>Some API's like netfilter and nfqueue may or may not be even provided, or may be in decrepit forms with deprecated warnings flying everywhere.
Recompile the kernel to have a stable api you want, linux isnt "one size fits all", different distros have different kernel options. but usually related distros have close kernel options (routers distros have close configs, as desktop distos also have closed configs). What mainline distro dont have netfilter support? also, new features is different, dont expect that older kernels magically support new features. some distros may backport, but its rare.
> Others libs like libcrypto have (...) that is not a kernel API
>Dream on. And even with the docs, you won't be able to do a better job than Nvidia themselves as they have all the experts.
hey, right, there are no more people in the world, nvidia have then all. look at the nouveau developers have made a amazing job, without any docs. look at the radeon driver, in several places is already equivalent to the fglrx (both windows and linux) (sadly other are lagging a lot), so there are other experts out there, all its needed is time.
>Probably because they have the most to lose. If they opened it up, I'm sure the clone market would be really happy.
yep, right, we are full of intel and ati clones out there!! not only building hardware is a lot different than software, but also open how a hardware works with the software makes almost no difference for whatever want to clone the hardware. everyone knows how a x86 works... do you see any clone, other than those that registered in the very start (via and amd)?
>Perhaps if Linux made a stable and consistent API for drivers, one which didn't constantly churn, a greater number of proprietary drivers would be able to settle and become stable,
yep, that helped the windows drivers being stable Windows drivers only start to improve the quality when MS start to certificate drivers and ship with many generic and certificated drivers
>Nvidia could very easily drop all support for desktop Linux if they wanted,
right, dream on, they would lose a huge market for they professional cards and probably higher for for CUDA/GPU processing. for me, i wouldnt care much if nvidia dropped linux, many developers that are happy with nvidia blob would start to think about helping improving the open source ones and NVIDIA would have to help the open sources one or lose the linux market.
>Linus should be thankful they bother to play his petty games. you are totally out of the linux reality... Linus dont play games
kernel developers dont change internal APIs randomly just because they like it. they change the kernel and those changes meed different interfaces. having a stable internal API requires emulations of old interfaces, so wasting kernel developers time and resources to keep something that doesnt want to work together with the kernel. why bother then?! Drivers that are in the kernel have the kernel developers help to update to the new interfaces, outside drivers must support the themselves that and pay for that decision.
If NVIDIA pays someone to keep a stable internal API in the kernel, hey, maybe it was accepted, but people wont have lot of works to help nvidia and getting nothing back (no money, no drivers, no specifications)
i agree with the features, open source one are still lacking. Both intel and amd open the drivers too late and are still catching up. Mesa had little support for many years and XFree86 lock down didnt help. Is not easy to fast forward to current GL specifications. More developers are needed to increase the rate of this recovery. Without MESA support for newer GL versions, drivers cant also develop their support, its need to be developed on both ends, debugged and optimized. all this makes the all cacth up story slower
sorry, but that is not a kernel problem, its a package management and version problem. no where i said that supporting various distros is easy.
both open source and close source program have this problem, totally different from the kernel internal api changing. the kernel user is stable, even between distros and kernel versions.
you have plenty of laptops with amd/ati graphic cards, from low end to high end those laptops also come with cpus from amd and intel, so no excuse about wrong cpu.
what makes you believe that reverse engineering isn't possible and not done by all companies? yes, its harder than reading the source, but the open source drivers arent also based on the closed one, so the open source ones will not give you that information, at very least you would need to look at the firmware (closed source and that you can also extract from the closed source driver)
Apps have a stable API, so non-FOSS software can work fine with linux...
now DRIVERS have to comply with the kernel API, that might not be stable over time and can change... hardware builders should integrate their drivers in the kernel tree or suffer the pain of outside development. Its their choice, having to work together with the community and have the pain for legal process and code cleanup (not all trash is accepted in the kernel) is harder in the beginning, but will pay off for everyone (users, developers and company) on the long run... or play dumb and keep the closed driver and keep updating it when things change.
