... and I see a way to make a little change to make it better, or fix a bug. Why should any employer/client worry about that?
Because it isn't your job.
You, sir, are a stupid asocial asshole.
Companies - like people - are supposed to behave in a positive fashion, be good neighbours and good citizens. So when you are a driver for your company, you are nontheless expected e.g. to help out when you see an accident on the wayside, or, more genereal, you are expected to contribute to the general well-being of the communities they live in.
The idea that ethics, decency, politeness and friendlyness just somehow magically don't apply when you are at work is one of the great sick misconceptions of our time.
So, if you can fix the bug with a reasonable effort, do and submit it. That's the expected behaviour - and good manners - in your trade.
Yes and no. An "Abmahnung" has a more formal meaning. It is only valid in certain legal areas, most notably the competition law, and the law specifies exactly who may issue an Abmahnung, and who can't (usually it is an affected competitor or certain qualified third parties , like consumer associations and the like).
Consequently, it also has more legal "power" than a simple cease and desist. For instance, you do not have the option to ignore such a thing - you must either accept it - and accede to its demands - or contest it in court. And if you accept it, you are required to pay the legal costs associated with it.
Of the western countries (excluding the US), France and Russia hold more Iraqi debt than all other countries combined.
Misleading nonsense. The major claimant is Kuwait, which demands horrendous sums for war reparations (and the US would indeed do good to learn and apply the lessons of Versailles here). If you calculate out the Kuwaiti and Saudi claims, the remaining debt becomes quite manageable.
ipfw is basically a basic packet filter with a few things bodged on top of it (variable expansion, keeping state, etc) (OK, that's a bit unfair, but it's what it *feels* like to use).
This is plain nonsense. Ipfw has all the bells and whistels you need, and quite some more. And, sorry, variable expansion under Unix is done in a shell or a macro preprocessor and not in the firewall control utility.
You (and maybe the pf author, too) apparently suffer from the Microsoft Word desease (Word calculates tables, Excel is a graphics Program and Powerpoint has a Wordprocessor funtion).
Under Unix a tool is supposed to do on e thing, and do it right. ipfw(8), that is, the control program, does this - it controls the filtering facility.
If you want more complex rule sets, write them in shell scripts (as I do), or have them preprocessed by cpp or m4 or whetever.
pf is a built-from-the-ground-up total firewall solution, with a hell of a lot of flexibility, and also several functions which will do in one line what it takes ipfw rather longer to do.
This may or may not be correct, but you totally failed to make that case.
I read through the pf man page and was astounded how good it was.
What an incredible bullshit.
The manpage you quote is documenting a programmer's interface with IOCTLs and c structs. It neither proveides a usefull overview of pf nor does it tell you how to build rules with it.
If you read that and found it better than FreeBSD's concise and well written ipfw(8) manpage you must have smoked some very heavy stuff.
In order to get pf's nice features into ipfilter, you would have brain-wash Darren Reed I guess.:-)
Why do you ignore ipfw here ?
ipfw is FreeBSD's very own and native packet filtering framework. It already has a number of those features ascribed to pf, and it works quite well with FreeBSD.
The very reason pf exists is that Theo and the Gang suffered from a mild rash of NIH when they needed packet filtering code after their run-in with the Ipf guy. Instead of just porting ipfw, they choose to do their own thing.
I agree with the original poster. FreeBSD needs another packet filtering system about as necessary as the proverbial fish needs that bicycle. If there is room for improvement (and there always is:-), improve ipfw !
Linus has a better understanding of technology and politics than either Schneier or you.
It is not my impression that you know who Bruce Schneier is.
And I furthermore think Linus wouldn't agree with you here.
Re:Props to Linus
on
Linus on DRM
·
· Score: 2, Informative
Linus is discussing the kernel not the OS. Linux is the kernel not the OS.
No. Linux discusses Politics here. Something his understanding of is obviously lacking.
Let me quote Bruce Schneier:
"... it is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-- Secrets & Lies: Digital Security in a Networked World, 2000
Oh, so you mean: "mp3's don't kill record companies, _people_ kill record companies";)
If only it were true.
