That's an interesting presumption. Does cell-phone coverage/usage imply that the users have smartphones? Has that technology filtered down to the poorer strata?
It's a heart-warming feeling that technological progress is enabling the poor masses. Yeah, why don't we see more pictures on instagram of poor Liberian street urchins?
Maybe I'm just jaded, but it feels like the Ebola scare is being hyped because it would be convenient if everyone forgot about ISIS, Ukraine, and how James Clapper should be charged for perjury.
Don't get me wrong. It's a terrible thing, and a risk to the USA. But it's not that big of a risk. And there are more important things that should be vieing for prime-time on the news reels.
Oh, whoa, sorry about that kneejerk reaction. You weren't talking about the president. "himself" is referencing Ross Ulbritch. You're saying that his ordering a hit, presumably on other criminals, was self-defense.
Yeah, no, that's silly. Not quite the war-mongering sort of bad, but it's laughable to think that paying someone to go out, find, and murder someone else is a a form of self-defense.
I don't think you understand what this generator is doing. It extends the range of the car. The exact opposite of your complaint. You know how you have to worry about the range of your electric car? A generator removes that worry, because it turns the electric car into an in-series hybrid. You just have to plug it in. You have as much range as you want as long as you can find a gas station and have a few minutes to gas up.
heavy trailer
a generator powerful enough to recharge your car sufficiently while it drives is going to be fairly large/heavy.
Uh... a heavy trailer is the sort of thing you get from UHAUL. This thing would be about of small as you could make a trailer. Any smaller and you'd want it on a roof-rack, or like one of those bike-racks they have on the back of cars. A generator "powerful enough" would probably be along the lines of... you know... a car engine. Like that little thing in a Prius. Because it's moving your car.
just to keep the car light and maximize its range that way.
And that maximum is not going to satisfy the conspiracy of eric. A generator on a trailer appeases a swath of users that occasionally want to travel interstate distances.
My dad had this idea years ago. Why hitch up a trailer with a generator in it? I mean, I know the car would have to be made to accept a charge while it's turning the wheels, but that's the crux of the Volt which is an in-series hybrid.
Your around-town jumper then becomes a long-haul vehicle. Probably not as efficient or cheap as a purpose built tool, but it'll get you there.
So there has to be something more to this idea because it hasn't happened yet. What am I missing here?
But that's assuming they knew he was american the whole time.
By that logic, this a perfectly valid argument for a cop performing an illegal search and seizure: "Well he looked like a spic at the time, thought he was a dewback" Is that what you want?
This is why the idea that non-citizens don't have rights is really dangerous. If a cop pulls you over and manages to lose your ID, and claims in court that he had no way of knowing that you were a citizen, then you effectively have no rights. You are the lowest common denominator.
This is why the cops/FBI/CIA shouldn't be allowed acting like criminals when it's convenient for them on overseas servers.
Every official query. Agents are allowed to search through that data at their whim. This was detailed by Snowden.
False. That is categorically, 100% false.
Uh, LOVEINT? These are crimes of convenience. It's right there, a tool to use as part of their job. Or do you think that Agent Smith requisitioned a permit from his manager to see what his girlfriend was up to?
And most of the instances of them catching this sort of abuse has to be self-reported. Meaning that there's no system in place to catch them. If there are logs of what they search for, those logs are not checked.
So... 100% false? Really? And this is what I get for talking to a true believer. Nothing really has the power to penetrate that nice thick layer of TRUE BELIEF.
ANY government power "could" be abused. And?
AND this abuse has no system of checks or balance. The part of the government that was supposed to place a check on them, the judicial branch in the form of the FISA court, which performs no actual oversight. Via the Snowden and Glennwald: "As but one typical example, The Guardian has obtained an August 19, 2010, Fisa court approval from Judge John D. Bates which does nothing more than recite the statutory language in approving the NSA's guidelines."
If you know this, why don't you believe it?
For the rest of the government, except the CIA, there are checks and balances which... well... keep them in check. The fact that this abuse is free from any oversight and out of the public's view means that potential abuse, their half of the parallel construction, will not have any negative consequences. Ever trained a dog? If they get away with that shit, it's going to get worse.
Where, in the Constitution, does it say the government cannot have a CAPABILITY that COULD be used against Americans?
