This article, while vainly attempting to sound even-handed, comes off as Linux bashing. He trivializes Linux developers for writing drivers (though, he not-so-deftly attempts to take it back) and he passes Linux off as a 'mini-BSD.' He fails to address most of the strengths of Linux other than Hardware support. (What about software? I didn't see a Code Warrior for xBSD)
Since when is supporting affordable hardware an unimportant goal? I don't feel like buying the most expensive, and only supported device X, when I can have full support under Linux.
If anything, this article is thinly veiled Linux-bashing by a holier-than-thou BSD user, and as much as I like FreeBSD for running Apache, I've found xBSD users to have an air of distain for all things non-BSD.
Linux is not xBSD on training wheels. It's an alternative, original implementation of classic UNIX concepts. It happens to run Quake3 accelerated on my Voodoo3? Does that make it less valid? I can run it on my desktop, and run a web server, sshd, and ftp.
I've read more unbiased opinions from NT supporters, and that's really sad.
Nice try. Ever taken a logic course? Morality is dictating by community standards. In North America, and most first world countries, morality and community standards dictate that dogs and cats are on a seperate plane from other animals. They have more respect, and are treated better here.
You also fail to make a point in your vain attempt to anger what you though was an 'animal rights' person, but rather a 'common sense' person. I couldn't care less what your car has on it. But if it had dog fur on the seats, I'd think you were pretty disgusting.
As for being a redneck, if knee-jerk reactions are part of being a redneck, maybe you are.
Dear Sirs, I am writing to inform you that, while I was disappointed in the writings of some of my more overzealous community members, it was far worse, that you chose to post their private e-mails with you in a public forum. Legal ramifications aside, these mails were sent to you in confidence, as is this one, and should have remained that way.
Also, this is a vain attempt to produce negative publicity about the group that have become your 'opponents' as of late. However, your focus on the few 'bad apples' is purely prejudicial, and thoroughly unprofessional.
I am not a zealot, I'm just a programmer who has to try and fit in with the many people who would rather mouth off that do anything constructive. In any grass roots movement, you have the few hot headed individuals, but they do not, by any means, represent our community as a whole.
You have my permission to post this message, though I'd appreciate if you'd obscure my e-mail address, as you failed to do on your previous posting. Please take the time to read about Netiquette, and the inappropriateness of posting private messages like you did.
This should be exciting. We get to be told about computers from the 'modern' company that is the Burlington Coat Factory. The same 'modern' company that sells dog and cat fur coats. I doubt the spin doctor they send to the conference will have anything to say about that.
To them, Linux is cutting corners, I'd imagine, not some technological innovation. Cutting corners seems to be their raison d'etre.
Does anyone get bothered at all that all these conferences seem to be turning into Comdex and become giant marketing conventions?
Not quite. Cold Fusion, for one thing, is a scientific process, Allaire's trademark is at best restricted to a Web application platform. Plus, they'd have a difficult time convincing people that they own that term. Prior art? People have been investigating cold fusion chemically, for a long time.
Plus, they'd have to conclusively prove that Code Fusion dillutes the trademark... I'm surprised they even managed to get one.
I second the motion of the guys supporting Code Warrior... Code Warrior is, bar none, the best damn IDE on the planet... I bought the GNU version, and assuming there is an upgrade, I'll buy the professional edition in the Fall (which will support Java and Code Warrior's native debugger) I'm excited to try Visual Age, though I've used Code Warrior almost exclusively on various platforms (Windows, Solaris and now Linux)
If my opinion doesn't sell you, keep in mind that even John Carmack would agree that Code Warrior is the simplest, fastest way to write good code....
It took me about five minutes to "port" the x11amp-alsa 0.3 driver to xmms. (Basically, rewriting some of the functions to their new names) It worked fine, and was fairly seamless. Those crying about conspiracies should actually try the code before complaining that OSS is going to somehow own this GPL'ed program.
So they want to make some money. So what. You don't like it? Use ALSA or OSS/Free.
Maybe if you guys would spent some time looking at code, you'd realize that (a) OSS can't 'steal' xmms/x11amp. (b) ALSA works fine, and but it's not stable, and thus not in the xmms/x11amp source distribution and (c) if you want ALSA to work, why not help the guy coding the plugin?
I liked this article. I had never really considered the effects of these two 'individuals' on our society, but Katz put is well, albeit a little long-winded.
