First off buddy get your facts right..This project is very much associated with SETI and is governed by the SETI league and the members of other SETI organizations (Dr. Jill Tarter is on the board of SETI@home so I don't know how much more affiliated with SETI you can get.) Perhaps you should try reading their website, the Website of the SETI League,Project Serendip etc all of which mention an link to SETI@home. As for dubious science, that is your humble opinion, and not one shared by a lot of the scientists in the field, it appears. So it you don't agree with the science, don't participate. Better yet put your money where your mouth is and design an experiment or system you think would work. The point is that there are some people out there trying to destroy what science is going on because they think that damaging other people's data and messing with their systems is ok simply because the can. You really didn't address the 'hacking'/'Creacking' problems the project has encountered. If some won did this to distributed.net or one of the projects to calculate PI, would you simply say 'well, chances are RC5 can't be broken so lets not try' ' PI will never be soleved to x digits so don't bother'?
With crap like this going on to legitimate, not-for-profit science, is it any wonder the term 'hacker' gets bad press - grow up, scrit kiddies nad go after MS. Leave the science alone.
Hard to "fix" the impact of a 200 m wide asteriod (look up Toutatis in a search engine or 1997 -XF11) or comet smashing into the ocean or Asia (the 2 biggest areas, simply for arguments sake). This is an Extinction Level Event - there will be no one left to "fix" it. At least with 100 people in an orbiting space station the human race has some chance of survival.
Besides, there are literally thousands of NEO's which are made of rare metals and elements which could be mined, and tha's some economic justification there.
Have some imagination!
Re:Good Open Source Citizens
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What version of RH?
I'll agree with the Win95 OSR1 stuff, but unless you're comparing it to a RH 4.2 or less, your not making a fair comaprison. OSR1 hasn't been available as OEM for 3 years - I don't even know if you can still buy it. So yeah, RH 5.2 or 6.0 is easier to install than Win 95 OSR1...but Win 95 is easier to install than Win 3.0 or Win 1.0 or DOS 4.5. And I'm sure RH6.0 is easier to install than RH4.2 . Comparing apples to oranges proves nothing. Most people today have either OSR2 or 98 (or even NT4.0) which, as I stated in my original post, are fairly easy to install and nothing like what you have just described - not since 1997.
Re:Good Open Source Citizens
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Wow, can I start a flame war or what! First off, let me apologize - when you mentioned Win95 I ASSUMED it was OSR-2 since OSR 1 has been sold for about 3 years. And I'll repeat what what was said in other posts - Win 98 comes with a boot disk but only if you buy the full version. If you buy the upgrade you won't get it...your supposed to be upgrading not putting the OS on a blank HD. If you got the Upgrade your breaking the law (whether you like the law or not) so don't be surprised when any software product doesn't do something it's not designed to do. I have the full version of 98 and I had to completely re-install my Win partition last night (my fault, its a long story with PartitionMagic and Norton AntiVirus as the two main protagonists). I stand by my assertion before about the install. Sure I had to click yes a few times but begining to end was 31 minutes and 1 coffee. The majority of my time was taken up with re-installing all my Win apps after that install. The OS was a snap. I have also had to blow away and re-install OSR2 of 95 on many HD at work (company policy when somebody leaves - reformat and re-install) and I have experienced the same ease.
Now I will give you the benefit of the doubt - maybe RH is easier to install. But I will also agree with what you said in your original post - most users of Win never have to install it because it comes pre-installed. That being the case, how is Linux going to spread if it is only slightly less complicated for user's to install than Windows? Most people aren't yet going to buy Linux pre-installed until they've had some experience with it. Installing it themselves is the only way they will get it and try it. And if they have had no experience installing ANY OS, they may not try it at all and just rely on the one they don't have to do anything (almost) to use.
If Corel can make a distro (based on Debian, a very good distro I might add) which my wife can pop into the cd-rom drive, answer a few questions and let the distro create the partions, format them, install Linux and X and be up and running in 31 minutes (without resorting to PartionMagic, fdisk or format from the command prompt)I will be quite happy. I may never use it but a lot of ordinary folks out there will (especially if they can do the install from within Windows, which is, remember, probably preloaded on their machine). And that means more exposure for Linux and that is good. So maybe for you and I Red Hat is a little easier than Win to install, but until its incredibly easy for REGULAR people to install, it's much harder than Windows for them. Juggling tennis balls is easier than juggling Bowling balls, but only if you already know how to juggle. If you don't, it's all hard and you just won't do it.
If you look at it like this, then the install process for Linux needs to be made way easier.
BTW comparing OSR1 and RH 6.0 is like comparing WIN95 to DOS 6.22 - apples and oranges so not really a good arguement. RH6.0 and Win98(or NT 4.0) would be more accurate.
Re:Good Open Source Citizens
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Corel Linux FAQ
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Whoa!! Buddy if you don't like FUD, don't spread it!
Actually I've Installed Win 95/98 a few dozen times in the last year. I plop in the CD Rom, go make a coffee and reboot at the end when it ask me to. I have never had a problem. Then it "detects new hardware" asks me for the disk and bingo - new network cards (PCMCIA and Ethernet), new joysticks what ever, installed - one more reboot and there I am running. The most important part of this is that it is easy for people who are not 'Power Users', programs or sys admins to install.My wife can install Win 95 (and has) and she's in advertising and uses a computer to do page layout - she doesn't program it. If you want to F**k with IRQ settings, don't be surprised if your machine is screwed up. As for a boot disk, if you can't make a dos boot disk with ms-dex on it you probably shouldn't be posting on/. Every computer I've ever owned has come with a boot disk.