Nowhere, but recording all the communications IS a violation. This bullshit doublethink where it's not a seizure of personal papers if they never look at it is blatantly unconstitutional. The sort of shit we had out of Dick Cheney during the Bush admin. Kinda sad.
here is no way to have technical (or any) capabilities to collect against "only" the foreign targets without having the capability to collect against any target that is using the same systems, networks, and tools.
What? "Hey Verizon, gimme everything you got for number X, we think he's a terrorist. Since you're on US soil, and we like to follow US law, here's the warrant detailing the exact place and information we hope to find."
Oh yeah, they're asking US firms on US soil for private information and the US firms have no real way to distinguish the nationality of the target. At least, they WOULD be asking under the old conditions. Now it's a wholesale dragnet of all traffic. What's funny is that this is the crux of the warrant-less wiretapping controversy from 2007 that people like you vehemently dismissed the possibility of, but now it's just taken as obvious fact and must be perfectly legal.
You want to error on the side of catching those commie bastards, I want to error on the side of protecting the rule of law.
How about they only have a dragnet on the data that enters or exits US soil? You know, physically. It's one of those bullshit technicalities that doesn't really solve the problem, but at least it would limit their ability to spy on all of our politicians. It would make for a lot of largely meaningless work, but sillier things have been done in the name of legality. A compromise. What do you say?
Sure, but do you think our culture has an endless appetite for paying enough for art so that an unlimited number of artists can earn a living?
Well take a look at how much we pay the NFL and company. Movie stars. Musicians..... In short, yeah, this is one of those areas I think people do have an endless appetite.
Also, when:
we get to a point where we just don't need everyone to work in order to provide the goods and services people want
...Then those goods and services that people want will be cheap. Supply and demand. If it's not cheap, then people will be able to make a buck making those goods or providing those services. It's one of those self-balancing thing.
in the context of what was available at those times.
And that's the point he's trying to make. The standard of living NOW is vastly greater then it was THEN. Things are different.
"The context" is what has changed. People today simply have it better then people of yesteryear. Yay progress!
The fact that we didn't have microwave ovens in the 1960s does nothing to alter the fact that we still had to obtain food and cook it somehow back then,
Yes, perfect example. You still had to do it somehow, and that somehow was with an oven or a hotplate. If you wanted a hot meal, it took longer with more skill required. AND SO, there were a lot of lonely bachelors who didn't know how to cook and simply didn't have a lot of hot meals that they would have had if they had microwaves. It's an extra cost that we take in stride in today's society, but it makes life better.
Yeah, I have to fess up to being one of the people he's talking about. One of those articles about systemd had some comment about how the makers were, you know, bad people.
So I looked it up, and yeah, this guy is at the top of the stack. I'm reading about him and as soon as the term PulseAudio popped up I transformed into a seething ball of rage that wanted bad things to happen to this person. Now, all thing considered with the human condition, that's perfectly fine and all. But then I posted to Slashdot verifying the OP was spot on about the... I dunno... satanic heritage or somethingorother about this guy. What can I say, he broke my sound.
So yeah, he is tied to a thing that caused me grief. I'd never actually want to hurt the guy, but I do wish he had never done anything with PulseAudio.
I don't care if he's the grand fucking pumba of the EFF, his rational in the article was laughable bullshit.
there is no systemic, policy, or enabling environment to illegally spy on Americans.
Did you forget what article you're posting under? The policy of using parallel construction is a systematic abuse of illegal spying on Americans.
That is, in fact, the current issue at hand.
And every query against that data requires a reasonable
Every official query. Agents are allowed to search through that data at their whim. This was detailed by Snowden.
Foreign targets now exist in the same sea of global digital communications as you and everyone else â" there is no way to have the technical capability to target the one without having the same capability to target them all.
Yes, the capability they want against the terrorists is a complete panopticon of all activity. And the simple response is that no, they are not allowed to have that capability when it comes to US citizens. As per the constitution.
Maybe I'm a lazy SOB for not RTFA, but how much do genes factor into intelligence? News like this is hardly startling. I mean, people are born mentally retarded and don't do as well in school. So obviously genes impact performance, Duh. And I imagine there is a massive sliding scale from complete retard to a fantastic set of genes that will hopefully be utilized and go on to make the next Hawking. But hopefully without the ALS. The slider is for intelligence, not general health.
But anyway, HOW MUCH do genes matter? I imagine it wouldn't matter at all if your mom was smoking a crack-pipe through the pregnancy. And no matter the quality of schooling and tutors, I don't think you'd have much luck with those inbred freaks.
