Why is it that everyone on slashdot these days don't use question marks when asking questions. I've seen them in books and in magazines and have found them to be rather useful at worst. I think I'll prefer a question mark to a period when asking a question. Maybe, I won't look as dumb, but at least I won't have to go through the agrivation of creating mock paragraphs when at work.
Seriously though, when done well, touch screens can be great. Sorry, but Palms are overpriced electronic organizers, and not designed to be used as 'real' computers. If "casio pocket computers" run PocketPC there are a few programs, like CalliGrapher, that would make it great to use, but since you're identifying it by it's brand name rather than something useful like the platform, I can't be sure.
With good real handwriting recognition (not graffiti, or some other character recognition scheme)- like CalliGrapher (for PocketPC), PenOffice (for Windoze), or the Newton OS 2.x HWR one can enter text quite fast. I can easily enter 45+ WPM on my Newton. I could probably get faster than that on my iPAQ running CalliGrapher 6 if the screen weren't so damn small.
But then again, I wouldn't pay a $1000 premium for something as bulky as this, no doubt without decent software to manage input. I suppose you could install PenOffice on top of Windows XP, which is what this no doubt comes preloaded with. However, there is no real HWR for Linux, which is disapointing.
No, I get it. And sure I care. Since when does 'caring' mean that I have to whine like everyone else about not getting everything on a silver platter?
If they're providing source for free, it's most likely under some sort of open source license. That's where they get the moniker "open source;" because it's open and available. The issue here isn't making the source available- it's simple about people being pissy because they're not having it compiled in advance for them. Period.
But any Joe Sixpack- like you or me- could create this ISO for the packages with source provided. We don't know specifically those that will not have source, but AFAWK, it's all of them. So get over it, man. Arguing for it's own sake isn't worth the time.
Or maybe you just don't get it. I'd love to explain it again- just let me know what doesn't make sense to you.
And are Linuxiso and Cheapbytes the only ways to get CD images of distros? No. I provided Linuxiso as an example; s/Linuxiso/anyone's iso mirror FTP site/g.
So they don't want to provide binaries. Big deal- someone will compile it- some member of the community, and pass the ISO along to someone at linuxiso.org. Problem solved. I would argue that they aren't obliged to compile it for you, why should they? Because they use software harvested from the community? Ooooooh. Those UnitedLinux guys owe me lunch! Everything you could need from there is in the source.
Jeeze, get over it.
(No, this is not a troll. I just can't comprehend what is so terribly hard to comprehend about this.)
The big deal here isn't that the XScale *can* support both SD and CF, but that the model *does* support it, that they built physical slots to accept the media. That's what is cool.
There are a lot of us that aren't into the computer hotrod bullshit olympics. I want a computer, be it a desktop or a PDA, to just work. Be expandable of course, but with a PDA, being able to upgrade the processor, internal ROM and RAM isn't terribly important.
You may like to read about the ChipSlice, which is, if anything else, such a standard for upgrading and expanding a PDA. Really sweet sounding architecture- and as a plus it runs PicoGUI on top of Linux. PicoGUI definately kicks some asses.
The only modern PDA I've ever heard of that was able to accept CPU upgrades is the Newton 2x00 series. Cool, but not very important.
Hear hear! Since I moved to an iPAQ with it's measly 320@240 screen from a Newton 2100u with a 480@320 screen, I've wondered many times why the hell there's not at least one available PocketPC with a decently sized screen. On a PDA, I expect to be able to take notes- not just keep schedules. I'm not talking about jotting down a short grocery list, but taking college lecture notes. I can do that fine on my Newton. The software is to do so is available on PocketPC (CalliGrapher), but not the hardware.
Sure, there are laptop-style devices that run WinCE 3.0 with 640@480 screens, but they have a permenently attached keyboard. That doesn't cut it.
The 480@320 Clie screen is OK, but is still physically small, with a high DPI. I'd like to have a larger screen with a lower DPI. A comprable DPI to the Newton or the iPAQ. I want more space to write and display, damnit!
