Wikipedia is wrong because it is Outdated. It lists the old analog frequencies which did not use the full 6 megahertz-wide channel. The new digital TV does uses the full 6 megahertz width, leaving virtually no space between channels 12 and 13. Or any of the other VHF-hi and UHF channels.
And yes there are gaps between 4 and 5, plus 6 and 7, but those aren't empty spaces. 4-5 is filled with police/emergency radio; 6-7 is filled with FM radio. These are not open spaces you ignorant. (Not that there's anything wrong with being ignorant, but then you should LISTEN to TV experts instead of opening your mouth and repeating false info.)
Let's say there's a hundred Mhz between channels: So channel 12 is 1200 Mhz, channel 13 is 1300 Mhz,
What's the point of assuming something that is false? Channels 12 and 13 DON'T have any usable space between. They jut-up next to one another like books on a bookshelf.
Ya know for a "technical news for nerds" site, you guys sure are ignorant about how Broadcast TV actually works. I could overlook 1 person's lack of knowledge, because mistakes happen, but I've seen about 10 posts from engineers/technicians all claiming there's space between channels - and that's flat wrong.
Please. Look up the TV channel assignments - there's no space between channels. Like books on a shelf.
The airwaves belong to the people by way of the federal government.
That's upside down.
THE PEOPLE (from which all authority comes and to which all common property belongs)
| Your State Constitution
| State Legislature
| Federal Constitution
| federal government (at the bottom - as servant and nothing more)
Nature has given us the Air. It is the common property of all humankind. It is upon this basis that Clean Air laws were enacted (the natural right to breath non-poisonous atmosphere). Well airwaves are also part of that common property
They are systems that scale horribly, in terms of users and in terms of area. This is why cell service almost variably sucks,
And the quality went down. Back when we had analog phones the sound was not great, but it was still better than the current overcompressed MP3-style cellphones. These modern voicecalls make your mom or grandma or whoever sound like they were "autotuned".
"Hey gramps, you sound just like Kanye West!";-) And it's only going to get worse as they shrink the voice line from 8 downto 4 downto 2 kbit/s streams, so they can squeeze more and more calls in their fixed bandwidth.
Copper and fiber are much better medium-distance and long-haul carriers
And multipliable. Wireless has ONE spectrum, and when it's full, it's full. No more room. Copper/fiber provides many spectrums - one per wire you lay down. It has near-infinite growth potential.
You're right. 3,000,000,000 gigabytes is a hell of a lot of data sent to 1/2 million homes every month.
- It's equivalent to send 60 million Bluray Discs to every home in Baltimore, every single month. - And another 60 million Blurays to every home in Washington DC, every single month. - And another 60 million to every home in Richmond Virginia, every single month...
times all 200 television markets. All at Zero cost to the consumers.
You're not a communist pinko. You just don't seem to realize that government is horribly inefficient, due to a white collar welfare mentality (people don't get laid off even when work is slow). I know. I work there. Or see the recent article about a UK website that cost ~100 million dollars per year to maintain. Rather than choose inefficient monopoly, I'd prefer to have a pro-choice solution between multiple corporations, all competing to make the pricetag as cheap as possible.
Also you used the roads as example, but for me that's an argument *against* government. Falling bridges, potholes, and ridiculous congestion because government is unwilling to add new highways (like an I-85 running parallel to I-95). Of course I can't think of a better alternative for roads due to their natural monopoly aspect, but that doesn't mean I want that model applies to communications.
And finally: You use water, sewer, power grid as secondary examples, but where I live NONE of these are government owned or operated. They are private, regulated companies. That's how we should treat folks like Comcast or Verizon.
At least the Radio and TV licensees give us free entertainment. They pay about $100,000 per year per channel, and charge nothing to access it. IMHO that automatically makes them a preferred option over giving that TV and FM band to Cell or Wireless companies that charge us.
I think you're being unnecesarily harsh towards C64 over what is, basically, a trivial matter. Channel or frequency. Who cares? Your pedantry reminds me of Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons.
Which is leaves a huge spread of frequencies between channel 12 and channel 13 that no one is using.
You are mistaken my friend. Channels 12 and 13 sit directly next to one another. There are NO free frequencies between channels 12 and 13. There's a small guard band of a few hertz, but that's not even wide enough to carry a dialup modem datalink (3000 hertz wide), much less a broadband internet connection.