And Windows has no Web browser? Are you new? Go to Windows help and look up IE - I believe there's some court case going on about it in case you missed it.
I'm not a huge Windows fan, but I will admit when it does something good - and the install of the OS is good. If Corel can provide me with a Debian based distro that I can either: 1)pop in, start and comeback when its done or 2)call my wife and have her do it while I'm driving home then more power to them. This will only spread Linux to more people and that's a good thing.
I beg to differ. There is nothing inherent about Visual C++ which requires you to write the kind of crap c++ code the review talked about. I work with it daily and have used it to code ANSI Standard C++ programs many times (you know 'using namspace std' stuff?).
Now if you mean relying on MFC (ARRGHH!!!) I can't help but agree with you. I try never to use that waste of disk space MS claims is a great OO class library! Even if I need to do Win32 stuff, I try to role my own class wappers because it reduces the overhead and I can use proper C++ constructs and style. But this has nothing to do with the development environment. Most of what the review speaks of seems to me to be a C convert to C++ still using the old bad habits (for C++ not C) of preprocessor directives everywhere and confusing a class with a struct. I suspect this same crap code could be written in Borland C++ Builder, Watcom C++ or whatever.
This has more to do with a bad coder than a bad coding tool.
As kooky as it might sound, if this is technically possible now (and we are only just hearing about it, so the NSA probably has known for about 5 years), maybe there's something to that "Alien abduction implant" stuff. I'm not suggesting that there really are little Grey aliens implanting transmitters in people to track them the same way we track bears or birds, but up until now one of the arguements against this has been that it is technically impossible or unfeaseable. Not so much now if you can create a paper thin transmitter, perhaps at nano-scales. This brings up more Orwellian and X-files paranoia than 2 grams of mushrooms!
Well, time for my medication... "There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy..."
Well perhaps secretaries was a bad example to use...they do type for a living. As for Garage mechanics with dos based systems, well where I come from that's still pretty rare. Most do things on paper still. My point is that the vast majority of people using computers are new to it and have not used one for work or pleasure before...some have never used a type writer either. I'm not saying rely completely on the mouse, that's ridiculous. But you can tab and type with Win 95 or BeOS or GNOME and people find those environments a lot more inviting and easy to use than the old green screen. Remember my point about configurability - allow the user to choose and customize according to their level of expertise, don't force them to use the CLI because YOU think its a better user interface than a GUI. Maybe for you, or your grandmother or your mechanic it is, but for a lot of other people it isn't (my mother and brother, who is a mechanic for instance).
Besides, as a programmer who does a lot of GUI design, if the 'hunt and peck' as you put it is so much slower, I suspect the GUI was very poorly designed in the first place. A good GUI can be designed to be intuitive, and just as fast to enter information as by hand (typing or writing). I think when you say GUI you think Win95/98/NT - no one has accused MS of being good at GUI design.
Try surfing to http://www.iarchitect.com/index.htm to see some pointer on proper UI design. You might not be so "cranky" about the CLI.
BTW click--copy --click--click---paste can be a lot quicker than mv/somedir/someotherdir/somefile/someotherdir2/someotherdir2/
for someone who does the two finger 'hunt and push' style of typing. Just my opinion of course.
I think everyone who replied to this missed the point of the post. He 's rooting for MS not because its a superior product, not because he dislikes Linux but because he's been turned of the movement by the same immature FUD that he is reflecting in the tone of his post. The Linux zealots, CLI bigots and the holier-than-thou developers who have utter contempt for the common user (kids, moms, secretaries, auto workers etc) seem to get a lot of air time on/. and elsewhere in the OSS community. And it appears that they are effectively driving people who may otherwise use Linux away and back into the open arms of MS. Everyone here is either one of the above mentioned people of felt their typed wrath on more than one occasion (I know I have).
People with attitudes like those the poster describes will do more to kill Linux and keep MS on top than any half-baked MS-Linux ditro could ever do.
Next time you want to blast MS, write the sentence down...now switch the words MS and Linux around...how does it sound now? FUD is FUD is FUD, no matter which direction it goes.
Remember, you get more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.
Felix, have you done any other job except use Unix? Everything you say is right and true but only applies to the 'Power Users' the articles talked about. Most grandmothers secretaries and store clerks don't want to (or can't) type. For a lot of people outside the computer industry, point and click is very much faster than typing will every be - not including the memorizing of obscure, English-centric commands (does 'ls' make any sense in French? or Arabic?). Lets face it, the article was well balanced..it slammed MS for being unreliable and *nix for being difficult for the average person to use. I think the 'honour' that was mentioned had more to do with respecting the user and their wishes rather than foisting your wishes as an OS maker upon them. That goes for MS as well as *nix. MS is forcing bloated, unecesary features on to users who don't want it and *nix is forcing users to use an archaic, unfriendly interface or "don't use the system at all" (KDE/GNOME I know, but the CLI snobs don't like those 2 either). The 'honour' is giving the user what they want AND what they need - A simple to use interface for those who NEED it and the power for those who WANT and NEED it. No bloat. No bizzare commands. Choice (have a GUI and a CLI). Power. Configuarability (I can use the GUI only, the CLI only or both together.I can turn off something I don't WANT or NEED).
Frankly, I don't see an OS out there yet which meets this standard of 'honour'...
Funny, Nortel has been doing alot of investigation into this "implausible" technology. Really, this is old news. Not as fast as the article in question claims but very feasable.
Now how about something about broadband wireless networking...that would really be news.
