Testing is a problem online at a distance when you are testing for memorization/regurgitation ability. It isn't quite so bad when you are testing things that require problem-solving or critical analysis, as these are qualities you can't really "cheat" on - unless you get a friend with those abilties to do your work for you!
For most university correspondence/distance ed courses, you are required to write an exam somewhere (often in your home city or one closeby) with a invigilator presiding... this is the only way you can mimic the normal course final procedure.
In many ways, online courses are good for courses that are not marked for a grade. If they are for credit, evaluation and examinations must be planned in ways traditionally used for distance education.
As a programmer involved with online and distance delivery education at a Univesity, I read the article carefully (and will be seeking the original sources). It makes some good points, but when I started to think about the problems mentioned in the article, I came to the conclusion that this particular online course was not well-planned. Like any software project, careful planning for online courses can save time and agony later on.
In many cases, online courses are viewed as making the course content available on the web, with email access to the instructor and other students. IMO, this is no different than mailing out a textbook and some SASEs. If the interactive features of online tools are not used, the student might as well choose to do the course via traditional correspondence means.
Here, when a professor or department come in to discuss putting a course online, we try to determine if that would be an appropriate thing to do. Certain courses lend themselves well to distance/online delivery, while others do not (though there may be a place for additional materials or tools online). Tools for instructor-student interaction and student-student interaction are used for most of our online courses. Animations, video and audio files and interactive web pages are used where appropriate. (Very few people are able to learn well by visual methods alone - it is good to use audio, experiential and social aspects to the learning experience in *any* course situation.) There are many proprietary courseware packages available that allow you to provide rich content and tools to students, if you use them to their full potential.
When a course is being prepared for online delivery, our instructional designers work closely with the content experts to plan how the course should be delivered so that the student can get the most out of the course. The technological requirements are discussed, and depending on what the target audience is, choices are made as to what tools will be used. Support is a big issue for online courses, so that students have somewhere to go when they run into troubles. However, pedagogy is one of the most important aspects of the planning stages - there has to be a commitment by the instructor (and department or institution) to actually facilitate the course.
In the situation described in the article, it appears that this course was not very well-designed and that there may not have been a full commitment by the instructor and institution to delivering the course. It also appears that support was not ideal for students encountering technical problems. Unfortunately, the students are the ones who suffer when this happens.
I think there is a huge potential for the use of online tools in education... I just hope people do not get caught up in the hype. It is easy to throw up a web page and call it "online course material" - teaching that material is a different story.
Well, the article is interesting, and probably some proportion of so-called "geeks" and "nerds" exhibit mild autism. But I think the article is rather misleading, as most people who would consider themselves "geeks" or "nerds" are simply intelligent and often a bit introverted (i.e. shy).
I know several people who are involved in science or technology fields, and who are shy. To an outside observer, they may appear to lack social skills. However, these people often have strong empathic traits, and are overly sensitive to social cues (which are opposite to autistic tendencies). They get along well with each other, and have active social lives within their social circles. (Admittedly some of them did not have much in the way of social lives in high school, where they were in a very small minority!) People tend to interact best with others who share interests and abilities - if you are someone who is highly intelligent and interested in something specialized, you may not seem socially adept to most of the populace. This does not necessarily mean you have a brain disorder!
Public education is probably good for people who have a mild version of autism - but it would be unfortunate for the already-stigmatized groups of introverted geeks/nerds/etc to be branded as having a mental illness. Be nice to have more non-negative publicity out there to combat the recent negative happenings...
Someone has already pointed out that this article concerns someone who *thinks* he can create an artificial bacterium, which is good to remember. But the thing I kept thinking while I was reading was, "Why bother?"
Microorganisms are very easy to manipulate (compared to the so-called "higher" lifeforms). We already swap genes from bacterial strains that are hardly related, and can put genes from plants or animals into bacteria. (Many therapeutic products are produced in this manner.) In terms of "germ warfare" it would be much more efficient and less unpredictable to use strains we already have and modify them - I am not advocating use of such weapons, but I suspect many people will seize on that potential when talking about this story.
It would take us a *long* time to create a GOOD artifical bacterium - Nature has the jump on us there! With the time and expense involved, I don't quite know why someone would bother... unless they feed off of the "Should-we-be-playing-God" controversy, of course!
