I do live and let live. Read the grandparent post.
Unless you view "stating the obvious but inconvenient truth" as "not letting live". In which case, I can't really help you. You need men in white kind of help.
Lie of the century. Not a single democracy in history of mankind functioned when based on truth.
Human societies simply do not function very well when faced with nothing but the truth. Lies are a necessary part of base functionality of human society on any level, even as basic as two people who are together for procreating.
Where and when exactly did this abandonment happened? Or is declaring other people "troll" the current modus operandi for exiting the argument when out of arguments?
His party has come to power several times before. However military would always stage a coup when his party started to repel secularist freedoms, overthrowing the democratically elected government. Then due to strength of party's base in Turkey, party would reform, get re-elected and try again.
This cycle continued in Turkey for a while until recently elected government got powerful enough (for a number of reasons irrelevant in scope of the issue) that it successfully thwarted military coup before it started by effectively destroying the army leadership through legislative means and is now proceeding to do what it tried to do for decades.
Because you don't need switches other then one in the basement for CAT3. You don't need them in CAT5 or CAT6 either. You do however need repeaters in case of CAT5 and CAT6 at around 90m-100m of every wire at the very least.
Your assumption of having a switch on the floor runs against common sense and multiple buildings with both CAT3 and CAT5 cabling that I have worked as netowork admin in. You typically have a switch in the basement in case of CAT5, and then repeaters for top floors if cable length starts to exceed 90-100m. In case of CAT3 you typically have a switch in the basement and no repeaters of any kind even for longer cables inside the actual building.
Building switches on every floor would be nightmare both in terms of costs and logistics.
Interesting angle that doesn't explain the fact that these problems with wireless are worldwide, including countries without entrenched incumbents with land lines, and including countries where there isn't cable-based infrastructure to begin with, such as many African nations.
Aye, just like in the bible and torah. And there are plenty of communities in US that live by same rules.
Did you have a point other then that organized religion with roots in judaism is inherently degenerate from secular point of view of a modern Western citizen? Because we're talking about a completely different topic.
That said if that was your point, I do agree completely.
It's a chase for lowest common denominator. Yes, some businesses can run through sneakernet. Doesn't mean that most businesses wouldn't benefit significantly from upgrading to internet.
You are referring to concept of modern freedoms. These have nothing to do with democracy. If majority views that a type of freedom is offensive to them, they can vote to repel it, or pick representatives that will repel such a freedom. What you're seeing in Turkey is rejection of Western model of secularism which was advocated by Kemal Ataturk (yes, I'm intimately familiar with Turkish history going as far as early Ottoman empire for reasons I would rather not disclose here). Historically, the guardians of these freedoms were the military which had to disband the parliament every time islamists got majority and started to repel secularist freedoms, until recently when majority that didn't want these freedoms voted Erdogan's party into leadership yet again (after it was disbanded several times by military and reformed). Such parliamentary disbands were essentially anti-democratic military coups where democratically elected government was overthrown by powerful military.
Example: US and its current ability to imprison people indefinitely under anti-terrorist laws. After 9/11 enough US people of voting aged judged that freedom to have a fair trial in reasonable amount of time was no longer on the list of freedoms they wish to have. So this freedom was repelled democratically.
There are many similar examples across the world. Turkish situation for last couple of decades at least is essentially a struggle between democratic movement that wants to repel secularist policies and freedoms it deems degenerate and offensive and powerful military that kept overthrowing democratically elected governments every time they tried to repel these freedoms. And now the democratically elected government finally succeeded in reigning military in.
Majority refers to those who are allowed/bothered to vote for obvious reasons. Else you could easily claim that a government in ancient greek city states was not democratic in spite of them being the birthplace of democracy, as due to high birth/infant/childhood mortality rates of the time, majority of the people did not in fact vote, as children formed the bulk of the population.
You are going way off tangent to show that any religious movement is essentially "extremist". It's not. Extremist is a word with a clear set of definitions. Just following religion in governance is not any of the definitions.
At worst you could reasonably claim he's building a theocracy. But theocracy isn't incompatible with democracy in any way - if majority of constituents want a state with legislation based off any set of ethics, including religious set of ethics, they are fully within their rights to implement such a state while remaining democratic, provided majority of constituents support such a state. For example the birthplace of modern democracy, Greek Polis city states were more often then not theocratic in nature due to the fact that religion was a major power and driver in everyday life of any human being living in organized societal structure. This not only didn't prevent them from being democratic, but in fact essentially gave birth to democracy as we know it.