It's the nature vs. nurture debate. It's obviously not completely one or the other. But I don't think it's a 50/50 split.
nuance, he didn't say "ensure success" he said "avoid a bad life". If you had the choice of spending $5,000 to remove a 5% risk of having a mentally retarded baby, would you spend it?
Wasting time? Son, we only need so many ditch diggers. The kids who don't just pick up this stuff naturally need TWICE as much schooling to get up to the basic level of competence we as a society need you to have to a functional member of our group.
Maybe we're just miscommunicating about the different levels of schooling. You see, highschool is (supposed to be) what you need to just be functional. If you don't have a highschool level education, going through life is going to be hard. The naturally stupid kids need extra schooling to get this. Past highschool, we train knowledge workers and skilled workers. You know, in college and trade schools and whatnot. And yeah, these poor bastards will probably drop out of the school system at some point. I don't imagine they'll typically go get their PhD. But they NEED to get past highschool.
I think they should stick with the studies and ride it as high as they can manage. Once they hit their upper limit, exit and get a job. You know, just like everyone else, brainiacs included.
Couldn't they do something more pleasant
We won't bankroll your League of Legends account out of the goodness of our hearts.
and productive with their time?
They outlawed putting kids in the coal mines ages ago.
It is of course wrong for officials to make false statements, as DNI Clapper did when he denied that NSA collects “any type of data at all” on ordinary Americans. But did the DNI actually “lie to Congress”?
Yes, that's pretty much the definition of "making false statements". He lied. He was asked say it again, and he correct "not wittingly". All the while, he knew damn well that YES, the NSA does "collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans". The senator saw that someone was feeding him a load of bullshit and he called him on it.
Now hey, sure, I actually do understand how something like the NSA could "unwittingly" collect data on millions of Americans. Those tidbits really add up. But if it's unwittingly, and just tidbits of information, then sure. That's understandable. But that's the the case. They most certainly did collect quite a lot of data on hundreds of millions of Americans. And James Clapper, the man in charge of the NSA and fully knowledgeable about it's programs, DAMN WELL DID KNOW HOW THEY WORK.
[it's not lieing] because the true answer to Senator Wyden’s question was already known to Senator Wyden
Are you fucking with me? It's not lying because, hey, in a hearing for the select committee on intelligence, where a senator asks you a question, gets an answer, and then asks if you're sure, pft, well he should have known differently and I don't feel like using the "classified" excuse. And this whole "official record" thing is really annoying, so fuck it.
Here's the exchange: (or hey, GO LOOK FOR YOURSELF) [At defon] Clapper: "Those who would want to weave the story that we have millions or hundreds of millions of dossiers on people, is absolutely false From my perspective, this is absolute nonsense." [in the hearing] Senator Wyden: "Does the NSA collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans?" Clapper: "No, sir." Wyden: "It does not?" Clapper: "Not wittingly. There are cases where they could inadvertently, perhaps, collect, but not wittingly."
Let me make this clear for you. If a senator knows something you said in public was bullshit, and then hauls your ass into a congressional hearing and asks you point blank about it. And then catches you in a lie, and asks you AGAIN. And you choose to double down and commit to the lie... THEN YOU HAVE COMMITTED PERJURY.
Listen, this is politics. The article goes on about rhetoric and maneuvering and all that jazz. And yeah, Clapper was indeed in a difficult position where he was directly asked about a classified program. Clapper tried to defend his program using a blatant lie and Wyden caught him on it. Clapper wanted the controversy and rage to die down, but telling the truth about the program would inflame the rage and cause more controversy. Wyden probably wanted those flames, so people were pissed, so that he could you know, gain that political capital to try and fix an obviously broken system. Or hey, maybe he was just being a dick and tightening the screws. Or simply doing his job ON THE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE.
I was hoping that your link had some sort of additional information that shed insight into the problem at hand. But no, it's just a mental backflip blaming the person asking the question.
Hey, it's great that you think you're "on my side" against government secrecy. But you seem to be sucking the cock of government secrecy pretty hard.
So do you understand the concern here? That with parallel construction, the 4th amendment is all but violated in name. When they have a complete panopticon and know exactly what everyone is doing at all times, and in a legal system where the typical person arguably* commits 3 felonies a day, it doesn't matter if they don't publicly admit to violating privacy. And that without the basic right to privacy, democracy is all but doomed.
