Gott in himmel, political ideologues.. this is not about politics or gdp or borders or..
We can collectively choose to save the planet (and ourselves), or individually choose to perish. You think there's somebody out there writing about who was right when we're done?
This is the way of humanity. Especially when the money is in the hands of the people causing the problem, and the inertia of the others.
It isn't like this is not exactly what has been going on for many years.
And I've come to the final conclusion is that people who don't give a damn about shorelines and other life simply like the warmer weather
Gott in himmel, political ideologues.. this is not about politics or gdp or borders or..
We can collectively choose to save the planet (and ourselves), or individually choose to perish. You think there's somebody out there writing about who was right when we're done?
This is the way of humanity. Especially when the money is in the hands of the people causing the problem, and the inertia of the others.
It isn't like this is not exactly what has been going on for many years.
I do store classified data in the cloud. I don't store it in google docs though.
Some of the cloud options offer security that is at military classification. Some of data that I work with cannot leave the country, has to remain inside certain datacenters and has a load of other security requirements around it. We still use the cloud.
Believe it or not Microsoft's Azure product is very secure if configured correctly.
That is only remotely the cloud we're talking about here.
Yes, trump has said that he will push coal. However, American utilities are not building any new coal plants AND we are closing them quickly. America is already around 200 GW of coal plant capacity and is expected to be around 150 GW by 2020. The problem is that China continues to add 35-50 get of new coal plants ( not replacements ) AND are converting coal to methane which will generate a great deal more CO2.
Well then, We should get busy releasing as much CO2 as we can! That'll show those Commies! 8^)
Kiddie porn is a special case, and rightfully so. Outside of that, none of the major providers is going to hand over any data without a court order, and they do a much better job of ensuring availability and security than you do.
So they just scrape it and block access fopr the LuLz? With no law enforcement intereststs, do you suggest that they are blocking access to people 's documents because they are buisness matters only? Like maybe some competitor of Google's?
I might be stupid, but that even sounds stupid to me.
Nope not a google employee. Or a seller of goggle products.
And no one actually involved in cloud transformations advertises it as the ultimate in availability or security.
That doesn't mean that we don't hear that often and loudly. Employee, zealot, or useful idiot, the glowing reports of unassailable security, 100 percent uptime, and almost miraculous reductions in cost of infrastructure and eliminating employees have been shouted from the rooftops for years.
The ultimate option remains having multiple instances of each server stored in diverse on-prem datacenters where you control all access. But the cost of doing that is insane.
Well okay. But who needs ultimate? The cloud certainly doesn't approach ultimate, and stupid stuff like expired security certificates (microsoft) and arbitrary lockouts from your own information by google are as much failures as hardware failures. And this still doesn't address the fact that they are scraping the files.
Also why am I only having it in the cloud? Consumer equipment is perfect for consuming. So there is no reason a document isn't replicated there. Given this was google docs it would be trivial for all files to be synced using drive stream and hence being able to access the most recent interation on any PC.
Tell me - would you store classified data in your cloud?
You realize the USA has some of the most aggressive environmental protection than all of the world, right?
Do you realize that Americans emit twice as much CO2 per capita as China, and eight times as much as India? Expecting them to make equal cuts is ridiculous. The cuts need to be where the waste is.
We'll all drive the bus off the cliff with our different political spin to make us happy. Meanwhile I suggest you move to Beijing to enjoy the air quality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollution_in_China
Note he was writing of the USA's environmental protection laws, not just CO2.
And he's right. We do have some good Environmental protection here. It isn't perfect, but it does allow us to have a better environment than we would otherwise. Water is cleaner, we're recycling a lot of stuff that used to go into landfills - it isn't perfect, but then again, perfect is often the enemy of good. The one-time air pollution capitals of Los Angeles and Pittsburgh now have remarkably clean air. The times I was in LA I was surprised that it was pretty clear, and Pittsburgh which I am very familiar with, is now a jewel of a city.
We really need to do something about CO2. Squabbling about the talking points will ensure that we don't.
You mean, they'll be from China? Did you even bother to read what I even wrote? You realize the USA has some of the most aggressive environmental protection than all of the world, right?
We're working on ending that now. Be a little patient, m'kay?
Blaming "Republicans" or Donald Trump is just silly, when we all know China and India is heavily influencing these agreements for their own benefit.
Cool story bro. So you are saying that unless every single nation on earth is 100 percent online, we just go ahead and drive the bus off the cliff because it's more fair to do that.
