> I do not believe that is it a constitutionally protected right to make money regardless of the nature of your industry.
No, it is not. But it is a right to TRY to make money regardless of the nature of the industry, so long as it does not break any laws. But, of course, that's what a business is.
> I don't see how this law is suddenly so much worse than say, a law that prevents selling microwaves that explode one time in 10.
Then you don't see a difference between a law that allows you to listen to music where you want (when you already could listen to it somehow) and a law that prevents 10 million people from dieing in preventable "accidents?" Excuse me, but that's pretty ignorant.
Deciding how your product is used does not infringe on fair use, as long as you don't threaten legal action for using it in a way not intended (prescription medications are an obvious exception). As for usurious contract, I have no idea what you are trying to claim, it doesn't really make sense in this context.
Can you expound on which business legislation you are referring to? (as you say, the US equivalent of Trade Descriptions Act). Health and Safety legislation do not enter into this at all, I don't understand why you brought it up.
It seems that you are taking a perfectly valid question about this particular issue and blowing it up into a general question about businesses instead of answering it for the one business we ARE talking about.
> they are as horrified as I am when I see an American behaving rudely towards someone from another country.
As rudely as Americans are treated you mean? I, personally, have never been to Europe (not for lack of desire, but money), although I know a few friends who have. Most of them have said it was a great place, except that they were treated horribly by a small percentage of the populace, just because they were American. It's not just a U.S. problem, it is a human problem, with everyone guilty of generalizing, regardless what side of the planet they live on.
But don't the people who run & manage those corporations have the right, in concert, to offer a product they want? With the features they desire? This, of course, disregards monopolies & cartels, but as a general rule, isn't this the case?
> Gosh, they called my office about two months ago and said they were pulling our T1s and IPs
Two months ago? Hell, our (my previous employer, actually) service was ended Dec 1, 2002. I had to move our little ISP to an entirely different place -- I never realized how much it sucked until I had to make sure 50+ domains all worked right on 1 IP, then 2 IPs at the same time, then just the other IP, never losing any traffic... bleargh
> I was never good at math, but I managed to get an "A" in Calculus I and a "B" in Calculus II,
I hate you. I was never a good student, but I got A's in all of my math classes until Calculus. I failed it twice. It is so horribly different than any other math class that it barely deserves to be in the same category. I classify it as "Big fucking waste of time," 'cuz when I finally got a C in the class I knew very little more about it than when I entered it. This was also from two different professors, both of whom were considered very good. I'll also point out that Pre-"calculus," isn't. How can a class justifiably be called Precalculus when it has 0 to do with Calculus except that it is in the same broad category (math)?
> what are the purposes of algebra, trigonometry, and calculus?
To get a college degree. I use algebra pretty regularly, but not trig or calc. ever. They are pretty much useless, unless your job is in math of some kind.
> Seems to me like stronger foundations are needed here...
I see the exact opposite. It seems to me that they are putting too much emphasis on things that are useless, just so they can say "100% of our graduates have passed Differential Equations." I was required to take Calc II to graduate, although I will never, ever, EVER, use anything from even Calc I. I think we need a stronger foundation in learning how to learn, and not just adding more useless information to confuse us. We're successfully creating smarter morons every year.
> Sounds to me like you're afraid to think, afraid of head-on confrontation with perspectives that differ from your own.
Sounds to me like the ones who won't think are the ones dressing propaganda up as the truth. Seriously, if I am going to college to learn facts, I don't want some asshole telling me my political beliefs. They should have no bearing and should not even be brought up unless in the proper context of a course (ie, History, Poli Sci).
> There's no better way to figure out what you really believe than by being surrounded by people you think are wrong
That's why I post to slashdot, not why I spend $18,000 a year to go to school.
> Just because you can read doesn't mean you can understand everything you have read. [...] if you think otherwise you are either a genius or full of shit.
I don't think it takes a genius at all, I think it just takes the right resources. Sometimes those resources are professors & teachers. I wouldn't consider myself anywhere near genius; hell, I don't even think I'm particularly smart, but I am confident that I can understand just about any topic (barring religion & some philosophy) given the proper information.
OTOH, you are sort-of correct, because the professors/teachers are the ones who already have the proper information & (hopefully) know how to present it in a manner that conveys the correct meaning, but that does not make them necessary.
> The DMCA's involvement was keeping the ISP from getting in trouble for breaking the hosting contract or for any other reason.
I think you are right. I think the company may have been doing a sort-of "Good Thing" by invoking DMCA, because they are protecting the ISP from any damages. Of course, this being a good thing depends on them not using it much further than that, which is probably not the case.
> Would we like the Musicians [...] to stop by our home and "download" copies of the original furniture
Sure, if they want to, they can make copies of my furniture. What the hell do I care if they want to decorate their house the same way mine is? Since they are only copying the furniture & not taking it with them, no problem.
