this is essentially going to apply the bizarre "declassification" regime we currently have to FISA law. its ridiculous. go look, for example, at the Inspector General report on the NSA's Trailblazer/Thinthread programs. It is pages and pages and pages of blacked out paragraphs, with a little number in the margin indicating which Exception to the Freedom of Information law the government used in justifying the blackout.
It is ridiculous beyond ridiculos. These senators are cowards of the highest order.
when the US was first becoming industrialized by copying the english, im sure we had our own share of problems. watt, joule, ampere - which of these was american? none.
india has a mathematical tradition going back thousands of years. they pioneered the fucking decimal point for chrissakes. i woul dtake a bunch of indian dudes who are ambitious and poor over 20 cum-guzzling american NSA contractors, whose main job is to sit around figuring out which lobbyists will win the next round of contract negotiations so they can decide what kind of buzzword laden horse shit to spoon around all over their whorish, lie-filled resumes.
sorry these arguments about the 'exceptional evil in iceland' do not hold water. icelands banks had the same issues as goldman sachs, deutschebank, UK banks, etc. the same people were involved in some cases.
the handful of icelandic banks, which had controllers and boards and advisers of an international nature, went bankrupt, just like the US banks and just like the UK banks and just like the German banks.
they all got bailed out. none of them are any more crooks than any others.
it says 'national defense information', and the stuff he leaked is not IMHO national defense information, its crap about domestic spying which is illegal.
thanks for convicting someone of breaking a law before having any trial or seeing the evidence.
Which law did he break, by the way?
Did you know its not actually illegal to leak classified information to a reporter?
That the Espionage Act doesnt even have the word 'classified' in it unless talking about specific stuff like encryption keys &c?
Have you even spent even a tiny amount of your day researching this on the internet?
Until you do, maybe you shouldnt be SLANDERING people with accusations. That, my friend, in an of itself is illegal. You could be liable for defaming his character by claiming he broke a law, when clearly you cant even name the law.
surprise, there is no law making it illegal to give this type of information to a reporter.
why? this information has nothing whatsoever to do with "national defense information" which is the standard of the Espionage Act. not 'classified'. But National Defense Information. and its not illegal to leak classified information.
These programs have little to nothing to do with national defense. They are domestic spying which the NSA shouldnt be involved in at all.
Therefore they are not a violation of the espionage act.
What other law could we be dealing with? The CFAA? Hell, this guy may have had every right to access this information, therefore he didn't break the CFAA.
Not to mention that, the Whistleblower laws can in theory protect people when they are uncovering blatant illegal activity by government employees.
Fuck the government's lawyers, they have no case to stand on here.
look, the last thing we need is yet another whistleblower rotting in prison or blackballed from their profession.
People are all "oh, this is so noble". Uhm, yeah. Its noble, and thousands of other people have already done it, and they suffered immensly for it. Go read some books by actual whistleblowers. Imagine making $50,000 a year and then going down to minimum wage because its the only job you can get after you get blackballed. Imagine you lose your health insurance, your house, and you have to go into debt to pay lawyers to keep you out of prison.
Imagine your wife, family, friends, being raided by the FBI with guns. Imagine getting stopped at every airport checkpoint, train station, etc for the rest of your life.
Imagine never working in your field again.
Imagine a large number of your friends just drop you. No contact. No calls. No meetings. Nothing.
Thats what a lot of whistleblowers face.
Oh, how noble. But if this guy was makign your french fries or bagging your groceries, would you say "oh how noble" to him? or would you continue your day to day condescending attitude towards those who have to live outside the system for whatever reason?
This guy should have hid under a fucking rock and let the NSA and FBI go fuck itself for 10 years trying to track down the leak source. Just laugh at them from the shadows.
It reminds me of the story in Mandela's autobiography. There were a lot of anti-apartheid activitists who operated purely out of some messianic belief they were right. Well, the enemy used this, and decimated them. They went to prison. They disappeared. They got murdered. Most of all, they didnt contribute to the continuing battle. They are like Petya Rostov in War And Peace, all heart and no brains. They might have done something admirable, but they didnt actually help win the battle or the war because they were no longer around to fight anymore.
Now, the enemy, the NSA, or FBI, can just take this guy and swallow him into some prison.
i mean, its right there in black and white in their internal documents. offensive hack capability violates international law and domestic lalw.
the fundamental problem is the idea that the government doesnt have to follow the same laws as the people. thats a problem and historically civilizations haved moved towards a system of legal equality for all, not a special eception for the already powerful
Slashdot Mirror
what law did he admit breaking?
this is essentially going to apply the bizarre "declassification" regime we currently have to FISA law. its ridiculous. go look, for example, at the Inspector General report on the NSA's Trailblazer/Thinthread programs. It is pages and pages and pages of blacked out paragraphs, with a little number in the margin indicating which Exception to the Freedom of Information law the government used in justifying the blackout.