I know I'm in the minority, but I reap the benefits of a quite fast CPU in a PDA without playing games. I currently have PDAs with 206 MHz (iPAQ 3150) and 162 MHz (Newton 2100u) processors and utilize them without games. How? I use a PDA much like most people use a desktop computer. I do development (programming) on my PDAs. It's a way of doing what I want as far as coding, but without needing to be restrained by a desktop or even a laptop. It's a pain in the ass doing it on current PDAs- with their piddly 320@240 screens- but it's quite usable on a 480@320 screen, like on my Newton.
Heh, driven by the Devil's Software? Devil or no, there has to be pragmatist or two around here. There has to be a practical person or two around here. It's too bad about being so closed minded- Linux on a PDA sucks currently. I have no doubts that it'll get better, but I can't imagine using it for anything serious myself. Especially because of the complete lack of usable real handwriting recognition, or any projects that are working towards it [1].
And before some numbskull posts a link to wavvy or xstroke- those are character recognition programs, not HWR.
I'd love if there were though. On my iPAQ, I use PocketPC 2002. Sure, it gives me a dirty feeling, but at least I can use it for what I expect a PDA to do, rather than having just an overly expensive toy. If that's what you want though, that's fine- I just expect more I guess.
At least there's Qtopia, which in the right direction, I suppose. But rather like KDE and GNOME, seem to be working towards a Windows clone rather than what works best. It's still pretty rough, but it's better than nothing.
[1] If there is a fairly new project that is working towards this, please do prove me wrong, I'd love to hear about it.:)
Re:In past ages the philosphers...
on
Homogenized Music
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· Score: 2
Weird. Where I've lived, we didn't have anything for our college stations (770 AM RadioK or KUMD). They have shows at different times of the day and week. Sure, shedules change, but it's pretty consistent semester to semester. For my stations at least.
Communism isn't neccesarily monopoly of the state. There is such a thing as stateless communism, and it happens to be the 'government' which all humanity used for thousands and thousands of years. Still do in some places, those groups we've not assimilated or murdered. Yet.
Tyranny of the Majority is not something to be desired either.
Lucky us, we've got both in the US! Tyranny of the majority in our political matters, and monopolies in your economic matters! Yea!
Re:In past ages the philosphers...
on
Homogenized Music
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· Score: 1, Flamebait
Well, duh. Of course capitalism restricts human development- it's idea is that you gain profit, which is nothing but the money you get by exploiting people. Getting paid a fair wage for your work isn't profit, so, so all you working saps don't get mad and say "w311 1 g0tta eat!!!"
I'm sure you know this, but it's hugely surprising how many people don't. It's sad.
None of these are X11 alternatives on the level of SVGALIB or DirectFB, but a bit higher level. They require a low-level display medium like DirectFB, SDL, or X11 (but you can ignore that option for now).
Squeak Smalltalk: A cool Smalltalk environment. Based on Smalltalk-80, for which first modern WIMP was invented. Has a bunch of little apps, simple web browser, vt100 client, few email clients, web servers, a couple different GUI toolkits and programming paradigms to choose from. Personally, what I use mostly as my OS. I like having my entire environment available to me, to be changed as I like, in a very straightforward way. Rather like Emacs users, I suppose. Except Squeak is more customizable, and has full windowing system. Also can run as the OS, no Linux or X11. DirectFB, SDL, X11, Mac (9/X), Windows, Acorn, WinCE, BeOS and lots of other ports that all run the same binaries.
ETH Oberon: Implementation of the Oberon language - derived from Pascal and Modula, by Nick Wirth. Has it's own entire GUI system, like Squeak does. Can run as an OS, without Linux or X11. Also has a VNC client, so you could still run the X11 app or two that you still needed in a window.:)
PicoGUI: A really cool GUI system especially for PDAs and other embedded applications. Super fast. Bindings for C, Perl, and Python (I think). Linux FB and SDL ports, runs wherever they can. Not much in the way of apps thus far, but it's definitely alive and under pretty active development.
GTK+ on Direct FB: Can't say I've used this, but I imagine bindings for regular GTK+ work in this port, which makes for a lot of development options.