Perhaps that is a "law" of backward time travel..if I go back and attampt to kill myself, I won't be able to, since that will prevent my trip in the first place, which means I won't die, which means I'll live to travel back in time. This only means I can't cause my own death somehow since that would violate causality, not that if it were physically possible that I couldn't travel back in time(maybe killing myself would automatically "self correct" and the knife I stabbed my younger self with would have no effect). A more likely scenario is that, as may be postulated by Hiesenberg followers, that every possible past and future state exists in parallel. Going back in time and killing an earlier me only disrupts one possible time line, not the one from which I originated (Sliders!). This fits very well with Quantum theory and violates no tenet of relativity.
Have some imagination. Orville Wright once said that man (sic) would not fly in his lifetime. Try to think outside the box instead of dismissing ideas outright because they don't agree with your world view.
IBM has really been pushing Java a solution as well for some time. I hope the combination of Linux, DB2 and Java (and Apache!) could make one kick as distibuted/internet computing platform. Maybe they can also help Java get a little faster. To hell with the nay sayers in the last 2 posts. This combined with the DX anouncement looks incredible for the future of non-MS solutions. I'm so excited I could....well I'm fairly excited.
Well this goes down that same old road we've heard here before. What if your man (sic) only wants to eat the fish [use the GUI] after 'buying' it rather than do the fishing [programming, in depth sys admin stuff] him/herself? Extend the same judgment you hold on everyone needing to know how to use a CLI to other things in life to see how ridiculous it is. I don't need to know how to build or repair a car in order to drive one, I don't need to know how to raise cattle in order to eat a steak (or how to be a butcher for that matter), I don't need to know how to wire my house in order to turn on a light. Now remember that word 'need'. If I 'wanted' to learn all those things, I could. But not knowing it doesn't preclude me from using these tools or doing these activities. Why should I 'have' to learn shell scripting and obscure *nix commands in order to surf the internet or write a letter or play a game? If someday I 'want' to learn these things I can, but I certainly shouldn't have to. My whole point is that most people use the tools with out this knowledge. If you then allow them to access complicated, dangerous aspects of the tools without the knowledge, your asking for trouble. Education yeas, if they want to learn more, but there still needs to be an easy baseline so that the tools can be used easily and effectively with out danger by anyone. Otherwise Linux (and motor cars and telephones) will never be used by the masses
I'd like to say that I am, but I'm not. My wife works in advertising at a major Canadian Store (more than just tires) and they have many bizarre things happening...University educated people thinking a pyramid scheme is a good way to get rich and that a plain text message will erase their hard drive. One of my wife's friends even forwarded a message to us about Bill Gates and Walt Disney Jr. giving away a trip with an e-mail tracking program. I calmly explained to her that that was just not possible with a plain text message. You must remember, they know all about marketing, or ad-mats or film houses (or cutting lumber or laying pipe), and not about computers. The majority of the people who don't read/. see the computer as amajic box information comes out of, and beleive what ever they are told about it. But I guess they could tell me anything about Advertising and I'd believe them... Now if this isn't an arguement for having a fool proof GUI to go on top of Linux power, I don't know what is. By the way, before we get to hard on people , give them some time to get used to the internet and computing ingeneral. Remember...people used to believe nuclear radiation came out of the microwave oven when they first came out. Now Now one still believes that do they?
Boy, you seem to know a lot about MS source code...If we've never seen it, how do we know it's badly commnented or that there may not be a few nuggets of gold in that hill? Just because YOU wouldn't want to go through it doesn't mean there isn't a lot of people out there that would. Maybe the open sourced version can be improved! That's supposed to be one of the strengths of OSS, isn't it? You sound like a child - if I can't see it, it must be bad so I don't want to see it anyway...EVER...WAHHHH! What is it we call spreading things you can't possibly know as facts instead of speculation, based only on a strong dislike (dare I say hatred) of that thing? Oh yes...FUD! If it's bad for MS to give the OSS community FUD, its just as bad for us to give it to MS. MS source code may well be terrible, but doesn't that sound like a CHALLENGE? Unless your afraid to try, that is...
Hate filled? Militaristic? Good Lord, farthest from the truth! I don't hate anyone. But I also won't stand by while an entire people are eradicated because they aren't : a) Christian or b) Serbian
Quebec has been part of Canada for longer than Canada has been a nation, but if they finaly vote to go, I'm not going to support my government going into Chicoiutimi (or Montreal or Trois Riviere) and forcing all the French to leave, burning down their homes and shooting those who resist into ditches. (if we ever do this, I hope NATO bombs the hell out of us until we stop too!)