You don't need an "open channel" because there IS space between frequencies channels are assigned to.
Flat wrong. My two most-watched channels are 10 and 11 and there is NO space in between them. I don't know where you got the idea there's space between channels???
You must be one of those persons who offers an opinion, but actually knows nothing about the subject.
About one week. Trying to watch the game on channel 10? Well too bad because the hacker kid next door is broadcasting over top of it. And even though FCC rules require people to turn off TV Band whitespace gadgets if they interfere with licensed TV reception, there's no way to enforce those rules. The kid can just ignore your request .
No buffer bands. Two of my favorite channels 10 and 11 butt-up right next to one another, with only a few hertz of space between them. That's enough room to carry a dialup modem (3000 hertz wide) and nothing more.
Here's a quick off-the-top of my head list of all the channels I get for free. How the heck do you propose to squeeze all of these into only channels 2 to 25, per the FCC's just-released Broadband Plan to sell off everything above 25. Even with MPEG4 it would be impossible to keep all of these:
- MAJOR NETS: abc, cbs, fox, nbc, cw, mynettv, ion, pbs - Other nets: univision, telemundo, telefutura - independents: MINDtv, Megahertz, Link, a local religious station, a 20 hour shopping channel plus 4 hour news - other national channels: GetWell channel This movie channel NBC Weather NBC sports PBSkids PBSworld FOX News channel Qubo Worship Smile of a Child JCTV (teen channel) Enlace (spanish) TBN RetroTV (70s/80s classics) Family Channel (50s/60s classics)
FOX is now part of the "Big Four". In fact it came in 2nd place the last two years. Plus The CW network at number 5, MyNetworkTV number 6, and finally ION (dead last). PBS too.
The only channels currently not in use along Washington DC to New York City I95 corridor (and also including ?Harrisburg, Scranton) are 2, 3, 4, and 5. Everything else is reserved, leaving no room for whitespace TV Band Devices (TVBDs in FCC parlance).
The airwaves are the collective property of the American People (long with roads, air, and other common goods). They have a natural right to at least SOME of it being usable without cost, i.e. Free TV and Radio. Why should an Owner have to rent his own property? That makes little sense.
merchants should be seizing cards that say "Check ID" on the signature strip
Why??? I have DEMAND PHOTO ID written below my signature, so the clerk will ask to see my photo. Why should my card be seized jackass? It's MY card. I have the right to control who uses it (me only).
Not sure about CDs but most DVDs and Games have end-user licenses displayed when they start playing, or embedded in the manual. Who knows what they say? Perhaps: "This item may not be used for public performances, or for resale."
I don't know what US you are living in, but the one I live in does not limit the number of hours a week you work
He didn't say there was. Go back and reread what C64 actually said and try to comprehend it this time.
As for lawyers if the Tyson Chicken Factory had ~100 workers jump off the top of the building (due to extreme exhaustion) just since January 1st don't you think the lawyers would be buzzing around that place like bees? Of course they would. But Foxconn doesn't have to worry because there are no (or few) lawyers in China. Foxconn doesn't need to obey the laws like a US corporation must.
When you use PayPal, you waive your right to a chargeback and agree to use Paypal's "dispute resolution mechanism".
Although I prefer to use paypal's dispute resolution, when they are unable to recover the money (because seller emptied his account), then I call my credit card company. I've done several chargebacks on paypal purchases.
Can't speak for C64 but here's the cards I've got:
Discover - 1% off everything and 5% off hotels/food during the third quarter (July-to-Sept); 5% off department stores 4th quarter Chase - 3% off gas, food, drugs; 1% everything else AAA credit - 2% off gas plus free renewal of membership every year (worth $50)
And with zero scarcity driving the cost down to zero for all books, publishing will will go from dying to dead.
Precisely correct...........
Somebody else above you wrote: Infinite supply is bad, so they artificially impose restrictions.
There is an infinite supply of Bits which represent these e-books, but there is not an infinite supply of authors. They still need to be compensated for their time and labor..... else they will quit being authors, go find factory jobs, and the output of new books will dwindle to nothing.
