You didn't notice the whole start button controversy in Windows 8?
You didn't notice the quick backtrack, and the lack of market share of Windows 8?
Never mind the dramatic changes it had in each major release since XP (Vista doesn't count)
Nope didn't notice that. Because there weren't any. Not for standard productive use of a computer. Everything is still in the same place it has been since Windows XP. Wifi still in the bottom right, start menu still in bottom left, applications in the middle. Everything else is not relevant to me using the OS.
But the point was, using an argument of Linux UI changes as a reason to not use Linux would also apply at least as well to Windows.
Yes and no. Just like you referenced a Windows 8 interface that was immediately backtracked Linux had errrrr GNOME 3 which is still being forced down our throats? errrr. Unity which is still being forced down our throats?
For better or for worse, MS has responded to the controversy far better than the OSS community has.
Why? iOS has notoriously good update rates, and Android introduced a security update system way back in KitKat decoupling security from the current running version. (I got a security update for 5 year old KitKat tablet this year, and a 3 year old phone running 3 versions behind on Android only 3 weeks ago (I wish I made up those numbers, though I was being dishonest with the last one which actually has a release date of 5 weeks ago, but it wasn't pushed to my phone until 2 weeks later)).
Sure by while you're pointing that out also point out that: a) you've only broken the first layer of defense and will likely have several other layers to overcome (e.g. SSL) b) it's an IoT device, so... by all means please hack me and turn my heater up.
This is WiFi snooping. You shouldn't be doing ANYTHING you don't want monitored over WiFi even if your WiFi is encrypted without using some secondary layer of defense (e.g. VPN, SSL, both, etc).
The problem was one in the standard itself, and Windows wasn't immune to it. Though it is now. Microsoft patched it ahead of release last Tuesday, and only since then has Windows ignored the re-transmissions.
Maybe in the USA, but in most of the world we regularly still receive updates to older phones. My Galaxy Tab 3 got an update earlier this year for Kitkat even though I voluntarily haven't installed Lollipop. My over 3 year old phone now 3 Android versions behind received its latest security update 3 weeks ago.
Kitkat introduced a security patching framework independent of the core OS. Since then, people quoting Android version install base when discussing security has been completely irrelevant.
but Android devices aren't something telcos have control over.
I take it you're not American? Yeah in most of the world the telcos in general don't get in the way much. However in America, the latest and greatest Android phones are telco specials, telco controlled, with telco specific firmware.
For example if you're the owner of a Galaxy S7 in the USA you will have one of these models depending who you buy it from: SM-G930U SM-G930V SM-G930VL SM-G930AZ SM-G930A SM-G930T1 SM-G930R6 SM-G930R7 SM-G930P SM-G930T SM-G930R4
If you're in Europe / The rest of the world with the exception of South Korea you will have: SM-G930F Or the dual sim model: SM-G930FD
Each of these have custom firmwares, and the US carriers are notoriously bad at providing firmware updates. Mind you all of this is irrelevant since the OP was quoting Android core OS versions and not security updates. Even KitKat phones still receive security updates through some vendors, and yes even American Telcos will sometimes roll these out to customers, albeit a bit later than the international firmware.
I'm really fucking concerned about how Google will fix this for Android, the most popular OS in the world.
Recent stats are showing that only 0.2% of users are using Android 8.0, the latest version. Only about 18% are using Android 7.x releases. A whopping 32% are using Android 6.x! About 28% are using Android 5.x! About 21% are using Android 4.x!
And? What's your point? I got an OTA security update for a 5 year old Android 4.4 device in February this year, one which I voluntarily chose not to upgrade to 5 (though that also got a security update at the same time). Just because it isn't the latest OS version doesn't mean that it isn't getting security updates.
And likewise just because it's a security issue doesn't mean that the fix requires an OTA update. A great many are done by patching up drivers and core components through the Play Store.
Read up on how security in Android is handled before you get too concerned. Stress is not healthy.