Unfortunately, those coke-snorting record execs are hard to kill, apparently. To the very least, people are not fast enough killing record companies right now.
Article 6. The Tribunal established by the Agreement referred to in Article 1 hereof for the trial and punishment of the major war criminals [...] shall have the power to try and punish persons who, acting in the interests of [... their...]countries, whether as individuals or as members of organizations, committed any of the following crimes.
The following acts, or any of them, are crimes coming within the jurisdiction of the Tribunal for which there shall be individual responsibility:
(a) CRIMES AGAINST PEACE: namely, planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression, or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances, or participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the foregoing;
(b) WAR CRIMES: namely, violations of the laws or customs of war. Such violations shall include, but not be limited to, murder, ill-treatment or deportation to slave labor or for any other purpose of civilian population of or in occupied territory, murder or ill-treatment of prisoners of war or persons on the seas, killing of hostages, plunder of public or private property, wanton destruction of cities, towns or villages, or devastation not justified by military necessity;
(c)CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY: namely, murder, extermination, enslavement, deportation, and other inhumane acts committed against any civilian population, before or during the war; or persecutions on political, racial or religious grounds in execution of or in connection with any crime within the jurisdiction of the Tribunal, whether or not in violation of the domestic law of the country where perpetrated.
Leaders, organizers, instigators and accomplices participating in the formulation or execution of a common plan or conspiracy to commit any of the foregoing crimes are responsible for all acts performed by any persons in execution of such plan.
Article 7. The official position of defendants, whether as Heads of State or responsible officials in Government Departments, shall not be considered as freeing them from responsibility or mitigating punishment.
Yep. And the cost of doing business is passed on to the customer. That's the way business works.
FWIW, from an economic point of view, this entirely makes sence. Cost structure on a service resembling the actual costs leads to more economic behaviour by all involved parties and thus to more overall efficience - i.e. lower prices and/or better quality.
If they want me to pay them every month, they need to absorb those costs.
That's not what you are asking for. You want DT to pass the cost of your frequent product changes to those customers who don't change their products all the time. As one of those customers, I pointedly protest - I don't plan to subsidize your habit of changing your mind every few weeks, thank you for asking.
No, I would be surprised. That would mean the French hand't already surrendered!
Oh well. You're confusing a keen sense for their own interests with cowardice.
For most of Europe's younger history, Germany and France had been at war with each other, one way or the other, and until more recently we hadn't much good to say of each other, too. A little more than 50 years ago, France was colloquially considered the "Erbfeind" (sort of "enemy by heritage") by many people. But though we ferquenmtyl spoke bad of each other, hardly a man would call the French cowarce. People knew better.
Now if you'd talk about that nation of heroes Signore Berlusconi reigns (did you hear the story about their new war flag design ? A white eagle on white background...) I might feel a certain sympathy, but confusing the French reluctance to do Mr Bushs bidding with cowardice is plain stupidity.
There are internet cafes. They are not as many as you encounter in some other parts of the world, but in most cities you find a few. Even in Postdam there should be some survivors, even though some Berlin local buerocrats currently do all they can to eradicate internet cafes completely.
Back then, the newsgroup soc.c ulture.german had quite a few FAQs and reference web sites for this topic.
No idea if this group is still there, or if the group by now has drowned in those vitriolic diatribes of American Nazis, Palestinian antisemites, and the various other hatemongers of numerous causes, who all apparently wake up every morning with the firm knowledge that Usenet was exclusively made to distribute their particular drivel.
Nonsense. Thios isn't exactly Pakistan or Iraq you are talking about.
The only real complaint I've heard from Americans living in Germany right now is that they rarely escape a party without debating US foreign policy (regardless of their stance on it) - and that's pretty annoying. I'm afraid, though, that's the kind of annoyance you were in for when you ordered governement services from a certain GW Bush some two years ago. I'd suggets you rethink that particular subscription when it comes up for renewal in a year or two, but OTOH as with all subscription services, the alternatives usually suck almost as bad as the one you have:-)
Sorry, this is technically not true. If you are an Arcor "native" customer (i.e. not Telekom+preselection, but Arcor ISDN) they will happily sell unlimited internet dialup access for a flat monthly fee to you in case they can not - for whatever reason - provide you with DSL access.
