One of them one was Loooooonnnnneeeey Tunes. Actually believed all that Mormon crap, which gives ol' Hubbard a run for his money in the Sci-Fi department. One of them was against women's rights, and wanted laws based solely on religion, and most cases, moral relativism.
This close to 2012 and the possible end of the world? Yeah, I really don't think I want a religious extremist in the White House. No thank you.
Other than that, your observation is spot-on. We are still getting fucked, but by somebody that might not kill us afterwards because of the people in the sky telling him strange shit that a con man came up with.
Do you blame a 3 year old for dropping food on the floor and not cleaning it up right away? Of course not.
I have a hard time blaming most people, because they lack the requisite sophistication to understand Apple products are highly detrimental to them in the long term.
They don't even understand enough about it to make philosophical or sociopolitical arguments about the pitfalls of such control, DRM, anonymity, privacy, etc.
That world with disappearing freedoms. All of that convenience you have obtained was paid for in your freedom, and the freedom of the next generation.
If you have been programming since 1979, you should realize that people have a poor understanding of what cyberspace is, and how progressively, it affects us more and more in real life, and soon freedom in cyberspace will be indistinguishable from freedom in real life.
People will understand that far too late. They would never, ever, allow government or corporations to tell them what groceries they can buy, or what food they can cook in their kitchen, or what clothes they can wear, or what colors they can paint their bathroom walls.
Telling them what to do on a device, and in cyberspace, is proving to be so much easier though isn't it?
Old people like you rolling over and just letting it happen, and even worse, championing it, is an anathemato me. Sorry, but you should know better. A 19 year kid I can understand, but man that has been programming since 1979? Come on Pete. You have to do better than touting how shiny and nice the cage is.
It's the one thing I truly love about Linux more than anything else. I can download the entire source for something like Asterisk, make changes (database field names that store passwords, etc.), and compile the program and run it.
Nothing comes close to that feeling of freedom in computing.
What it's absolutely incompatible with is my wallet.
This shit is hilarious. People put up with the XBOX360 to play games. The moment scenes like this play out, people will just stop using it and go elsewhere. Laptop and Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, Piracy, whatever...
These people that are coming up with shit like this are insane. Even the most unsophisticated consumer sheep is going to lose it the day playback stops because their friend walked in.
I never said the US was not part of the problem, or that it is attempting to export its extreme copyright protectionist policies.
Keep telling yourselves that the US is where it all comes from though. Purely? That's a load of crap.
A lot of the scariest ideas coming down the pipeline are from the UK and Australia when it comes to surveillance and Internet powers. Not all of that is being justified by copyright either, which your claim that is purely driven by the US.
ACTA was defeated in the US because enough people in the US stood up to it, not because it was also defeated in the EU.
It's a mistake to give the rest of the governments a pass as just being under the bad influence of the US. They have their own agendas when it comes to the Internet, and freedom, and not all of it is driven by copyrights at all. In fact, copyright most often is just another excuse, like think-of-the-children.
There are far too many articles about incidents in the EU regarding just about everything we are complaining about.
What about Canada? What about Australia?
The USA is not alone in this at all. The damage the Internet needs to route around is governments curtailing freedom, privacy, and anonymity, in the name of protecting these broken business models, while at the same time gaining the intelligence tools they claim will be used to protect us.
That's going to be quite problematic in practice with technology like TrueCrypt.
1) Outlawing crypto, or forcing the keys to be available is the clearest act of war against civilians by a government, and a perfectly just cause to rebel and overthrow the government. Anonymity, and the right to conduct private transactions and conversations was held to be sacrosanct the founding fathers in the US. They, more than anybody, understood the value, and how absolutely critical it was to prevent tyranny.
2) The operations can be divested from each other. Creating a crypto product that can manage data stores on service like Drop Box would create multiple companies, or a larger attack surface for law enforcement and the courts. Neither company would have the required information and access to data to comply with court requests, and neither company might be breaking the law either.
3) Technologies like TrueCrypt allow for the dissemination of a crypto key, while not disseminating the real data store. I've not heard of any real weaknesses yet, and complaining to the judge that the defendant did not comply because there was no incriminating evidence will not hold a lot of water either.
Pedophile enabler is the stupidest thing I've heard of yet when characterizing data storage services. That's like saying gun manufacturers are enablers of murders. No, it's worse. It's like saying construction crews that create roads are enablers of childhood obesity because ice cream trucks can use them.