Releasing the hardware papers will allow the community to develop their drivers without the company have to work much, so between open source drivers, papers or close source drivers, the company have a lot to choose.
Most companies choose the first or at every least, release some papers or demo driver. They are seen as heros. Nvidia is one of the few that choose closed sources drivers and so earns the hate of many users and the kernel developers.
Again, its their choice. Also, its the user choice to buy their cards or not. i personally prefer open drivers and stability over better performance and locked in over on my own machine. other might have other opinions.
finally Linus dont have a hidden agenda, he cares only about the kernel and closed source drivers make very hard to almost impossible to debug problems. He choose GPL as a license as it protect his work from being abused by others. Linus didnt even wanted to migrate to GPL V3, so is clearly dont have a hidden agenda. Again, if NVIDIA dont like the kernel license, they can choose to work only with *BSD kernels.
i dont know much more than you, but from what read, its a measure of cosmic rays and it starting to increase fast... so it looks that there is less resistance for then to travel. That can be explained as a lower particles density around and so that Voyager is entering a bigger void (/dev/null even more empty if you prefer):) The rapid increase indicates a "frontier" as opposite to a very smooth increase, that would indicate a slow fade and harder to detect solar system limits.
Someone with more knowledge can correct be if i miss by a large margin:)
right, as no bank ever gone bankrupt and no one lost money!!
you lose money above certain limits, the insurance DO NOT covers all the money... so yep, you depend always on the believe that everything is alright.
Banks have a lot more control and failovers than bitcoin, but is a matter on how much money they have and their influence on the economy... if everyone used bitcoins, for sure brokers would have more insurances.
also, remember that money you have on your pocket (file, in the bitcoin case) is your responsibility, if you get robbed, you will lose the money in both cases.
i want to change the window buttons to put the close on the left and stick,minimize and maximize on the right. Focus follow mouse, auto-hide the slit/pager/toolbar. all this can be done on KDE, but KDE have Tabs support, i want to group apps as i need then. i'm still amazed how to little WM support tabs
i also dont like the number of process kde runs in the background, where many of then eat VM memory (Virtual memory, not resident memory), requiring a large swap to a machine with high uptime and many apps. Nepomuk and akonadi are resources waste.
example: kiinit is right now eating 1.3GB of Virtual memory
dont know if it required -current or not, but you can go back in the blog to find the latest kde release that works on -stable (or just upgrade to -current)
usually there is a -stable release once a year, but this time the 13.37 version is taking longer to be replaced. many people use the -current directly, it's almost just as stable, as long you read the changelog before updating things
the -current is using firefox 12 (and the new firefox 13 should go out in a few days) and kernel is 3.2.13 and the kde is 4.8.2
finally, the $SLACKWARE_VERSION.$KERNEL_VERSION is just a joke, for people like you (that take things way too seriously) to accept the 13.37 version number without protesting:)
slackware always have fun with version numbers, it jumped from slackware 4 to 7 (to joke about version race from other distros) , slackware 13.37 , with RC 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716. and RC 4.6692. (the first Feigenbaum constant) Pat and many slackers are believers of the Church of the Subgenius:}P
and they use it long ago... and what did those companies do to improve *bsd systems? it goes from very little to not enough even google contributed more than ixsystems.com, a top *bsd user!! Netapp products make money from *bsd, but yet they are very, very low in that list
BSD have this fault, companies take the code, but contribute very little back and only look back to take yet more code
yep, you are right, RSA isnt a major company, that dont have as its clients most of the other majors companies and governments... stolen RSA IDs couldnt be used to acces to important information...
not, EMC wasnt hacked, and the source for vmware stolen... so you are safe in thousand of companies and corporation that use ESX in trust that their platform is safe and trusted...
and dont forget you are always save with the encryption, certificates are safe, no one can issue rogue certificates and decrypt your data
i cant discuss about your taste, but a test game is your proof on with browser is the best!?
i bet that the game doesnt run because you dont have the 3D hardware acceleration enable on your mac... chrome have workaround many opengl bugs, firefox choose to enable only 3D on know to be safe graphic drivers.