MicroWindows/Nano-X: Yet enother embedded GUI option. It's developer seems to be pushing for PDA, set-tops and such. Not many apps, but could be useful especially for custom apps.
Are there any worthwhile just-Java windowing systems out there? There are al ot of Java-OS projects, but none of them seem to have gotten past linking Kaffee with OSKit...
Probably others out there, but this is a good look at some options.
They wouldn't need to license NeWS. NeXT's DPS had those same capabilities as NeWS. NeXTSTEP and OpenStep's display system was Display PostScript, and one could run an app over the network by passing a -NSHost or -NXHost (depending on the version of *STEP) flag. Yes, X- or NeWS-like app networkability, not something VNC-like.
This fantastic ability was lost in the transition from DPS to Quartz, which is Display PDF. They didn't want to keep having to pay up to Adobe for those PS rights. They just didn't bother porting -NXHost to PDF from PostScript, I suppose. Damn shame though.
Actually, it's something I've wanted to work on for a while. I was going to write it in and for Squeak- one of the last tools I need before I can dump primitive systems like Mac OS X and Unix/X11. Like I said, Scribe can do this, to an extent. I don't know if there's a way to refer to cells within a table though, but it could definitely be added without pulling teeth.
Yeah, read-only, no prob. But there are times when I'll just use Word because I have to pass it around. Sucks, but what can you do?
Never used LyX. TeXShop or Emacs was always good enough for me, for what I do, which is pretty simple, mostly tables, \em \bf- very little math.
I'll wish for a thought-to-MIDI converter while we're at it!:P
I don't plan on it either. I use LaTeX and I dig it. But that doesn't solve the same problem as these Office suites do. Sure, everyone can read and print a PDF, but what about edit it, and send a revised version back to you? LaTeX savy people can work from your source document, yes, but most normal Office-users wouldn't have the slightest clue what to do with a LaTeX file.
I have Office v.X installed, because there are times when I need to do just this. You'd be surprised, even among CS profs, how few people know LaTeX enough to feel comfy editing your drafts written in it.
Also, there's no way to do something like a spreadsheet with LaTeX. However, in lambdaTeX or Scribe (in Scheme) something like this could be done, and for that reason, I plan on moving to Scribe eventually (over LaTeX). It can generate PDF, HTML and PS just like LaTeX, but has a more familiar (s-exp) syntax, and has a much more powerful language behind it, for doing calculations within your document. That said, I'd also welcome a LaTeX preprocessor that could do something similar... For instance:
\begin{worksheet}{c|c|c|c} \hline Name & Beer Drunk & Milk Drunk & Total Liquids \\ Me & 10 L & 12 L & \add{\cell{B2}, \cell{C2}} \\ You & 14 L & 2 L & \add{\cell{B3}, \cell{C3}} \\ \end{worksheet}
and so on... ugly as hell in LaTeX, but in something Lisplike, it could be a lot nicer-
(worksheet "c|c|c|c"
(hline)
Name & Beer Drunk & Milk Drunk & Total Liquids \\
Me & 10 L & 12 L & (+ B2 C2) \\
You & 14 L & 2 L & (+ B3 C3) \\ )
Go read your license. A lot of commercial software has a clause in the license that says it's illegal to resell the software+license to someone else without written consent. I wouldn't be surprised if Office was that way. The license itself should say.
Heh. "From scratch" in this case doesn't mean from a bunch of pre-built components. I suppose you figure you wrote your own OS because you were able to "make bzImage" a new kernel?
Just remembered something... Within the stock Squeak image, are some classes that go under the heading "StarSqueak." StarSqueak is a Squeak port/analog of StarLogo, a Logo dialect aimed at big Logo-driven simulations with many (hundreds-thousands) of "turtles." In the Squeak version, the coding of the "Turtles" (agents) and the world is done in Smalltalk, rather than logo. Info.
