That's good to know. Some of the comments starting making feel like I was a unicorn.
Yeah I know a female programmer - me.
I've known good female programmers and have met a few bad ones (like a database programmer who claimed joins were impossible). I can say the same thing for my male colleagues.
As far as commenting goes, it depends on the programmer.
You didn't say where your organization is, but have you factored your location into the equation? Maybe in another area, you could find web developers with the correct skill set. Of course on the other hand, you could be using something outdated.
Last time my company hired a new programmer, we had trouble. However it had more to do with the local job market, a general lack of IT talent in the area and other human factors (pay, benefits, etc...).
You know when you are asking about an older technology when most of the younger applicants give you a blank stare and the older ones sit there for a minute thinking about the last time they used it.
Real ID isn't dying because of privacy concerns. I think (at least in Michigan), it's about the cost for the states. States were ok with the plan until it hit them that it cost them money. Also let's consider the fact the states were asked to basically implement Real ID after they spent tons of money on homeland security.
I am one of the people involved with MidnightBSD (http://www.midnightbsd.org). Several of us tried to get a slashdot article about our first release. None of the articles were approved.
Or they could have "quality" hardware like the XBox 360. Honestly I think the 360 is interesting but I just know too many people who have had to get the damn thing repaired or replaced.
I'm not saying any hardware vendor has a perfect product line.
I will say their mice and keyboards are ok. Though the best Microsoft mouse I ever had I didn't pay for, I won in a MSDN contest.
I think if Microsoft was really confident in these PC's, they would have launched them in the U.S. or Europe. One problem they may have is that the price they set is too high for some users in India (not all - but some). Also if the PC's are huge failure, it will be easier for them to sweep 'em under the rug.
I agree it is insulting. I think programming is essential to a good computer science education. I think maybe the approach should be (and this would help all students) is show that writing code is just part of the process. I'm a programmer and yes I write a lot of code. However I read a lot of design specs, spend a lot time in design meetings, spend time talking to potential users, spend time talking to testers, debugging, etc...
The very idea that somehow I overcome some inherent deficiency to become a programmer is horrible.
For example, I was helping my parents clean out their basement. My parents kept all my report cards, progress reports, etc... I found a progress report from my junior high school programming teacher. The person commented that I was picking up programming faster than the other students and suggested my parents encourage me to go a computer camp or learn a more complex language. My parents dismissed the very idea of me being a programmer. There was no deficiency on my part.
Honestly the statement "programmers don't understand their users" is not new. Hell the first time this statement was probably uttered is when we started having non-technical users.
What I find really interesting is that somehow this suggests programmers are different than end users, and "could" design for other programmers / technical users.
If you look at psychology work done in programming and software design, there is support that the process of programming is not a natural human process. Maybe one could even argue that the act of programming influences general problem solving. Humans beings do not like to break down problems and solutions into tiny, detailed steps, however computer require detailed steps.
Now let's get out of the realm of "end user" software, and let's look at the design of programming languages. How many programming languages would you consider "programmer" friendly? Of those "programmer" friendly languages, how many of them would you consider powerful?
I spent a lot of time with Indian college graduates in grad school. Some were smart and others couldn't even find a computer let alone program it. I can say the exact same thing about American / European / (insert your nationality) graduates.
One thing I will say about Indian college graduates is that they *tend* not to think outside the box. If the solution wasn't painfully obvious or spelled out in the textbook or lecture notes, then some of the Indian students would run into serious problems. Also some Indian students would ace courses which required large amounts of memorization but would fail practical courses.
Another thing if you try to get private health insurance, the company can deny you coverage more often.
For example, I have a genetic predisposition for blood clots. I have never had a blood clot and am not on a blood thinner. But due to the fact I am 5 - 10% more likely to develop a blood clot, I was denied coverage. This genetic problem is noted on my medical records.
Now that I am working full time, I can get coverage. HIPAA prohibits companies from denying you coverage based on your DNA in group plans but not individual plans. I also have trouble getting life insurance.
In summary, if you think you're getting screwed through your employer's insurance, try applying for private insurance. You can get screwed over even more.
I'm guessing they're estimating based on typical email use. But in reality, there's no way they could know. Anyway everyone knows most statistics are made up!
So I would have to conceal my gender to be a kernel developer?
If hiding my gender and worrying about people finding out that I'm a woman is the admission price to work on a well established open source project, count me out.
