I'm not sure why more people don't consider Mozilla COmposer...I tried it out, it's not half bad... it's not FrontPage, but it's not half bad.:)
I think a lot of people are really scarred from Netscape Composer, and have consequently written off Mozilla Composer. Composer was really quite horrible for anything other than a middle school's website. BLINK BLINK BLINK. It does really simple sites fine, but the kind of folks that would prefer a simple black-on-white with blue link page would probably just do it the old fashioned way.
Did she design the Spinning Pizza of Death, in OS x?
I don't believe she did- the Spinner in OS X is a cleaned up version of the Spinning Winchester/CD of Death in NeXTSTEP, OpenStep and older version of OS X.
I agree- I think this product has a good potential to provide some thing fairly important than Linux has been missing.
At first, I thought that perhaps it shouldn't have been posted to Slashdot, at least not until the product is ready to ship/buy/download/use. But then again, Slashdot posts stories about interesting OSS/FS projects when they're in a larval stage, provided they're interesting. I see this as about the same thing, except it looks like this LPM software already exists to an extent- you just can't get it yet.
I was thinking of that- the site listed with the IPK for Konq for the Sharp ROM no longer carries IPKs- the directory listing is now blank. I'd love to try it, but I don't have the setup to compile it all myself.:/
I got a Zaurus SL-5500 with the posting of the awesome deal at HSN a week or two ago. It's an awesome machine, better than I expected coming from a Newton 2100.
One big beef I have: How the hell can I have more than one Opera web window open at a time?! You can on WinCE, and it sure seems silly for a Linux PDA with "so much more power" according to al lthe Linux and OPIE zealouts to not be able to have more than one browser window at a time.:P
You don't need to get a C64 emulator just to program in BASIC- there are plenty of free implementations tailored for all sorts of reasons, and quite a few intended for beginning programmers wanting to make cool stuff- simple graphics and the like. Kids like that kind of stuff usually, a high return for their time investment. Especially important with today's no-attention-span kids. I think some good experience programming could help with that though.:)
Other than that, there are a wealth of other environments which could also be fun as well as useful. There is Squeak Smalltalk, which has been used in education for almost 30 years. Most recently, there is the eToys system- which can be used by kids and adults a like for creating interactive, multi-media-ish setups by drawing/dragging your objects, assigning actions. You can do a lot without writing a line of code- but if you want to, the power of a full, mature language is at your disposal. Quite a combo!
Umm, I don't know anyone who calls anything object _orientated_" except for maybe frosh CS majors who really don't know how to code you.
It's "object oriented," and whether a language supports objects (and therefore OOP) or is fundamentally OO is just a question of the way the standard libraries present the language's capabilities to you. I've not been able to read the article and derive if they're rewriting the PHP libs to be object-based, or if they're just finally adding support for OOP.
Just curious, how can you have an object model without namespaces? Or interfaces for that matter? Isn't that like "New Car - with tires!"??
Plenty of OO languages do not have namespaces. It isn't vital to an object system in the least. They are handy, but far from neccesary.
Last I checked, you could only use SOAP to do this - has anyone tested how well that performs?
Last you checked, you could only do what with SOAP? RPC calls? from PHP to anything else? There are plenty of ways to do something analogous to SOAP, homebrew and pre-built, text (like SOAP or XML-RPC) or binary based.
(not that it matters, but you are donning the flamesuite, not "dawning" it.)
You're wrong. No script should cause the interpreter to seg, period. If there's an error condition, it should be reported. A segfault is a bug in the interpreter, no matter how buggy my code is.
Indeed- I think the person to which you are replying either a) is used to mightily shitty scripting languges or b) is used to C/C++, where segfaults show up unexpectedly all too often.
Naturally, someone else could tell you to take it to the next level, say goodbye to Ruby, and go with Smalltalk. All of the features (and more) of Ruby in a language that is quite a bit more mature, better acceptance in the world of business, and is generally a lot faster- often due to use of more modern VM technologies than "scripting" languages like Ruby, Perl, or Python generally use. Not to mention web app frameworks that only make you do the neccesary work- far beyond simple templating or anything you can get with Ruby.
That said, Ruby isn't bad, but if if you're advocating a switch from PHP->Ruby, one may as well finish the evolution and go to Smalltalk...
.NET bytecode? What kind of bytecode does.NET have? Perhaps what you meant was CLI bytecode?
Jesus man, no need to freak out. The bytecode that the.NET uses is that which the CLI VM interprets, yes. Was it that hard to understand what I meant?
Anyway, why bother with this if you have Java, working fairly well?