The fact that politicians use such tactics is pathetic, and that some citizens fall for it, even more pathetic.
For the record, I would rather be enabling some pedophiles to transfer data around privately, than to give up all our freedom for some perceived gains in security for our children.
Sure, your child might have a %.000001 chance less of taking it up the ass by PedoBear, but they will have a dangerously high chance of growing up in a world where they can put in jail, or education camps, for dissenting speech.
The USA is not alone in this bullshit by any stretch. There are just as many problems in the EU right now. ALL governments right now are corrupt and owned by very powerful groups with intense interests in protecting the revenue from their copyrights.
Nobody wants to change, and there are a bunch of rent seeking sociopaths that are trying to kill freedom as quickly as possible, because it is the most direct route to having the control required to protect their business models and assets.
To say it is the USA only, gives a huge pass to those governments in the EU.
Is that pen really listed amongst the tools that could be used for counterfeiting currency? If so, is the claim that it is exclusively used for currency, not for use as a pen, really going to hold water?
All of these arguments are moot once the patent system moves to a first-to-file system.
Sure, all the arguments will go away as far as prior art is concerned, but then it will also become a system where the barrier to entry is so high to enter the markets that small startups and inventors will never get a fair shake anymore.
I would like to have seen those Apple guys try and get started in a market where IBM only had to file a patent on work to get it granted....
"It's so obvious to me that some aspects of society need to be to treated like critical infrastructure and all attempts must be made to remove corruption from it. Step one, is removing profit." -- Then stop accepting a paycheck for doing work. Just do nice things for everyone and hope everyone will do nice things for you and see how it works out.
That's not what I meant, and I think you know it.
Removing profit means making the whole enterprise a not-for-profit. You can still pay all involved with a fair wage, benefits, etc. Removing profit means that there are no shareholders that need to be satisfied with consistent growth and ROI.
What's so wrong with socialism? Why is it always an insult?
It's not like we ever had communism yet either. Every attempt at communism was just an elaborate tribute to Orwell's Animal Farm. It's not like capitalism is the clear winner, in terms of both economic and moral success.
Both are deeply flawed implementations of their ideologies where corruption and greed have perverted the movement towards the original positive ideas of freedom and equality (equality in the sense of human worth and opportunity, not material distribution).
It's so obvious to me that some aspects of society need to be to treated like critical infrastructure and all attempts must be made to remove corruption from it. Step one, is removing profit.
I've lived long enough to realize that we don't even have capitalism. That's a farce. Any attempts and pleas to even move towards fairness, sanity, social justice, or basically towards the center of capitalism is perceived as far left socialism. Which again, as an insult makes no sense.
Hmmm, what's that political term about windows? Oh yeah, Overton.
People are not looking at the bigger picture when they make their purchasing decisions for several reasons:
1) They don't understand what cyberspace *is* yet, how their actions, and others actions, can have real tangible effects on their "real" lives. 2) They have a poor understanding of privacy, anonymity, it's true value to all parties, and Game Theory. 3) Apathy. I'm too small to make any meaningful difference anyways, so I will just continue to act against my best interests in the long term for short term gains in transient happiness and feelings of security. 4) I'm too poor to shop at someplace else other than Walmart. I have to save my pennies, regardless of the fact that continuing to give money to businesses that outsource jobs, has real and tragic effects on all people back at home, which ultimately affects how many pennies I get paid in the first place. 5) It really is a pretty shiny.... 6) Huh? Watevs. I don't like peeps that use like big words and shit always thinking there better or something. I got swag, yolo muthafucka
The death of America, and Freedom, will be because of apathy and complacency. I've a hard time really blaming them either, since there is an awful lot to be cynical about. Only until this generation actually has to suffer, really suffer, for Freedom will they finally understand, revolt against our oppressors (peacefully I hope) and then allow future generations to make all the same mistakes all over again.
Did you see their response to the DMCA takedown request? The copyrighted data in question was removed from the site itself, and a long explanation, that wonderfully explained the DMCA, Scientology, its greatest and most vocal opponent on the Internet at the time, and how to fight against laws like this was put in its place.
The specific data, OT III, was made available in legal ways and even more attention was garnered than before. Streisand effect wonderfully executed.