Leaving the whole issue of the quality of the dialogue etc aside, was Alec Guinness *forced* to take on the role of Obi-Wan in Star Wars? Did he not get a chance to peruse the script at all beforehand? I can understand that he may be sick of all the hype and obsessive fans, but with all his comments trashing the movie script/dialogue, I really wonder why he did it in the first place...
I just tried Meta Moderation, and though you can reasonably guess that certain posts are interesting/informative (or trolls/flamebait) by looking at them, without a link to the actual story it is difficult to truly know the context of the post. I don't think I'll feel comfortable M-Moderating under this system.
Lucas's suggestion of increasing available moderator points makes sense, especially given the recent scourge of trolls that have been wasting moderator points. Much less complicated than Meta Moderation, too, IMO!
I almost couldn't bring myself to read the posts when I saw an article by *Katz* about *Macs*! But then I started to think about it, and it is kind of an interesting little experiment: Are Katz-despisers and Mac-haters mutually exclusive? What proportion of/. readers bash both of them? Will Katz annoy the Mac-lovers, even?
Regardless, no matter what Katz actually says, you had to know there would be some heated discussions here!:-)
Seriously, as someone who works at an educational institution, this idea makes a lot of sense. Our project manager was keen on getting a bunch of iBooks just to use the 'airport'... This will work much better in a lab setting!!!
Exactly. I have a PhD in microbiology, and I probably could have gotten a job in that field - if I wanted to move, earn 20K/year and have no benefits. After a few years postdoc-ing, I could have fought for an academic position... A postdoc in my lab has applied for over 100 jobs (and he has a good publication and teaching record), which is depressing. There are just too many qualified PhDs for a handful of (good) jobs.
On the other hand, with a couple of programming courses (and a lot of reading and playing with computers in my spare time), I was able to get a permanent developing job that pays at least twice what a normal postdoc earns, with excellent benefits. I wouldn't have switched careers if I hadn't enjoyed programming, but from a practical point of view, it was the logical choice for me.
I do not encourage someone to go into biology unless they absolutely love research... the extrinsic rewards are not there, and it can be a tough life.
Cool as it would be to see all the figures on the web, PNAS is primarily a scientific journal - and generally scientific figures aren't shown in full in the web versions of articles. (I doubt PNAS has seen this much activity in a long time - not too many of these articles get mentioned on/.!)
Heretic old fashioned suggestion: You could always go to your local University library and take a peek in the actual journal...;-)
I have to hand it to a small company willing to go after a much larger one like GT Interactive. It is a dangerous precedent (if the story is true), if GT Interactive is let off the hook just by agreeing to not sell the pirated software anymore.
I wonder though, what the laws are in this situation... seems like the justice system generally lags behind "new" technology and the abuses within...
I just found it on their web site (and feel a little better now!): _____________________________________________ Does Chapters.ca disclose personal customer information to third parties?
We don't currently sell or rent users' non-aggregated specific personal information to third-party companies, but we may decide to do so in the future. If this were to happen, Chapters.ca would announce such a plan by e-mail and ask you to "opt in". By default, we'd assume that you don't want in - if you wanted to share your personal information, you would have to respond to the e-mail. If we didn't hear from you, your information would not be distributed.
Chapters.ca reserves the right to cooperate with local, provincial and national officials in any investigation requiring either personal information -- including any personal information provided online through www.chapters.ca -- or reports about lawful or unlawful user activities on this site.
Chapters.ca also reserves the right to change this Privacy Policy at any time. We also reserve the right at any time to disclose any information in an individual's account:
i. to satisfy any law, regulation or government request;
ii. if such disclosure is necessary or appropriate to site operation; or
iii. to protect the rights or property of Chapters.ca and its users, sponsors, providers, licensors or merchants. _____________________________________________
Well, after advocating online purchasing to friends and family, I hate to see an abuse of privacy like this! Where I work (a University), there is a huge concern over the "Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Program" (FOIP), to the point where we can no longer view access logs of the web pages we have on the system. For some of the stuff I have to do here, FOIP can be an irritation, but when put in perspective, I can see why the program is place.