Who said anything about extremism? Erdogan platform is about repelling secular society through legislative means which his constituents view as oppressive towards their beliefs. It's the exact opposite of extremism.
Call me when you can successfully run any kind of reliable low latency service off wireless that doesn't cost you more then deploying same service over a landline. Until then, all you can really do is cite advertisement and PR material of wireless operators.
He's not a dictator in any sense. A majority of Turks are very clearly supportive of him. There is very little doubt about this.
The issue here is the conflict between the urban and rural folks in Turkey. Rural areas are not really developed, thickly populated and essentially exist in conditions that modern urban dweller would find atrocious, similar to those found in early 1900s. But to them, that is normal existence and all they know. Also to them islam is the way of life, like christianity was a way of life to farmers of late early 1900s in USA. These people will vote for islamic parties and they are in a clear majority in Turkey. As a result, every attempt to institute democracy in Turkey led to rise of islamist movements. Western dogma has for long been suppression of democratic movement in order to prevent this through installation of various dictators.
Essentially Turkey is going through the same thing that Arab Spring nations went through, but instead of requiring a military/rebellious deposition of installed leaders, they succeeded in stripping power from the guardian of secular society (army) via democratic legislative process after a few tries.
The people protesting are the urban minority who learned to enjoy the pleasures of secular Turkey that doesn't exist outside large cities. Ergodan is representing his constituents in his actions, as a democratic leader should.
That is the reality of democracy: it's the image of the people. If most voting people of the nation are rural farmers that live in a strict religious society, then democracy will eventually evolve into society that favors them over everyone else unless certain safeguards are in place to prevent this. Because in its core, democracy is nothing but dictatorship of majority.
And in Turkey, majority is currently clearly calling the shots and wants secular elements of society that it views as degenerate removed.
Increase in category means a more complex weave of the cabling and sometimes thicker cable. That's where the extra price comes from. In case of Cat6 they have to use thicker cable which results in a out-of-spec assembly for modern RJ45 jack, or more specifically 8 position 8 contact connector. Hence "fiddly to terminate".
But it's not so much a problem as just an annoyance. The real problem is indeed cost, as you need a lot of cabling to fully network an apartment building and price difference between good quality CAT3 and CAT6 is huge. Then there's a fact that unlike CAT3, CAT6 needs to have repeaters every 100meters according to the spec. That means that any taller buildings are likely going to have repeaters for upper floors. Which adds to the expense and complexity.
Cat3 and below is POTS network. Quite a few newer buildings have cat5, in some cases 5E.
Cat6 is rare because the cable starts to get quite expensive for the length you need to run it, and 6A is VERY rare.
Ethernet isn't really tolerant of CAT3 cabling, and it's not that speed drops - it's just that it will cease functioning completely due to noise. That's why various DSL solutions are used instead, most current being VDSL2 allowing for up to 250mbit/s.
Copper pair is going to be the technology of choice for "last hundred meters". Essentially what will happen is what happened to my apartment building - ISP will pull a fiberoptic cable to the basement, install a DSLAM hooked into the fiber and deliver the connection to each apartment via existing copper pair connection over VSDL2.
This is an excellent choice for end users because they each get individual internet line with low latency that isn't hit hard by neighbour "warezing" in older buildings without the need to tear up walls to install fiber to end user.
New housing will likely eventually get fiber directly to end user. But for most places, CAT3 (and in some rarer cases CAT5/5E/6 twisted copper pair for ethernet) is the wiring solution for delivering networking to each individual apartment. I used to live in an apartment building used as build for purpose student housing, and that had CAT5 ethernet installed in every room (apartments ranged from single room to three room ones). When I moved in it offered half duplex 10mbit internet directly to socket, and when I moved out it was long upgraded to 100mbit full duplex, and was directly linked to university network via an optical cable (I was the building's admin for a couple of years in the end of my tenancy).
It's not just that. There are allowed exceptions for healthcare in copyright and patent treaties. That is why India can legally produce copy medicines ignoring patents - it invokes these clauses and applies them widely. And even big pharma is helpless before that. They spent a lot fighting it - and lost.
I'd be really surprised if Saudis let this get in the way.
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I do live and let live. Read the grandparent post.
Unless you view "stating the obvious but inconvenient truth" as "not letting live". In which case, I can't really help you. You need men in white kind of help.
Lie of the century. Not a single democracy in history of mankind functioned when based on truth.
Human societies simply do not function very well when faced with nothing but the truth. Lies are a necessary part of base functionality of human society on any level, even as basic as two people who are together for procreating.
Because the urban secular minority is unhappy. What, did you think that rioting was a privilege only reserved for majority?