Especially odd that the present solution of the Republican party is to re-open the mines and emulate China.
You don't realize it, but your argument - which brings up some very good points about the politics of the situation, exactly proves my point.
You gloss over the science facts then dive right into the politics. That does ignore completely that The Republican party overwhelmingly and their leader uniquivocally deny that there is sich a thing as greenhouse gas global warming.
Meanwhile, you argue for allowing China to control your actions.
Nope. You can't legislate or decree away reality. Reality always wins.
This reminds me of a story in I think either Discover Magazine or Scientific American. It was referencing novel about a Government that decreed that humans would become aquatic, and grow gills and live underwater. Update reports on the effort were pretty funny.
Written during the cold war era, and in Eastern Europe, it was obvious in hindsight that it was a jab at Lysenkoism, the communist party dogma alternative to evolution and biology.
Now that I had that memory awakened, do any of our Eastern European friends have a clue about the title and author?
Yep, as usual - backup your files. That's all you need.
... but hardly anyone does.
Well then, grant access to your cloud provider to look at your files, and if you don't toe the line, you might not have access to them, or might even be arrested.
I really don't care if people store anythingon the cloud, I merely say storing anything there is an open invitation to lose it or to find yourself in trouble, deserved or not.. If you don't care, by all means do it.
By the way, don't people remember when an idiot was caught storing kiddie porn on Ubuntu's cloud service? They'll scrape it, they'll run hashes on it. It's simply there for the taking
How would I flag my data on my own network or computer as violating my Terms of Service? The mind boggles. It definitely is "the cloud". The cloud means you don't control your data.
It's not just "the cloud", such a thing could happen on any network. It's that you must "trust" that Google will revert the issue and grant you access to *your* documents. They don't have to.
The only person I trust is me. I've lived long enough to know that my documents won't mean a damn thing to anyone else. And for any cloud service, I'm just another customer.
So I'm stored locally, with one local and one backup not stored here.
Pretty simple, as I care about my most important customer.
... you didn't know that Google could cut off access to files in Google Drive? How the hell did you think it worked? I thought this site was news for nerds, not news for my grandma?
Until your hard drive blows up, your LAN goes down or your computer goes on the fritz. It's not like local file servers are magically immune to failures.
In those cases, would the cloud somehow still work? That's a hellava cloud that gets th edat through a busted LAN and a non-functioning computer. Majick!
This access denial is a non-polishable turd. If I'm working on a project and suddenly "The cloud" locks me out of it, I'm well and truly screwed with tight deadlines. Wait - I know the answer - I'm supposed to both use the cloud andlocal storage along with my multiple backups. Which means the one item that is redundant is - the cloud.
I'll use dropbox or equivalent for transfer if I have to but never anything stored there or any other cloud storage or backup that isn't directly under my control, and that I can't put my grubby mitts on.
So there was a minor outage that was caused by software? Could easily have happened for a million other reasons that no one would care about.
Would the outage have exceeded 12 hours? I can't see any RTO details, but if not you are still well within 99.9% availability.
That's way better than what you will ever achieve with crappy consumer equipment.
Looks like Google employees are presenting.
Sorry church, The cloud is advertized as the ultimate in security, and availability, Fuck you and your cloud is better than "consumer equipment.
Here comes the curse. May you get locked out of the biggest and mot important document you ever had, th eone your boss and your jobs depend on, and you only have it in teh cloud, since who would put it oncrappy consumer equipment. Go to the customer and tell them you got nothing.
Yeah, fuck them. All of the up-side to being an academic disappeared more than a decade ago. If they think salary is the *only* thing theyâ(TM)re not winning at, theyâ(TM)ve got their collective heads up their asses.
Once upon a time, a job at a University (at least here in th e US) wouldn't be the highest pay, but there was usually a decent retirement plan, and the work was pretty stable.
Now Universities have major problems. As tuitions raised by double digit percentage every year, because parents were hypnotized that their children would end up living under a bridge if they didn't have a degree, most degrees don't mean anything at all - no job prospects.
This allowed the Universities to add more and more management and accountants, until professors and researchers were a minority of employees. So those folks sucked up money at an alarming rate.
So there goes any hope of decent compensation, and there goes the decent pension exchanged for 401K type programs. Of course, the multiple levels of management and accountants only knows one thing - you need many more levels of management and even more accountants. Buh-Bye Overhead. My once generous budget for professional development and requirements to pursue it ended up turning into "I read a web page about a process" in the end.