However, the research community has traditionally been one of the most elitist. While in principle, it subscribes to open ideas (all experimental findings and methods should be available), there is a great deal of effort spent, it seems, on making this information difficult to get a hold of.
As far as Code Warrior is concerned, there are next to no problems running it on another distribution. Right now, I'm running a flawless commercial copy of Code Warrior on my Stampede GNU/Linux 0.89 machine. I don't use RPM, but alien solved that problem. Also, Code Warrior includes it's own libraries, so library incompatibilities are not an issue.
Let's be honest, Redhat is not a solid distribution. It is flaky. It's probably the last distribution I would consider. However, it is the biggest name, arguably the most popular, and for Metrowerks to support them is not unusual. They can't expect to figure out how their product works on every distribution on the planet, and they probably won't be releasing their killer product as Open Source. So they had to pick a distribution. So what.
Bottom line: Redhat is nearly the standard, as are RPMs. It's too bad, but it's not RedHat's fault. They're successful, and it would be silly to expect them to apologize for it.
I remember iCE, back in the day. I was a member for a few months back in 1994. It was nice to be able to look up all my old artwork (only four pictures:) and it reminded me of how cool and simple those days were.
There were a few groups back then, ACiD, iCE, DARK, and GOTHIC (which merged with ACiD). I had the privledge of being part of all four.
The weirdest thing is, I still have friends that I made back then, friends I made over international conference calls, that a member managed to 'acquire.'.
I also remember the hostility I saw for refusing to use the pixel-by-pixel Deluxe Paint II... I was using Photoshop and Fractal Design Painter. Simpler days, for sure.:)
Anyway, I guess I could mention some of those great people I met back then, Elminster, Epitaph, Oxygene, Radman, Prison Breaker, Carnifex, 4th Disciple, the list goes on.
I ended up getting into Sheridan College's Animation Program on the strength of art I did with those groups. (I left after a few months, but that's a different story:)
BBS'ing, was terrific. It was a tighter, sharing community; sure, we had private BBS's, phreaking, and silly Telegard/Renegade/PCBoard hackers, ansi rippers, and pizza delivery boys running Art Groups, but it was a fun time. Without the people I met there, I probably would never had seen a UNIX system, never seen the Internet when it was mostly FTP and IRC.... oh, and Netscape 1.0 was around the corner, but it's not like we had ISP providing PPP... for that matter, we didn't exactly have a lot of ISPs.:)
Thanks to iCE-guys for reminding me of all this great stuff,
I worked for an (unnamed) company, and I needed to automate a wide variety of Windows tasks, including accessing the Windows NT registry, and the IIS Metabase. Without Perl, this would have taken forever, as I would have needed to write a complete compiled program.
Instead, with ActiveState, and the ALREADY exiting Win32 extensions, I managed to write a usable program using batch files and Perl in just a few hours.
You can complain about Win32, (I do) but a lot of us have to work on it, and more tools that we know inside out, never hurt.
After all, try telling me to use Windows without using the Win32 port of VI.
One other point. IF this is an American law, if a software company attempts to shut down a piece of software in a country with no agreement to upload this (ridiculous) law, would the company have the right to sue (the living hell out of) the company?
This is a ridiculous law, but it's intended to protect ridiculous people. Who cares? I've run Linux for a few years now, I've had Word Processors that make better College Reports than any commercial (LyX), better Math software (Rlab) and better programming environments, Vi, Emacs.. . If these commercial developers who make shoddy software want to cripple themselves even more, especially in the face of this OSS revolution, more power to them. I don't need them, and neither do you.
So consequently, KDE is going to use developers who could be doing something new, to rewrite Gimp using QT? Sounds like a waste of valuable resources. I suppose it's really up to the developers what they do, but if they're compentent enough programmers to rewrite the Gimp from scratch, there are a lot of areas where their type would be better spent.
It's too bad that 'widget-wars' are resulting in many developers writing the same applications in QT and GTK.
Don't flame, I did specifically say that it is up to the developers.
Try proving it. It's one thing to make an argument, it's another thing to find EVIDENCE to do so. We live in a world where statistics are what matter, because without them, we can't possibly extrapolate into a real-world situation.
The foundation of science is that an experiment can be reproduced, independantly. Otherwise, it's fair to say that the hypothesis is false. I worked with drug testing in a psychiatric hospital, and it was the same approach. A number of DIFFERENT people have to have consistent results, before a drug can be discredited or credited.