anyway, as long as a browser respect the standards, you can use what ever you want:)
ok, right, a nuclear meltdown isnt a nuclear detonation, but look at the numbers... most of the kills were after the detonation, by radioactivity effects.. when a nuclear fission goes out of control it will destroy its container and release radioactive particles... how many Kg dangerous material you have in a nuclear reactor, compared with the two first atomic bombs?
atomic bombs have a higher destruction level, but nuclear reactor have a higher level of potential radioactive poisoning over a much wider region
yeh, right... the atomic bombs killed a lot more than 19,300, directly killed by the detonation range from 40000 to 75000... long term deads where even higher:
90,000–166,000 killed in Hiroshima 60,000–80,000 killed in Nagasaki
and the nuclear fallout would spread all over the world...nope, you need to protect the nuclear reactors... better yet, dont even build then, long term analysis points to renewable energies as a better solutions, specially if we manage to do local and micro production instead of a huge central one
how is that different from the boss wanting to use firefox and you dont allow it?
if a management asks for a browser, if its important/powerful enough, you will install it, if not, you can say no... if you allow user installed browsers, if the management is its important/powerful enough, you will support it, if not, you can say no...
Slashdot Mirror
>Some API's like netfilter and nfqueue may or may not be even provided, or may be in decrepit forms with deprecated warnings flying everywhere.
Recompile the kernel to have a stable api you want, linux isnt "one size fits all", different distros have different kernel options. but usually related distros have close kernel options (routers distros have close configs, as desktop distos also have closed configs). What mainline distro dont have netfilter support?
also, new features is different, dont expect that older kernels magically support new features. some distros may backport, but its rare.
> Others libs like libcrypto have (...)
that is not a kernel API
>Dream on. And even with the docs, you won't be able to do a better job than Nvidia themselves as they have all the experts.
hey, right, there are no more people in the world, nvidia have then all.
look at the nouveau developers have made a amazing job, without any docs.
look at the radeon driver, in several places is already equivalent to the fglrx (both windows and linux) (sadly other are lagging a lot), so there are other experts out there, all its needed is time.
>Probably because they have the most to lose. If they opened it up, I'm sure the clone market would be really happy.
yep, right, we are full of intel and ati clones out there!!
not only building hardware is a lot different than software, but also open how a hardware works with the software makes almost no difference for whatever want to clone the hardware. everyone knows how a x86 works... do you see any clone, other than those that registered in the very start (via and amd)?
>Perhaps if Linux made a stable and consistent API for drivers, one which didn't constantly churn, a greater number of proprietary drivers would be able to settle and become stable,
yep, that helped the windows drivers being stable
Windows drivers only start to improve the quality when MS start to certificate drivers and ship with many generic and certificated drivers
>Nvidia could very easily drop all support for desktop Linux if they wanted,
right, dream on, they would lose a huge market for they professional cards and probably higher for for CUDA/GPU processing.
for me, i wouldnt care much if nvidia dropped linux, many developers that are happy with nvidia blob would start to think about helping improving the open source ones and NVIDIA would have to help the open sources one or lose the linux market.
>Linus should be thankful they bother to play his petty games. ... Linus dont play games
you are totally out of the linux reality
kernel developers dont change internal APIs randomly just because they like it. they change the kernel and those changes meed different interfaces. having a stable internal API requires emulations of old interfaces, so wasting kernel developers time and resources to keep something that doesnt want to work together with the kernel. why bother then?! Drivers that are in the kernel have the kernel developers help to update to the new interfaces, outside drivers must support the themselves that and pay for that decision.
If NVIDIA pays someone to keep a stable internal API in the kernel, hey, maybe it was accepted, but people wont have lot of works to help nvidia and getting nothing back (no money, no drivers, no specifications)
i agree with the features, open source one are still lacking.
Both intel and amd open the drivers too late and are still catching up. Mesa had little support for many years and XFree86 lock down didnt help. Is not easy to fast forward to current GL specifications. More developers are needed to increase the rate of this recovery.