I would agree with you if the comment was simply removed and/. acted like it never existed. Far from it...
No rage. Just a vast sea of disappointment and concern for our future.
I was not the one to come up with that analogy, nor did it come from a vacuum either. Jobs did not do great things for computing. Creating admittedly great devices is merely a distraction for the toxic environment he created where consumers do not own their own devices, decide what software and media is acceptable for the devices, and have freedom in general.
It's not like I would have to try very hard to get disappointment, frustration, and yes, rage from app developers and vendors that work with Apple either.
The app store is not a great idea, and it is a terrible execution of it for that matter. Creating a walled garden approach to computing is never a good idea. I might feel different about it if:
1) Any developer could submit any app, without restrictions, and receive a fair price. I won't argue about Apple's cut for this, which is way too high, either. 2) The consumer owned their own device and did not need to the endorsement of the Supreme Court to "jail break" their device to load software, and basically, enjoy what should be the basic fundamental rights of anybody in the computing "world".
An app store as a distribution model, great idea. An app store as a tool for totalitarian suppression of a population (mostly sheep), terrible idea that is a pox on society.
You can try to attribute hate and malice to my "rant", but how about coming up with good defenses of for the walled garden and lack of freedom?
Oh, and y'know... he's dead. Those wars are over, asshole.
Nooo.... no they're not. The wars he started are really just beginning.
Steve Jobs was truly an evil and despicable person in the world of computing. One of the first to even understand what cyberspace *was*, what it *could* become, and how to ultimately control it.
It was once explained this way, and still is my favorite analogy:
Steve Jobs saw computing as a wide open territory yet to be populated. He did not want to empower people with free movement, or any freedom in general, in this new "space". The way he saw computing was like trains instead of cars. He would build the trains, sell the trains, and by building and owning the tracks, "guide" people in this new "space". He would be the gatekeeper, the guide, the prophet, and all would experience his world, on his terms, and why not? He's a fucking genius right ?
To say that man is a toxic plague upon cyberspace is a vast understatement. Where are we now with the whole concept of the walled gardens? How many other companies are rushing in with greedy fervor to make money the same way? Microsoft... I'm looking at you with Windows 8 and the app store.....
Yes, he could see that people wanted easy to use, shiny, very shiny, devices that just worked. Why not do that and control their ability at the same time?
If somebody brings up his anti-DRM stance, just remember that he had the foresight to see there was no winning that war, and that by controlling the walled garden and giving very cheap payment options, he would make up the money in volume and hardware sales.
The wars, the wars against people and freedom, have only just begun. Thanks to Steve Jobs, the people have started out with a severe disadvantage and handicap.
Although, to be fair, he is not wholly responsible for the horrific state we are in. Zuckerburg has some responsibility too.
While/. removed the copyrighted material, what it replaced it with was a textbook example of the Streisand effect. Multiple links to the material and organizations that fought against the plaintiff.
Certainly not a victory for those who were seeking censorship in the first place.
Wow, the moment you call out some people as just being cheap and lazy when they infringe copyright... people jump to the conclusion that you must support old business models and toxic laws to support them:)
I don't support "piracy" because we have to figure out some way to motivate the content creators to continue to contribute to the Public Domain (which is what you meant to say).
I support copyrights, in theory, because they allow a temporary set of legal entitlements over some works, separating them from the Public Domain (temporarily), with the end goal of nourishing the Public Domain even further.
I don't support the draconian enforcement laws and perversion of copyrights because they are an extreme danger to freedoms, a functional and fair economy, and represent a slippery slope to actual intellectual property. The very idea of owning an idea, or expression, is abhorrent.
None of my positions actually contradict each other at all, and much like politics, it seems you just can't talk rationally about it sometimes.
Slashdot Mirror
Oh yeah..... there was a big fucking difference.
One of them one was Loooooonnnnneeeey Tunes. Actually believed all that Mormon crap, which gives ol' Hubbard a run for his money in the Sci-Fi department.
One of them was against women's rights, and wanted laws based solely on religion, and most cases, moral relativism.
This close to 2012 and the possible end of the world? Yeah, I really don't think I want a religious extremist in the White House. No thank you.
Other than that, your observation is spot-on. We are still getting fucked, but by somebody that might not kill us afterwards because of the people in the sky telling him strange shit that a con man came up with.