I'm sorry to tell you that you suffer from delusions of huge proportions. IF you are outside of Europe, ISDN is anything but ISDN. Differences are that bad that the FreeBSD ISDN stack only works in Europe (and Australia, AFAIK) but not in the US. Furthermore, most European ISDN equipment doesn't even work in the US, regardless of software and protocol issues, since the US carriers in their infernal wisdom mostly choose to implement the uk0 interface and not the S0 interface, which is supposed to be used as customer interface (uk0 is the interface between the CPE and the telco network).
Oh well - when having the choice between doing it the Right Way(TM) and saving half a dime, why do they always choose the latter ??
But in 90% of Germany, you simply have no other choice:-(
Hm... but more than 50% of Germans do have another choice. Those other choices are not necessarily better, though. Deutsche Telekom has substantially improved over the last few years.
One thing - if you're an avid online gamer, avoid Deutsche Telekom and its resellers (like 1&1). They run their DSL equipment on the "interleave" path, adding substantial delay to the packets. This results in DSL customers having pings worse than 56k modem users. For fast pings, subscribe with a carrier which has its own equipment - either local ones (in the few lucky places that have good local carriers doing DSL) or Arcor or QSC, wich both operate nationwide, but only cover more urban areas.
This 50 euro fee is a super scam, especially considering all they have to do is flip a switch.
Sorry, but you're wrong here. I don't work for Deutsche Telekom but for a competitor of theirs, but this is probably similar with their tech. Yes, in some cases, it _could_ be a switch. But in many more cases, someone will have to go and move (re-wire) your copper wire from one port to another in the switching office. This other port will have to be bought. Some guy will have to go and change documentation. Some guy will have to go and hack your change whishes into billing and provisioning systems. Some guy will have to go and change routing data in the phone switch, and possibly at some point, to check configuration. You are statistically expected to waste X minutes of support staff time since something goes wrong (regardless of who's fault it is) etc etc. All this goes into the caclculation of these 50 EU, and from what I've seen of our own caclculations, 50 EU (roughly equivalent 50 bucks) usually doesn't cover it all.
Apparently the University in question plans to give the students a slap on the wrist and not persue the matter further. But this is unacceptable - under no circiumstance can these people allowed to proceed in their chosen path.
I've got a few alternative suggestions. Let's start with the more reasonable, modest ones:
Get Law enforcement involved. Get the FBI. This is 1. a conspiracy, 2. intention to commit wire fraud 3. most likely committed across state borders. So they should offer the students leniency for full cooperation, and then haul the real spammer's ass to court and get him into the slammer for years ! Make it RICO, make it organized crime! Consider the renaming of the mail relay software encryption, and use that as aggravating circumstance. Throw the whole book at him, and then do it again! Use whatever you can get, to put this miserable worthless piece of human DNA garbage into a hole and throw the key away.
you also might want to punish the student offenders slightly more severe. Expulsion from the university comes to mind. And make them compensate the University's expenses to the last dime. Including admin time spent to handle complaints, track them down, etc.
you could increase that by banning them from any university in this state, or from higher education in the US in general.
lets get more serious now. The above mentioned conspiration thing might applied to the students as well. Put them to jail for a few year, and then ban them from using the Internet for another 5 or 10 years. If you can do that to some harmless trespasser like Kevin Mitnick, you certainly can do it to criminal scum like these!
Now let's explore more universally just and moral options. One of these would of course be execute the students on the spot. Grant them their right to a speedy trial (of, say, one day or so), foreclose any appeals and then bring them to a fast and merciful death. Execute them publicly (say, on a market place) so their sorry fate can at least serve the moral enlightenment of others. Of course, for universal justice, you would have to administer a more severe punishment to the master spammer. There are a number of time proven methods, but if you're out of ideas, ask Mr. Ascroft - he's got some people on a cuban base, that know numerous ways to put a man into a state where he practically begs for a fast death.