By ignoring any attempt to re-transmit and restarting the entire handshake process from the beginning. Ultimately it will result in a slower connection if something doesn't go perfectly the first go but the security flaw relies on a spec feature that was designed to cope with transmission errors during the negotiation process.
Not sure why you're quoting version numbers instead of manufacturer support. This isn't iOS. Most security fixes are backported to earlier versions of Android. E.g. Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 which is now 5 years old had it's most recent security update applied in February this year for both devices running 4.4/Kitkat and those which were optionally upgraded to 5/Lollipop by users.
And that's to say nothing of the many security problems that are resolved in Android by simply updating some application through the play store which includes things such as security flaws in system components and drivers.
Can't get to the link in the 8th word of the submission? How do you have a job with an attention span that short?
Or if you actually have a useful attention span, how do you have a job with time management skills so poor that you spend more time posting about not being spoon fed then clicking a link?
The #1 goal of an UI is to empower users. Which means making it EASIER for users to do what they need to do -- NOT HARDER.
I'll leave out the bit about insulting straight up but now you're just saying the exact opposite to that of actual UI and UX gurus and then stressing the primary point of a UI which the ribbon interface specifically addresses, which is to make tasks shorter, simpler, and easier to get to through better layout and description.
I gave you a freebie so I could read to the end of the paragraph but sorry I stop reading posts after 3 worthless statements. I assume the rest of your post was garbage too. I should expect no less from a "UX guru" (oh man I couldn't type that with a straight face, you should have seen me laugh as I wrote "appeal to authority" hahahahaha)
Limiting what users can do and blocking malicious behaviour like installing software and the ability to send network traffic is the job of the operating system. If you need a second application with kernel level privileges just to replicate the functionality of the actual kernel, you have a deeper problem.
Now user hostile system aside, there's a reason why anti-virus relies on matching the type of software, actual software lists, or attempting to determine what looks like malware rather than closing off the options for malware to exist: a) users will happily permit malware to install without a thought, b) most malware looks identical to any other application on the system in terms of how it interacts with the OS.
So something as tunable and fungible as software that monitors and attempts to block other software does NOT now, nor should it ever run in the kernel.
Every single OS in the world has your "deeper problem" the only difference between them is ultimately the attack surface (mono-culture helps) and the effort people are willing to put into the attack.
You don't need to look for grease. You just need to look at personal preferences of those in charge since they have a lot of ultimate power over such decisions. You also need to look at potential investments, like... the fancy new headquarters in Munich which I'm sure included some kind of tax break or maybe even just flat out had a "only if you dump Linux" clause.
They didn't destroy a stable Office interface with the disaster known as the "Ribbon".
That disaster isn't, and wasn't. What it was was and endless complaint by professional users who spent years learning an archaic old interface which relied heavily on the memory of symbols, shortcuts, and nested menus which were irrelevant to 90% of what was being done at the time.
There's a reason that interface has been widely adopted, and more generally that menus have been eliminated and context dependent UIs have replaced them. Presenting all options to all users at all times is frankly a disaster when learning a new system.
Sorry but I can't help but disagree. An office scenario where a PC dynamically changes state is the perfect use case *FOR* things like systemd, networkmanager and pulse audio.
Switching between wireless and docked networks, constantly changing hardware attached in meeting rooms, VPNs, headphones, headsets etc dynamically selected for video / audio calls. About the only use case for a pre-these-three-things linux, is a fixed desktop.
Huh? *looks to the start button in the bottom left that has existed since Windows 95* *looks to the task bar which still shows running apps as it has since windows 95* *looks to the top right, yep still the same three buttons on every windows since windows 95*.
What the hell are you doing on your computer that requires you to use more than 3 three UI features when interacting with a program?
Then they were also very smart people when they decided to switch to Linux. Or does that notion conflict with your bias?
I seem to recall that was some 15 years ago. I bought an ICE car back then, so am I inherently biased against EVs?
The city saved $10m euro over the years in licensing fees. How much would be made back with the newly proposed MS headquarters? There were also complaints of productivity issues that don't show in license figures, as well as training.