Yes, I really like it when a *big, strong* man tells me what to do. I work because I want to. End of story. I want a life outside of my marriage. It's not a radical concept, men usually want a life outside of their relationships.
"They would much rather take care of their newborn than go back to their stress-filled jobs."
Umm... I don't have kids, but I have never thought raising a child would be easy and relaxing. I think being responsible for a human being would be stressful. It may be even more stressful than going to an office and working 50+ hour work weeks. Again, I don't have kids so I can't really comment on how stressful parenthood would be.
Plus the whole post taps into this line of thinking that all women want to have children. Some argue that women biologically desire children, but one nice thing about being a human is that we're not completely tied to our hormonal urges. Some of us don't want children. We don't all have the same desires and dreams.
You can't be an idiot by any means. But most CS students aren't experts in whatever language their school requires. Even if the student is an expert in the school's intro language of choice, the student needs to create code to the instructor's standards.
I am aware that computer science higher education is useless to people who don't have a strong aptitude toward programming. In its current form, CS education was designed to weed people out of the department. Now that there appears to be a shortage of students, there needs to be a shift in how the classes are taught.
Most first year CS students do not have the necessary knowledge to pass the courses w/o going to class. I did go to school with a student who could but that's the exception not the rule.
I think there are a lot of factors in how much a college degree is worth. Where did the person go? Was it a school that you could skip most of your classes and still pull a C average in your major (most majors do require a C average in core classes)? How much programming did the person actually have to do versus how much theory did they memorize (sorry meant learn)?
I have a bachelor's degree and a master's in CS. I had to code for both degrees and you couldn't pass without writing functional code. I didn't go to schools that you could skip 99.9% of your classes and pass.
Some of my fellow graduate students were very strong in theory but couldn't code their way out of a paper bag.
Some degrees are worth more than others. It's a fact.
As a programmer I would prefer smaller chunks of code. The key to X.Org's success or failture with a modular design is this - documentation. Most of the time I will not need to know how other parts work but if I do need to look at another module, there better be some good documentation.
Plus programs aren't skyscrapers or houses. Code is something completely different.
You have been very lucky. I wish I could have said in my 3rd year at college that no one had treated negatively due to my gender.
However there are a few notable differences. I am an American and attended American universities. My undergrad studies were done at a liberal arts college and I am currently finish my MS at a mid-sized university in the American midwest.
I don't think the work is more suited for one gender or another. I point out to my male colleagues that early programming was primarily done by women. If they don't believe me, I ask them to do some research.
That's amazing. Most of the female students I know in computer science are there to learn. Several of us women in computer science are already married and didn't need to go into CS to meet men. I will go even farther in saying if I was single, I wouldn't date any of my fellow students.
For the record, I have one semester left until I complete my MS in computer science.
Yes, there are several homework assignments posted as projects. First, I feel that all students should write their own code, but most of the blame falls solely on the students' shoulders. Personally I would have problems being paid to write a homework assignment, but the coders are just trying to earn a little extra money. Cheating should be handled by universities. Hey if someone is dumb enough to get caught cheating, it's best to get him or her out of the program as quickly as possible.
First, it is legal in some cases for a genetic predisposition to be considered a pre-existing condition in terms of insurances (at least in the U.S.).
I have a genetic predisposition for blood clots. I found out about this after one of my parents was treated for a blood clot. This genetic test is very common and done after someone is treated for a blood clot now. I was tested as a precaution and found out I carry the same genetic predisposition.
If you obtain your insurance through a group plan, a genetic predisposition is NOT a pre-existing condition. However if you ever try to obtain private insurance, surprise you have a pre-existing condition! This was basically a compromise made for the insurance industry's sake.
Moral of the story, if you ever get your DNA tested a genetic predisposition, get some life insurance (or you may not be able to afterward).
At one point I would have agreed with you completely. At my current job I'm the Mac OS X tech / SysAdmin. Some types of businesses are almost exclusively Mac. I work at a university and the newspaper is a Mac only shop, because newspapers are primarily Mac shops. Graphic artists, marketing, etc... use Macs too. So if we take most newspapers, graphic artists (who may have a few employees other than him or herself, marketing and then add a few other business - we may actual reach 17%.
Slashdot Mirror
VirtualBox in general has a lot of issues with most BSD projects.
MidnightBSD (which was forked from FreeBSD 6.1) worked with earlier versions of VirtualBox, but can't work with later versions.
That's good to know. Some of the comments starting making feel like I was a unicorn.