I should mention, I don't buy from Amazon... but I do buy from Chapters.ca, a Canadian online bookseller. Methinks I will be checking to see if they have any privacy policies in place...
Interesting, not altogether surprising. It is certainly more efficient for me to check the pages I know are useful than to try to find new ones.
However, it isn't like the WWW has been in popular use for all that long. I have some doubt that "trends" really mean much. Perhaps I missed other references in the article, but it seems that they are only comparing this year to the last. In this industry, I think we can expect to see more changes in the near future that may affect web usage.
Am I a cynic to wonder if some of the major portal sites had some influence in publicizing these statistics?;-)
YS
Re:Maybe you should actually read the article, peo
on
AOL Plans TV Channel
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· Score: 1
The title of the CNN news piece is somewhat confusing ("AOL plans TV channel") and Case sez "We don't want to turn the TV into a computer", but if it is planning on offering "email" and "chat forums", it does look like a WebTV clone...
Role models don't HAVE to be of the same sex... but it certainly helps if you can relate to the role model. Girls will often relate to other women, go figure. And it always strikes me, if I walk into a workplace that is all male - why aren't there women here? Is it an unfriendly place for a woman to work?
As for the "compliment", yeah, there is room for debate over its appropriateness and if I am overreacting in feeling that it was inappropriate. But in a career where there are allegations that women get jobs because of their looks, not their skills, it is difficult to be taken seriously when your appearance is the focus. I don't expect most males to understand this, but I have seen previous/. posts claiming that "airhead" girls get CS jobs because they are "babes".
Now my experiences in high school are my own, and I hope that other females have had better ones! My science teachers were the ones who practised the subtle prejudice in their career suggestions. Steve, the 4th highest student in Chem, Physics and Bio, was encouraged to go into engineering. Girls held the top 3 spots, but we were encouraged to go into "journalism", "education" and (well, this isn't so bad) "law". Science/technology was never suggested to us.
I have some references in terms of limited advancement for women (and minorities too) in comp sci: Educational Pipeline Issues for Women Women in Science and Engineering I doubt if the males out there who suggest there is no problem will read these articles, but they may be of interest to other women in this area...
Again, I don't know if there is a need for "artificial encouragement" here - little girls *are* given Barbies and baby dolls, and boys are given mechanical toys. Girls are expected to be quiet and feminine, while boys are encouraged to get dirty and take apart the toaster. Those are generalizations, and some families are providing non-stereotypical upbringings for kids, but mainstream media (including commercials) gives the same old message.
There is a lack of good software for girls right now... The fact that girls aren't drawn to the blood-and-gore shoot-em-ups does NOT reflect a lack of ability to program! But the lack of games out there does mean that computers may not be as attractive for young females. Hopefully this situation will improve, at least the game companies will someday want to tap that market that they are missing... Perhaps the computer itself is not the thing that is not interesting, but the lack of any uses that computer can be put to by the girl in question. The web, with its boundless information resources and communications capability is already bringing large numbers of women into the computer-using world, and I hope will also help young girls become more comfortable in using computers and see a reason to do so.
One thing I find interesting in this debate is how upset some of the men out there are getting about this. It's not like big scholarships are being given to stupid girls or something. Getting the feeling there is a lot of insecurity out there...
YS
PS. My C instructor was a pretty cool guy - only comments he made to me were about my programming skills... same as to the higher-scoring guys!
For anyone who thinks that women aren't discouraged from working as programmers, a quick look at many of the posts here should enlighten them as to why this environment can sometimes be hostile for females... Interesting that the majority of these comments are from ACs!
YS
PS. It is nice to see the occasional non-sexist comment from the guys out there!
I am all for schools encouraging females to enter CS programs, but the real steps IMO need to be taken with girls while they are young. In a lot of cases, the problems are not just that girls are not encouraged to experiment and play with computers/technology, but that they are discouraged (sometimes actively, sometimes subtly). Around Junior High seems to be a critical time for girls, determining whether they will have the self-confidence to succeed in what they want to do, or whether they will succumb to the popular ideal and submerge their own personality.
Girls also need more positive role models in science and technology. This has got to be one of the toughest things - society, as a whole, does not reward women who embark on a traditionally male-dominated career path. How many female instructors/professors have you witnessed in the physical sciences and in computer technology? This lack of role models is something that is rarely acknowledged as a problem, but has been shown to affect career choices of female students.