Now we leave the enlightened 19th century and draw from resources originating in more medieval times. Back then, prison sentences didn't play a role. Anything that couldn't be handled by monetary compensation (or bribery) would be handled by corporal punishment. But, underlying philosophy was that the punishment hat to fit the crime - even if only in a symbolic way. The real challenge for the medieval judical systems, of course, was to invent fitting punishments. Most of those invloved rose to the challenge. And most punishments shomehow involved the death of the perpetrator, thereby reducing the chance for repeat offense to zero. Unfortunately, none of them knew spammers, so we have to come up with fitting punishments ourselves. For a first time offender, who didn't relay more than, say, 100 messages, we might suggest something lenient, like cuting off their two typing fingers, or removing their tongues (highly symbolic - those who poison the well of communication shall be prevented from using it). For a more serious offender, a number of punishments come to mind, all alluring to some of the distasteful missives they sent out. Ideas involve death by overdoses of Viagra, deathly penile enlargement by help of fluid (molten) metal, getting beaten to death with a roulette kettle (from an internet gambling operation) or beeing suffocated-by/squeezed-under/force-fed-with a truckload of worthless spam-hyped pennystocks. And, of course, all kinds of deaths involving long, sharp wooden poles (in highly symbolic reference to the "teenage girls getting it up the ass" type of spam). Once you are in the right mood, you'll probably come with a few more poetic ideas of your own. Just read your daily dose of spam
Of course, there are few minor legal obstacles to solve for one or two of these points, but, after all, now that the US has officially reintroduced torture and abolished habeas corpus, those can be considered minor problems, which can be solved with minimal legislative effort.
[...] prostitution [is a crime] against society. If you cannot see how [it is] harmful to society, then you are ignoring the obvious. Crack whores are not happy, productive people, let me tell you.
*sigh*
The crackwhore here is a classical strawman. She's bad off beacuse she a.) has a drug problem and b.) is forced by the laws to work in a dangerous setting. In places where prostitution is legal and free of discriminatory laws you find prostitutes who are quite happy and in control of themselves, work in a safe environment and make good money.
Laws against prostitution are one of the last bastions of legislating morality. And the good old US of A is in company of mostly authoritarian and theocratic regimes to entirely ban it. More civilized nations with a working secular constitution don't do so.
But legislation morality is in fashion in the US these days. This doesn't apply to prostitution alone - things like sodomy laws or flag burning come to mind, too.
Victimless crimes do not exist.
Dream on.
Oh well... what do I argue ? You're probably a troll anyway, trying to push people's buttons.
Slashdot Mirror
Companies - like people - are supposed to behave in a positive fashion, be good neighbours and good citizens. So when you are a driver for your company, you are nontheless expected e.g. to help out when you see an accident on the wayside, or, more genereal, you are expected to contribute to the general well-being of the communities they live in.
The idea that ethics, decency, politeness and friendlyness just somehow magically don't apply when you are at work is one of the great sick misconceptions of our time.
So, if you can fix the bug with a reasonable effort, do and submit it. That's the expected behaviour - and good manners - in your trade.
IIRC at least one Rep congress critter called for that boycott as well. Don't know about Bush.
Yes and no. An "Abmahnung" has a more formal meaning. It is only valid in certain legal areas, most notably the competition law, and the law specifies exactly who may issue an Abmahnung, and who can't (usually it is an affected competitor or certain qualified third parties , like consumer associations and the like).
Consequently, it also has more legal "power" than a simple cease and desist. For instance, you do not have the option to ignore such a thing - you must either accept it - and accede to its demands - or contest it in court. And if you accept it, you are required to pay the legal costs associated with it.
You do have a support contract, do you ? With 4h "time back to service" or some such ?
You (and maybe the pf author, too) apparently suffer from the Microsoft Word desease (Word calculates tables, Excel is a graphics Program and Powerpoint has a Wordprocessor funtion).