(*You don't have enough wealth to afford a counter-argument)
I mean, we have historical accounts for this. What happens when an intelligence agency is given this much power. Check out Hoover's COINTELPRO.
it still could just be FBI somewhat clumsily protecting its own sources and methods
Yeah, I'm not a fan of the police not presenting the evidence they have for a legal case. I don't particularly care if it makes their job harder by revealing how they spy on people.
In a free society governed by the rule of law, it is the LAW, not the capability, that is paramount.
If you think we live under the rule of law then why the fuck hasn't James Clapper being charged with perjury yet?
I guess I'll take "just-smart-enough-but-not-quite to not think deeply enough about the issues" over "can't even wade into the kiddy pool".
ok, ok, ok, let me try to help you out with this: 1) The definition of "criminal" is one who breaks the law. 2) There are so many laws on the books (and specifically, laws which are vague and/or reference other materials you have to comply with) that you most likely break a number of federal laws without knowing it. 3) Ergo, most people are criminals. Include, most likely, you and me.
I mean, jesus christ dude, I don't know how simpler I can make this: MLK was a criminal, but not someone you had to fear.
Sigh, how about you switch the name-tag on your boogeyman from "criminal" to "convicted felon of a violent crime"? That'll work a little better.
But seriously, if you're not even going to try to follow the conversation, everyone would appreciate it if you withheld your comments. You're not helping.
Slashdot Mirror
That's an interesting presumption. Does cell-phone coverage/usage imply that the users have smartphones? Has that technology filtered down to the poorer strata?
It's a heart-warming feeling that technological progress is enabling the poor masses. Yeah, why don't we see more pictures on instagram of poor Liberian street urchins?
We all agree that the US is not the World's police.
I think that'd be nice, but it's not quite a universal sentiment.
Since when did the US become the World's nurse?
Uh..... The 1800's?
Maybe I'm just jaded, but it feels like the Ebola scare is being hyped because it would be convenient if everyone forgot about ISIS, Ukraine, and how James Clapper should be charged for perjury.
Don't get me wrong. It's a terrible thing, and a risk to the USA. But it's not that big of a risk. And there are more important things that should be vieing for prime-time on the news reels.
Oh, whoa, sorry about that kneejerk reaction. You weren't talking about the president. "himself" is referencing Ross Ulbritch. You're saying that his ordering a hit, presumably on other criminals, was self-defense.
Yeah, no, that's silly. Not quite the war-mongering sort of bad, but it's laughable to think that paying someone to go out, find, and murder someone else is a a form of self-defense.
reduces your car's range
I don't think you understand what this generator is doing. It extends the range of the car. The exact opposite of your complaint. You know how you have to worry about the range of your electric car? A generator removes that worry, because it turns the electric car into an in-series hybrid. You just have to plug it in. You have as much range as you want as long as you can find a gas station and have a few minutes to gas up.
heavy trailer
a generator powerful enough to recharge your car sufficiently while it drives is going to be fairly large/heavy.
Uh... a heavy trailer is the sort of thing you get from UHAUL. This thing would be about of small as you could make a trailer. Any smaller and you'd want it on a roof-rack, or like one of those bike-racks they have on the back of cars.
A generator "powerful enough" would probably be along the lines of... you know... a car engine. Like that little thing in a Prius. Because it's moving your car.
just to keep the car light and maximize its range that way.
And that maximum is not going to satisfy the conspiracy of eric. A generator on a trailer appeases a swath of users that occasionally want to travel interstate distances.
My dad had this idea years ago. Why hitch up a trailer with a generator in it? I mean, I know the car would have to be made to accept a charge while it's turning the wheels, but that's the crux of the Volt which is an in-series hybrid.
Your around-town jumper then becomes a long-haul vehicle. Probably not as efficient or cheap as a purpose built tool, but it'll get you there.
So there has to be something more to this idea because it hasn't happened yet. What am I missing here?
What kind of war-mongering doublethink bullshit is this?
Remember when we elected the guy so that he would stop the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq? So that he wouldn't invade Iran?
Just because he has the power doesn't make it right.
Listen, if you're a democrat, would you please kindly get the fuck out of my party?
But that's assuming they knew he was american the whole time.
By that logic, this a perfectly valid argument for a cop performing an illegal search and seizure:
"Well he looked like a spic at the time, thought he was a dewback"
Is that what you want?