I am lucky - my parents encouraged me to do what I wanted, and to have confidence in myself. Even with that support, it was still difficult to be an intelligent girl interested in science and technology. Subtle prejudice from teachers ("But you're so good at English!!!") and peer pressure made my life difficult at times. I still find sometimes that my appearance is taken more seriously than my work (Recently a VB instructor commented to me that as well as being one of his "best" students, I was one of his "prettiest"... what an effective way to reduce me to a superficial level!!!)
Oooh, the rant must stop. But as one of the minority of female programmers here, I just have to mention that there is a lot of negative stuff that still affects females in non-traditional areas. I am lucky, most of the negative feedback I have had has been silly and petty, and hasn't limited my advancement... yet. Unfortunately, that is not the case for a lot of women.
Sometimes I wonder if I *should* be encouraging females to go into CS/IT...
No - I am not trolling, the topic of trademarking these banal phrases just got me to wondering if FileMaker Pro actually trademarked that particular phrase... they are definitely using it a lot in advertising, etc.
Everytime I go to their website, I can't help but giggle at such a friendly slogan...
The article is interesting, but I imagine a similar phenomenon would be seen in other careers of folks who are (in general) introverts dedicated to their work.
There are a lot of similarities between the life of a programmer and that of a research scientist. I have seen scientists (molecular and micro-biologists) lead lonely existences, spending the majority of their time in the lab. But the lab is a safe place for the introvert... much like the computer! Not great places for gaining social skills, though.
So this trend is hardly surprising... What is interesting is seeing the primarily male responses to this article! It is kind of like a locker room in here, no?;-)
As a chick who reads/. (and the ONLY female programmer in our group), I have to object. I don't _want_ a job that I am not qualified for! I am as qualified as the men here, and have seen underqualified _men_ get jobs because of rapport with the interviewer...
And for "if you're female then things are good.", I invite you to check out:
This is slightly off the main topic (and I'd just like to say that I think when we can find a way of certifying scientific information has been adequately peer reviewed, electronic versions will be the new medium of choice... until then, we are stuck with the established media, and must deal with that.)... and with that in mind:
There are newsgroups out there where you can post such technical questions (try bionet.molbio.methds.reagnts). However, given that at some point you will have to reference your methods and reagents, you can really only take informal suggestions as just that - suggestions. (Conferences are great places to meet experts in your field who can give you some feedback, btw - and you can often email them later on when you have other concerns.)
People can give you invaluable hints, but IMO you learn the most when you try to work through things yourself. Yeah, it sucks when things don't work perfectly the first time round, but you also end up learning far more as you try to figure out what happened (or did not happen, whatever the case might be).
There are some journals and abstracts online that you can do a quick search for your particular research methods. Yes, you will have to ultimately read a few articles and make some choices as to which methods are right for you, but that is part of the whole scientific thing! Part of research is learning to review literature and decide what is appropriate to use in your own investigation. Part of what you are learning is independence, as well as scientific methodology. (This is something I have seen undergrads and neophyte grad students have trouble grasping... but eventually if they stick around, they figure it out!)
I am curious about what you are doing in confocal microscopy, sounds like it might be an interesting project. Good luck in your research,
I know I am rising to the bait, but it is disheartening to see these gender stereotypes being perpetuated... I am all for computers being attractive to females, but at the expensive of speed and power? For use as a FASHION ACCESSORY? So, what, we should have REAL, POWERFUL computers for boys and FASHION TOYS for girls?
If someone offered me the choice between the iBook and a PowerBook, there is no contest - I want the power, not the pretty case. Luckily, I have learned that although I am female, I still have the right to use technology in the same ways as the guys...
No point getting too deep into the whole females-and-technology stuff here, but I can't just let this go by...
(BTW, in my office, the guys were as impressed by the iBook as the women...)
Slashdot Mirror
Testing is a problem online at a distance when you are testing for memorization/regurgitation ability. It isn't quite so bad when you are testing things that require problem-solving or critical analysis, as these are qualities you can't really "cheat" on - unless you get a friend with those abilties to do your work for you!
... this is the only way you can mimic the normal course final procedure.