Yeah I know a female programmer - me.
I've known good female programmers and have met a few bad ones (like a database programmer who claimed joins were impossible). I can say the same thing for my male colleagues.
As far as commenting goes, it depends on the programmer.
You didn't say where your organization is, but have you factored your location into the equation? Maybe in another area, you could find web developers with the correct skill set. Of course on the other hand, you could be using something outdated.
Last time my company hired a new programmer, we had trouble. However it had more to do with the local job market, a general lack of IT talent in the area and other human factors (pay, benefits, etc...).
You know when you are asking about an older technology when most of the younger applicants give you a blank stare and the older ones sit there for a minute thinking about the last time they used it.
Real ID isn't dying because of privacy concerns. I think (at least in Michigan), it's about the cost for the states. States were ok with the plan until it hit them that it cost them money. Also let's consider the fact the states were asked to basically implement Real ID after they spent tons of money on homeland security.
Or he did post it and it was never approved.
I am one of the people involved with MidnightBSD (http://www.midnightbsd.org). Several of us tried to get a slashdot article about our first release. None of the articles were approved.
Sometimes you can't even get free advertising.
Or they could have "quality" hardware like the XBox 360. Honestly I think the 360 is interesting but I just know too many people who have had to get the damn thing repaired or replaced.
I'm not saying any hardware vendor has a perfect product line.
I will say their mice and keyboards are ok. Though the best Microsoft mouse I ever had I didn't pay for, I won in a MSDN contest.
I think if Microsoft was really confident in these PC's, they would have launched them in the U.S. or Europe. One problem they may have is that the price they set is too high for some users in India (not all - but some). Also if the PC's are huge failure, it will be easier for them to sweep 'em under the rug.
I agree it is insulting. I think programming is essential to a good computer science education. I think maybe the approach should be (and this would help all students) is show that writing code is just part of the process. I'm a programmer and yes I write a lot of code. However I read a lot of design specs, spend a lot time in design meetings, spend time talking to potential users, spend time talking to testers, debugging, etc...
The very idea that somehow I overcome some inherent deficiency to become a programmer is horrible.
For example, I was helping my parents clean out their basement. My parents kept all my report cards, progress reports, etc... I found a progress report from my junior high school programming teacher. The person commented that I was picking up programming faster than the other students and suggested my parents encourage me to go a computer camp or learn a more complex language. My parents dismissed the very idea of me being a programmer. There was no deficiency on my part.
Honestly the statement "programmers don't understand their users" is not new. Hell the first time this statement was probably uttered is when we started having non-technical users.
What I find really interesting is that somehow this suggests programmers are different than end users, and "could" design for other programmers / technical users.
If you look at psychology work done in programming and software design, there is support that the process of programming is not a natural human process. Maybe one could even argue that the act of programming influences general problem solving. Humans beings do not like to break down problems and solutions into tiny, detailed steps, however computer require detailed steps.
Now let's get out of the realm of "end user" software, and let's look at the design of programming languages. How many programming languages would you consider "programmer" friendly? Of those "programmer" friendly languages, how many of them would you consider powerful?
I spent a lot of time with Indian college graduates in grad school. Some were smart and others couldn't even find a computer let alone program it. I can say the exact same thing about American / European / (insert your nationality) graduates.
One thing I will say about Indian college graduates is that they *tend* not to think outside the box. If the solution wasn't painfully obvious or spelled out in the textbook or lecture notes, then some of the Indian students would run into serious problems. Also some Indian students would ace courses which required large amounts of memorization but would fail practical courses.
Another thing if you try to get private health insurance, the company can deny you coverage more often.
For example, I have a genetic predisposition for blood clots. I have never had a blood clot and am not on a blood thinner. But due to the fact I am 5 - 10% more likely to develop a blood clot, I was denied coverage. This genetic problem is noted on my medical records.
Now that I am working full time, I can get coverage. HIPAA prohibits companies from denying you coverage based on your DNA in group plans but not individual plans. I also have trouble getting life insurance.
In summary, if you think you're getting screwed through your employer's insurance, try applying for private insurance. You can get screwed over even more.
Very true except in most states, you can be fired for being gay. Well you can be fired for being gay in Michigan at least.
LOL. No one else will understand why that is so funny.
I'm guessing they're estimating based on typical email use. But in reality, there's no way they could know. Anyway everyone knows most statistics are made up!
Geeze, wonderful quote. (As a woman) I find her response insulting. I am much more than my uterus - thank you.