The last time NATO and the UN stood by and let this happen "800,000 *SERBIANS* have been "ethnically cleansed" along with millions of Bosnian Muslims and Croats. Before that we let Millions die in Rawanda. Is this right? As a Canadian perhaps you remember the national shame of "None is too many", when Mackenzie King refused the St. Louis permission to enter Canada, and almost all aboard died in Auchwietz(sp?). I, as the grandson of a Canadian soldier who liberated Bergen-Belsen with the British 8th Army, will not, cannot stand by and let this happen again. Do I like civilians dying? No, whether they are Serb civilians in Belgrade last night or Kosovar Albanians in mass graves and ditches over the last 6 months. Stopping the bombing won't stop the killing, it may only make it worse. Do I hate Serbs? Hell no. I don't much care for dictators like Milosovic (sorry about the spelling) but the Serb people are just people. What I don't like are people who try to tell me that because I don't like genocide I must suddenly hate the Serbs.I don't like what htey are doing in Kosovo. There is no excuse for what the Yugoslav government is doing and like it or not it is based on Serb Nationalism - Just as Russian nationalism under Vlad Zhyronofsky (sorry again) is a bad thing and German Nationalism under Hitler was a bad thing. I'm certainly not saying that Russians or Germans or Serbs are evil as a people. All nationalism is evil.(The Albanians have been there since 1389, which is a lot longer than 1912, if you want to get into a pissing contest) Would I stop YOU with bombs? Only if you were actively supporting genocide. My comments indicate that if you, like Slobo, think killing people and driving them off their land is ok you would have to be stopped. I gather by your comments you don't, which is good. My 'Lebansraum' comment was an allusions to one ethnic group forcing another off there land in order to reclaim it or just take it. As for your sources on the Bosnian War, well pointing me to Right Wing propoganda sites hardly counts as facts. As my brother the peace keeper told me, in Bosnia, most of the ethnic cleansing was done by the Bosnian Serb Army. There were not a lot of Muslim run rape camps, if I recall. But lets let the International War Crimes Tribunal sort that out. Plus I do get some of my information from the 5th Estate, W5 and 60 Minutes ( oh sorry I forgot how all these shows are nothing but propoganda machines for the government...yeah they NEVER say anthing the government doesn't want them to!). I was totally against the Gulf War but I have always said that to fight facism and hate in the Balkans I'd glady support military action to stop it. BTW, as a Canadian, your narrowminded fool-hardy support of hate mongers and bigotted genocide disgusts me. Unlike you, I appreciate your point of view and respect your right to express it. I'm glad your a citizen. (PS NATO plans to disarm the KLA and return Kosovo to Yugoslavia, not create a new country - check out the Raboullet Treaty (spelling again I know)).
Yeah except that your whole assumption rests on the fact that SOMEONE has control over another based on their race/religion. Whereas in the US and Canada, the government is made up of a mix of people from all races and all areas of the country (admittedly not a fair mix at times)who try to represent their people in government, Yugoslavia is ruled predominantly by the majority in Serbia. How many Kosovar Albanian cabinet ministers are there in the Milosovic government? How many Kosovar Albanians are there in the Government at all? Is there any representation at all? From what I see the situation in Kosovo is like Canada ruling Quebec (one of our Provinces)with no provincial government made up of the French minority (majority in the province, however)and no representation in the Federal Government (Kosovo lost that remember). That's not right nor is it fair. The Serb government has NO juridiction over a people who they do not represent - I don't remember any elections taking place recently, do you? (Trick question - No one in Slobo's government was elected - he's a Facist dictator). Hell, that alone is reason to bomb him but I digress. When the Kosovar Albanians dared to do publicly what you are doing right now (express your opinion and/or distaste with the actions of "their" government), the were met with repression and progroms. They were forced form their homes and made to flee. Some were lined up and shot. With no other recourse (no impartial civil law, no elected representatives in the government etc) they took up arms to defend themselves (as the Americans did for almost identical reasons in 1775 and the French an few years later). When the West tries to do the right thing and prevent a gneocide, Serb apologist whine about NATO's repression! All because Slobo wants to keep a field where the Serbs lost a battle 610 years ago - I guess that's why he seems to hate Albanians/Muslims so.
Considering the above your comparison makes no sense whatsoever.
check out this, its a Yugoslav Gov't site http://www.gov.yu/kosovo_facts/enter1.html Accoding to this only 16% of the Kosovars are Serbs, yet they wish to dictate their will on the rest of the population (mostly Albanians and Muslims). Again this is Kosovo, not the rest of Yugoslavia.
I've had the source for the 3 early versions of the Windows client for a year (MFC yeach). Although the UI is completely different now, most of the math and functionality is the same, as I understand it. If many of you had been paying attention last May, you could have gotten it too. I'll try to dig it up and e-mail it to anyone who asks and posts their email here. BTW This is in no way funded by the government - SETI was made into and acedemic and private consortium about 6 years ago when all the funding was cut. Besides if the you read the FAQ or the Scentific explanation you can probably figure most of it out anyway, if you know anything about software design and engineering.
I thought we were talking about Kosovo, not all of what is left of Yugoslavia? By they way, if Slobo is so right in what he is doing, why is the president of Montenegro basically against what Slobo is doing in Kosovo? Even parts of his own country don't agree (at least the parts with a relatively free press and open society).
Besides, you missed the point - 90%, 50%, 14% or whatever - The Yugoslav government under Milocovic does not have the right to force people off of their land and out of their homes based soley on their ethnicity, for revenge for a battle that was lost 610 years ago. End of story. Send in the troops to go after the KLA? Sure. But since when does that give them the right to murder and expel everyone who is NOT Serb? For a country and a people who often pride themselves on fighting Hitler and Facism in WWII ( and love to point out how the Croats collaborated and massacre Serbs during the same time), I find it odd that they are now acting exactly like the Nazis when it comes to the Kosovars. This wouldn't have anything to do with the Kosovars being Muslims now would it? Sounds like a bigoted progrom to me...