See? It's not an "artificial" restriction. We're talking about real people and real-world limits. You can't just enslave these people and make them write your entertainment free of charge. They must be compensated somehow, whether it's by you purchasing directly or the library purchasing the book & loaning it out (but with restrictions; like not being able to give it away to others)...........
Another person wrote: Ever since I was a victim of XCP there's no way I'll touch ANYTHING Sony makes.
By that reasoning, I would no longer be able to buy any product from any megacorp. Not Sony, not Nintendo, nor Microsoft, or even Apple. They have ALL harmed me at some point during the last 20 years. It's inevitable that a company will, from time to time, make a mistake and choosing to boycott them forever is an unrealistic response .
Sony has devised a system of artificially restricting access to books, effectively a short-term, no end-user-cost license
It's the same thing as a library except you can't steal the book.
Precisely. Also it wasn't Sony that "devised" this system. Libraries devised the system hundreds of years ago when they said you can only keep your books for 14 days, and then you must return them. The fact "grub" opposes the E-book variant of this (you get a book 14 days and then it gets returned to the library) indicates to me that he's probably a thief. He thinks he should be able to download books for Free and keep them forever, thereby depriving the authors of compensation for their labor.
Maybe part of the Entitlement Generation? "I want what I want & not hav to pay. It hrts author incme? LOL. Frak themmmmmm" .
Strawman argument. The grandparent poster never claimed a republic is "always" better than a monarchy.
All he said was he thought the 1600s UK Republic was better than the previous monarch that had existed (and abused the people). And I agree. Similarly the Roman Republic was superior to the previous Roman Kingdom of the 700-500 BC era. That's all he was saying. Obviously a Republic can be bad, like the former East German Socialist Republic, but we were discussing the UK and the merits of its various governments (monarch vs. republic) specifically.
By the way I find the whole concept of one person being supreme over everybody else as being foreign to my thoughts. The Queen is a human being. Nothing more. She shouldn't have that job, because she did nothing to earn it. The monarch should be altered to an elected position, chosen either by the People or the "governors" of each british county.
Or possibly eliminated altogether (there's really no need for a monarch or executive).
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Wikipedia is wrong because it is Outdated. It lists the old analog frequencies which did not use the full 6 megahertz-wide channel. The new digital TV does uses the full 6 megahertz width, leaving virtually no space between channels 12 and 13. Or any of the other VHF-hi and UHF channels.
And yes there are gaps between 4 and 5, plus 6 and 7, but those aren't empty spaces. 4-5 is filled with police/emergency radio; 6-7 is filled with FM radio. These are not open spaces you ignorant. (Not that there's anything wrong with being ignorant, but then you should LISTEN to TV experts instead of opening your mouth and repeating false info.)
Let's say there's a hundred Mhz between channels: So channel 12 is 1200 Mhz, channel 13 is 1300 Mhz,
What's the point of assuming something that is false? Channels 12 and 13 DON'T have any usable space between. They jut-up next to one another like books on a bookshelf.
Ya know for a "technical news for nerds" site, you guys sure are ignorant about how Broadcast TV actually works. I could overlook 1 person's lack of knowledge, because mistakes happen, but I've seen about 10 posts from engineers/technicians all claiming there's space between channels - and that's flat wrong.
Please. Look up the TV channel assignments - there's no space between channels. Like books on a shelf.
The airwaves belong to the people by way of the federal government.
That's upside down.
THE PEOPLE (from which all authority comes and to which all common property belongs)
|
Your State Constitution
|
State Legislature
|
Federal Constitution
|
federal government (at the bottom - as servant and nothing more)
Nature has given us the Air. It is the common property of all humankind. It is upon this basis that Clean Air laws were enacted (the natural right to breath non-poisonous atmosphere). Well airwaves are also part of that common property
They are systems that scale horribly, in terms of users and in terms of area. This is why cell service almost variably sucks,
And the quality went down. Back when we had analog phones the sound was not great, but it was still better than the current overcompressed MP3-style cellphones. These modern voicecalls make your mom or grandma or whoever sound like they were "autotuned".
"Hey gramps, you sound just like Kanye West!" ;-) And it's only going to get worse as they shrink the voice line from 8 downto 4 downto 2 kbit/s streams, so they can squeeze more and more calls in their fixed bandwidth.
Copper and fiber are much better medium-distance and long-haul carriers
And multipliable. Wireless has ONE spectrum, and when it's full, it's full. No more room. Copper/fiber provides many spectrums - one per wire you lay down. It has near-infinite growth potential.