Slashdot Mirror
It's the public school system! I SWEAR! ;)
Why is it that everyone on slashdot these days don't use question marks when asking questions. I've seen them in books and in magazines and have found them to be rather useful at worst. I think I'll prefer a question mark to a period when asking a question. Maybe, I won't look as dumb, but at least I won't have to go through the agrivation of creating mock paragraphs when at work.
Seriously though, when done well, touch screens can be great. Sorry, but Palms are overpriced electronic organizers, and not designed to be used as 'real' computers. If "casio pocket computers" run PocketPC there are a few programs, like CalliGrapher, that would make it great to use, but since you're identifying it by it's brand name rather than something useful like the platform, I can't be sure.
With good real handwriting recognition (not graffiti, or some other character recognition scheme)- like CalliGrapher (for PocketPC), PenOffice (for Windoze), or the Newton OS 2.x HWR one can enter text quite fast. I can easily enter 45+ WPM on my Newton. I could probably get faster than that on my iPAQ running CalliGrapher 6 if the screen weren't so damn small.
But then again, I wouldn't pay a $1000 premium for something as bulky as this, no doubt without decent software to manage input. I suppose you could install PenOffice on top of Windows XP, which is what this no doubt comes preloaded with. However, there is no real HWR for Linux, which is disapointing.
No, I get it. And sure I care. Since when does 'caring' mean that I have to whine like everyone else about not getting everything on a silver platter?
If they're providing source for free, it's most likely under some sort of open source license. That's where they get the moniker "open source;" because it's open and available. The issue here isn't making the source available- it's simple about people being pissy because they're not having it compiled in advance for them. Period.
But any Joe Sixpack- like you or me- could create this ISO for the packages with source provided. We don't know specifically those that will not have source, but AFAWK, it's all of them. So get over it, man. Arguing for it's own sake isn't worth the time.
Or maybe you just don't get it. I'd love to explain it again- just let me know what doesn't make sense to you.
But ... but ... who will find the time to put it together with mkisofs?! OH THE HUMANITY!
;)
Man, it's sure sad when the AC trolls are the ones who are more and more telling the truth...
And are Linuxiso and Cheapbytes the only ways to get CD images of distros? No. I provided Linuxiso as an example; s/Linuxiso/anyone's iso mirror FTP site/g.
So they don't want to provide binaries. Big deal- someone will compile it- some member of the community, and pass the ISO along to someone at linuxiso.org. Problem solved. I would argue that they aren't obliged to compile it for you, why should they? Because they use software harvested from the community? Ooooooh. Those UnitedLinux guys owe me lunch! Everything you could need from there is in the source.
Jeeze, get over it.
(No, this is not a troll. I just can't comprehend what is so terribly hard to comprehend about this.)
Why? So you can sound 31337 and name-droppy without even being at your computer, or for a good reason? ;)
The big deal here isn't that the XScale *can* support both SD and CF, but that the model *does* support it, that they built physical slots to accept the media. That's what is cool.
There are a lot of us that aren't into the computer hotrod bullshit olympics. I want a computer, be it a desktop or a PDA, to just work. Be expandable of course, but with a PDA, being able to upgrade the processor, internal ROM and RAM isn't terribly important.
You may like to read about the ChipSlice, which is, if anything else, such a standard for upgrading and expanding a PDA. Really sweet sounding architecture- and as a plus it runs PicoGUI on top of Linux. PicoGUI definately kicks some asses.
The only modern PDA I've ever heard of that was able to accept CPU upgrades is the Newton 2x00 series. Cool, but not very important.
Hear hear! Since I moved to an iPAQ with it's measly 320@240 screen from a Newton 2100u with a 480@320 screen, I've wondered many times why the hell there's not at least one available PocketPC with a decently sized screen. On a PDA, I expect to be able to take notes- not just keep schedules. I'm not talking about jotting down a short grocery list, but taking college lecture notes. I can do that fine on my Newton. The software is to do so is available on PocketPC (CalliGrapher), but not the hardware.
Sure, there are laptop-style devices that run WinCE 3.0 with 640@480 screens, but they have a permenently attached keyboard. That doesn't cut it.