For most university correspondence/distance ed courses, you are required to write an exam somewhere (often in your home city or one closeby) with a invigilator presiding
In many ways, online courses are good for courses that are not marked for a grade. If they are for credit, evaluation and examinations must be planned in ways traditionally used for distance education.
YS
As a programmer involved with online and distance delivery education at a Univesity, I read the article carefully (and will be seeking the original sources). It makes some good points, but when I started to think about the problems mentioned in the article, I came to the conclusion that this particular online course was not well-planned. Like any software project, careful planning for online courses can save time and agony later on.
... I just hope people do not get caught up in the hype. It is easy to throw up a web page and call it "online course material" - teaching that material is a different story.
In many cases, online courses are viewed as making the course content available on the web, with email access to the instructor and other students. IMO, this is no different than mailing out a textbook and some SASEs. If the interactive features of online tools are not used, the student might as well choose to do the course via traditional correspondence means.
Here, when a professor or department come in to discuss putting a course online, we try to determine if that would be an appropriate thing to do. Certain courses lend themselves well to distance/online delivery, while others do not (though there may be a place for additional materials or tools online). Tools for instructor-student interaction and student-student interaction are used for most of our online courses. Animations, video and audio files and interactive web pages are used where appropriate. (Very few people are able to learn well by visual methods alone - it is good to use audio, experiential and social aspects to the learning experience in *any* course situation.) There are many proprietary courseware packages available that allow you to provide rich content and tools to students, if you use them to their full potential.
When a course is being prepared for online delivery, our instructional designers work closely with the content experts to plan how the course should be delivered so that the student can get the most out of the course. The technological requirements are discussed, and depending on what the target audience is, choices are made as to what tools will be used. Support is a big issue for online courses, so that students have somewhere to go when they run into troubles. However, pedagogy is one of the most important aspects of the planning stages - there has to be a commitment by the instructor (and department or institution) to actually facilitate the course.
In the situation described in the article, it appears that this course was not very well-designed and that there may not have been a full commitment by the instructor and institution to delivering the course. It also appears that support was not ideal for students encountering technical problems. Unfortunately, the students are the ones who suffer when this happens.
I think there is a huge potential for the use of online tools in education
YS
Drat, just when I thought I had an excuse to procrastinate ... I see no working game, just an image!
Anyone actually see a working copy of the Ultimate DNA Separation Game?
YS
Well, the article is interesting, and probably some proportion of so-called "geeks" and "nerds" exhibit mild autism. But I think the article is rather misleading, as most people who would consider themselves "geeks" or "nerds" are simply intelligent and often a bit introverted (i.e. shy).
...
I know several people who are involved in science or technology fields, and who are shy. To an outside observer, they may appear to lack social skills. However, these people often have strong empathic traits, and are overly sensitive to social cues (which are opposite to autistic tendencies). They get along well with each other, and have active social lives within their social circles. (Admittedly some of them did not have much in the way of social lives in high school, where they were in a very small minority!) People tend to interact best with others who share interests and abilities - if you are someone who is highly intelligent and interested in something specialized, you may not seem socially adept to most of the populace. This does not necessarily mean you have a brain disorder!
Public education is probably good for people who have a mild version of autism - but it would be unfortunate for the already-stigmatized groups of introverted geeks/nerds/etc to be branded as having a mental illness. Be nice to have more non-negative publicity out there to combat the recent negative happenings
YS
Someone has already pointed out that this article concerns someone who *thinks* he can create an artificial bacterium, which is good to remember. But the thing I kept thinking while I was reading was, "Why bother?"
... unless they feed off of the "Should-we-be-playing-God" controversy, of course!
Microorganisms are very easy to manipulate (compared to the so-called "higher" lifeforms). We already swap genes from bacterial strains that are hardly related, and can put genes from plants or animals into bacteria. (Many therapeutic products are produced in this manner.) In terms of "germ warfare" it would be much more efficient and less unpredictable to use strains we already have and modify them - I am not advocating use of such weapons, but I suspect many people will seize on that potential when talking about this story.