Without MESA support for newer GL versions, drivers cant also develop their support, its need to be developed on both ends, debugged and optimized. all this makes the all cacth up story slower
sorry, but that is not a kernel problem, its a package management and version problem. no where i said that supporting various distros is easy.
both open source and close source program have this problem, totally different from the kernel internal api changing. the kernel user is stable, even between distros and kernel versions.
what is wrong with laptops with amd/ati cards?
you have plenty of laptops with amd/ati graphic cards, from low end to high end
those laptops also come with cpus from amd and intel, so no excuse about wrong cpu.
To make things equivalent, here is the source for my open source Bluetooth pin reminder:
echo "0000"
you can now extract the pin from the source.
the bank account is still closed source, sorry, you will have to guess it!
what makes you believe that reverse engineering isn't possible and not done by all companies? yes, its harder than reading the source, but the open source drivers arent also based on the closed one, so the open source ones will not give you that information, at very least you would need to look at the firmware (closed source and that you can also extract from the closed source driver)
Apps have a stable API, so non-FOSS software can work fine with linux...
now DRIVERS have to comply with the kernel API, that might not be stable over time and can change... hardware builders should integrate their drivers in the kernel tree or suffer the pain of outside development. Its their choice, having to work together with the community and have the pain for legal process and code cleanup (not all trash is accepted in the kernel) is harder in the beginning, but will pay off for everyone (users, developers and company) on the long run... or play dumb and keep the closed driver and keep updating it when things change.
Releasing the hardware papers will allow the community to develop their drivers without the company have to work much, so between open source drivers, papers or close source drivers, the company have a lot to choose.
Most companies choose the first or at every least, release some papers or demo driver. They are seen as heros.
Nvidia is one of the few that choose closed sources drivers and so earns the hate of many users and the kernel developers.
Again, its their choice. Also, its the user choice to buy their cards or not.
i personally prefer open drivers and stability over better performance and locked in over on my own machine. other might have other opinions.
finally Linus dont have a hidden agenda, he cares only about the kernel and closed source drivers make very hard to almost impossible to debug problems. He choose GPL as a license as it protect his work from being abused by others. Linus didnt even wanted to migrate to GPL V3, so is clearly dont have a hidden agenda.
Again, if NVIDIA dont like the kernel license, they can choose to work only with *BSD kernels.
"oh my god!! its full of bugs out there"
IE7 its much better than than IE6, but compared with IE8, firefox and chrome, it's very buggy, making harder to use the newest web technologies.
i dont know much more than you, but from what read, its a measure of cosmic rays and it starting to increase fast... so it looks that there is less resistance for then to travel. That can be explained as a lower particles density around and so that Voyager is entering a bigger void (/dev/null even more empty if you prefer) :)
The rapid increase indicates a "frontier" as opposite to a very smooth increase, that would indicate a slow fade and harder to detect solar system limits.
Someone with more knowledge can correct be if i miss by a large margin :)
right, as no bank ever gone bankrupt and no one lost money!!
you lose money above certain limits, the insurance DO NOT covers all the money... so yep, you depend always on the believe that everything is alright.
Banks have a lot more control and failovers than bitcoin, but is a matter on how much money they have and their influence on the economy... if everyone used bitcoins, for sure brokers would have more insurances.
also, remember that money you have on your pocket (file, in the bitcoin case) is your responsibility, if you get robbed, you will lose the money in both cases.
strange, i put money in a bank, get some interest back... but then the bank starts to demand payment for services, for accounts, for transfers, etc...
And different banks have different interest rates, so you also "pay" by getting more or less interest
so yes, if you use a bank, you are always paying something, no matter what
I use fluxbox, with fluxter as a pager.
i want to change the window buttons to put the close on the left and stick,minimize and maximize on the right. Focus follow mouse, auto-hide the slit/pager/toolbar. all this can be done on KDE, but KDE have Tabs support, i want to group apps as i need then. i'm still amazed how to little WM support tabs
i also dont like the number of process kde runs in the background, where many of then eat VM memory (Virtual memory, not resident memory), requiring a large swap to a machine with high uptime and many apps. Nepomuk and akonadi are resources waste.