You're right. 3,000,000,000 gigabytes is a hell of a lot of data sent to 1/2 million homes every month.
- It's equivalent to send 60 million Bluray Discs to every home in Baltimore, every single month.
- And another 60 million Blurays to every home in Washington DC, every single month.
- And another 60 million to every home in Richmond Virginia, every single month...
times all 200 television markets. All at Zero cost to the consumers.
You're not a communist pinko. You just don't seem to realize that government is horribly inefficient, due to a white collar welfare mentality (people don't get laid off even when work is slow). I know. I work there. Or see the recent article about a UK website that cost ~100 million dollars per year to maintain. Rather than choose inefficient monopoly, I'd prefer to have a pro-choice solution between multiple corporations, all competing to make the pricetag as cheap as possible.
Also you used the roads as example, but for me that's an argument *against* government. Falling bridges, potholes, and ridiculous congestion because government is unwilling to add new highways (like an I-85 running parallel to I-95). Of course I can't think of a better alternative for roads due to their natural monopoly aspect, but that doesn't mean I want that model applies to communications.
And finally: You use water, sewer, power grid as secondary examples, but where I live NONE of these are government owned or operated. They are private, regulated companies. That's how we should treat folks like Comcast or Verizon.
At least the Radio and TV licensees give us free entertainment. They pay about $100,000 per year per channel, and charge nothing to access it. IMHO that automatically makes them a preferred option over giving that TV and FM band to Cell or Wireless companies that charge us.
why should most of the country suffer for what is an east coast centric problem?
Because over half the country lives on the east coast or northeast, where this problem occurs. Majority rules, right? Right. ;-)
I think you're being unnecesarily harsh towards C64 over what is, basically, a trivial matter. Channel or frequency. Who cares? Your pedantry reminds me of Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons.
Which is leaves a huge spread of frequencies between channel 12 and channel 13 that no one is using.
You are mistaken my friend. Channels 12 and 13 sit directly next to one another. There are NO free frequencies between channels 12 and 13. There's a small guard band of a few hertz, but that's not even wide enough to carry a dialup modem datalink (3000 hertz wide), much less a broadband internet connection.
You don't need an "open channel" because there IS space between frequencies channels are assigned to.
Flat wrong. My two most-watched channels are 10 and 11 and there is NO space in between them. I don't know where you got the idea there's space between channels???
You must be one of those persons who offers an opinion, but actually knows nothing about the subject.
About one week. Trying to watch the game on channel 10? Well too bad because the hacker kid next door is broadcasting over top of it. And even though FCC rules require people to turn off TV Band whitespace gadgets if they interfere with licensed TV reception, there's no way to enforce those rules. The kid can just ignore your request
.
No buffer bands. Two of my favorite channels 10 and 11 butt-up right next to one another, with only a few hertz of space between them. That's enough room to carry a dialup modem (3000 hertz wide) and nothing more.
Here's a quick off-the-top of my head list of all the channels I get for free. How the heck do you propose to squeeze all of these into only channels 2 to 25, per the FCC's just-released Broadband Plan to sell off everything above 25. Even with MPEG4 it would be impossible to keep all of these:
- MAJOR NETS: abc, cbs, fox, nbc, cw, mynettv, ion, pbs
- Other nets: univision, telemundo, telefutura
- independents: MINDtv, Megahertz, Link, a local religious station, a 20 hour shopping channel plus 4 hour news
- other national channels:
GetWell channel
This movie channel
NBC Weather
NBC sports
PBSkids
PBSworld
FOX News channel
Qubo
Worship
Smile of a Child
JCTV (teen channel)
Enlace (spanish)
TBN
RetroTV (70s/80s classics)
Family Channel (50s/60s classics)
FOX is now part of the "Big Four". In fact it came in 2nd place the last two years. Plus The CW network at number 5, MyNetworkTV number 6, and finally ION (dead last). PBS too.
You are correct.
The only channels currently not in use along Washington DC to New York City I95 corridor (and also including ?Harrisburg, Scranton) are 2, 3, 4, and 5. Everything else is reserved, leaving no room for whitespace TV Band Devices (TVBDs in FCC parlance).
Then you don't get TV.