Looking to the past to make a decision about the present should only be a deciding factor in a tie-breaker.
No one is moving away from Visa / Mastercard because it's "western payments". They are moving away because it's old methods with old technologies.
Hell the USA were the first to move away from these payment methods with the rise of Paypal. This all is just the natural progression of technology combined with a cashless economy.
And all of that is completely irrelevant as to why the UK is attempting to arrest him, you know like the post I was replying to. Nothing happening in the USA or in Sweden is currently related to the crime he committed in the UK.
stackable in apartments mostly not an issue, thing could come through wall or window.
At a 45 degree re-entry that would reduce my 95 sqm apartment to about 4sqm worth of exposed risk the rest protecting me by significant amounts of reinforced concrete.
humans ARE roughly 1 square meter
Only dead on from the side, which is not how satellites reenter.
Perhaps not ideal but if software can make a hardware problem seem to disappear then I have to ask, was the problem really in the hardware?
Given how the examples didn't actually fix anything and instead "masked" them and reduced performance as they went, yes the problem is in hardware.
In my example of the truck throttle control I could just as easily say that the software did not account properly for the limits of the hardware
So... new limits of hardware that were now magically lower than previously? Again, how is this not a hardware problem. I have yet to see any of these "software fixes" actually work in a way that doesn't reduce performance. One should remember why the software was designed as it was in the first place.
And the 2011 macbook pro which also had overheating early failure issues. And while not actually a fault, the earlier Macbook Air which had shithouse performance compared to most other devices on the same processor thanks to thermally throttling every time it did something as strenuous as displaying a webpage.
Slashdot Mirror
You didn't notice the whole start button controversy in Windows 8?
You didn't notice the quick backtrack, and the lack of market share of Windows 8?
Never mind the dramatic changes it had in each major release since XP (Vista doesn't count)
Nope didn't notice that. Because there weren't any. Not for standard productive use of a computer. Everything is still in the same place it has been since Windows XP. Wifi still in the bottom right, start menu still in bottom left, applications in the middle. Everything else is not relevant to me using the OS.
But the point was, using an argument of Linux UI changes as a reason to not use Linux would also apply at least as well to Windows.
Yes and no. Just like you referenced a Windows 8 interface that was immediately backtracked Linux had errrrr GNOME 3 which is still being forced down our throats? errrr. Unity which is still being forced down our throats?
For better or for worse, MS has responded to the controversy far better than the OSS community has.
Why? iOS has notoriously good update rates, and Android introduced a security update system way back in KitKat decoupling security from the current running version. (I got a security update for 5 year old KitKat tablet this year, and a 3 year old phone running 3 versions behind on Android only 3 weeks ago (I wish I made up those numbers, though I was being dishonest with the last one which actually has a release date of 5 weeks ago, but it wasn't pushed to my phone until 2 weeks later)).
Sure by while you're pointing that out also point out that: ... by all means please hack me and turn my heater up.
a) you've only broken the first layer of defense and will likely have several other layers to overcome (e.g. SSL)
b) it's an IoT device, so
This is WiFi snooping. You shouldn't be doing ANYTHING you don't want monitored over WiFi even if your WiFi is encrypted without using some secondary layer of defense (e.g. VPN, SSL, both, etc).
The problem was one in the standard itself, and Windows wasn't immune to it. Though it is now. Microsoft patched it ahead of release last Tuesday, and only since then has Windows ignored the re-transmissions.
Maybe in the USA, but in most of the world we regularly still receive updates to older phones.
My Galaxy Tab 3 got an update earlier this year for Kitkat even though I voluntarily haven't installed Lollipop. My over 3 year old phone now 3 Android versions behind received its latest security update 3 weeks ago.
Kitkat introduced a security patching framework independent of the core OS. Since then, people quoting Android version install base when discussing security has been completely irrelevant.
but Android devices aren't something telcos have control over.