example: kiinit is right now eating 1.3GB of Virtual memory
-stable is dated, you can try to load the kde 4.8.4 from alienbob:
http://alien.slackbook.org/blog/kde-4-8-4-last-in-the-4-8-series/
dont know if it required -current or not, but you can go back in the blog to find the latest kde release that works on -stable (or just upgrade to -current)
That is the -stable version, released more than one year ago... check the -current version instead:
http://www.slackware.com/changelog/current.php?cpu=x86_64
usually there is a -stable release once a year, but this time the 13.37 version is taking longer to be replaced. many people use the -current directly, it's almost just as stable, as long you read the changelog before updating things
the -current is using firefox 12 (and the new firefox 13 should go out in a few days) and kernel is 3.2.13 and the kde is 4.8.2
finally, the $SLACKWARE_VERSION.$KERNEL_VERSION is just a joke, for people like you (that take things way too seriously) to accept the 13.37 version number without protesting :)
slackware always have fun with version numbers, it jumped from slackware 4 to 7 (to joke about version race from other distros) , slackware 13.37 , with RC 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716. and RC 4.6692. (the first Feigenbaum constant) :}P
Pat and many slackers are believers of the Church of the Subgenius
please keep using your distro, you know nothing about slackware development cycle and how most things happens in the background
if you really want to understand a little, just search slashdot for slackware and read the last story about slackware problems with the web server.
the next release is always: "when its ready" ... not sooner, not later
and they use it long ago... and what did those companies do to improve *bsd systems? it goes from very little to not enough
even google contributed more than ixsystems.com, a top *bsd user!!
Netapp products make money from *bsd, but yet they are very, very low in that list
BSD have this fault, companies take the code, but contribute very little back and only look back to take yet more code
Just install a tabbed windows manager, like fluxbox and you get tabs everywhere...
Arm ISA situation and see wow, you really do have to get an Arm license
AHAHAHAHAHA! HAHAHAHAHA AHHA!!!! ... Please stop.... HAHA... getting a ARM license... HAHAH... stop, you are killing me!! :)
yep, you are right, RSA isnt a major company, that dont have as its clients most of the other majors companies and governments... stolen RSA IDs couldnt be used to acces to important information...
not, EMC wasnt hacked, and the source for vmware stolen... so you are safe in thousand of companies and corporation that use ESX in trust that their platform is safe and trusted...
and dont forget you are always save with the encryption, certificates are safe, no one can issue rogue certificates and decrypt your data
hey, you already created my username and setup my personal password?! ! how did you know then!?
I will teach you a lesson, i'm doing pipe the /dev/zero to your HD right now!!
i cant discuss about your taste, but a test game is your proof on with browser is the best!?
i bet that the game doesnt run because you dont have the 3D hardware acceleration enable on your mac... chrome have workaround many opengl bugs, firefox choose to enable only 3D on know to be safe graphic drivers.
anyway, as long as a browser respect the standards, you can use what ever you want :)
ok, right, a nuclear meltdown isnt a nuclear detonation, but look at the numbers... most of the kills were after the detonation, by radioactivity effects.. when a nuclear fission goes out of control it will destroy its container and release radioactive particles... how many Kg dangerous material you have in a nuclear reactor, compared with the two first atomic bombs?
atomic bombs have a higher destruction level, but nuclear reactor have a higher level of potential radioactive poisoning over a much wider region
yeh, right... the atomic bombs killed a lot more than 19,300, directly killed by the detonation range from 40000 to 75000... long term deads where even higher:
90,000–166,000 killed in Hiroshima
60,000–80,000 killed in Nagasaki
and the nuclear fallout would spread all over the world...nope, you need to protect the nuclear reactors... better yet, dont even build then, long term analysis points to renewable energies as a better solutions, specially if we manage to do local and micro production instead of a huge central one
how is that different from the boss wanting to use firefox and you dont allow it?
if a management asks for a browser, if its important/powerful enough, you will install it, if not, you can say no...
if you allow user installed browsers, if the management is its important/powerful enough, you will support it, if not, you can say no...
see... no difference at all!!