The final nail in this coffin is that Universities have been largely taken over by third wave feminists. You have to sit and listen to be told that as a man, you are a rapist, and that anything a woman decides is sexual harassment is sexual harassment, and you will lose your job.
All in all, a pretty poisonous atmosphere. Where I once would suggest to anyone to pursue a career at University, I now not only say you don't want a career there, but you would be better off getting an online degree.
You are of course correct. I think they are using the wrong words "mathematical proof" when the accurate term is "extensive modelling."
If by "extensive" you mean building the simplest possible model that some significant subset of the chattering class is willing to regard as credible for all of the five minutes it takes to seagull post and flit onto the next topic.
Excellent work. Now the reader is equipped with a yellow flag that activates (one hopes) on next encounter with a similarly thumping article (subtype: da da da DAH!) beating the vapid drum that "it's the telomere, stupid!"
Now well-equipped reader thinks, I once read a MOASH (mother of all stupid headlines) to the effect that merely fixing the telomeres lurks below the snake oil horizon.
This is what hapless mayfly dredges out of his or her damp, woven basket promulgated as "proof".
Appalling.
Even the huddled yeast on this proof basket fail to thrive.
For my money, we have to take whatever lumps that earth is going to give us at this point. It makes sense to restrict CO2 emissions, but SO2 release comes with it's own problems at most scales.
Indeed. We've spent billions of dollars REMOVING sulfur from emission stacks. Remember acid rain?
Hell, if we want to do this, we can just get a bunch of Trump supporters to fire up their 'Rolling Coal' machines and run around.
Oh hell yeah. I remember when after the steel mills shut down in Pisstburgh their air didn't get any cleaner. Then they found out it was the asses in Ohio with their SO2 and acid rain, just drifting over. It's much better now. Anyhow we really don't want to be sending that crap into the atmosphere. The coal emissions contain radioactive particles as well.
Slashdot Mirror
Gott in himmel, political ideologues.. this is not about politics or gdp or borders or..
We can collectively choose to save the planet (and ourselves), or individually choose to perish. You think there's somebody out there writing about who was right when we're done?
This is the way of humanity. Especially when the money is in the hands of the people causing the problem, and the inertia of the others.
It isn't like this is not exactly what has been going on for many years.
And I've come to the final conclusion is that people who don't give a damn about shorelines and other life simply like the warmer weather
Gott in himmel, political ideologues.. this is not about politics or gdp or borders or..
We can collectively choose to save the planet (and ourselves), or individually choose to perish. You think there's somebody out there writing about who was right when we're done?
This is the way of humanity. Especially when the money is in the hands of the people causing the problem, and the inertia of the others.
It isn't like this is not exactly what has been going on for many years.
I do store classified data in the cloud. I don't store it in google docs though.
Some of the cloud options offer security that is at military classification. Some of data that I work with cannot leave the country, has to remain inside certain datacenters and has a load of other security requirements around it. We still use the cloud.
Believe it or not Microsoft's Azure product is very secure if configured correctly.
That is only remotely the cloud we're talking about here.
Yes, trump has said that he will push coal. However, American utilities are not building any new coal plants AND we are closing them quickly. America is already around 200 GW of coal plant capacity and is expected to be around 150 GW by 2020. The problem is that China continues to add 35-50 get of new coal plants ( not replacements ) AND are converting coal to methane which will generate a great deal more CO2.
Well then, We should get busy releasing as much CO2 as we can! That'll show those Commies! 8^)
Meh.
Kiddie porn is a special case, and rightfully so. Outside of that, none of the major providers is going to hand over any data without a court order, and they do a much better job of ensuring availability and security than you do.
So they just scrape it and block access fopr the LuLz? With no law enforcement intereststs, do you suggest that they are blocking access to people 's documents because they are buisness matters only? Like maybe some competitor of Google's?
I might be stupid, but that even sounds stupid to me.
Nope not a google employee. Or a seller of goggle products.
And no one actually involved in cloud transformations advertises it as the ultimate in availability or security.
That doesn't mean that we don't hear that often and loudly. Employee, zealot, or useful idiot, the glowing reports of unassailable security, 100 percent uptime, and almost miraculous reductions in cost of infrastructure and eliminating employees have been shouted from the rooftops for years.
The ultimate option remains having multiple instances of each server stored in diverse on-prem datacenters where you control all access. But the cost of doing that is insane.
Well okay. But who needs ultimate? The cloud certainly doesn't approach ultimate, and stupid stuff like expired security certificates (microsoft) and arbitrary lockouts from your own information by google are as much failures as hardware failures. And this still doesn't address the fact that they are scraping the files.