The main difference - I agree with the NATO bombing because of what the Yugoslav government is doing, not because of who or what they are. I could care less if they were Serbs or Croats, green or purple. If the tables were turned, I'd say bomb the Kosovars. Are the Serbs going to prevent another Krajina by killing all the Albanians in Kosovo? (I beleive the commander of that Croat army unit is before the Hague). If it was wrong for the Croats to do it in Krajina, it's wrong for the Serbs to do it in Kosovo (or Pale, or Sreberniza or where ever else they've done it in the last 10 years). Would you rather stand by and do nothing, like we did in Bosnia? How many bodies and mass graves are they still finding in that country after the war there? What's happening in Kosovo has more to do with irrational Serb nationalism and a battle which took place in 1389 than with anything which happened in 1987-89. Milosovic engineered that to take away Kosovos autonomy because Kosovo contains the Field of Black Birds - the very focal point of Serb nationalism. It also conveniently keeps Slobo the Communist dictator in power. As for the US and Britain's dirty hands, well, I think they were alot dirtier when they stood by and let the slaughter take place in Bosnia and Rawanda. It's about time they finally did the right thing. As for name calling, well, chalk that up to frustration with all the Serb apologists I see who keep throwing Molotov coctails at the US consulate in downtown Toronto. I do appologize for that, but at least my agruement isn't "well look what the Croats did...They did it First!Why aren't you going after them! WAAAAAAWAAAAAA!" What the Croats did was inexcusable, but that doesn't mean NATO should let the Serbs do the same thing. They should certainly learn from their mistakes.
The Ramboullet Treaty is quite fair to both sides, as is the current offer, sponsored in part by Russia. It allows Yugoslavia to remain in tact and NATO/UN would disarm the KLA and best of all, ALL the refugees would be able to return to their homes. If Slobo is serious about peace, he still knows exactly what he can do to stop the bombing. If not, its pretty obvious he's bent on destroying the Albanian population of Kosovo no matter what (kinda like Hitler exterminating Jews, Gypsies and Poles right up to the time the Russians roled in, even though the trains and men could have been beter used on the front)
Nationalism is the last bastion of the idiot.
Now with that off my chest, lets get back to the business at hand the 2.3.0 kernel...
According to the CIA yearbook you're so fond of quoting its 90% - so do you only believe and quote facts you find that agree with your particular viewpoint and ignore everything else as "poppycock"? And besides, so what if its not 90% (which it is). Does that make the Serbs treatment of them any less deplorable? The treaty NATO is trying to enforce would have them disarm the KLA as well, don't forget.
"Even if it were true, that would mean the US would have no authority in New Mexico, S. California, DC, Puerto Rico, or any other place where white folk are in a minority. "
Huh? Buddy, not everything comes down to race/skin colour or religion. Sometimes you have to do the right thing. Up here in Canada we have a province like Kosovo - Quebec is over 80% French within the province but the French minority only represents 24% of Canada's total population. We've let them vote on separation twice in the last 20 years, and we'll probably let them do it again. If they vote to separate in a fair and free election, then we'll let them go and become their own country(that's the right thing to do isn't it?). If my Prime Minister decides to role in the tanks, and shoot people into ditches simply because they are French in order to keep the "ancestral homeland" of Canadians, I hope NATO bombs my country into the stone age too - we'd deserve it.
I can argue with you all day if you like but the fact remains that the Serbs are committing atrocities in Kosovo (as they did in Bosnia, or is my own brother in on this conspiracy too? He was a Peace Keeper there and saw it all) and are systematically driving the majority ethnic group out of lands and homes they have owned for over 600 years. That is wrong. There is no excuse that can be made to justify the behaviour of the Yugslav governemnt/Serbia in this situation. They had many opportuities to stop this with the Ramboullet Treaty (sp?) but chose not to, for what ever nationalistic reasons. Now they have to pay the piper.
PS. Since Puerto Rico isn't a State, if they decided to become their own country, yes you'd be right...but it would have nothing to do with the colour of their skin or their religion.
Well, I followed your link to discover, HATE propoganda against muslims...fancy that. A fundementalist christian bigot site. Please go away and don't come back.../. is for enlightened, albeit spirited debate on a lot of topics. You represent niether of these. I may not like SqueezeTruck, but at least ST debates back and forth and is fairly intellegent. You, well, your the reason I'm and atheist. If being christian means hating other people, especially if they don't share the same idea about god or happen to be of a slightly darker hue and texture, then no thanks. I'd rather eat my own sh*t than even be mistaken for one of you guys.
BTW, I'm white and formerly christian, in case you were wondering....
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First off buddy get your facts right..This project is very much associated with SETI and is governed by the SETI league and the members of other SETI organizations (Dr. Jill Tarter is on the board of SETI@home so I don't know how much more affiliated with SETI you can get.) Perhaps you should try reading their website, the Website of the SETI League,Project Serendip etc all of which mention an link to SETI@home.
As for dubious science, that is your humble opinion, and not one shared by a lot of the scientists in the field, it appears. So it you don't agree with the science, don't participate. Better yet put your money where your mouth is and design an experiment or system you think would work.
The point is that there are some people out there trying to destroy what science is going on because they think that damaging other people's data and messing with their systems is ok simply because the can. You really didn't address the 'hacking'/'Creacking' problems the project has encountered. If some won did this to distributed.net or one of the projects to calculate PI, would you simply say 'well, chances are RC5 can't be broken so lets not try' ' PI will never be soleved to x digits so don't bother'?
With crap like this going on to legitimate, not-for-profit science, is it any wonder the term 'hacker' gets bad press - grow up, scrit kiddies nad go after MS. Leave the science alone.
Hard to "fix" the impact of a 200 m wide asteriod (look up Toutatis in a search engine or 1997 -XF11) or comet smashing into the ocean or Asia (the 2 biggest areas, simply for arguments sake). This is an Extinction Level Event - there will be no one left to "fix" it. At least with 100 people in an orbiting space station the human race has some chance of survival.
Besides, there are literally thousands of NEO's which are made of rare metals and elements which could be mined, and tha's some economic justification there.
Have some imagination!
What version of RH?