Try reading my message in it's entirety. I didn't say guns caused violence. I said, LOTS of things did. When you learn to read, and post your name, we'll talk.
I wasn't trolling for gun nuts, but I think it's funny that you'd say that. I personally think hunting is the poorest excuse for a sport. Maybe if you did it with a pocket knife. Maybe that would even the odds considering how much smarter we are, but I digress.
The root of my argument though, was that it's easy to try to create a cause->effect relationship where there isn't one. Guns do not always lead to kids murdering, neither do video games, it's a lot of factors, which this lawsuit couldn't possibly address. Let's not forget that the foundation of American society is revolution. To quote Homer Simpson
"If I didn't have a gun, the King of England could just show up and start pushing you around, do you want that?"
If you live like that, constantly thinking about 'dying and killing' for freedom, it's not surprising that you'll do that same to improve your social standing:)
Actually, you CAN argue that it does not lead to violence. It's simple. If you were doing an experiment, and you found that everytime you added acid to base, you got salt, you could realistically conclude that acid+base = salt. On the other hand, if you did it say, 50 million times (roughly the players of Doom), and you got a total of 5 'salts', you'd hardly be able to conclude that acid+base = salt.
There has to be a significant correlation before you can make an argument, one way or another, otherwise, you haven't got much to stand on.
The problem is that people are assuming that only one factor can be responsible for an action. This is a falacy, logically speaking. They assume that these kids are messed up BECAUSE of doom, when it would be scientifically impossible to show doom leads to killing, simply because a lot of people play doom, (some of us are even vegetarians) and don't like, or condone killing. This is a blatent attempt by politicans and lawyers to make some money, while ignoring the real problems. Guns.
Give a boy a fish, and you feed him for a day, Give him a gun, and he'll shoot up his high school.
Slashdot Mirror
This article, while vainly attempting to sound even-handed, comes off as Linux bashing. He trivializes Linux developers for writing drivers (though, he not-so-deftly attempts to take it back) and he passes Linux off as a 'mini-BSD.' He fails to address most of the strengths of Linux other than Hardware support. (What about software? I didn't see a Code Warrior for xBSD)
Since when is supporting affordable hardware an unimportant goal? I don't feel like buying the most expensive, and only supported device X, when I can have full support under Linux.
If anything, this article is thinly veiled Linux-bashing by a holier-than-thou BSD user, and as much as I like FreeBSD for running Apache, I've found xBSD users to have an air of distain for all things non-BSD.
Linux is not xBSD on training wheels. It's an alternative, original implementation of classic UNIX concepts. It happens to run Quake3 accelerated on my Voodoo3? Does that make it less valid? I can run it on my desktop, and run a web server, sshd, and ftp.
I've read more unbiased opinions from NT supporters, and that's really sad.
Try Xing... bar none the best quality, and it's blidingly fast. (The Linux version is CLI, but it works well with grip.)
Nice try. Ever taken a logic course? Morality is dictating by community standards. In North America, and most first world countries, morality and community standards dictate that dogs and cats are on a seperate plane from other animals. They have more respect, and are treated better here.
You also fail to make a point in your vain attempt to anger what you though was an 'animal rights' person, but rather a 'common sense' person. I couldn't care less what your car has on it. But if it had dog fur on the seats, I'd think you were pretty disgusting.
As for being a redneck, if knee-jerk reactions are part of being a redneck, maybe you are.
Dear Sirs,
I am writing to inform you that, while I was disappointed in the writings of some of my more overzealous community members, it was far worse, that you chose to post their private e-mails with you in a public forum. Legal ramifications aside, these mails were sent to you in confidence, as is this one, and should have remained that way.
Also, this is a vain attempt to produce negative publicity about the group that have become your 'opponents' as of late. However, your focus on the few 'bad apples' is purely prejudicial, and thoroughly unprofessional.
I am not a zealot, I'm just a programmer who has to try and fit in with the many people who would rather mouth off that do anything constructive. In any grass roots movement, you have the few hot headed individuals, but they do not, by any means, represent our community as a whole.
You have my permission to post this message, though I'd appreciate if you'd obscure my e-mail address, as you failed to do on your previous posting. Please take the time to read about Netiquette, and the inappropriateness of posting
private messages like you did.
Regards,
Aubin
This should be exciting. We get to be told about computers from the 'modern' company that is the Burlington Coat Factory. The same 'modern' company that sells dog and cat fur coats. I doubt the spin doctor they send to the conference will have anything to say about that.