This is why the idea that non-citizens don't have rights is really dangerous. If a cop pulls you over and manages to lose your ID, and claims in court that he had no way of knowing that you were a citizen, then you effectively have no rights. You are the lowest common denominator.
This is why the cops/FBI/CIA shouldn't be allowed acting like criminals when it's convenient for them on overseas servers.
Yeah, when the stakes are high enough, you arguably have the power to declare the hit, and the ordering of the hit, to be legal.
Why isn't this modded higher?
Elon de Musk? Old Flux? Come on Mods, get your coffee, wake up, and have a chuckle. This is Internet gold.
Every official query. Agents are allowed to search through that data at their whim. This was detailed by Snowden.
False. That is categorically, 100% false.
Uh, LOVEINT? These are crimes of convenience. It's right there, a tool to use as part of their job. Or do you think that Agent Smith requisitioned a permit from his manager to see what his girlfriend was up to?
And most of the instances of them catching this sort of abuse has to be self-reported. Meaning that there's no system in place to catch them. If there are logs of what they search for, those logs are not checked.
So... 100% false? Really? And this is what I get for talking to a true believer. Nothing really has the power to penetrate that nice thick layer of TRUE BELIEF.
ANY government power "could" be abused. And?
AND this abuse has no system of checks or balance. The part of the government that was supposed to place a check on them, the judicial branch in the form of the FISA court, which performs no actual oversight. Via the Snowden and Glennwald: "As but one typical example, The Guardian has obtained an August 19, 2010, Fisa court approval from Judge John D. Bates which does nothing more than recite the statutory language in approving the NSA's guidelines."
If you know this, why don't you believe it?
For the rest of the government, except the CIA, there are checks and balances which... well... keep them in check. The fact that this abuse is free from any oversight and out of the public's view means that potential abuse, their half of the parallel construction, will not have any negative consequences. Ever trained a dog? If they get away with that shit, it's going to get worse.
Where, in the Constitution, does it say the government cannot have a CAPABILITY that COULD be used against Americans?
Nowhere, but recording all the communications IS a violation. This bullshit doublethink where it's not a seizure of personal papers if they never look at it is blatantly unconstitutional. The sort of shit we had out of Dick Cheney during the Bush admin. Kinda sad.
here is no way to have technical (or any) capabilities to collect against "only" the foreign targets without having the capability to collect against any target that is using the same systems, networks, and tools.
What?
"Hey Verizon, gimme everything you got for number X, we think he's a terrorist. Since you're on US soil, and we like to follow US law, here's the warrant detailing the exact place and information we hope to find."
Oh yeah, they're asking US firms on US soil for private information and the US firms have no real way to distinguish the nationality of the target.
At least, they WOULD be asking under the old conditions. Now it's a wholesale dragnet of all traffic. What's funny is that this is the crux of the warrant-less wiretapping controversy from 2007 that people like you vehemently dismissed the possibility of, but now it's just taken as obvious fact and must be perfectly legal.
You want to error on the side of catching those commie bastards, I want to error on the side of protecting the rule of law.
How about they only have a dragnet on the data that enters or exits US soil? You know, physically. It's one of those bullshit technicalities that doesn't really solve the problem, but at least it would limit their ability to spy on all of our politicians. It would make for a lot of largely meaningless work, but sillier things have been done in the name of legality. A compromise. What do you say?
2) Art
Sure, but do you think our culture has an endless appetite for paying enough for art so that an unlimited number of artists can earn a living?
Well take a look at how much we pay the NFL and company. Movie stars. Musicians. .... In short, yeah, this is one of those areas I think people do have an endless appetite.
Also, when:
we get to a point where we just don't need everyone to work in order to provide the goods and services people want
...Then those goods and services that people want will be cheap. Supply and demand. If it's not cheap, then people will be able to make a buck making those goods or providing those services. It's one of those self-balancing thing.
Oh man! I can't believe I missed this one! It was right over the plate:
Couldn't they do something more pleasant and productive with their time?
No, that just makes for more less-then-stellar kids running about.
I believe there is an unlimited amount of work to be done when it comes to
1) Science/engineering/making-stuff-better/STEM
2) Art
3) Politicking
Brains, creativity, and interpersonal skills. If you don't have one or more of those, your long-term viability isn't looking good.
in the context of what was available at those times.