I'll agree with the Win95 OSR1 stuff, but unless you're comparing it to a RH 4.2 or less, your not making a fair comaprison. OSR1 hasn't been available as OEM for 3 years - I don't even know if you can still buy it. So yeah, RH 5.2 or 6.0 is easier to install than Win 95 OSR1...but Win 95 is easier to install than Win 3.0 or Win 1.0 or DOS 4.5. And I'm sure RH6.0 is easier to install than RH4.2 . Comparing apples to oranges proves nothing. Most people today have either OSR2 or 98 (or even NT4.0) which, as I stated in my original post, are fairly easy to install and nothing like what you have just described - not since 1997.
Wow, can I start a flame war or what!
First off, let me apologize - when you mentioned Win95 I ASSUMED it was OSR-2 since OSR 1 has been sold for about 3 years. And I'll repeat what what was said in other posts - Win 98 comes with a boot disk but only if you buy the full version. If you buy the upgrade you won't get it...your supposed to be upgrading not putting the OS on a blank HD. If you got the Upgrade your breaking the law (whether you like the law or not) so don't be surprised when any software product doesn't do something it's not designed to do.
I have the full version of 98 and I had to completely re-install my Win partition last night (my fault, its a long story with PartitionMagic and Norton AntiVirus as the two main protagonists). I stand by my assertion before about the install. Sure I had to click yes a few times but begining to end was 31 minutes and 1 coffee. The majority of my time was taken up with re-installing all my Win apps after that install. The OS was a snap. I have also had to blow away and re-install OSR2 of 95 on many HD at work (company policy when somebody leaves - reformat and re-install) and I have experienced the same ease.
Now I will give you the benefit of the doubt - maybe RH is easier to install. But I will also agree with what you said in your original post - most users of Win never have to install it because it comes pre-installed. That being the case, how is Linux going to spread if it is only slightly less complicated for user's to install than Windows? Most people aren't yet going to buy Linux pre-installed until they've had some experience with it. Installing it themselves is the only way they will get it and try it. And if they have had no experience installing ANY OS, they may not try it at all and just rely on the one they don't have to do anything (almost) to use.
If Corel can make a distro (based on Debian, a very good distro I might add) which my wife can pop into the cd-rom drive, answer a few questions and let the distro create the partions, format them, install Linux and X and be up and running in 31 minutes (without resorting to PartionMagic, fdisk or format from the command prompt)I will be quite happy. I may never use it but a lot of ordinary folks out there will (especially if they can do the install from within Windows, which is, remember, probably preloaded on their machine). And that means more exposure for Linux and that is good. So maybe for you and I Red Hat is a little easier than Win to install, but until its incredibly easy for REGULAR people to install, it's much harder than Windows for them.
Juggling tennis balls is easier than juggling Bowling balls, but only if you already know how to juggle. If you don't, it's all hard and you just won't do it.
If you look at it like this, then the install process for Linux needs to be made way easier.
BTW comparing OSR1 and RH 6.0 is like comparing WIN95 to DOS 6.22 - apples and oranges so not really a good arguement. RH6.0 and Win98(or NT 4.0) would be more accurate.
Whoa!! Buddy if you don't like FUD, don't spread it!
/. Every computer I've ever owned has come with a boot disk.
Actually I've Installed Win 95/98 a few dozen times in the last year. I plop in the CD Rom, go make a coffee and reboot at the end when it ask me to. I have never had a problem. Then it "detects new hardware" asks me for the disk and bingo - new network cards (PCMCIA and Ethernet), new joysticks what ever, installed - one more reboot and there I am running.
The most important part of this is that it is easy for people who are not 'Power Users', programs or sys admins to install.My wife can install Win 95 (and has) and she's in advertising and uses a computer to do page layout - she doesn't program it.
If you want to F**k with IRQ settings, don't be surprised if your machine is screwed up.
As for a boot disk, if you can't make a dos boot disk with ms-dex on it you probably shouldn't be posting on
And Windows has no Web browser? Are you new? Go to Windows help and look up IE - I believe there's some court case going on about it in case you missed it.
I'm not a huge Windows fan, but I will admit when it does something good - and the install of the OS is good. If Corel can provide me with a Debian based distro that I can either:
1)pop in, start and comeback when its done or
2)call my wife and have her do it while I'm driving home then more power to them. This will only spread Linux to more people and that's a good thing.
I beg to differ. There is nothing inherent about Visual C++ which requires you to write the kind of crap c++ code the review talked about. I work with it daily and have used it to code ANSI Standard C++ programs many times (you know 'using namspace std' stuff?).
Now if you mean relying on MFC (ARRGHH!!!) I can't help but agree with you. I try never to use that waste of disk space MS claims is a great OO class library! Even if I need to do Win32 stuff, I try to role my own class wappers because it reduces the overhead and I can use proper C++ constructs and style. But this has nothing to do with the development environment. Most of what the review speaks of seems to me to be a C convert to C++ still using the old bad habits (for C++ not C) of preprocessor directives everywhere and confusing a class with a struct. I suspect this same crap code could be written in Borland C++ Builder, Watcom C++ or whatever.
This has more to do with a bad coder than a bad coding tool.
As kooky as it might sound, if this is technically possible now (and we are only just hearing about it, so the NSA probably has known for about 5 years), maybe there's something to that "Alien abduction implant" stuff. I'm not suggesting that there really are little Grey aliens implanting transmitters in people to track them the same way we track bears or birds, but up until now one of the arguements against this has been that it is technically impossible or unfeaseable. Not so much now if you can create a paper thin transmitter, perhaps at nano-scales.
This brings up more Orwellian and X-files paranoia than 2 grams of mushrooms!
Well, time for my medication...
"There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy..."