The 480@320 Clie screen is OK, but is still physically small, with a high DPI. I'd like to have a larger screen with a lower DPI. A comprable DPI to the Newton or the iPAQ. I want more space to write and display, damnit!
I know I'm in the minority, but I reap the benefits of a quite fast CPU in a PDA without playing games. I currently have PDAs with 206 MHz (iPAQ 3150) and 162 MHz (Newton 2100u) processors and utilize them without games. How? I use a PDA much like most people use a desktop computer. I do development (programming) on my PDAs. It's a way of doing what I want as far as coding, but without needing to be restrained by a desktop or even a laptop. It's a pain in the ass doing it on current PDAs- with their piddly 320@240 screens- but it's quite usable on a 480@320 screen, like on my Newton.
Heh, driven by the Devil's Software? Devil or no, there has to be pragmatist or two around here. There has to be a practical person or two around here. It's too bad about being so closed minded- Linux on a PDA sucks currently. I have no doubts that it'll get better, but I can't imagine using it for anything serious myself. Especially because of the complete lack of usable real handwriting recognition, or any projects that are working towards it [1].
:)
And before some numbskull posts a link to wavvy or xstroke- those are character recognition programs, not HWR.
I'd love if there were though. On my iPAQ, I use PocketPC 2002. Sure, it gives me a dirty feeling, but at least I can use it for what I expect a PDA to do, rather than having just an overly expensive toy. If that's what you want though, that's fine- I just expect more I guess.
At least there's Qtopia, which in the right direction, I suppose. But rather like KDE and GNOME, seem to be working towards a Windows clone rather than what works best. It's still pretty rough, but it's better than nothing.
[1] If there is a fairly new project that is working towards this, please do prove me wrong, I'd love to hear about it.
Heh.
Weird. Where I've lived, we didn't have anything for our college stations (770 AM RadioK or KUMD). They have shows at different times of the day and week. Sure, shedules change, but it's pretty consistent semester to semester. For my stations at least.
Communism isn't neccesarily monopoly of the state. There is such a thing as stateless communism, and it happens to be the 'government' which all humanity used for thousands and thousands of years. Still do in some places, those groups we've not assimilated or murdered. Yet.
Tyranny of the Majority is not something to be desired either.
Lucky us, we've got both in the US! Tyranny of the majority in our political matters, and monopolies in your economic matters! Yea!
Well, duh. Of course capitalism restricts human development- it's idea is that you gain profit, which is nothing but the money you get by exploiting people. Getting paid a fair wage for your work isn't profit, so, so all you working saps don't get mad and say "w311 1 g0tta eat!!!"
I'm sure you know this, but it's hugely surprising how many people don't. It's sad.
Keep it real.
None of these are X11 alternatives on the level of SVGALIB or DirectFB, but a bit higher level. They require a low-level display medium like DirectFB, SDL, or X11 (but you can ignore that option for now).
:)
Squeak Smalltalk: A cool Smalltalk environment. Based on Smalltalk-80, for which first modern WIMP was invented. Has a bunch of little apps, simple web browser, vt100 client, few email clients, web servers, a couple different GUI toolkits and programming paradigms to choose from. Personally, what I use mostly as my OS. I like having my entire environment available to me, to be changed as I like, in a very straightforward way. Rather like Emacs users, I suppose. Except Squeak is more customizable, and has full windowing system. Also can run as the OS, no Linux or X11. DirectFB, SDL, X11, Mac (9/X), Windows, Acorn, WinCE, BeOS and lots of other ports that all run the same binaries.
ETH Oberon: Implementation of the Oberon language - derived from Pascal and Modula, by Nick Wirth. Has it's own entire GUI system, like Squeak does. Can run as an OS, without Linux or X11. Also has a VNC client, so you could still run the X11 app or two that you still needed in a window.
PicoGUI: A really cool GUI system especially for PDAs and other embedded applications. Super fast. Bindings for C, Perl, and Python (I think). Linux FB and SDL ports, runs wherever they can. Not much in the way of apps thus far, but it's definitely alive and under pretty active development.
QT/Embedded: You know, like runs on the Zaurus.