And that's the point he's trying to make.
The standard of living NOW is vastly greater then it was THEN. Things are different.
"The context" is what has changed. People today simply have it better then people of yesteryear. Yay progress!
The fact that we didn't have microwave ovens in the 1960s does nothing to alter the fact that we still had to obtain food and cook it somehow back then,
Yes, perfect example. You still had to do it somehow, and that somehow was with an oven or a hotplate. If you wanted a hot meal, it took longer with more skill required. AND SO, there were a lot of lonely bachelors who didn't know how to cook and simply didn't have a lot of hot meals that they would have had if they had microwaves. It's an extra cost that we take in stride in today's society, but it makes life better.
Yeah, I have to fess up to being one of the people he's talking about. One of those articles about systemd had some comment about how the makers were, you know, bad people.
So I looked it up, and yeah, this guy is at the top of the stack. I'm reading about him and as soon as the term PulseAudio popped up I transformed into a seething ball of rage that wanted bad things to happen to this person. Now, all thing considered with the human condition, that's perfectly fine and all. But then I posted to Slashdot verifying the OP was spot on about the... I dunno... satanic heritage or somethingorother about this guy. What can I say, he broke my sound.
So yeah, he is tied to a thing that caused me grief. I'd never actually want to hurt the guy, but I do wish he had never done anything with PulseAudio.
I can understand if he's caught some flak online.
I don't care if he's the grand fucking pumba of the EFF, his rational in the article was laughable bullshit.
there is no systemic, policy, or enabling environment to illegally spy on Americans.
Did you forget what article you're posting under?
The policy of using parallel construction is a systematic abuse of illegal spying on Americans.
That is, in fact, the current issue at hand.
And every query against that data requires a reasonable
Every official query. Agents are allowed to search through that data at their whim. This was detailed by Snowden.
Foreign targets now exist in the same sea of global digital communications as you and everyone else â" there is no way to have the technical capability to target the one without having the same capability to target them all.
Yes, the capability they want against the terrorists is a complete panopticon of all activity. And the simple response is that no, they are not allowed to have that capability when it comes to US citizens. As per the constitution.
Maybe I'm a lazy SOB for not RTFA, but how much do genes factor into intelligence? News like this is hardly startling. I mean, people are born mentally retarded and don't do as well in school. So obviously genes impact performance, Duh. And I imagine there is a massive sliding scale from complete retard to a fantastic set of genes that will hopefully be utilized and go on to make the next Hawking. But hopefully without the ALS. The slider is for intelligence, not general health.
But anyway, HOW MUCH do genes matter? I imagine it wouldn't matter at all if your mom was smoking a crack-pipe through the pregnancy. And no matter the quality of schooling and tutors, I don't think you'd have much luck with those inbred freaks.
It's the nature vs. nurture debate. It's obviously not completely one or the other. But I don't think it's a 50/50 split.
nuance, he didn't say "ensure success" he said "avoid a bad life". If you had the choice of spending $5,000 to remove a 5% risk of having a mentally retarded baby, would you spend it?
How about a baby that was just a little slow?
How about a baby that was merely average?
Wasting time? Son, we only need so many ditch diggers. The kids who don't just pick up this stuff naturally need TWICE as much schooling to get up to the basic level of competence we as a society need you to have to a functional member of our group.
Maybe we're just miscommunicating about the different levels of schooling. You see, highschool is (supposed to be) what you need to just be functional. If you don't have a highschool level education, going through life is going to be hard. The naturally stupid kids need extra schooling to get this. Past highschool, we train knowledge workers and skilled workers. You know, in college and trade schools and whatnot. And yeah, these poor bastards will probably drop out of the school system at some point. I don't imagine they'll typically go get their PhD. But they NEED to get past highschool.
I think they should stick with the studies and ride it as high as they can manage. Once they hit their upper limit, exit and get a job. You know, just like everyone else, brainiacs included.
Couldn't they do something more pleasant
We won't bankroll your League of Legends account out of the goodness of our hearts.
and productive with their time?
They outlawed putting kids in the coal mines ages ago.
Dude, have you read that article?
It is of course wrong for officials to make false statements, as DNI Clapper did when he denied that NSA collects “any type of data at all” on ordinary Americans. But did the DNI actually “lie to Congress”?