To them, Linux is cutting corners, I'd imagine, not some technological innovation. Cutting corners seems to be their raison d'etre.
Does anyone get bothered at all that all these conferences seem to be turning into Comdex and become giant marketing conventions?
Not quite. Cold Fusion, for one thing, is a scientific process, Allaire's trademark is at best restricted to a Web application platform. Plus, they'd have a difficult time convincing people that they own that term. Prior art? People have been investigating cold fusion chemically, for a long time.
Plus, they'd have to conclusively prove that Code Fusion dillutes the trademark... I'm surprised they even managed to get one.
I second the motion of the guys supporting Code Warrior... Code Warrior is, bar none, the best damn IDE on the planet... I bought the GNU version, and assuming there is an upgrade, I'll buy the professional edition in the Fall (which will support Java and Code Warrior's native debugger) I'm excited to try Visual Age, though I've used Code Warrior almost exclusively on various platforms (Windows, Solaris and now Linux)
If my opinion doesn't sell you, keep in mind that even John Carmack would agree that Code Warrior is the simplest, fastest way to write good code....
It took me about five minutes to "port" the x11amp-alsa 0.3 driver to xmms. (Basically, rewriting some of the functions to their new names) It worked fine, and was fairly seamless. Those crying about conspiracies should actually try the code before complaining that OSS is going to somehow own this GPL'ed program.
So they want to make some money. So what. You don't like it? Use ALSA or OSS/Free.
Maybe if you guys would spent some time looking at code, you'd realize that (a) OSS can't 'steal' xmms/x11amp. (b) ALSA works fine, and but it's not stable, and thus not in the xmms/x11amp source distribution and (c) if you want ALSA to work, why not help the guy coding the plugin?
I'm thinking about going to this, but $125 for students? Even Comdex is free.
Well, it seems that it's not reading my .x11amp .x11amp to .xmms doesn't work either.
stuff, including my skins. Of course, moving
I liked this article. I had never really considered the effects of these two 'individuals' on our society, but Katz put is well, albeit a little long-winded.
However, the research community has traditionally been one of the most elitist. While in principle, it subscribes to open ideas (all experimental findings and methods should be available), there is a great deal of effort spent, it seems, on making this information difficult to get a hold of.
As far as Code Warrior is concerned, there are next to no problems running it on another distribution. Right now, I'm running a flawless commercial copy of Code Warrior on my Stampede GNU/Linux 0.89 machine. I don't use RPM, but alien solved that problem. Also, Code Warrior includes it's own libraries, so library incompatibilities are not an issue.
Let's be honest, Redhat is not a solid distribution. It is flaky. It's probably the last distribution I would consider. However, it is the biggest name, arguably the most popular, and for Metrowerks to support them is not unusual. They can't expect to figure out how their product works on every distribution on the planet, and they probably won't be releasing their killer product as Open Source. So they had to pick a distribution. So what.
Bottom line: Redhat is nearly the standard, as are RPMs. It's too bad, but it's not RedHat's fault. They're successful, and it would be silly to expect them to apologize for it.
Hardly :) That was the 'style' at the time. When iCE came out, everyone wrote i's that way... ACiD, GOTHiC, 4i6 etc. Imac is just a plain-old rip off :)
I remember iCE, back in the day. I was a member for a few months back in 1994. It was nice to be able to look up all my old artwork (only four pictures :) and it reminded me of how cool and simple those days were.
:)
:)
:)
There were a few groups back then, ACiD, iCE, DARK, and GOTHIC (which merged with ACiD). I had the privledge of being part of all four.
The weirdest thing is, I still have friends that I made back then, friends I made over international conference calls, that a member managed to 'acquire.'.
I also remember the hostility I saw for refusing to use the pixel-by-pixel Deluxe Paint II... I was using Photoshop and Fractal Design Painter. Simpler days, for sure.
Anyway, I guess I could mention some of those great people I met back then, Elminster, Epitaph, Oxygene, Radman, Prison Breaker, Carnifex, 4th Disciple, the list goes on.
I ended up getting into Sheridan College's Animation Program on the strength of art I did with those groups.