Where and when exactly did this abandonment happened? Or is declaring other people "troll" the current modus operandi for exiting the argument when out of arguments?
His party has come to power several times before. However military would always stage a coup when his party started to repel secularist freedoms, overthrowing the democratically elected government. Then due to strength of party's base in Turkey, party would reform, get re-elected and try again.
This cycle continued in Turkey for a while until recently elected government got powerful enough (for a number of reasons irrelevant in scope of the issue) that it successfully thwarted military coup before it started by effectively destroying the army leadership through legislative means and is now proceeding to do what it tried to do for decades.
Not entirely sure how your advocacy of mass murder has anything to do with my post.
Because you don't need switches other then one in the basement for CAT3. You don't need them in CAT5 or CAT6 either. You do however need repeaters in case of CAT5 and CAT6 at around 90m-100m of every wire at the very least.
Your assumption of having a switch on the floor runs against common sense and multiple buildings with both CAT3 and CAT5 cabling that I have worked as netowork admin in. You typically have a switch in the basement in case of CAT5, and then repeaters for top floors if cable length starts to exceed 90-100m. In case of CAT3 you typically have a switch in the basement and no repeaters of any kind even for longer cables inside the actual building.
Building switches on every floor would be nightmare both in terms of costs and logistics.
Interesting angle that doesn't explain the fact that these problems with wireless are worldwide, including countries without entrenched incumbents with land lines, and including countries where there isn't cable-based infrastructure to begin with, such as many African nations.
Aye, just like in the bible and torah. And there are plenty of communities in US that live by same rules.
Did you have a point other then that organized religion with roots in judaism is inherently degenerate from secular point of view of a modern Western citizen? Because we're talking about a completely different topic.
That said if that was your point, I do agree completely.
It's a chase for lowest common denominator. Yes, some businesses can run through sneakernet. Doesn't mean that most businesses wouldn't benefit significantly from upgrading to internet.
By this definition, not a single state in the world is democratic. Because that's not what democracy means. You're talking about right to trial.
Many forms of government that are not democratic contain provisions that grant right to trial. These include monarchies, theocracies and so on.
On the other hand most democracies in fact allow for killing without trial. US is one such nation.
Theocracy is government by religious elite. Representative democracy is government by elected elite.
If religious elite is elected democratically, as has happened in Turkey, theocracy is in fact democratic.
You are referring to concept of modern freedoms. These have nothing to do with democracy. If majority views that a type of freedom is offensive to them, they can vote to repel it, or pick representatives that will repel such a freedom. What you're seeing in Turkey is rejection of Western model of secularism which was advocated by Kemal Ataturk (yes, I'm intimately familiar with Turkish history going as far as early Ottoman empire for reasons I would rather not disclose here). Historically, the guardians of these freedoms were the military which had to disband the parliament every time islamists got majority and started to repel secularist freedoms, until recently when majority that didn't want these freedoms voted Erdogan's party into leadership yet again (after it was disbanded several times by military and reformed). Such parliamentary disbands were essentially anti-democratic military coups where democratically elected government was overthrown by powerful military.
Example: US and its current ability to imprison people indefinitely under anti-terrorist laws. After 9/11 enough US people of voting aged judged that freedom to have a fair trial in reasonable amount of time was no longer on the list of freedoms they wish to have. So this freedom was repelled democratically.
There are many similar examples across the world. Turkish situation for last couple of decades at least is essentially a struggle between democratic movement that wants to repel secularist policies and freedoms it deems degenerate and offensive and powerful military that kept overthrowing democratically elected governments every time they tried to repel these freedoms. And now the democratically elected government finally succeeded in reigning military in.
Remember: democracy is not advocacy of freedoms.
Majority refers to those who are allowed/bothered to vote for obvious reasons. Else you could easily claim that a government in ancient greek city states was not democratic in spite of them being the birthplace of democracy, as due to high birth/infant/childhood mortality rates of the time, majority of the people did not in fact vote, as children formed the bulk of the population.
You are going way off tangent to show that any religious movement is essentially "extremist". It's not. Extremist is a word with a clear set of definitions. Just following religion in governance is not any of the definitions.
At worst you could reasonably claim he's building a theocracy. But theocracy isn't incompatible with democracy in any way - if majority of constituents want a state with legislation based off any set of ethics, including religious set of ethics, they are fully within their rights to implement such a state while remaining democratic, provided majority of constituents support such a state. For example the birthplace of modern democracy, Greek Polis city states were more often then not theocratic in nature due to the fact that religion was a major power and driver in everyday life of any human being living in organized societal structure. This not only didn't prevent them from being democratic, but in fact essentially gave birth to democracy as we know it.