It would take us a *long* time to create a GOOD artifical bacterium - Nature has the jump on us there! With the time and expense involved, I don't quite know why someone would bother
YS
Leaving the whole issue of the quality of the dialogue etc aside, was Alec Guinness *forced* to take on the role of Obi-Wan in Star Wars? Did he not get a chance to peruse the script at all beforehand? I can understand that he may be sick of all the hype and obsessive fans, but with all his comments trashing the movie script/dialogue, I really wonder why he did it in the first place ...
YS
I just tried Meta Moderation, and though you can reasonably guess that certain posts are interesting/informative (or trolls/flamebait) by looking at them, without a link to the actual story it is difficult to truly know the context of the post. I don't think I'll feel comfortable M-Moderating under this system.
Lucas's suggestion of increasing available moderator points makes sense, especially given the recent scourge of trolls that have been wasting moderator points. Much less complicated than Meta Moderation, too, IMO!
YS
I almost couldn't bring myself to read the posts when I saw an article by *Katz* about *Macs*! But then I started to think about it, and it is kind of an interesting little experiment: Are Katz-despisers and Mac-haters mutually exclusive? What proportion of /. readers bash both of them? Will Katz annoy the Mac-lovers, even?
:-)
Regardless, no matter what Katz actually says, you had to know there would be some heated discussions here!
YS
An airport in every classroom ... :-)
... This will work much better in a lab setting!!!
Seriously, as someone who works at an educational institution, this idea makes a lot of sense. Our project manager was keen on getting a bunch of iBooks just to use the 'airport'
YS
Well the rest of the site is still up, so I would guess that they have removed the offending article ...
Exactly. I have a PhD in microbiology, and I probably could have gotten a job in that field - if I wanted to move, earn 20K/year and have no benefits. After a few years postdoc-ing, I could have fought for an academic position ... A postdoc in my lab has applied for over 100 jobs (and he has a good publication and teaching record), which is depressing. There are just too many qualified PhDs for a handful of (good) jobs.
On the other hand, with a couple of programming courses (and a lot of reading and playing with computers in my spare time), I was able to get a permanent developing job that pays at least twice what a normal postdoc earns, with excellent benefits. I wouldn't have switched careers if I hadn't enjoyed programming, but from a practical point of view, it was the logical choice for me.
I do not encourage someone to go into biology unless they absolutely love research ... the extrinsic rewards are not there, and it can be a tough life.
YSCool as it would be to see all the figures on the web, PNAS is primarily a scientific journal - and generally scientific figures aren't shown in full in the web versions of articles. (I doubt PNAS has seen this much activity in a long time - not too many of these articles get mentioned on /.!)
... ;-)
Heretic old fashioned suggestion: You could always go to your local University library and take a peek in the actual journal
YS
I have to hand it to a small company willing to go after a much larger one like GT Interactive. It is a dangerous precedent (if the story is true), if GT Interactive is let off the hook just by agreeing to not sell the pirated software anymore.
... seems like the justice system generally lags behind "new" technology and the abuses within ...
I wonder though, what the laws are in this situation
YS
I just found it on their web site (and feel a little better now!):
_____________________________________________
Does Chapters.ca disclose personal customer information to third parties?
We don't currently sell or rent users' non-aggregated specific personal information to third-party companies, but we may decide to do so in the future. If this were to happen, Chapters.ca would announce such a plan by e-mail and ask you to "opt in". By default, we'd assume that you don't want in - if you wanted to share your personal information, you would have to respond to the e-mail. If we didn't hear from you, your information would not be distributed.
Chapters.ca reserves the right to cooperate with local, provincial and national officials in any investigation requiring either personal information -- including any personal information provided online through www.chapters.ca -- or reports about lawful or unlawful user activities on this site.
Chapters.ca also reserves the right to change this Privacy Policy at any time. We also reserve the right at any time to disclose any information in an individual's account:
i. to satisfy any law, regulation or government request;
ii. if such disclosure is necessary or appropriate to site operation; or
iii. to protect the rights or property of Chapters.ca and its users, sponsors, providers, licensors or merchants.
_____________________________________________
YS
Well, after advocating online purchasing to friends and family, I hate to see an abuse of privacy like this! Where I work (a University), there is a huge concern over the "Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Program" (FOIP), to the point where we can no longer view access logs of the web pages we have on the system. For some of the stuff I have to do here, FOIP can be an irritation, but when put in perspective, I can see why the program is place.