So I would have to conceal my gender to be a kernel developer?
If hiding my gender and worrying about people finding out that I'm a woman is the admission price to work on a well established open source project, count me out.
"Women usually like to be led."
Yes, I really like it when a *big, strong* man tells me what to do. I work because I want to. End of story. I want a life outside of my marriage. It's not a radical concept, men usually want a life outside of their relationships.
"They would much rather take care of their newborn than go back to their stress-filled jobs."
Umm... I don't have kids, but I have never thought raising a child would be easy and relaxing. I think being responsible for a human being would be stressful. It may be even more stressful than going to an office and working 50+ hour work weeks. Again, I don't have kids so I can't really comment on how stressful parenthood would be.
Plus the whole post taps into this line of thinking that all women want to have children. Some argue that women biologically desire children, but one nice thing about being a human is that we're not completely tied to our hormonal urges. Some of us don't want children. We don't all have the same desires and dreams.
You can't be an idiot by any means. But most CS students aren't experts in whatever language their school requires. Even if the student is an expert in the school's intro language of choice, the student needs to create code to the instructor's standards.
I am aware that computer science higher education is useless to people who don't have a strong aptitude toward programming. In its current form, CS education was designed to weed people out of the department. Now that there appears to be a shortage of students, there needs to be a shift in how the classes are taught.
Most first year CS students do not have the necessary knowledge to pass the courses w/o going to class. I did go to school with a student who could but that's the exception not the rule.
I think there are a lot of factors in how much a college degree is worth. Where did the person go? Was it a school that you could skip most of your classes and still pull a C average in your major (most majors do require a C average in core classes)? How much programming did the person actually have to do versus how much theory did they memorize (sorry meant learn)?
I have a bachelor's degree and a master's in CS. I had to code for both degrees and you couldn't pass without writing functional code. I didn't go to schools that you could skip 99.9% of your classes and pass.
Some of my fellow graduate students were very strong in theory but couldn't code their way out of a paper bag.
Some degrees are worth more than others. It's a fact.
As a programmer I would prefer smaller chunks of code. The key to X.Org's success or failture with a modular design is this - documentation. Most of the time I will not need to know how other parts work but if I do need to look at another module, there better be some good documentation.
Plus programs aren't skyscrapers or houses. Code is something completely different.
This building analogy is not really working out.
You have been very lucky. I wish I could have said in my 3rd year at college that no one had treated negatively due to my gender.
However there are a few notable differences. I am an American and attended American universities. My undergrad studies were done at a liberal arts college and I am currently finish my MS at a mid-sized university in the American midwest.
I don't think the work is more suited for one gender or another. I point out to my male colleagues that early programming was primarily done by women. If they don't believe me, I ask them to do some research.
That's amazing. Most of the female students I know in computer science are there to learn. Several of us women in computer science are already married and didn't need to go into CS to meet men. I will go even farther in saying if I was single, I wouldn't date any of my fellow students.
For the record, I have one semester left until I complete my MS in computer science.
Yes, there are several homework assignments posted as projects. First, I feel that all students should write their own code, but most of the blame falls solely on the students' shoulders. Personally I would have problems being paid to write a homework assignment, but the coders are just trying to earn a little extra money. Cheating should be handled by universities. Hey if someone is dumb enough to get caught cheating, it's best to get him or her out of the program as quickly as possible.
First, it is legal in some cases for a genetic predisposition to be considered a pre-existing condition in terms of insurances (at least in the U.S.).
I have a genetic predisposition for blood clots. I found out about this after one of my parents was treated for a blood clot. This genetic test is very common and done after someone is treated for a blood clot now. I was tested as a precaution and found out I carry the same genetic predisposition.
If you obtain your insurance through a group plan, a genetic predisposition is NOT a pre-existing condition. However if you ever try to obtain private insurance, surprise you have a pre-existing condition! This was basically a compromise made for the insurance industry's sake.
Moral of the story, if you ever get your DNA tested a genetic predisposition, get some life insurance (or you may not be able to afterward).
At one point I would have agreed with you completely. At my current job I'm the Mac OS X tech / SysAdmin. Some types of businesses are almost exclusively Mac. I work at a university and the newspaper is a Mac only shop, because newspapers are primarily Mac shops. Graphic artists, marketing, etc... use Macs too. So if we take most newspapers, graphic artists (who may have a few employees other than him or herself, marketing and then add a few other business - we may actual reach 17%.