Also why am I only having it in the cloud? Consumer equipment is perfect for consuming. So there is no reason a document isn't replicated there. Given this was google docs it would be trivial for all files to be synced using drive stream and hence being able to access the most recent interation on any PC.
Tell me - would you store classified data in your cloud?
You realize the USA has some of the most aggressive environmental protection than all of the world, right?
Do you realize that Americans emit twice as much CO2 per capita as China, and eight times as much as India? Expecting them to make equal cuts is ridiculous. The cuts need to be where the waste is.
List of countries by per capita CO2 emissions
We'll all drive the bus off the cliff with our different political spin to make us happy. Meanwhile I suggest you move to Beijing to enjoy the air quality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollution_in_China
Note he was writing of the USA's environmental protection laws, not just CO2.
And he's right. We do have some good Environmental protection here. It isn't perfect, but it does allow us to have a better environment than we would otherwise. Water is cleaner, we're recycling a lot of stuff that used to go into landfills - it isn't perfect, but then again, perfect is often the enemy of good. The one-time air pollution capitals of Los Angeles and Pittsburgh now have remarkably clean air. The times I was in LA I was surprised that it was pretty clear, and Pittsburgh which I am very familiar with, is now a jewel of a city.
We really need to do something about CO2. Squabbling about the talking points will ensure that we don't.
You mean, they'll be from China? Did you even bother to read what I even wrote? You realize the USA has some of the most aggressive environmental protection than all of the world, right?
We're working on ending that now. Be a little patient, m'kay?
Blaming "Republicans" or Donald Trump is just silly, when we all know China and India is heavily influencing these agreements for their own benefit.
Cool story bro. So you are saying that unless every single nation on earth is 100 percent online, we just go ahead and drive the bus off the cliff because it's more fair to do that.
Especially odd that the present solution of the Republican party is to re-open the mines and emulate China.
You don't realize it, but your argument - which brings up some very good points about the politics of the situation, exactly proves my point.
You gloss over the science facts then dive right into the politics. That does ignore completely that The Republican party overwhelmingly and their leader uniquivocally deny that there is sich a thing as greenhouse gas global warming.
Meanwhile, you argue for allowing China to control your actions.
Nope. You can't legislate or decree away reality. Reality always wins.
This reminds me of a story in I think either Discover Magazine or Scientific American. It was referencing novel about a Government that decreed that humans would become aquatic, and grow gills and live underwater. Update reports on the effort were pretty funny.
Written during the cold war era, and in Eastern Europe, it was obvious in hindsight that it was a jab at Lysenkoism, the communist party dogma alternative to evolution and biology.
Now that I had that memory awakened, do any of our Eastern European friends have a clue about the title and author?
Since Republicans are in power, they will stop this socialist global warming in it's tracks . Problem solved!
Since it's all a Chinese hoax, there's nothing to stop. Donald of Orange is always right, right?
I never could figure the Chinese hoax angle. Musta been something he picked up from his Leninist buddy Steve.
on Ritalin
I think you mean off Ritalin.
Good correction!
Yep, as usual - backup your files. That's all you need.
... but hardly anyone does.
Well then, grant access to your cloud provider to look at your files, and if you don't toe the line, you might not have access to them, or might even be arrested.
I really don't care if people store anythingon the cloud, I merely say storing anything there is an open invitation to lose it or to find yourself in trouble, deserved or not.. If you don't care, by all means do it.
By the way, don't people remember when an idiot was caught storing kiddie porn on Ubuntu's cloud service? They'll scrape it, they'll run hashes on it. It's simply there for the taking
How would I flag my data on my own network or computer as violating my Terms of Service? The mind boggles. It definitely is "the cloud". The cloud means you don't control your data.
That pretty much ends the argument!
It's not just "the cloud", such a thing could happen on any network. It's that you must "trust" that Google will revert the issue and grant you access to *your* documents. They don't have to.
The only person I trust is me. I've lived long enough to know that my documents won't mean a damn thing to anyone else. And for any cloud service, I'm just another customer.
So I'm stored locally, with one local and one backup not stored here. Pretty simple, as I care about my most important customer.
... you didn't know that Google could cut off access to files in Google Drive? How the hell did you think it worked? I thought this site was news for nerds, not news for my grandma?
Be nice - your grandma is a great lady.
Until your hard drive blows up, your LAN goes down or your computer goes on the fritz. It's not like local file servers are magically immune to failures.