The airwaves are the collective property of the American People (long with roads, air, and other common goods). They have a natural right to at least SOME of it being usable without cost, i.e. Free TV and Radio. Why should an Owner have to rent his own property? That makes little sense.
merchants should be seizing cards that say "Check ID" on the signature strip
Why??? I have DEMAND PHOTO ID written below my signature, so the clerk will ask to see my photo. Why should my card be seized jackass? It's MY card. I have the right to control who uses it (me only).
Not sure about CDs but most DVDs and Games have end-user licenses displayed when they start playing, or embedded in the manual. Who knows what they say? Perhaps: "This item may not be used for public performances, or for resale."
I don't know what US you are living in, but the one I live in does not limit the number of hours a week you work
He didn't say there was. Go back and reread what C64 actually said and try to comprehend it this time.
As for lawyers if the Tyson Chicken Factory had ~100 workers jump off the top of the building (due to extreme exhaustion) just since January 1st don't you think the lawyers would be buzzing around that place like bees? Of course they would. But Foxconn doesn't have to worry because there are no (or few) lawyers in China. Foxconn doesn't need to obey the laws like a US corporation must.
When you use PayPal, you waive your right to a chargeback and agree to use Paypal's "dispute resolution mechanism".
Although I prefer to use paypal's dispute resolution, when they are unable to recover the money (because seller emptied his account), then I call my credit card company. I've done several chargebacks on paypal purchases.
Can't speak for C64 but here's the cards I've got:
Discover - 1% off everything and 5% off hotels/food during the third quarter (July-to-Sept); 5% off department stores 4th quarter
Chase - 3% off gas, food, drugs; 1% everything else
AAA credit - 2% off gas plus free renewal of membership every year (worth $50)
And with zero scarcity driving the cost down to zero for all books, publishing will will go from dying to dead.
Precisely correct. ..... .....
Somebody else above you wrote:
Infinite supply is bad, so they artificially impose restrictions.
There is an infinite supply of Bits which represent these e-books, but there is not an infinite supply of authors. They still need to be compensated for their time and labor..... else they will quit being authors, go find factory jobs, and the output of new books will dwindle to nothing.
See? It's not an "artificial" restriction. We're talking about real people and real-world limits. You can't just enslave these people and make them write your entertainment free of charge. They must be compensated somehow, whether it's by you purchasing directly or the library purchasing the book & loaning it out (but with restrictions; like not being able to give it away to others). ..... .....
Another person wrote:
Ever since I was a victim of XCP there's no way I'll touch ANYTHING Sony makes.
By that reasoning, I would no longer be able to buy any product from any megacorp. Not Sony, not Nintendo, nor Microsoft, or even Apple. They have ALL harmed me at some point during the last 20 years. It's inevitable that a company will, from time to time, make a mistake and choosing to boycott them forever is an unrealistic response
.
Sony has devised a system of artificially restricting access to books, effectively a short-term, no end-user-cost license
It's the same thing as a library except you can't steal the book.
Precisely. Also it wasn't Sony that "devised" this system. Libraries devised the system hundreds of years ago when they said you can only keep your books for 14 days, and then you must return them. The fact "grub" opposes the E-book variant of this (you get a book 14 days and then it gets returned to the library) indicates to me that he's probably a thief. He thinks he should be able to download books for Free and keep them forever, thereby depriving the authors of compensation for their labor.
Maybe part of the Entitlement Generation? "I want what I want & not hav to pay. It hrts author incme? LOL. Frak themmmmmm"
.
Strawman argument. The grandparent poster never claimed a republic is "always" better than a monarchy.
All he said was he thought the 1600s UK Republic was better than the previous monarch that had existed (and abused the people). And I agree. Similarly the Roman Republic was superior to the previous Roman Kingdom of the 700-500 BC era. That's all he was saying. Obviously a Republic can be bad, like the former East German Socialist Republic, but we were discussing the UK and the merits of its various governments (monarch vs. republic) specifically.
By the way I find the whole concept of one person being supreme over everybody else as being foreign to my thoughts. The Queen is a human being. Nothing more. She shouldn't have that job, because she did nothing to earn it. The monarch should be altered to an elected position, chosen either by the People or the "governors" of each british county.
Or possibly eliminated altogether (there's really no need for a monarch or executive).