You should clarify that he should only sell if the deal is an equitable one for all parties, or at least in his favor.
Plenty of people have got screwed that way when they sold low and too early.
Even after rooting your phone, eliminating all that crapware is non-trivial.
Quite a bit of instructions and know-how to just to eliminate an app that seems to be more protected than the Pentagon.
Do you blame a 3 year old for dropping food on the floor and not cleaning it up right away? Of course not.
I have a hard time blaming most people, because they lack the requisite sophistication to understand Apple products are highly detrimental to them in the long term.
They don't even understand enough about it to make philosophical or sociopolitical arguments about the pitfalls of such control, DRM, anonymity, privacy, etc.
That includes most developers as well...
Well Pete, enjoy your world while you have it.
That world with disappearing freedoms. All of that convenience you have obtained was paid for in your freedom, and the freedom of the next generation.
If you have been programming since 1979, you should realize that people have a poor understanding of what cyberspace is, and how progressively, it affects us more and more in real life, and soon freedom in cyberspace will be indistinguishable from freedom in real life.
People will understand that far too late. They would never, ever, allow government or corporations to tell them what groceries they can buy, or what food they can cook in their kitchen, or what clothes they can wear, or what colors they can paint their bathroom walls.
Telling them what to do on a device, and in cyberspace, is proving to be so much easier though isn't it?
Old people like you rolling over and just letting it happen, and even worse, championing it, is an anathemato me. Sorry, but you should know better. A 19 year kid I can understand, but man that has been programming since 1979? Come on Pete. You have to do better than touting how shiny and nice the cage is.
and..... is grampa wrong here?
We don't need to turn this into a war against Apple, but seriously, is he wrong?
Like?
It's the one thing I truly love about Linux more than anything else. I can download the entire source for something like Asterisk, make changes (database field names that store passwords, etc.), and compile the program and run it.
Nothing comes close to that feeling of freedom in computing.
What it's absolutely incompatible with is my wallet.
This shit is hilarious. People put up with the XBOX360 to play games. The moment scenes like this play out, people will just stop using it and go elsewhere. Laptop and Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, Piracy, whatever...
These people that are coming up with shit like this are insane. Even the most unsophisticated consumer sheep is going to lose it the day playback stops because their friend walked in.
I never said the US was not part of the problem, or that it is attempting to export its extreme copyright protectionist policies.
Keep telling yourselves that the US is where it all comes from though. Purely? That's a load of crap.
A lot of the scariest ideas coming down the pipeline are from the UK and Australia when it comes to surveillance and Internet powers. Not all of that is being justified by copyright either, which your claim that is purely driven by the US.
ACTA was defeated in the US because enough people in the US stood up to it, not because it was also defeated in the EU.
It's a mistake to give the rest of the governments a pass as just being under the bad influence of the US. They have their own agendas when it comes to the Internet, and freedom, and not all of it is driven by copyrights at all. In fact, copyright most often is just another excuse, like think-of-the-children.
I have to disagree.
There are far too many articles about incidents in the EU regarding just about everything we are complaining about.
What about Canada? What about Australia?
The USA is not alone in this at all. The damage the Internet needs to route around is governments curtailing freedom, privacy, and anonymity, in the name of protecting these broken business models, while at the same time gaining the intelligence tools they claim will be used to protect us.
No it isn't.
The poster made the claim that the damage the Internet needs to route around is the USA.
That's clearly not true in all cases, and ignores quite a bit of legal cases and laws being proposed in the EU, Australia, etc.
That's going to be quite problematic in practice with technology like TrueCrypt.
1) Outlawing crypto, or forcing the keys to be available is the clearest act of war against civilians by a government, and a perfectly just cause to rebel and overthrow the government. Anonymity, and the right to conduct private transactions and conversations was held to be sacrosanct the founding fathers in the US. They, more than anybody, understood the value, and how absolutely critical it was to prevent tyranny.
2) The operations can be divested from each other. Creating a crypto product that can manage data stores on service like Drop Box would create multiple companies, or a larger attack surface for law enforcement and the courts. Neither company would have the required information and access to data to comply with court requests, and neither company might be breaking the law either.
3) Technologies like TrueCrypt allow for the dissemination of a crypto key, while not disseminating the real data store. I've not heard of any real weaknesses yet, and complaining to the judge that the defendant did not comply because there was no incriminating evidence will not hold a lot of water either.