GTK+ on Direct FB: Can't say I've used this, but I imagine bindings for regular GTK+ work in this port, which makes for a lot of development options.
MicroWindows/Nano-X: Yet enother embedded GUI option. It's developer seems to be pushing for PDA, set-tops and such. Not many apps, but could be useful especially for custom apps.
Are there any worthwhile just-Java windowing systems out there? There are al ot of Java-OS projects, but none of them seem to have gotten past linking Kaffee with OSKit...
Probably others out there, but this is a good look at some options.
They wouldn't need to license NeWS. NeXT's DPS had those same capabilities as NeWS. NeXTSTEP and OpenStep's display system was Display PostScript, and one could run an app over the network by passing a -NSHost or -NXHost (depending on the version of *STEP) flag. Yes, X- or NeWS-like app networkability, not something VNC-like.
This fantastic ability was lost in the transition from DPS to Quartz, which is Display PDF. They didn't want to keep having to pay up to Adobe for those PS rights. They just didn't bother porting -NXHost to PDF from PostScript, I suppose. Damn shame though.
> Looks like you found yourself a new project ;)
:P
Actually, it's something I've wanted to work on for a while. I was going to write it in and for Squeak- one of the last tools I need before I can dump primitive systems like Mac OS X and Unix/X11. Like I said, Scribe can do this, to an extent. I don't know if there's a way to refer to cells within a table though, but it could definitely be added without pulling teeth.
Yeah, read-only, no prob. But there are times when I'll just use Word because I have to pass it around. Sucks, but what can you do?
Never used LyX. TeXShop or Emacs was always good enough for me, for what I do, which is pretty simple, mostly tables, \em \bf- very little math.
I'll wish for a thought-to-MIDI converter while we're at it!
Exactly my point. :)
I don't plan on it either. I use LaTeX and I dig it. But that doesn't solve the same problem as these Office suites do. Sure, everyone can read and print a PDF, but what about edit it, and send a revised version back to you? LaTeX savy people can work from your source document, yes, but most normal Office-users wouldn't have the slightest clue what to do with a LaTeX file.
I have Office v.X installed, because there are times when I need to do just this. You'd be surprised, even among CS profs, how few people know LaTeX enough to feel comfy editing your drafts written in it.
Also, there's no way to do something like a spreadsheet with LaTeX. However, in lambdaTeX or Scribe (in Scheme) something like this could be done, and for that reason, I plan on moving to Scribe eventually (over LaTeX). It can generate PDF, HTML and PS just like LaTeX, but has a more familiar (s-exp) syntax, and has a much more powerful language behind it, for doing calculations within your document. That said, I'd also welcome a LaTeX preprocessor that could do something similar... For instance:
\begin{worksheet}{c|c|c|c}
\hline
Name & Beer Drunk & Milk Drunk & Total Liquids \\
Me & 10 L & 12 L & \add{\cell{B2},
\cell{C2}} \\
You & 14 L & 2 L & \add{\cell{B3},
\cell{C3}} \\
\end{worksheet}
and so on... ugly as hell in LaTeX, but in something Lisplike, it could be a lot nicer-
(worksheet "c|c|c|c"
(hline)
Name & Beer Drunk & Milk Drunk & Total Liquids \\
Me & 10 L & 12 L & (+ B2 C2) \\
You & 14 L & 2 L & (+ B3 C3) \\
)
Man, that'd rule.
Go read your license. A lot of commercial software has a clause in the license that says it's illegal to resell the software+license to someone else without written consent. I wouldn't be surprised if Office was that way. The license itself should say.
Heh. "From scratch" in this case doesn't mean from a bunch of pre-built components. I suppose you figure you wrote your own OS because you were able to "make bzImage" a new kernel?
Just remembered something... Within the stock Squeak image, are some classes that go under the heading "StarSqueak." StarSqueak is a Squeak port/analog of StarLogo, a Logo dialect aimed at big Logo-driven simulations with many (hundreds-thousands) of "turtles." In the Squeak version, the coding of the "Turtles" (agents) and the world is done in Smalltalk, rather than logo. Info.