I have also had an opportunity to play with a new type of PDA; the Motorola StarTac add-on organizer. One of the big complaints of some of my coworkers is that they have to carry around their pager, cell phone, pilot, etc. With the StarTac add-on, they can merge the pilot and cell phone into one device. The limitation is that there is no PocketChess on the train ride home nor can you really do much else other than the standard apps, but for most people, the Schedule, Contacts and ToDo list are all that matter. Additional bonus is that you can use the synchronized contact list to dial the cell phone.
Currently I carry around a pager, Nokia 6120 cell phone, Palm III and the occasional Rio. Now wouldn't it be nice if some of those could merge together? At the least, I'd like it if I could make my cell phone and pilot synchronize their contact lists. I've heard that there is something sort-of out there that lets you do that, but the cable appears to cost as much as a pilot.
Nice improvement on the Vx, but some other features might be nice.
--
Never hit your grandmother with a shovel, for it leaves a bad impression on her mind...
--
If I had to create a wishlist for the next Palm, it would be: Unbreakable (titanium case and some kind of bulletproof screen), more memory (around 8-10 mb would be fine), waterproof (I don't want to have to worry about it getting damaged), and I want it to be equipped with the ability to receive content via RF (such as the continually updated slashdot content or the NY times on the web (two sites which constitute 70% of my web browsing))).
I don't think that we should worry about being able to send anything with it yet, mostly because it isn't a great text-input device...
I do, however, want it to double as a hammer, crowbar or frizbee... or at least I'd like to be able to sit on it or throw it in my bag without worrying about it breaking.
Everyone remember the ITSY? It's a handheld computer prototype with a 200 MHz StrongARM CPU that had active down-clocking software to save battery life. I runs Linux too. It's not being mass-produced, however.
:-)
Well, what I want to know is, why doesn't anyone else use a "variable-speed" CPU so that you can run your CPU intensive apps with decent performance, but still get good battery life when running PDA apps?
Imagine EPOCH32 or PalmOS running on one of those... WinCE could use it too I suppose, though you'd have to run at the fastest CPU speed most of the time anyway, so why bother?
Anyway, adding the above CPU and a color 320x320 resolution screen to the Palm (thus allowing the old 160x160 apps to run) would make it a tough act to follow.
Is there a reason why it can't be done with the Palm?
What I'd suggest is a dual mode device as a better compromise. What I'd like is a pair of devices that maintain all of the functionality of both a Palm V and a cell phone, while allowing the two to be combined at will to allow for wireless Net access. Simply put, sometimes I just need the capabilities of a cell phone, sometimes I just need the capabilities of an organizer, and sometimes I'd like quick e-mail access through a Palm device. But I generally don't need one device that can do all of these things at once. Plus, if the devices can be decoupled, then one piece can go in one pocket, the other can go in another pocket, which I think is better than one bulky device that won't fit in ANY pocket. Also, this may allow a person to separate the providers of various services. My understanding is that with the Palm IIIx, you're kind of limited in the ways that you can access the wireless Net. Why not leave that up to a dedicated third party telecom company, and allow people some choice in the matter?
As a further extension, I would like to see a device like this in a form that one could strap around one's wrist as a replacement for the wristwatch. Kind of like the doohickey that appears in Reboot and its cousin in Futurama. If you keep the telecom and messaging device funcions in separate devices, then perhaps you end up with the best of all possible worlds. A complex of devices that could be attached to the "top" and "bottom" of a wrist mount (to keep it from being too bulky on one side of your arm) or that could be combined in a handheld configuration, or ultimately used in separate handheld configurations.
What the Palm Pilot component of this system needs is a lot more memory, for which I would be willing to trade a little bit of size considerations. With more memory and a headphone jack, the Palm has the potential for MP3 play without memory add-in cards, and also to store electronic books for reading on planes, bus stops, etc, etc. (for the e-book function, I can see a need for a slightly better screen - however, it is not inconceivable even now). Plus, the addition of a headphone jack introduces the interesting possibility of adding a small microphone to the headset and allowing one to use this in place of the speaker/microphone incorporated into the cell phone unit (assuming that the cell phone has been attached to the Pilot unit, which has the headphone jack). Why would this be a good thing? Well, I'd love this capability in a wrist-mounted configuration, simply because it separates the cell phone's transmitter and its questionable brain cancer risk from the side of my head and moves it to my wrist, which has minimal delicate tissues, and can be held away from the body if one is really paranoid. Or, put a tiny CCD camera in the Pilot unit, and you could hold the combined Pilot/cell phone in front of you to acquire the occasional still snap while the headset/microphone picks up your voice.
I think that this configuration of devices would allow for maximum functionality as well as maximum degrees of freedom for the use of these functions. The only thing I'd add is that I'd like to see a standard interface line to the Palm Pilot and other handhelds pop up everywhere. Hanging from every pay phone, bank machine, restaurant table, etc., allowing me to carry my information with me in my Pilot and using its interface wherever I go.
Anyway, just a few random thoughts.
--
You have basicly three options for text input. First is handwriting recognition, sorta. It's called "graffiti". To save processor power and increse acuracy you write differently (an a is an upside down v like /\. it sounds odd and some don't like it but I can write with it almost as fast as I can write with a pen on that flat white stuff.
The second is an onscreen keybord. That sucks.
The third is an external addon (70USD?) keybord that is about twice the size of the palm. I havn't used one but there was a favorable review of it on ugeek.com
IMHO all of these beat the rest of the PDAs (winces have tiny keybords or none at all and/or they have onscrene keybords/handwriting...
--Ben
On a related note; why haven't Palm or especially Handspring come out with support for Compact Flash cards? There is the obvious power strain, but is that enough to rule it out? Why did Handspring use the same connector and almost the same form factor as CF, but it's not CF compatible? So far WindowsCE devices are the only ones that have Compact Flash slots, but perhapse thats because you need that extra 96 megs of ram for the MS-BLOTE factor. Anyway, there are lots of useful devices built on the CF platform. Why is MicroBorg the only one taking advantage of it? I for one could live with the tiny added weight and power drain of a CF card on a PalmV.
Take a look at the Qualcomm PdQ PDA... It's a cell phone, pager and Pilot all in one.
:)
But I agree with your statement. Integrated functionality, and modular items, are sorely needed. Hopefully this new Handspring Visor - with it's expansion slot - will spurr the other vendors to get on the bandwagon.
Of course we will see a bunch of competing standards until either a de facto standard is chosen for technological superiority, or more likely a consortium forms, and royalties are paid.
In any case, in about three years, there's sure to be a PDA bus standard, for which expansion modules, port duplicators and such are available. Hopefully the modules will be intelligently enough designed that their functionality will be software definable - so the MP3 player will be able to do multi-duty as a voice recorder & speach-to-text convertor etc...
This way we'll be able to buy the hardware option that matches all the software options we are interested in (storage, special purpose processing, DSP, opticals, audio I/O...). That Transmeta chip might be in for a broader market then they realize.
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.