Erdogan's publicist would want to paint him as someone who isn't getting "middle class vote" when he actually is to Western audience?
I'm intrigued at your logic, or utter lack of it specifically.
Who said anything about extremism? Erdogan platform is about repelling secular society through legislative means which his constituents view as oppressive towards their beliefs. It's the exact opposite of extremism.
Call me when you can successfully run any kind of reliable low latency service off wireless that doesn't cost you more then deploying same service over a landline. Until then, all you can really do is cite advertisement and PR material of wireless operators.
He's not a dictator in any sense. A majority of Turks are very clearly supportive of him. There is very little doubt about this.
The issue here is the conflict between the urban and rural folks in Turkey. Rural areas are not really developed, thickly populated and essentially exist in conditions that modern urban dweller would find atrocious, similar to those found in early 1900s. But to them, that is normal existence and all they know. Also to them islam is the way of life, like christianity was a way of life to farmers of late early 1900s in USA. These people will vote for islamic parties and they are in a clear majority in Turkey. As a result, every attempt to institute democracy in Turkey led to rise of islamist movements. Western dogma has for long been suppression of democratic movement in order to prevent this through installation of various dictators.
Essentially Turkey is going through the same thing that Arab Spring nations went through, but instead of requiring a military/rebellious deposition of installed leaders, they succeeded in stripping power from the guardian of secular society (army) via democratic legislative process after a few tries.
The people protesting are the urban minority who learned to enjoy the pleasures of secular Turkey that doesn't exist outside large cities. Ergodan is representing his constituents in his actions, as a democratic leader should.
That is the reality of democracy: it's the image of the people. If most voting people of the nation are rural farmers that live in a strict religious society, then democracy will eventually evolve into society that favors them over everyone else unless certain safeguards are in place to prevent this. Because in its core, democracy is nothing but dictatorship of majority.
And in Turkey, majority is currently clearly calling the shots and wants secular elements of society that it views as degenerate removed.
Increase in category means a more complex weave of the cabling and sometimes thicker cable. That's where the extra price comes from. In case of Cat6 they have to use thicker cable which results in a out-of-spec assembly for modern RJ45 jack, or more specifically 8 position 8 contact connector. Hence "fiddly to terminate".
But it's not so much a problem as just an annoyance. The real problem is indeed cost, as you need a lot of cabling to fully network an apartment building and price difference between good quality CAT3 and CAT6 is huge. Then there's a fact that unlike CAT3, CAT6 needs to have repeaters every 100meters according to the spec. That means that any taller buildings are likely going to have repeaters for upper floors. Which adds to the expense and complexity.
Cat3 and below is POTS network. Quite a few newer buildings have cat5, in some cases 5E.
Cat6 is rare because the cable starts to get quite expensive for the length you need to run it, and 6A is VERY rare.
Ethernet isn't really tolerant of CAT3 cabling, and it's not that speed drops - it's just that it will cease functioning completely due to noise. That's why various DSL solutions are used instead, most current being VDSL2 allowing for up to 250mbit/s.
Copper pair is going to be the technology of choice for "last hundred meters". Essentially what will happen is what happened to my apartment building - ISP will pull a fiberoptic cable to the basement, install a DSLAM hooked into the fiber and deliver the connection to each apartment via existing copper pair connection over VSDL2.
This is an excellent choice for end users because they each get individual internet line with low latency that isn't hit hard by neighbour "warezing" in older buildings without the need to tear up walls to install fiber to end user.
New housing will likely eventually get fiber directly to end user. But for most places, CAT3 (and in some rarer cases CAT5/5E/6 twisted copper pair for ethernet) is the wiring solution for delivering networking to each individual apartment. I used to live in an apartment building used as build for purpose student housing, and that had CAT5 ethernet installed in every room (apartments ranged from single room to three room ones). When I moved in it offered half duplex 10mbit internet directly to socket, and when I moved out it was long upgraded to 100mbit full duplex, and was directly linked to university network via an optical cable (I was the building's admin for a couple of years in the end of my tenancy).
Which is utterly incapable of replacing copper pair for the simple reason known as "physics".
It's not just that. There are allowed exceptions for healthcare in copyright and patent treaties. That is why India can legally produce copy medicines ignoring patents - it invokes these clauses and applies them widely. And even big pharma is helpless before that. They spent a lot fighting it - and lost.
I'd be really surprised if Saudis let this get in the way.
I'm sorry, I thought we were talking about a Western country, not Somalia.