For the same reasons some people are interested in.NET as a means of development for one or multiple platforms. Many languages, interoping together, a decent API, cross-platform. You could use Java, but some people would rather program in a language they knew better already and is supported on.NET.
As I answered someone else, I know IE 5 for Mac OS supports ActiveX in some limited fashion. As to why, I'm not positive- perhaps IE5 for Mac OS can run those made with VB6, compiled to VB6 bytecode, while not being able to run components written in C++ which use the Win32 API.
I think ActiveX can rely largely on an x86 CPU and the Win32 API. I'm not positive, but I believe this is the case. I'm sure this will change with.NET- relying on the.NET bytecode rather than an actual CPU-arch. That said, there has to be some ActiveX components that must use VB6 bytecode or something- I know IE5 for Mac OS supports ActiveX, even though I don't think anywhere near as extensively as on IE on a PC.
Just write a driver yourself? In the case of ACPI, someone has already written perfectly fine support for it. But it is not being included in the kernel. It cannot be put into a module like drivers for other devices, but a kernel patch.
I use Dynapad, an OS/computing environment for PDAs that I am working on. I've done some playing of MP3s over the network within it, but not in a more regular WinCE app.
Dynapad/Squeak has an MP3 decoding plugin for fast MP3 and mpeg decoding. I have a mp3 app that plays songs via the network using FTP. It basically downloads one song past the one you are listening to, deletes it when you are done. Poor man's streaming.;P But then again, it uses regular MP3 quality rather than lower streaming quality. Works fine though! Dynapad works on both WinCE and Linux PDA (as well as most/all desktop platforms).
I'm not sure what a one could do as far as a regular WinCE user and regular WinCE apps. Have you looked around for apps that let you mount an FTP site/SMB/NFS and then just play the files through WMP? Does WMP do streaming?
A shame you never put it to good use- while slower, it sounds like it could really be a useful little machine. May be the best thing for our poster, running DOS or Linux.
Then get a DOS PDA and run an older DOS C compiler. GCC certainly doesn't run in 4 MB of RAM, not without using an enormous amount of swap. Yes, you *should* be able to do it, but with modern compilers, you can't. I used to run Turbo C on an XT with 640K of RAM- you can get these HP OmniGo PDAs with 1-2 MB on an XT (or 286, can't remember) procesor.
Nope. Not that runs on the PalmOS itself. Due to limitations of the PalmOS, there aren't too many "full-blown" programming environments available for it. Therei s LispMe and Quartus forth which are cool, and you can get a very stripped down Python. But nothing like what you can get for a WinCE or Linux PDA.
I think there are a few reaons the MobilePro models aren't more popular.
1. They run WinCE. Automaticly hated by people around these parts. (excluding me) Yes, Slashdot isn't the rest of the world, but... 2. They are large. Yes, they have a large, nice kb as a cause/result. But they're almost as big as a regular laptop- I think most people figure that if they're going to have something as big as a MP, they're just going to have a laptop. 3. They don't have a 206 MHz StrongARM. More importantly a SA in general. Most software for WinCE these days is for StrongARM, not MIPS. It's hard finding up to date sofware for the MIPS+HPC 2000. It's a lot easier to find stuff for the Jornada 720, 728, or 820 (bigger laptop formfactor of the Jornada 72x)- people are still maintaining H/PC 2000 packages for StrongARM. Also, with a couple DLLs, you can run packages meant for StrongARM PocketPCs, widely expanding the mass of available software. Can't do that on the MobilePros.
Last summer, I was looking for a WinCE device with a built in, touch-typeable keyboard. I was mostly looking at either the MobilePro 790 or the Jornada 720, and after a lot of reading, decided on the J720, for the above reasons and some others. I was a bit afraid the keyboard would be too small on the J720, but it's just big enough that I can touch-type on it, but just small enough that it fits in my pocket. Definately couldn't stash a MP790 in my pocket, that's for darn sure.:)
Forth is a pretty sweet little language. Most modern PDAs can definately handle language much more... bloated than it, although there are good implementations on all the PDA platforms. There is the Palm OS one as you mentioned, as well as a number of OSS/FS implementations for Linux PDAs. WinCE has a couple, the best probably being DSForth, which even compiles to machine code, all on the device. Quite slick.
Slashdot Mirror
I'm not sure why more people don't consider Mozilla COmposer...I tried it out, it's not half bad ... it's not FrontPage, but it's not half bad. :)
I think a lot of people are really scarred from Netscape Composer, and have consequently written off Mozilla Composer. Composer was really quite horrible for anything other than a middle school's website. BLINK BLINK BLINK. It does really simple sites fine, but the kind of folks that would prefer a simple black-on-white with blue link page would probably just do it the old fashioned way.