> if the product is too expensive for you, it doesn't justify stealing it. Theft is theft.
Well, it's a damn good thing he didn't steal it (or "thieve it") then, or else someone else wouldn't have been able to buy it!
> I love when people try to justify their criminal activity with excuses like you give
But even giving in to the fallacy of reproducing being "theft," I justify my (questionably) criminal activity by the fact that I don't feel guilty about it. I'm no Jesus, but I have morals, and copying a piece of software, in the grand scheme of things, is about as harmful as killing a rat. Some people wouldn't do it, but I consider it insignificant. (No, I don't kill very many rats -- without a good reason.)
> In an actual free market I'd be able to program in a 'white list' of numbers and automatically reject all other calls
I still claim it's a free market -- all you have to do is set up your PC (running Linux, of course;) at the incoming point of your phone line and, using caller ID, pick up the line & hang up if it's not on your PC 'white list.' Problem solved, free market reintroduced.
> I don't pay $35 a month for phone service so I can have a way for people to spam me acoustically. I don't pay $60 for net service so I can get even MORE advertisements for penis enlarging... I don't pay $40 a month to Comcast to see advertisements on my Television! Oh, wait, I do.
I totally agree with your feeling, but your reasoning needs a little work.
> Why the hell would you need a Bachelor's degree to work a helpdesk job in the first place?
Umm, because very few will hire you without one. Please note, I don't mean scripted phone support. I'm talking about a small business that has 1-3 people doing all computer-related tasks for the entire company.
Slashdot Mirror
> I do not believe that is it a constitutionally protected right to make money regardless of the nature of your industry.
No, it is not. But it is a right to TRY to make money regardless of the nature of the industry, so long as it does not break any laws. But, of course, that's what a business is.
> I don't see how this law is suddenly so much worse than say, a law that prevents selling microwaves that explode one time in 10.
Then you don't see a difference between a law that allows you to listen to music where you want (when you already could listen to it somehow) and a law that prevents 10 million people from dieing in preventable "accidents?" Excuse me, but that's pretty ignorant.
Deciding how your product is used does not infringe on fair use, as long as you don't threaten legal action for using it in a way not intended (prescription medications are an obvious exception). As for usurious contract, I have no idea what you are trying to claim, it doesn't really make sense in this context.
Can you expound on which business legislation you are referring to? (as you say, the US equivalent of Trade Descriptions Act). Health and Safety legislation do not enter into this at all, I don't understand why you brought it up.
It seems that you are taking a perfectly valid question about this particular issue and blowing it up into a general question about businesses instead of answering it for the one business we ARE talking about.
> they are as horrified as I am when I see an American behaving rudely towards someone from another country.
As rudely as Americans are treated you mean? I, personally, have never been to Europe (not for lack of desire, but money), although I know a few friends who have. Most of them have said it was a great place, except that they were treated horribly by a small percentage of the populace, just because they were American. It's not just a U.S. problem, it is a human problem, with everyone guilty of generalizing, regardless what side of the planet they live on.
> Corporations don't have rights, people do
But don't the people who run & manage those corporations have the right, in concert, to offer a product they want? With the features they desire? This, of course, disregards monopolies & cartels, but as a general rule, isn't this the case?
> Gosh, they called my office about two months ago and said they were pulling our T1s and IPs
Two months ago? Hell, our (my previous employer, actually) service was ended Dec 1, 2002. I had to move our little ISP to an entirely different place -- I never realized how much it sucked until I had to make sure 50+ domains all worked right on 1 IP, then 2 IPs at the same time, then just the other IP, never losing any traffic... bleargh
> I was never good at math, but I managed to get an "A" in Calculus I and a "B" in Calculus II,
I hate you. I was never a good student, but I got A's in all of my math classes until Calculus. I failed it twice. It is so horribly different than any other math class that it barely deserves to be in the same category. I classify it as "Big fucking waste of time," 'cuz when I finally got a C in the class I knew very little more about it than when I entered it. This was also from two different professors, both of whom were considered very good. I'll also point out that Pre-"calculus," isn't.
How can a class justifiably be called Precalculus when it has 0 to do with Calculus except that it is in the same broad category (math)?
> what are the purposes of algebra, trigonometry, and calculus?
To get a college degree. I use algebra pretty regularly, but not trig or calc. ever. They are pretty much useless, unless your job is in math of some kind.
> Seems to me like stronger foundations are needed here...
I see the exact opposite. It seems to me that they are putting too much emphasis on things that are useless, just so they can say "100% of our graduates have passed Differential Equations." I was required to take Calc II to graduate, although I will never, ever, EVER, use anything from even Calc I. I think we need a stronger foundation in learning how to learn, and not just adding more useless information to confuse us. We're successfully creating smarter morons every year.