I take it you're not American? Yeah in most of the world the telcos in general don't get in the way much. However in America, the latest and greatest Android phones are telco specials, telco controlled, with telco specific firmware.
For example if you're the owner of a Galaxy S7 in the USA you will have one of these models depending who you buy it from:
SM-G930U
SM-G930V
SM-G930VL
SM-G930AZ
SM-G930A
SM-G930T1
SM-G930R6
SM-G930R7
SM-G930P
SM-G930T
SM-G930R4
If you're in Europe / The rest of the world with the exception of South Korea you will have:
SM-G930F
Or the dual sim model: SM-G930FD
Each of these have custom firmwares, and the US carriers are notoriously bad at providing firmware updates.
Mind you all of this is irrelevant since the OP was quoting Android core OS versions and not security updates. Even KitKat phones still receive security updates through some vendors, and yes even American Telcos will sometimes roll these out to customers, albeit a bit later than the international firmware.
I'm really fucking concerned about how Google will fix this for Android, the most popular OS in the world.
Recent stats are showing that only 0.2% of users are using Android 8.0, the latest version. Only about 18% are using Android 7.x releases. A whopping 32% are using Android 6.x! About 28% are using Android 5.x! About 21% are using Android 4.x!
And? What's your point? I got an OTA security update for a 5 year old Android 4.4 device in February this year, one which I voluntarily chose not to upgrade to 5 (though that also got a security update at the same time). Just because it isn't the latest OS version doesn't mean that it isn't getting security updates.
And likewise just because it's a security issue doesn't mean that the fix requires an OTA update. A great many are done by patching up drivers and core components through the Play Store.
Read up on how security in Android is handled before you get too concerned. Stress is not healthy.
Defense in depth. If you come to my house I will happily give you my wifi access code. It's only 1 small part of the security process.
By ignoring any attempt to re-transmit and restarting the entire handshake process from the beginning. Ultimately it will result in a slower connection if something doesn't go perfectly the first go but the security flaw relies on a spec feature that was designed to cope with transmission errors during the negotiation process.
Not sure why you're quoting version numbers instead of manufacturer support. This isn't iOS. Most security fixes are backported to earlier versions of Android. E.g. Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 which is now 5 years old had it's most recent security update applied in February this year for both devices running 4.4/Kitkat and those which were optionally upgraded to 5/Lollipop by users.
And that's to say nothing of the many security problems that are resolved in Android by simply updating some application through the play store which includes things such as security flaws in system components and drivers.
Can't get to the link in the 8th word of the submission? How do you have a job with an attention span that short?
Or if you actually have a useful attention span, how do you have a job with time management skills so poor that you spend more time posting about not being spoon fed then clicking a link?
Incorrect.
Unqualified statement.
As a graphics, UI, andU UX guru
Appeal to authority
The #1 goal of an UI is to empower users. Which means making it EASIER for users to do what they need to do -- NOT HARDER.
I'll leave out the bit about insulting straight up but now you're just saying the exact opposite to that of actual UI and UX gurus and then stressing the primary point of a UI which the ribbon interface specifically addresses, which is to make tasks shorter, simpler, and easier to get to through better layout and description.
I gave you a freebie so I could read to the end of the paragraph but sorry I stop reading posts after 3 worthless statements. I assume the rest of your post was garbage too. I should expect no less from a "UX guru" (oh man I couldn't type that with a straight face, you should have seen me laugh as I wrote "appeal to authority" hahahahaha)
Let me paraphrase:
You shouldn't need anti-virus software at all.
Limiting what users can do and blocking malicious behaviour like installing software and the ability to send network traffic is the job of the operating system. If you need a second application with kernel level privileges just to replicate the functionality of the actual kernel, you have a deeper problem.
Now user hostile system aside, there's a reason why anti-virus relies on matching the type of software, actual software lists, or attempting to determine what looks like malware rather than closing off the options for malware to exist: a) users will happily permit malware to install without a thought, b) most malware looks identical to any other application on the system in terms of how it interacts with the OS.