Did she design the Spinning Pizza of Death, in OS x?
I don't believe she did- the Spinner in OS X is a cleaned up version of the Spinning Winchester/CD of Death in NeXTSTEP, OpenStep and older version of OS X.
Ok, so who was the artist behind Jesus's logo?
I agree- I think this product has a good potential to provide some thing fairly important than Linux has been missing.
At first, I thought that perhaps it shouldn't have been posted to Slashdot, at least not until the product is ready to ship/buy/download/use. But then again, Slashdot posts stories about interesting OSS/FS projects when they're in a larval stage, provided they're interesting. I see this as about the same thing, except it looks like this LPM software already exists to an extent- you just can't get it yet.
I was thinking of that- the site listed with the IPK for Konq for the Sharp ROM no longer carries IPKs- the directory listing is now blank. I'd love to try it, but I don't have the setup to compile it all myself. :/
I got a Zaurus SL-5500 with the posting of the awesome deal at HSN a week or two ago. It's an awesome machine, better than I expected coming from a Newton 2100.
:P
One big beef I have: How the hell can I have more than one Opera web window open at a time?! You can on WinCE, and it sure seems silly for a Linux PDA with "so much more power" according to al lthe Linux and OPIE zealouts to not be able to have more than one browser window at a time.
You don't need to get a C64 emulator just to program in BASIC- there are plenty of free implementations tailored for all sorts of reasons, and quite a few intended for beginning programmers wanting to make cool stuff- simple graphics and the like. Kids like that kind of stuff usually, a high return for their time investment. Especially important with today's no-attention-span kids. I think some good experience programming could help with that though. :)
Other than that, there are a wealth of other environments which could also be fun as well as useful. There is Squeak Smalltalk, which has been used in education for almost 30 years. Most recently, there is the eToys system- which can be used by kids and adults a like for creating interactive, multi-media-ish setups by drawing/dragging your objects, assigning actions. You can do a lot without writing a line of code- but if you want to, the power of a full, mature language is at your disposal. Quite a combo!
I can't say I've compared Citrix to it, but TightVNC still leaves me wanting. Still putzy to use on a 10 mbit LAN for me... Alas.
Umm, I don't know anyone who calls anything object _orientated_" except for maybe frosh CS majors who really don't know how to code you.
It's "object oriented," and whether a language supports objects (and therefore OOP) or is fundamentally OO is just a question of the way the standard libraries present the language's capabilities to you. I've not been able to read the article and derive if they're rewriting the PHP libs to be object-based, or if they're just finally adding support for OOP.
Just curious, how can you have an object model without namespaces? Or interfaces for that matter? Isn't that like "New Car - with tires!"??
Plenty of OO languages do not have namespaces. It isn't vital to an object system in the least. They are handy, but far from neccesary.
Last I checked, you could only use SOAP to do this - has anyone tested how well that performs?
Last you checked, you could only do what with SOAP? RPC calls? from PHP to anything else? There are plenty of ways to do something analogous to SOAP, homebrew and pre-built, text (like SOAP or XML-RPC) or binary based.
(not that it matters, but you are donning the flamesuite, not "dawning" it.)
You're wrong. No script should cause the interpreter to seg, period. If there's an error condition, it should be reported. A segfault is a bug in the interpreter, no matter how buggy my code is.
Indeed- I think the person to which you are replying either a) is used to mightily shitty scripting languges or b) is used to C/C++, where segfaults show up unexpectedly all too often.
Nope, you can't beat Ruby with a stick, but you can beat it with a Smalltalk! ;)
Naturally, someone else could tell you to take it to the next level, say goodbye to Ruby, and go with Smalltalk. All of the features (and more) of Ruby in a language that is quite a bit more mature, better acceptance in the world of business, and is generally a lot faster- often due to use of more modern VM technologies than "scripting" languages like Ruby, Perl, or Python generally use. Not to mention web app frameworks that only make you do the neccesary work- far beyond simple templating or anything you can get with Ruby.
That said, Ruby isn't bad, but if if you're advocating a switch from PHP->Ruby, one may as well finish the evolution and go to Smalltalk...
.NET bytecode? What kind of bytecode does .NET have? Perhaps what you meant was CLI bytecode?
.NET uses is that which the CLI VM interprets, yes. Was it that hard to understand what I meant?
.NET as a means of development for one or multiple platforms. Many languages, interoping together, a decent API, cross-platform. You could use Java, but some people would rather program in a language they knew better already and is supported on .NET.