Pedophile enabler is the stupidest thing I've heard of yet when characterizing data storage services. That's like saying gun manufacturers are enablers of murders. No, it's worse. It's like saying construction crews that create roads are enablers of childhood obesity because ice cream trucks can use them.
The fact that politicians use such tactics is pathetic, and that some citizens fall for it, even more pathetic.
For the record, I would rather be enabling some pedophiles to transfer data around privately, than to give up all our freedom for some perceived gains in security for our children.
Sure, your child might have a %.000001 chance less of taking it up the ass by PedoBear, but they will have a dangerously high chance of growing up in a world where they can put in jail, or education camps, for dissenting speech.
The problem is that the "damage" is the USA.
HARDLY
The USA is not alone in this bullshit by any stretch. There are just as many problems in the EU right now. ALL governments right now are corrupt and owned by very powerful groups with intense interests in protecting the revenue from their copyrights.
Nobody wants to change, and there are a bunch of rent seeking sociopaths that are trying to kill freedom as quickly as possible, because it is the most direct route to having the control required to protect their business models and assets.
To say it is the USA only, gives a huge pass to those governments in the EU.
The best come back ever came from this movie:
"Yes, it's true. This man has no dick" - Bill Murray.
I think you mean 18 USC Â 642.
Is that pen really listed amongst the tools that could be used for counterfeiting currency? If so, is the claim that it is exclusively used for currency, not for use as a pen, really going to hold water?
All of these arguments are moot once the patent system moves to a first-to-file system.
Sure, all the arguments will go away as far as prior art is concerned, but then it will also become a system where the barrier to entry is so high to enter the markets that small startups and inventors will never get a fair shake anymore.
I would like to have seen those Apple guys try and get started in a market where IBM only had to file a patent on work to get it granted....
"It's so obvious to me that some aspects of society need to be to treated like critical infrastructure and all attempts must be made to remove corruption from it. Step one, is removing profit." -- Then stop accepting a paycheck for doing work. Just do nice things for everyone and hope everyone will do nice things for you and see how it works out.
That's not what I meant, and I think you know it.
Removing profit means making the whole enterprise a not-for-profit. You can still pay all involved with a fair wage, benefits, etc. Removing profit means that there are no shareholders that need to be satisfied with consistent growth and ROI.
What's so wrong with socialism? Why is it always an insult?
It's not like we ever had communism yet either. Every attempt at communism was just an elaborate tribute to Orwell's Animal Farm. It's not like capitalism is the clear winner, in terms of both economic and moral success.
Both are deeply flawed implementations of their ideologies where corruption and greed have perverted the movement towards the original positive ideas of freedom and equality (equality in the sense of human worth and opportunity, not material distribution).
It's so obvious to me that some aspects of society need to be to treated like critical infrastructure and all attempts must be made to remove corruption from it. Step one, is removing profit.
I've lived long enough to realize that we don't even have capitalism. That's a farce. Any attempts and pleas to even move towards fairness, sanity, social justice, or basically towards the center of capitalism is perceived as far left socialism. Which again, as an insult makes no sense.
Hmmm, what's that political term about windows? Oh yeah, Overton.
He isn't wrong though.
People are not looking at the bigger picture when they make their purchasing decisions for several reasons:
1) They don't understand what cyberspace *is* yet, how their actions, and others actions, can have real tangible effects on their "real" lives.
2) They have a poor understanding of privacy, anonymity, it's true value to all parties, and Game Theory.
3) Apathy. I'm too small to make any meaningful difference anyways, so I will just continue to act against my best interests in the long term for short term gains in transient happiness and feelings of security.
4) I'm too poor to shop at someplace else other than Walmart. I have to save my pennies, regardless of the fact that continuing to give money to businesses that outsource jobs, has real and tragic effects on all people back at home, which ultimately affects how many pennies I get paid in the first place.
5) It really is a pretty shiny....
6) Huh? Watevs. I don't like peeps that use like big words and shit always thinking there better or something. I got swag, yolo muthafucka
The death of America, and Freedom, will be because of apathy and complacency. I've a hard time really blaming them either, since there is an awful lot to be cynical about. Only until this generation actually has to suffer, really suffer, for Freedom will they finally understand, revolt against our oppressors (peacefully I hope) and then allow future generations to make all the same mistakes all over again.