Under Unix a tool is supposed to do on e thing, and do it right. ipfw(8), that is, the control program, does this - it controls the filtering facility.
If you want more complex rule sets, write them in shell scripts (as I do), or have them preprocessed by cpp or m4 or whetever.
This may or may not be correct, but you totally failed to make that case.
The manpage you quote is documenting a programmer's interface with IOCTLs and c structs. It neither proveides a usefull overview of pf nor does it tell you how to build rules with it.
If you read that and found it better than FreeBSD's concise and well written ipfw(8) manpage you must have smoked some very heavy stuff.
ipfw is FreeBSD's very own and native packet filtering framework. It already has a number of those features ascribed to pf, and it works quite well with FreeBSD.
The very reason pf exists is that Theo and the Gang suffered from a mild rash of NIH when they needed packet filtering code after their run-in with the Ipf guy. Instead of just porting ipfw, they choose to do their own thing.
I agree with the original poster. FreeBSD needs another packet filtering system about as necessary as the proverbial fish needs that bicycle. If there is room for improvement (and there always is
And I furthermore think Linus wouldn't agree with you here.
Let me quote Bruce Schneier:
"... it is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-- Secrets & Lies: Digital Security in a Networked World, 2000
Unfortunately, those coke-snorting record execs are hard to kill, apparently. To the very least, people are not fast enough killing record companies right now.
Stop buying music !
FWIW, from an economic point of view, this entirely makes sence. Cost structure on a service resembling the actual costs leads to more economic behaviour by all involved parties and thus to more overall efficience - i.e. lower prices and/or better quality.
That's not what you are asking for. You want DT to pass the cost of your frequent product changes to those customers who don't change their products all the time. As one of those customers, I pointedly protest - I don't plan to subsidize your habit of changing your mind every few weeks, thank you for asking.
Oh well. You're confusing a keen sense for their own interests with cowardice.
For most of Europe's younger history, Germany and France had been at war with each other, one way or the other, and until more recently we hadn't much good to say of each other, too. A little more than 50 years ago, France was colloquially considered the "Erbfeind" (sort of "enemy by heritage") by many people. But though we ferquenmtyl spoke bad of each other, hardly a man would call the French cowarce. People knew better.
Now if you'd talk about that nation of heroes Signore Berlusconi reigns (did you hear the story about their new war flag design ? A white eagle on white background
There are internet cafes. They are not as many as you encounter in some other parts of the world, but in most cities you find a few. Even in Postdam there should be some survivors, even though some Berlin local buerocrats currently do all they can to eradicate internet cafes completely.
Back then, the newsgroup soc.c ulture.german had quite a few FAQs and reference web sites for this topic.
No idea if this group is still there, or if the group by now has drowned in those vitriolic diatribes of American Nazis, Palestinian antisemites, and the various other hatemongers of numerous causes, who all apparently wake up every morning with the firm knowledge that Usenet was exclusively made to distribute their particular drivel.
Nonsense. Thios isn't exactly Pakistan or Iraq you are talking about.
:-)
The only real complaint I've heard from Americans living in Germany right now is that they rarely escape a party without debating US foreign policy (regardless of their stance on it) - and that's pretty annoying. I'm afraid, though, that's the kind of annoyance you were in for when you ordered governement services from a certain GW Bush some two years ago. I'd suggets you rethink that particular subscription when it comes up for renewal in a year or two, but OTOH as with all subscription services, the alternatives usually suck almost as bad as the one you have
Oh well - when having the choice between doing it the Right Way(TM) and saving half a dime, why do they always choose the latter ??
One thing - if you're an avid online gamer, avoid Deutsche Telekom and its resellers (like 1&1). They run their DSL equipment on the "interleave" path, adding substantial delay to the packets. This results in DSL customers having pings worse than 56k modem users. For fast pings, subscribe with a carrier which has its own equipment - either local ones (in the few lucky places that have good local carriers doing DSL) or Arcor or QSC, wich both operate nationwide, but only cover more urban areas.
Good luck !
Yes. Change costs money.