... but I do buy from Chapters.ca, a Canadian online bookseller. Methinks I will be checking to see if they have any privacy policies in place ...
I should mention, I don't buy from Amazon
YS
Interesting, not altogether surprising. It is certainly more efficient for me to check the pages I know are useful than to try to find new ones.
;-)
However, it isn't like the WWW has been in popular use for all that long. I have some doubt that "trends" really mean much. Perhaps I missed other references in the article, but it seems that they are only comparing this year to the last. In this industry, I think we can expect to see more changes in the near future that may affect web usage.
Am I a cynic to wonder if some of the major portal sites had some influence in publicizing these statistics?
YS
The title of the CNN news piece is somewhat confusing ("AOL plans TV channel") and Case sez "We don't want to turn the TV into a computer", but if it is planning on offering "email" and "chat forums", it does look like a WebTV clone ...
...
Not a very informative news story, IMO
YS.
I should leave this alone, but I can't ...
... but it certainly helps if you can relate to the role model. Girls will often relate to other women, go figure. And it always strikes me, if I walk into a workplace that is all male - why aren't there women here? Is it an unfriendly place for a woman to work?
/. posts claiming that "airhead" girls get CS jobs because they are "babes".
...
... The fact that girls aren't drawn to the blood-and-gore shoot-em-ups does NOT reflect a lack of ability to program! But the lack of games out there does mean that computers may not be as attractive for young females. Hopefully this situation will improve, at least the game companies will someday want to tap that market that they are missing ... Perhaps the computer itself is not the thing that is not interesting, but the lack of any uses that computer can be put to by the girl in question. The web, with its boundless information resources and communications capability is already bringing large numbers of women into the computer-using world, and I hope will also help young girls become more comfortable in using computers and see a reason to do so.
...
... same as to the higher-scoring guys!
Role models don't HAVE to be of the same sex
As for the "compliment", yeah, there is room for debate over its appropriateness and if I am overreacting in feeling that it was inappropriate. But in a career where there are allegations that women get jobs because of their looks, not their skills, it is difficult to be taken seriously when your appearance is the focus. I don't expect most males to understand this, but I have seen previous
Now my experiences in high school are my own, and I hope that other females have had better ones! My science teachers were the ones who practised the subtle prejudice in their career suggestions. Steve, the 4th highest student in Chem, Physics and Bio, was encouraged to go into engineering. Girls held the top 3 spots, but we were encouraged to go into "journalism", "education" and (well, this isn't so bad) "law". Science/technology was never suggested to us.
I have some references in terms of limited advancement for women (and minorities too) in comp sci:
Educational Pipeline Issues for Women
Women in Science and Engineering
I doubt if the males out there who suggest there is no problem will read these articles, but they may be of interest to other women in this area
Again, I don't know if there is a need for "artificial encouragement" here - little girls *are* given Barbies and baby dolls, and boys are given mechanical toys. Girls are expected to be quiet and feminine, while boys are encouraged to get dirty and take apart the toaster. Those are generalizations, and some families are providing non-stereotypical upbringings for kids, but mainstream media (including commercials) gives the same old message.
There is a lack of good software for girls right now
One thing I find interesting in this debate is how upset some of the men out there are getting about this. It's not like big scholarships are being given to stupid girls or something. Getting the feeling there is a lot of insecurity out there
YS
PS. My C instructor was a pretty cool guy - only comments he made to me were about my programming skills
For anyone who thinks that women aren't discouraged from working as programmers, a quick look at many of the posts here should enlighten them as to why this environment can sometimes be hostile for females ... Interesting that the majority of these comments are from ACs!
YS
PS. It is nice to see the occasional non-sexist comment from the guys out there!
I am all for schools encouraging females to enter CS programs, but the real steps IMO need to be taken with girls while they are young. In a lot of cases, the problems are not just that girls are not encouraged to experiment and play with computers/technology, but that they are discouraged (sometimes actively, sometimes subtly). Around Junior High seems to be a critical time for girls, determining whether they will have the self-confidence to succeed in what they want to do, or whether they will succumb to the popular ideal and submerge their own personality.
... yet. Unfortunately, that is not the case for a lot of women.
...