You're being pedantic.
Content was not removed. If you delete a file from a directory, and then place a symbolic link to the same file, is the data really gone?
Was it removed? NO.
Caved my ass.
Did you see their response to the DMCA takedown request? The copyrighted data in question was removed from the site itself, and a long explanation, that wonderfully explained the DMCA, Scientology, its greatest and most vocal opponent on the Internet at the time, and how to fight against laws like this was put in its place.
The specific data, OT III, was made available in legal ways and even more attention was garnered than before. Streisand effect wonderfully executed.
I would agree with you if the comment was simply removed and /. acted like it never existed. Far from it...
No rage. Just a vast sea of disappointment and concern for our future.
I was not the one to come up with that analogy, nor did it come from a vacuum either. Jobs did not do great things for computing. Creating admittedly great devices is merely a distraction for the toxic environment he created where consumers do not own their own devices, decide what software and media is acceptable for the devices, and have freedom in general.
It's not like I would have to try very hard to get disappointment, frustration, and yes, rage from app developers and vendors that work with Apple either.
The app store is not a great idea, and it is a terrible execution of it for that matter. Creating a walled garden approach to computing is never a good idea. I might feel different about it if:
1) Any developer could submit any app, without restrictions, and receive a fair price. I won't argue about Apple's cut for this, which is way too high, either.
2) The consumer owned their own device and did not need to the endorsement of the Supreme Court to "jail break" their device to load software, and basically, enjoy what should be the basic fundamental rights of anybody in the computing "world".
An app store as a distribution model, great idea. An app store as a tool for totalitarian suppression of a population (mostly sheep), terrible idea that is a pox on society.
You can try to attribute hate and malice to my "rant", but how about coming up with good defenses of for the walled garden and lack of freedom?
Oh, and y'know... he's dead. Those wars are over, asshole.
Nooo.... no they're not. The wars he started are really just beginning.
Steve Jobs was truly an evil and despicable person in the world of computing. One of the first to even understand what cyberspace *was*, what it *could* become, and how to ultimately control it.
It was once explained this way, and still is my favorite analogy:
Steve Jobs saw computing as a wide open territory yet to be populated. He did not want to empower people with free movement, or any freedom in general, in this new "space". The way he saw computing was like trains instead of cars. He would build the trains, sell the trains, and by building and owning the tracks, "guide" people in this new "space". He would be the gatekeeper, the guide, the prophet, and all would experience his world, on his terms, and why not? He's a fucking genius right ?
To say that man is a toxic plague upon cyberspace is a vast understatement. Where are we now with the whole concept of the walled gardens? How many other companies are rushing in with greedy fervor to make money the same way? Microsoft... I'm looking at you with Windows 8 and the app store.....
Yes, he could see that people wanted easy to use, shiny, very shiny, devices that just worked. Why not do that and control their ability at the same time?
If somebody brings up his anti-DRM stance, just remember that he had the foresight to see there was no winning that war, and that by controlling the walled garden and giving very cheap payment options, he would make up the money in volume and hardware sales.
The wars, the wars against people and freedom, have only just begun. Thanks to Steve Jobs, the people have started out with a severe disadvantage and handicap.
Although, to be fair, he is not wholly responsible for the horrific state we are in. Zuckerburg has some responsibility too.
That does not qualify.
While /. removed the copyrighted material, what it replaced it with was a textbook example of the Streisand effect. Multiple links to the material and organizations that fought against the plaintiff.
Certainly not a victory for those who were seeking censorship in the first place.
Wow, the moment you call out some people as just being cheap and lazy when they infringe copyright... people jump to the conclusion that you must support old business models and toxic laws to support them :)
I don't support "piracy" because we have to figure out some way to motivate the content creators to continue to contribute to the Public Domain (which is what you meant to say).
I support copyrights, in theory, because they allow a temporary set of legal entitlements over some works, separating them from the Public Domain (temporarily), with the end goal of nourishing the Public Domain even further.
I don't support the draconian enforcement laws and perversion of copyrights because they are an extreme danger to freedoms, a functional and fair economy, and represent a slippery slope to actual intellectual property. The very idea of owning an idea, or expression, is abhorrent.
None of my positions actually contradict each other at all, and much like politics, it seems you just can't talk rationally about it sometimes.