In those cases, would the cloud somehow still work? That's a hellava cloud that gets th edat through a busted LAN and a non-functioning computer. Majick!
This access denial is a non-polishable turd. If I'm working on a project and suddenly "The cloud" locks me out of it, I'm well and truly screwed with tight deadlines. Wait - I know the answer - I'm supposed to both use the cloud andlocal storage along with my multiple backups. Which means the one item that is redundant is - the cloud.
I'll use dropbox or equivalent for transfer if I have to but never anything stored there or any other cloud storage or backup that isn't directly under my control, and that I can't put my grubby mitts on.
So there was a minor outage that was caused by software? Could easily have happened for a million other reasons that no one would care about.
Would the outage have exceeded 12 hours? I can't see any RTO details, but if not you are still well within 99.9% availability.
That's way better than what you will ever achieve with crappy consumer equipment.
Looks like Google employees are presenting.
Sorry church, The cloud is advertized as the ultimate in security, and availability, Fuck you and your cloud is better than "consumer equipment.
Here comes the curse. May you get locked out of the biggest and mot important document you ever had, th eone your boss and your jobs depend on, and you only have it in teh cloud, since who would put it oncrappy consumer equipment. Go to the customer and tell them you got nothing.
News for 'tards; Jewish propaganda.
Jeezuz, the trolls are getting pathetic. Do you think you can sow doubt by sounding like a third grader on Ritalin? Thanks for playing though.
Slasdot goes crazy,
Since Republicans are in power, they will stop this socialist global warming in it's tracks . Problem solved!
The Apple Newton from the 80's also flopped.
Wrong decade.
Maybe he meant Fig Newton?
Yeah, fuck them. All of the up-side to being an academic disappeared more than a decade ago. If they think salary is the *only* thing theyâ(TM)re not winning at, theyâ(TM)ve got their collective heads up their asses.
Once upon a time, a job at a University (at least here in th e US) wouldn't be the highest pay, but there was usually a decent retirement plan, and the work was pretty stable.
Now Universities have major problems. As tuitions raised by double digit percentage every year, because parents were hypnotized that their children would end up living under a bridge if they didn't have a degree, most degrees don't mean anything at all - no job prospects.
This allowed the Universities to add more and more management and accountants, until professors and researchers were a minority of employees. So those folks sucked up money at an alarming rate.
So there goes any hope of decent compensation, and there goes the decent pension exchanged for 401K type programs. Of course, the multiple levels of management and accountants only knows one thing - you need many more levels of management and even more accountants. Buh-Bye Overhead. My once generous budget for professional development and requirements to pursue it ended up turning into "I read a web page about a process" in the end.
The final nail in this coffin is that Universities have been largely taken over by third wave feminists. You have to sit and listen to be told that as a man, you are a rapist, and that anything a woman decides is sexual harassment is sexual harassment, and you will lose your job.
All in all, a pretty poisonous atmosphere. Where I once would suggest to anyone to pursue a career at University, I now not only say you don't want a career there, but you would be better off getting an online degree.
If by "extensive" you mean building the simplest possible model that some significant subset of the chattering class is willing to regard as credible for all of the five minutes it takes to seagull post and flit onto the next topic.
Excellent work. Now the reader is equipped with a yellow flag that activates (one hopes) on next encounter with a similarly thumping article (subtype: da da da DAH!) beating the vapid drum that "it's the telomere, stupid!"
Now well-equipped reader thinks, I once read a MOASH (mother of all stupid headlines) to the effect that merely fixing the telomeres lurks below the snake oil horizon.
This is what hapless mayfly dredges out of his or her damp, woven basket promulgated as "proof".
Appalling.
Even the huddled yeast on this proof basket fail to thrive.
Whoa dude, let's have a beer and relax.
For my money, we have to take whatever lumps that earth is going to give us at this point. It makes sense to restrict CO2 emissions, but SO2 release comes with it's own problems at most scales.
Indeed. We've spent billions of dollars REMOVING sulfur from emission stacks. Remember acid rain?
Hell, if we want to do this, we can just get a bunch of Trump supporters to fire up their 'Rolling Coal' machines and run around.
Oh hell yeah. I remember when after the steel mills shut down in Pisstburgh their air didn't get any cleaner. Then they found out it was the asses in Ohio with their SO2 and acid rain, just drifting over. It's much better now. Anyhow we really don't want to be sending that crap into the atmosphere. The coal emissions contain radioactive particles as well.