Well perhaps secretaries was a bad example to use...they do type for a living. As for Garage mechanics with dos based systems, well where I come from that's still pretty rare. Most do things on paper still. My point is that the vast majority of people using computers are new to it and have not used one for work or pleasure before...some have never used a type writer either. I'm not saying rely completely on the mouse, that's ridiculous. But you can tab and type with Win 95 or BeOS or GNOME and people find those environments a lot more inviting and easy to use than the old green screen. Remember my point about configurability - allow the user to choose and customize according to their level of expertise, don't force them to use the CLI because YOU think its a better user interface than a GUI. Maybe for you, or your grandmother or your mechanic it is, but for a lot of other people it isn't (my mother and brother, who is a mechanic for instance).
/somedir/someotherdir/somefile /someotherdir2/someotherdir2/
Besides, as a programmer who does a lot of GUI design, if the 'hunt and peck' as you put it is so much slower, I suspect the GUI was very poorly designed in the first place. A good GUI can be designed to be intuitive, and just as fast to enter information as by hand (typing or writing). I think when you say GUI you think Win95/98/NT - no one has accused MS of being good at GUI design.
Try surfing to http://www.iarchitect.com/index.htm
to see some pointer on proper UI design. You might not be so "cranky" about the CLI.
BTW click--copy --click--click---paste can be a lot quicker than
mv
for someone who does the two finger 'hunt and push' style of typing. Just my opinion of course.
I think everyone who replied to this missed the point of the post. He 's rooting for MS not because its a superior product, not because he dislikes Linux but because he's been turned of the movement by the same immature FUD that he is reflecting in the tone of his post. The Linux zealots, CLI bigots and the holier-than-thou developers who have utter contempt for the common user (kids, moms, secretaries, auto workers etc) seem to get a lot of air time on /. and elsewhere in the OSS community. And it appears that they are effectively driving people who may otherwise use Linux away and back into the open arms of MS. Everyone here is either one of the above mentioned people of felt their typed wrath on more than one occasion (I know I have).
People with attitudes like those the poster describes will do more to kill Linux and keep MS on top than any half-baked MS-Linux ditro could ever do.
Next time you want to blast MS, write the sentence down...now switch the words MS and Linux around...how does it sound now? FUD is FUD is FUD, no matter which direction it goes.
Remember, you get more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.
Felix, have you done any other job except use Unix? Everything you say is right and true but only applies to the 'Power Users' the articles talked about. Most grandmothers secretaries and store clerks don't want to (or can't) type. For a lot of people outside the computer industry, point and click is very much faster than typing will every be - not including the memorizing of obscure, English-centric commands (does 'ls' make any sense in French? or Arabic?). Lets face it, the article was well balanced..it slammed MS for being unreliable and *nix for being difficult for the average person to use. I think the 'honour' that was mentioned had more to do with respecting the user and their wishes rather than foisting your wishes as an OS maker upon them. That goes for MS as well as *nix. MS is forcing bloated, unecesary features on to users who don't want it and *nix is forcing users to use an archaic, unfriendly interface or "don't use the system at all" (KDE/GNOME I know, but the CLI snobs don't like those 2 either). The 'honour' is giving the user what they want AND what they need - A simple to use interface for those who NEED it and the power for those who WANT and NEED it.
No bloat. No bizzare commands.
Choice (have a GUI and a CLI). Power. Configuarability (I can use the GUI only, the CLI only or both together.I can turn off something I don't WANT or NEED).
Frankly, I don't see an OS out there yet which meets this standard of 'honour'...
Funny, Nortel has been doing alot of investigation into this "implausible" technology. Really, this is old news. Not as fast as the article in question claims but very feasable.
Now how about something about broadband wireless networking...that would really be news.
Has anyone found that alleged "face on Mars" in any of the datasets/animations? Is it there? Let me know, maybe it can be analyzed.
Perhaps that is a "law" of backward time travel..if I go back and attampt to kill myself, I won't be able to, since that will prevent my trip in the first place, which means I won't die, which means I'll live to travel back in time. This only means I can't cause my own death somehow since that would violate causality, not that if it were physically possible that I couldn't travel back in time(maybe killing myself would automatically "self correct" and the knife I stabbed my younger self with would have no effect).
A more likely scenario is that, as may be postulated by Hiesenberg followers, that every possible past and future state exists in parallel. Going back in time and killing an earlier me only disrupts one possible time line, not the one from which I originated (Sliders!). This fits very well with Quantum theory and violates no tenet of relativity.
Have some imagination. Orville Wright once said that man (sic) would not fly in his lifetime. Try to think outside the box instead of dismissing ideas outright because they don't agree with your world view.
IBM has really been pushing Java a solution as well for some time. I hope the combination of Linux, DB2 and Java (and Apache!) could make one kick as distibuted/internet computing platform. Maybe they can also help Java get a little faster. To hell with the nay sayers in the last 2 posts. This combined with the DX anouncement looks incredible for the future of non-MS solutions. I'm so excited I could....well I'm fairly excited.
Well this goes down that same old road we've heard here before. What if your man (sic) only wants to eat the fish [use the GUI] after 'buying' it rather than do the fishing [programming, in depth sys admin stuff] him/herself? Extend the same judgment you hold on everyone needing to know how to use a CLI to other things in life to see how ridiculous it is. I don't need to know how to build or repair a car in order to drive one, I don't need to know how to raise cattle in order to eat a steak (or how to be a butcher for that matter), I don't need to know how to wire my house in order to turn on a light. Now remember that word 'need'. If I 'wanted' to learn all those things, I could. But not knowing it doesn't preclude me from using these tools or doing these activities. Why should I 'have' to learn shell scripting and obscure *nix commands in order to surf the internet or write a letter or play a game? If someday I 'want' to learn these things I can, but I certainly shouldn't have to.