So something as tunable and fungible as software that monitors and attempts to block other software does NOT now, nor should it ever run in the kernel.
Every single OS in the world has your "deeper problem" the only difference between them is ultimately the attack surface (mono-culture helps) and the effort people are willing to put into the attack.
... you shouldn't use any operating system or computer work environment that needs to rely on anti-virus software to relyably function.
Glad I could help.
So we shouldn't use anything period? You weren't much of a help.
You don't need to look for grease. You just need to look at personal preferences of those in charge since they have a lot of ultimate power over such decisions. You also need to look at potential investments, like ... the fancy new headquarters in Munich which I'm sure included some kind of tax break or maybe even just flat out had a "only if you dump Linux" clause.
They didn't destroy a stable Office interface with the disaster known as the "Ribbon".
That disaster isn't, and wasn't. What it was was and endless complaint by professional users who spent years learning an archaic old interface which relied heavily on the memory of symbols, shortcuts, and nested menus which were irrelevant to 90% of what was being done at the time.
There's a reason that interface has been widely adopted, and more generally that menus have been eliminated and context dependent UIs have replaced them. Presenting all options to all users at all times is frankly a disaster when learning a new system.
Sorry but I can't help but disagree. An office scenario where a PC dynamically changes state is the perfect use case *FOR* things like systemd, networkmanager and pulse audio.
Switching between wireless and docked networks, constantly changing hardware attached in meeting rooms, VPNs, headphones, headsets etc dynamically selected for video / audio calls. About the only use case for a pre-these-three-things linux, is a fixed desktop.
whereas Windows changes it's entire UI
Huh? *looks to the start button in the bottom left that has existed since Windows 95*
*looks to the task bar which still shows running apps as it has since windows 95*
*looks to the top right, yep still the same three buttons on every windows since windows 95*.
What the hell are you doing on your computer that requires you to use more than 3 three UI features when interacting with a program?
Then they were also very smart people when they decided to switch to Linux.
Or does that notion conflict with your bias?
I seem to recall that was some 15 years ago. I bought an ICE car back then, so am I inherently biased against EVs?
The city saved $10m euro over the years in licensing fees. How much would be made back with the newly proposed MS headquarters? There were also complaints of productivity issues that don't show in license figures, as well as training.
Looking to the past to make a decision about the present should only be a deciding factor in a tie-breaker.
No one is moving away from Visa / Mastercard because it's "western payments". They are moving away because it's old methods with old technologies.
Hell the USA were the first to move away from these payment methods with the rise of Paypal. This all is just the natural progression of technology combined with a cashless economy.
And all of that is completely irrelevant as to why the UK is attempting to arrest him, you know like the post I was replying to. Nothing happening in the USA or in Sweden is currently related to the crime he committed in the UK.
stackable in apartments mostly not an issue, thing could come through wall or window.
At a 45 degree re-entry that would reduce my 95 sqm apartment to about 4sqm worth of exposed risk the rest protecting me by significant amounts of reinforced concrete.
humans ARE roughly 1 square meter
Only dead on from the side, which is not how satellites reenter.
Perhaps not ideal but if software can make a hardware problem seem to disappear then I have to ask, was the problem really in the hardware?
Given how the examples didn't actually fix anything and instead "masked" them and reduced performance as they went, yes the problem is in hardware.
In my example of the truck throttle control I could just as easily say that the software did not account properly for the limits of the hardware
So... new limits of hardware that were now magically lower than previously? Again, how is this not a hardware problem. I have yet to see any of these "software fixes" actually work in a way that doesn't reduce performance. One should remember why the software was designed as it was in the first place.
And the 2011 macbook pro which also had overheating early failure issues. And while not actually a fault, the earlier Macbook Air which had shithouse performance compared to most other devices on the same processor thanks to thermally throttling every time it did something as strenuous as displaying a webpage.
while Apple looked to update the software.
For a hardware problem. Ladies and gentlemen, I present our current fucked up world.