(I left after a few months, but that's a different story
BBS'ing, was terrific. It was a tighter, sharing community; sure, we had private BBS's, phreaking, and silly Telegard/Renegade/PCBoard hackers, ansi rippers, and pizza delivery boys running Art Groups, but it was a fun time. Without the people I met there, I probably would never had seen a UNIX system, never seen the Internet when it was mostly FTP and IRC.... oh, and Netscape 1.0 was around the corner, but it's not like we had ISP providing PPP... for that matter, we didn't exactly have a lot of ISPs.
Thanks to iCE-guys for reminding me of all this great stuff,
The Artist Formerly Known as Crow
I worked for an (unnamed) company, and I needed to automate a wide variety of Windows tasks, including accessing the Windows NT registry, and the IIS Metabase. Without Perl, this would have taken forever, as I would have needed to write a complete compiled program.
Instead, with ActiveState, and the ALREADY exiting Win32 extensions, I managed to write a usable program using batch files and Perl in just a few hours.
You can complain about Win32, (I do) but a lot of us have to work on it, and more tools that we know inside out, never hurt.
After all, try telling me to use Windows without using the Win32 port of VI.
One other point. IF this is an American law, if a software company attempts to shut down a piece of software in a country with no agreement to upload this (ridiculous) law, would the company have the right to sue (the living hell out of) the company?
This is a ridiculous law, but it's intended to protect ridiculous people. Who cares? I've run Linux for a few years now, I've had Word Processors that make better College Reports than any commercial (LyX), better Math software (Rlab) and better programming environments, Vi, Emacs..
. If these commercial developers who make shoddy software want to cripple themselves even more, especially in the face of this OSS revolution, more power to them.
I don't need them, and neither do you.
So consequently, KDE is going to use developers who could be doing something new, to rewrite Gimp using QT? Sounds like a waste of valuable resources. I suppose it's really up to the developers what they do, but if they're compentent enough programmers to rewrite the Gimp from scratch, there are a lot of areas where their type would be better spent.
It's too bad that 'widget-wars' are resulting in many developers writing the same applications in QT and GTK.
Don't flame, I did specifically say that it is up to the developers.
Whoops. I'm thinking of Carmack. Romero is a dork.
Who is he? Probably one of the smartest, and coolest programmers in commercial software today. He's a geek who made it. Let him enjoy it.
Try proving it. It's one thing to make an argument, it's another thing to find EVIDENCE to do so. We live in a world where statistics are what matter, because without them, we can't possibly extrapolate into a real-world situation.
The foundation of science is that an experiment can be reproduced, independantly. Otherwise, it's fair to say that the hypothesis is false. I worked with drug testing in a psychiatric hospital, and it was the same approach. A number of DIFFERENT people have to have consistent results, before a drug can be discredited or credited.
Try reading my message in it's entirety. I didn't say guns caused violence. I said, LOTS of things did. When you learn to read, and post your name, we'll talk.
I wasn't trolling for gun nuts, but I think it's funny that you'd say that. I personally think hunting is the poorest excuse for a sport. Maybe if you did it with a pocket knife. Maybe that would even the odds considering how much smarter we are, but I digress.
:)
The root of my argument though, was that it's easy to try to create a cause->effect relationship where there isn't one. Guns do not always lead to kids murdering, neither do video games, it's a lot of factors, which this lawsuit couldn't possibly address. Let's not forget that the foundation of American society is revolution. To quote Homer Simpson
"If I didn't have a gun, the King of England could just show up and start pushing you around, do you want that?"
If you live like that, constantly thinking about 'dying and killing' for freedom, it's not surprising that you'll do that same to improve your social standing
Actually, you CAN argue that it does not lead to violence. It's simple. If you were doing an experiment, and you found that everytime you added acid to base, you got salt, you could realistically conclude that acid+base = salt. On the other hand, if you did it say, 50 million times (roughly the players of Doom), and you got a total of 5 'salts', you'd hardly be able to conclude that acid+base = salt.
There has to be a significant correlation before you can make an argument, one way or another, otherwise, you haven't got much to stand on.
The problem is that people are assuming that only
one factor can be responsible for an action. This is a falacy, logically speaking. They assume that
these kids are messed up BECAUSE of doom, when it would be scientifically impossible to show doom leads to killing, simply because a lot of people play doom, (some of us are even vegetarians) and don't like, or condone killing. This is a blatent attempt by politicans and lawyers to make some money, while ignoring the real problems. Guns.
Give a boy a fish, and you feed him for a day, Give him a gun, and he'll shoot up his high school.