Yes, that's pretty much the definition of "making false statements". He lied. He was asked say it again, and he correct "not wittingly". All the while, he knew damn well that YES, the NSA does "collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans". The senator saw that someone was feeding him a load of bullshit and he called him on it.
Now hey, sure, I actually do understand how something like the NSA could "unwittingly" collect data on millions of Americans. Those tidbits really add up. But if it's unwittingly, and just tidbits of information, then sure. That's understandable. But that's the the case. They most certainly did collect quite a lot of data on hundreds of millions of Americans. And James Clapper, the man in charge of the NSA and fully knowledgeable about it's programs, DAMN WELL DID KNOW HOW THEY WORK.
[it's not lieing] because the true answer to Senator Wyden’s question was already known to Senator Wyden
Are you fucking with me? It's not lying because, hey, in a hearing for the select committee on intelligence, where a senator asks you a question, gets an answer, and then asks if you're sure, pft, well he should have known differently and I don't feel like using the "classified" excuse. And this whole "official record" thing is really annoying, so fuck it.
Here's the exchange: (or hey, GO LOOK FOR YOURSELF)
[At defon] Clapper: "Those who would want to weave the story that we have millions or hundreds of millions of dossiers on people, is absolutely false From my perspective, this is absolute nonsense."
[in the hearing] Senator Wyden: "Does the NSA collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans?"
Clapper: "No, sir."
Wyden: "It does not?"
Clapper: "Not wittingly. There are cases where they could inadvertently, perhaps, collect, but not wittingly."
Let me make this clear for you. If a senator knows something you said in public was bullshit, and then hauls your ass into a congressional hearing and asks you point blank about it. And then catches you in a lie, and asks you AGAIN. And you choose to double down and commit to the lie... THEN YOU HAVE COMMITTED PERJURY.
Listen, this is politics. The article goes on about rhetoric and maneuvering and all that jazz. And yeah, Clapper was indeed in a difficult position where he was directly asked about a classified program. Clapper tried to defend his program using a blatant lie and Wyden caught him on it. Clapper wanted the controversy and rage to die down, but telling the truth about the program would inflame the rage and cause more controversy. Wyden probably wanted those flames, so people were pissed, so that he could you know, gain that political capital to try and fix an obviously broken system. Or hey, maybe he was just being a dick and tightening the screws. Or simply doing his job ON THE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE.
I was hoping that your link had some sort of additional information that shed insight into the problem at hand. But no, it's just a mental backflip blaming the person asking the question.
Hey, it's great that you think you're "on my side" against government secrecy. But you seem to be sucking the cock of government secrecy pretty hard.
the search and seizure of private information without warrant is a crime,
Wow, you're a real true believer, aren't you?
So do you understand the concern here? That with parallel construction, the 4th amendment is all but violated in name. When they have a complete panopticon and know exactly what everyone is doing at all times, and in a legal system where the typical person arguably* commits 3 felonies a day, it doesn't matter if they don't publicly admit to violating privacy. And that without the basic right to privacy, democracy is all but doomed.
(*You don't have enough wealth to afford a counter-argument)
I mean, we have historical accounts for this. What happens when an intelligence agency is given this much power. Check out Hoover's COINTELPRO.
it still could just be FBI somewhat clumsily protecting its own sources and methods
Yeah, I'm not a fan of the police not presenting the evidence they have for a legal case. I don't particularly care if it makes their job harder by revealing how they spy on people.
In a free society governed by the rule of law, it is the LAW, not the capability, that is paramount.
If you think we live under the rule of law then why the fuck hasn't James Clapper being charged with perjury yet?
It's "Potato" - "Potawto"
I guess I'll take "just-smart-enough-but-not-quite to not think deeply enough about the issues" over "can't even wade into the kiddy pool".
ok, ok, ok, let me try to help you out with this:
1) The definition of "criminal" is one who breaks the law.
2) There are so many laws on the books (and specifically, laws which are vague and/or reference other materials you have to comply with) that you most likely break a number of federal laws without knowing it.
3) Ergo, most people are criminals. Include, most likely, you and me.
I mean, jesus christ dude, I don't know how simpler I can make this: MLK was a criminal, but not someone you had to fear.
Sigh, how about you switch the name-tag on your boogeyman from "criminal" to "convicted felon of a violent crime"? That'll work a little better.
But seriously, if you're not even going to try to follow the conversation, everyone would appreciate it if you withheld your comments. You're not helping.