Girls also need more positive role models in science and technology. This has got to be one of the toughest things - society, as a whole, does not reward women who embark on a traditionally male-dominated career path. How many female instructors/professors have you witnessed in the physical sciences and in computer technology? This lack of role models is something that is rarely acknowledged as a problem, but has been shown to affect career choices of female students.
I am lucky - my parents encouraged me to do what I wanted, and to have confidence in myself. Even with that support, it was still difficult to be an intelligent girl interested in science and technology. Subtle prejudice from teachers ("But you're so good at English!!!") and peer pressure made my life difficult at times. I still find sometimes that my appearance is taken more seriously than my work (Recently a VB instructor commented to me that as well as being one of his "best" students, I was one of his "prettiest"... what an effective way to reduce me to a superficial level!!!)
Oooh, the rant must stop. But as one of the minority of female programmers here, I just have to mention that there is a lot of negative stuff that still affects females in non-traditional areas. I am lucky, most of the negative feedback I have had has been silly and petty, and hasn't limited my advancement
Sometimes I wonder if I *should* be encouraging females to go into CS/IT
YS
No - I am not trolling, the topic of trademarking these banal phrases just got me to wondering if FileMaker Pro actually trademarked that particular phrase ... they are definitely using it a lot in advertising, etc.
...
Everytime I go to their website, I can't help but giggle at such a friendly slogan
;-)
YS
The article is interesting, but I imagine a similar phenomenon would be seen in other careers of folks who are (in general) introverts dedicated to their work.
... much like the computer! Not great places for gaining social skills, though.
... What is interesting is seeing the primarily male responses to this article! It is kind of like a locker room in here, no? ;-)
/.)
There are a lot of similarities between the life of a programmer and that of a research scientist. I have seen scientists (molecular and micro-biologists) lead lonely existences, spending the majority of their time in the lab. But the lab is a safe place for the introvert
So this trend is hardly surprising
YS
(Chick who reads
Huh?
/. (and the ONLY female programmer in our group), I have to object. I don't _want_ a job that I am not qualified for! I am as qualified as the men here, and have seen underqualified _men_ get jobs because of rapport with the interviewer ...
As a chick who reads
And for "if you're female then things are good.", I invite you to check out:
Educational pipeline issues for women
Women and Minorities in Science and Engineering
YS
This is slightly off the main topic (and I'd just like to say that I think when we can find a way of certifying scientific information has been adequately peer reviewed, electronic versions will be the new medium of choice ... until then, we are stuck with the established media, and must deal with that.) ... and with that in mind:
... but eventually if they stick around, they figure it out!)
There are newsgroups out there where you can post such technical questions (try bionet.molbio.methds.reagnts). However, given that at some point you will have to reference your methods and reagents, you can really only take informal suggestions as just that - suggestions. (Conferences are great places to meet experts in your field who can give you some feedback, btw - and you can often email them later on when you have other concerns.)
People can give you invaluable hints, but IMO you learn the most when you try to work through things yourself. Yeah, it sucks when things don't work perfectly the first time round, but you also end up learning far more as you try to figure out what happened (or did not happen, whatever the case might be).
There are some journals and abstracts online that you can do a quick search for your particular research methods. Yes, you will have to ultimately read a few articles and make some choices as to which methods are right for you, but that is part of the whole scientific thing! Part of research is learning to review literature and decide what is appropriate to use in your own investigation. Part of what you are learning is independence, as well as scientific methodology. (This is something I have seen undergrads and neophyte grad students have trouble grasping
I am curious about what you are doing in confocal microscopy, sounds like it might be an interesting project. Good luck in your research,
YS (PhD, Microbiology, The University of Calgary)
I know I am rising to the bait, but it is disheartening to see these gender stereotypes being perpetuated ... I am all for computers being attractive to females, but at the expensive of speed and power? For use as a FASHION ACCESSORY? So, what, we should have REAL, POWERFUL computers for boys and FASHION TOYS for girls?
...
...
...)
If someone offered me the choice between the iBook and a PowerBook, there is no contest - I want the power, not the pretty case. Luckily, I have learned that although I am female, I still have the right to use technology in the same ways as the guys
No point getting too deep into the whole females-and-technology stuff here, but I can't just let this go by
(BTW, in my office, the guys were as impressed by the iBook as the women
YS