Shouldn't it be more like
"Welcome to Black Mesa research facility..."
Hi Gordon!
I've got a few alternative suggestions. Let's start with the more reasonable, modest ones:
- Get Law enforcement involved. Get the FBI. This is 1. a conspiracy, 2. intention to commit wire fraud 3. most likely committed across state borders. So they should offer the students leniency for full cooperation, and then haul the real spammer's ass to court and get him into the slammer for years ! Make it RICO, make it organized crime! Consider the renaming of the mail relay software encryption, and use that as aggravating circumstance. Throw the whole book at him, and then do it again! Use whatever you can get, to put this miserable worthless piece of human DNA garbage into a hole and throw the key away.
- you also might want to punish the student offenders slightly more severe. Expulsion from the university comes to mind. And make them compensate the University's expenses to the last dime. Including admin time spent to handle complaints, track them down, etc.
- you could increase that by banning them from any university in this state, or from higher education in the US in general.
- lets get more serious now. The above mentioned conspiration thing might applied to the students as well. Put them to jail for a few year, and then ban them from using the Internet for another 5 or 10 years. If you can do that to some harmless trespasser like Kevin Mitnick, you certainly can do it to criminal scum like these!
- Now let's explore more universally just and moral options. One of these would of course be execute the students on the spot. Grant them their right to a speedy trial (of, say, one day or so), foreclose any appeals and then bring them to a fast and merciful death. Execute them publicly (say, on a market place) so their sorry fate can at least serve the moral enlightenment of others. Of course, for universal justice, you would have to administer a more severe punishment to the master spammer. There are a number of time proven methods, but if you're out of ideas, ask Mr. Ascroft - he's got some people on a cuban base, that know numerous ways to put a man into a state where he practically begs for a fast death.
- Now we leave the enlightened 19th century and draw from resources originating in more medieval times. Back then, prison sentences didn't play a role. Anything that couldn't be handled by monetary compensation (or bribery) would be handled by corporal punishment. But, underlying philosophy was that the punishment hat to fit the crime - even if only in a symbolic way. The real challenge for the medieval judical systems, of course, was to invent fitting punishments. Most of those invloved rose to the challenge. And most punishments shomehow involved the death of the perpetrator, thereby reducing the chance for repeat offense to zero. Unfortunately, none of them knew spammers, so we have to come up with fitting punishments ourselves. For a first time offender, who didn't relay more than, say, 100 messages, we might suggest something lenient, like cuting off their two typing fingers, or removing their tongues (highly symbolic - those who poison the well of communication shall be prevented from using it). For a more serious offender, a number of punishments come to mind, all alluring to some of the distasteful missives they sent out. Ideas involve death by overdoses of Viagra, deathly penile enlargement by help of fluid (molten) metal, getting beaten to death with a roulette kettle (from an internet gambling operation) or beeing suffocated-by/squeezed-under/force-fed-with a truckload of worthless spam-hyped pennystocks. And, of course, all kinds of deaths involving long, sharp wooden poles (in highly symbolic reference to the "teenage girls getting it up the ass" type of spam). Once you are in the right mood, you'll probably come with a few more poetic ideas of your own. Just read your daily dose of spam
Of course, there are few minor legal obstacles to solve for one or two of these points, but, after all, now that the US has officially reintroduced torture and abolished habeas corpus, those can be considered minor problems, which can be solved with minimal legislative effort.Did I mention I hate spammers ?
The crackwhore here is a classical strawman. She's bad off beacuse she a.) has a drug problem and b.) is forced by the laws to work in a dangerous setting. In places where prostitution is legal and free of discriminatory laws you find prostitutes who are quite happy and in control of themselves, work in a safe environment and make good money.
Laws against prostitution are one of the last bastions of legislating morality. And the good old US of A is in company of mostly authoritarian and theocratic regimes to entirely ban it. More civilized nations with a working secular constitution don't do so.
But legislation morality is in fashion in the US these days. This doesn't apply to prostitution alone - things like sodomy laws or flag burning come to mind, too. Dream on.
Oh well