Jesus man, no need to freak out. The bytecode that the
Anyway, why bother with this if you have Java, working fairly well?
For the same reasons some people are interested in
As I answered someone else, I know IE 5 for Mac OS supports ActiveX in some limited fashion. As to why, I'm not positive- perhaps IE5 for Mac OS can run those made with VB6, compiled to VB6 bytecode, while not being able to run components written in C++ which use the Win32 API.
I think ActiveX can rely largely on an x86 CPU and the Win32 API. I'm not positive, but I believe this is the case. I'm sure this will change with .NET- relying on the .NET bytecode rather than an actual CPU-arch. That said, there has to be some ActiveX components that must use VB6 bytecode or something- I know IE5 for Mac OS supports ActiveX, even though I don't think anywhere near as extensively as on IE on a PC.
Wow, almost enough for me to want that over my land line. When you get unlimited data, at what speed can one expect for thoroughput?
Anyone had a look at this? What is development for the SideKick like? What kind of model/style? What language? Presumable C or C++.
(I'm a big platform/PDA nerd, yes)
Just write a driver yourself? In the case of ACPI, someone has already written perfectly fine support for it. But it is not being included in the kernel. It cannot be put into a module like drivers for other devices, but a kernel patch.
I use Dynapad, an OS/computing environment for PDAs that I am working on. I've done some playing of MP3s over the network within it, but not in a more regular WinCE app.
;P But then again, it uses regular MP3 quality rather than lower streaming quality. Works fine though! Dynapad works on both WinCE and Linux PDA (as well as most/all desktop platforms).
Dynapad/Squeak has an MP3 decoding plugin for fast MP3 and mpeg decoding. I have a mp3 app that plays songs via the network using FTP. It basically downloads one song past the one you are listening to, deletes it when you are done. Poor man's streaming.
I'm not sure what a one could do as far as a regular WinCE user and regular WinCE apps. Have you looked around for apps that let you mount an FTP site/SMB/NFS and then just play the files through WMP? Does WMP do streaming?
A shame you never put it to good use- while slower, it sounds like it could really be a useful little machine. May be the best thing for our poster, running DOS or Linux.
Then get a DOS PDA and run an older DOS C compiler. GCC certainly doesn't run in 4 MB of RAM, not without using an enormous amount of swap. Yes, you *should* be able to do it, but with modern compilers, you can't. I used to run Turbo C on an XT with 640K of RAM- you can get these HP OmniGo PDAs with 1-2 MB on an XT (or 286, can't remember) procesor.
Nope. Not that runs on the PalmOS itself. Due to limitations of the PalmOS, there aren't too many "full-blown" programming environments available for it. Therei s LispMe and Quartus forth which are cool, and you can get a very stripped down Python. But nothing like what you can get for a WinCE or Linux PDA.
I think there are a few reaons the MobilePro models aren't more popular.
:)
1. They run WinCE. Automaticly hated by people around these parts. (excluding me) Yes, Slashdot isn't the rest of the world, but...
2. They are large. Yes, they have a large, nice kb as a cause/result. But they're almost as big as a regular laptop- I think most people figure that if they're going to have something as big as a MP, they're just going to have a laptop.
3. They don't have a 206 MHz StrongARM. More importantly a SA in general. Most software for WinCE these days is for StrongARM, not MIPS. It's hard finding up to date sofware for the MIPS+HPC 2000. It's a lot easier to find stuff for the Jornada 720, 728, or 820 (bigger laptop formfactor of the Jornada 72x)- people are still maintaining H/PC 2000 packages for StrongARM. Also, with a couple DLLs, you can run packages meant for StrongARM PocketPCs, widely expanding the mass of available software. Can't do that on the MobilePros.
Last summer, I was looking for a WinCE device with a built in, touch-typeable keyboard. I was mostly looking at either the MobilePro 790 or the Jornada 720, and after a lot of reading, decided on the J720, for the above reasons and some others. I was a bit afraid the keyboard would be too small on the J720, but it's just big enough that I can touch-type on it, but just small enough that it fits in my pocket. Definately couldn't stash a MP790 in my pocket, that's for darn sure.
(you can run Linux on the J72x)
Forth is a pretty sweet little language. Most modern PDAs can definately handle language much more... bloated than it, although there are good implementations on all the PDA platforms. There is the Palm OS one as you mentioned, as well as a number of OSS/FS implementations for Linux PDAs. WinCE has a couple, the best probably being DSForth, which even compiles to machine code, all on the device. Quite slick.