> Is there a CVS like system for notes/messages/babbling/drooling?
I'm ashamed to admit it, but I've never used CVS, but I think what you are looking for is Lotus Notes possibly.
> Sounds to me like you're afraid to think, afraid of head-on confrontation with perspectives that differ from your own.
Sounds to me like the ones who won't think are the ones dressing propaganda up as the truth. Seriously, if I am going to college to learn facts, I don't want some asshole telling me my political beliefs. They should have no bearing and should not even be brought up unless in the proper context of a course (ie, History, Poli Sci).
> There's no better way to figure out what you really believe than by being surrounded by people you think are wrong
That's why I post to slashdot, not why I spend $18,000 a year to go to school.
> Just because you can read doesn't mean you can understand everything you have read. [...] if you think otherwise you are either a genius or full of shit.
I don't think it takes a genius at all, I think it just takes the right resources. Sometimes those resources are professors & teachers. I wouldn't consider myself anywhere near genius; hell, I don't even think I'm particularly smart, but I am confident that I can understand just about any topic (barring religion & some philosophy) given the proper information.
OTOH, you are sort-of correct, because the professors/teachers are the ones who already have the proper information & (hopefully) know how to present it in a manner that conveys the correct meaning, but that does not make them necessary.
> That sounds really bleak. Where did you sleep?
On the controller, duh! It's more comfortable than some hotel beds I've slept in...
> when the real-life Prometheus first plucked a blazing brand
erm, I doubt Prometheus ever really lived... It's a story, man.
> Doesn't sound like a good way to protect the ISP at all to me.
:)
You are absolutely right, I didn't think that through enough. I was just trying to find some way not to call them stupid. Guess I failed
Previous post, -1 blamebait
This post, -1 flamebite
> Heck, then again, the way the US is going they will probably be branding "liberals" (with a branding iron) any day now.
About time, lord knows the Conservatives have been branded by the Liberals as anything but human.
> The DMCA's involvement was keeping the ISP from getting in trouble for breaking the hosting contract or for any other reason.
I think you are right. I think the company may have been doing a sort-of "Good Thing" by invoking DMCA, because they are protecting the ISP from any damages. Of course, this being a good thing depends on them not using it much further than that, which is probably not the case.
> Would we like the Musicians [...] to stop by our home and "download" copies of the original furniture
Sure, if they want to, they can make copies of my furniture. What the hell do I care if they want to decorate their house the same way mine is? Since they are only copying the furniture & not taking it with them, no problem.
> if the product is too expensive for you, it doesn't justify stealing it. Theft is theft.
Well, it's a damn good thing he didn't steal it (or "thieve it") then, or else someone else wouldn't have been able to buy it!
> I love when people try to justify their criminal activity with excuses like you give
But even giving in to the fallacy of reproducing being "theft," I justify my (questionably) criminal activity by the fact that I don't feel guilty about it. I'm no Jesus, but I have morals, and copying a piece of software, in the grand scheme of things, is about as harmful as killing a rat. Some people wouldn't do it, but I consider it insignificant. (No, I don't kill very many rats -- without a good reason.)
> Who actually believes that some football player just happens to have a full length black hooded robe and 6' sword handy?
Who believes some weak, pasty, geek would have a 6' sword and a black robe? I personally know a few, and Jock & Geek aren't mutually exclusive.
Plus, when you have a few thousand people posting, you'll find some personal stories that not everyone will see in their lifetime.
> In an actual free market I'd be able to program in a 'white list' of numbers and automatically reject all other calls
;) at the incoming point of your phone line and, using caller ID, pick up the line & hang up if it's not on your PC 'white list.' Problem solved, free market reintroduced.
I still claim it's a free market -- all you have to do is set up your PC (running Linux, of course
> I don't pay $35 a month for phone service so I can have a way for people to spam me acoustically. I don't pay $60 for net service so I can get even MORE advertisements for penis enlarging ... I don't pay $40 a month to Comcast to see advertisements on my Television! Oh, wait, I do.
I totally agree with your feeling, but your reasoning needs a little work.
> cause their Exchange servers to crash.
You don't need to pray for that to happen, just wait a few days.
> Price wars do not affect gasoline taxes.
No, but they affect gasoline prices, which is what was being said.
Hey, I like +1 mods as much as the next guy, but my post was definitely not insightful...
> Why the hell would you need a Bachelor's degree to work a helpdesk job in the first place?
Umm, because very few will hire you without one. Please note, I don't mean scripted phone support. I'm talking about a small business that has 1-3 people doing all computer-related tasks for the entire company.
> So Maple/Mathematica or Matlab if youare engineering.
Also known as, "If you are friggin' rich." How much does Mathematica cost these days? $1500 yet? more?