It is ridiculous beyond ridiculos. These senators are cowards of the highest order.
and you dont even know what law they broke.
you should probably step back for a minute and contemplate what you are saying.
and again, and again, and nobody ever seems to answer me. probably because what he did isnt illegal.
do you
a. go to prison for 30 years
b. pay a zillion dollars
c. get extradited
d. get a slap on the wrist b/c companies do it al the time
its really presumptous to say someone broke a law without a fair trial
when the US was first becoming industrialized by copying the english, im sure we had our own share of problems. watt, joule, ampere - which of these was american? none.
india has a mathematical tradition going back thousands of years. they pioneered the fucking decimal point for chrissakes. i woul dtake a bunch of indian dudes who are ambitious and poor over 20 cum-guzzling american NSA contractors, whose main job is to sit around figuring out which lobbyists will win the next round of contract negotiations so they can decide what kind of buzzword laden horse shit to spoon around all over their whorish, lie-filled resumes.
sorry these arguments about the 'exceptional evil in iceland' do not hold water. icelands banks had the same issues as goldman sachs, deutschebank, UK banks, etc. the same people were involved in some cases.
the handful of icelandic banks, which had controllers and boards and advisers of an international nature, went bankrupt, just like the US banks and just like the UK banks and just like the German banks.
they all got bailed out. none of them are any more crooks than any others.
secret courts are making a comeback in the US.
if people dont have ordinary names, they are usually up to no good.
so they could seize the UK assets stored in failed Icelandic banks (failed after being privatized on the suggestion of UK/US "experts")
before accosting me with your ignorance?
not only were these people reprimanded before the media stories,
only one of them, Drake, ever contacted the media.
please take some time to read about the case. you are just wrong.
if they hadnt complained to the IG, none of them would have been raided.
until those tapes were found, it was all just speculation.
im guessing obama has some tape-like-entities somewhere.
it says 'national defense information', and the stuff he leaked is not IMHO national defense information, its crap about domestic spying which is illegal.
the jury can agree.
this is not 'national defense information', this is power point slides about domestic spying. that has little or nothing to do with national defense.
the word 'classified' doesnt make something automatically count under the Espionage Act.
his friends and family are probably being raided while i write this.
going to the IG is the worst mistake a whistleblower can make. the people who submitted the IG complaint for trailblazer got raided by the FBI
and your clients fire you and suddenly theres child porn on your machine.
nice job.
thanks for convicting someone of breaking a law before having any trial or seeing the evidence.
Which law did he break, by the way?
Did you know its not actually illegal to leak classified information to a reporter?
That the Espionage Act doesnt even have the word 'classified' in it unless talking about specific stuff like encryption keys &c?
Have you even spent even a tiny amount of your day researching this on the internet?
Until you do, maybe you shouldnt be SLANDERING people with accusations. That, my friend, in an of itself is illegal. You could be liable for defaming his character by claiming he broke a law, when clearly you cant even name the law.
surprise, there is no law making it illegal to give this type of information to a reporter.
why? this information has nothing whatsoever to do with "national defense information" which is the standard of the Espionage Act. not 'classified'. But National Defense Information. and its not illegal to leak classified information.
These programs have little to nothing to do with national defense. They are domestic spying which the NSA shouldnt be involved in at all.
Therefore they are not a violation of the espionage act.
What other law could we be dealing with? The CFAA? Hell, this guy may have had every right to access this information, therefore he didn't break the CFAA.
Not to mention that, the Whistleblower laws can in theory protect people when they are uncovering blatant illegal activity by government employees.
Fuck the government's lawyers, they have no case to stand on here.
look, the last thing we need is yet another whistleblower rotting in prison or blackballed from their profession.
People are all "oh, this is so noble". Uhm, yeah. Its noble, and thousands of other people have already done it, and they suffered immensly for it. Go read some books by actual whistleblowers. Imagine making $50,000 a year and then going down to minimum wage because its the only job you can get after you get blackballed. Imagine you lose your health insurance, your house, and you have to go into debt to pay lawyers to keep you out of prison.
Imagine your wife, family, friends, being raided by the FBI with guns. Imagine getting stopped at every airport checkpoint, train station, etc for the rest of your life.
Imagine never working in your field again.
Imagine a large number of your friends just drop you. No contact. No calls. No meetings. Nothing.
Thats what a lot of whistleblowers face.
Oh, how noble. But if this guy was makign your french fries or bagging your groceries, would you say "oh how noble" to him? or would you continue your day to day condescending attitude towards those who have to live outside the system for whatever reason?
This guy should have hid under a fucking rock and let the NSA and FBI go fuck itself for 10 years trying to track down the leak source. Just laugh at them from the shadows.
It reminds me of the story in Mandela's autobiography. There were a lot of anti-apartheid activitists who operated purely out of some messianic belief they were right. Well, the enemy used this, and decimated them. They went to prison. They disappeared. They got murdered. Most of all, they didnt contribute to the continuing battle. They are like Petya Rostov in War And Peace, all heart and no brains. They might have done something admirable, but they didnt actually help win the battle or the war because they were no longer around to fight anymore.
Now, the enemy, the NSA, or FBI, can just take this guy and swallow him into some prison.
Oh well.
the sco trial is over man. you just had a bad dream, that's all.
i mean, its right there in black and white in their internal documents. offensive hack capability violates international law and domestic lalw.
the fundamental problem is the idea that the government doesnt have to follow the same laws as the people. thats a problem and historically civilizations haved moved towards a system of legal equality for all, not a special eception for the already powerful
5 pounds, 18 inches baby