My whole point is that most people use the tools with out this knowledge. If you then allow them to access complicated, dangerous aspects of the tools without the knowledge, your asking for trouble. Education yeas, if they want to learn more, but there still needs to be an easy baseline so that the tools can be used easily and effectively with out danger by anyone. Otherwise Linux (and motor cars and telephones) will never be used by the masses
I'd like to say that I am, but I'm not. My wife works in advertising at a major Canadian Store (more than just tires) and they have many bizarre things happening...University educated people thinking a pyramid scheme is a good way to get rich and that a plain text message will erase their hard drive. One of my wife's friends even forwarded a message to us about Bill Gates and Walt Disney Jr. giving away a trip with an e-mail tracking program. I calmly explained to her that that was just not possible with a plain text message. You must remember, they know all about marketing, or ad-mats or film houses (or cutting lumber or laying pipe), and not about computers. The majority of the people who don't read /. see the computer as amajic box information comes out of, and beleive what ever they are told about it. But I guess they could tell me anything about Advertising and I'd believe them...
Now if this isn't an arguement for having a fool proof GUI to go on top of Linux power, I don't know what is.
By the way, before we get to hard on people , give them some time to get used to the internet and computing ingeneral. Remember...people used to believe nuclear radiation came out of the microwave oven when they first came out. Now Now one still believes that do they?
Boy, you seem to know a lot about MS source code...If we've never seen it, how do we know it's badly commnented or that there may not be a few nuggets of gold in that hill? Just because YOU wouldn't want to go through it doesn't mean there isn't a lot of people out there that would. Maybe the open sourced version can be improved! That's supposed to be one of the strengths of OSS, isn't it?
You sound like a child - if I can't see it, it must be bad so I don't want to see it anyway...EVER...WAHHHH!
What is it we call spreading things you can't possibly know as facts instead of speculation, based only on a strong dislike (dare I say hatred) of that thing? Oh yes...FUD!
If it's bad for MS to give the OSS community FUD, its just as bad for us to give it to MS.
MS source code may well be terrible, but doesn't that sound like a CHALLENGE? Unless your afraid to try, that is...
Hate filled? Militaristic? Good Lord, farthest from the truth! I don't hate anyone. But I also won't stand by while an entire people are eradicated because they aren't :
a) Christian or
b) Serbian
Quebec has been part of Canada for longer than Canada has been a nation, but if they finaly vote to go, I'm not going to support my government going into Chicoiutimi (or Montreal or Trois Riviere) and forcing all the French to leave, burning down their homes and shooting those who resist into ditches. (if we ever do this, I hope NATO bombs the hell out of us until we stop too!)
The last time NATO and the UN stood by and let this happen "800,000 *SERBIANS* have been "ethnically cleansed" along with millions of Bosnian Muslims and Croats. Before that we let Millions die in Rawanda. Is this right? As a Canadian perhaps you remember the national shame of "None is too many", when Mackenzie King refused the St. Louis permission to enter Canada, and almost all aboard died in Auchwietz(sp?). I, as the grandson of a Canadian soldier who liberated Bergen-Belsen with the British 8th Army, will not, cannot stand by and let this happen again. Do I like civilians dying? No, whether they are Serb civilians in Belgrade last night or Kosovar Albanians in mass graves and ditches over the last 6 months. Stopping the bombing won't stop the killing, it may only make it worse.
Do I hate Serbs? Hell no. I don't much care for dictators like Milosovic (sorry about the spelling) but the Serb people are just people. What I don't like are people who try to tell me that because I don't like genocide I must suddenly hate the Serbs.I don't like what htey are doing in Kosovo. There is no excuse for what the Yugoslav government is doing and like it or not it is based on Serb Nationalism - Just as Russian nationalism under Vlad Zhyronofsky (sorry again) is a bad thing and German Nationalism under Hitler was a bad thing. I'm certainly not saying that Russians or Germans or Serbs are evil as a people. All nationalism is evil.(The Albanians have been there since 1389, which is a lot longer than 1912, if you want to get into a pissing contest)
Would I stop YOU with bombs? Only if you were actively supporting genocide. My comments indicate that if you, like Slobo, think killing people and driving them off their land is ok you would have to be stopped. I gather by your comments you don't, which is good. My 'Lebansraum' comment was an allusions to one ethnic group forcing another off there land in order to reclaim it or just take it.
As for your sources on the Bosnian War, well pointing me to Right Wing propoganda sites hardly counts as facts. As my brother the peace keeper told me, in Bosnia, most of the ethnic cleansing was done by the Bosnian Serb Army. There were not a lot of Muslim run rape camps, if I recall. But lets let the International War Crimes Tribunal sort that out. Plus I do get some of my information from the 5th Estate, W5 and 60 Minutes ( oh sorry I forgot how all these shows are nothing but propoganda machines for the government...yeah they NEVER say anthing the government doesn't want them to!).
I was totally against the Gulf War but I have always said that to fight facism and hate in the Balkans I'd glady support military action to stop it.
BTW, as a Canadian, your narrowminded fool-hardy support of hate mongers and bigotted genocide disgusts me. Unlike you, I appreciate your point of view and respect your right to express it. I'm glad your a citizen. (PS NATO plans to disarm the KLA and return Kosovo to Yugoslavia, not create a new country - check out the Raboullet Treaty (spelling again I know)).
Yeah except that your whole assumption rests on the fact that SOMEONE has control over another based on their race/religion. Whereas in the US and Canada, the government is made up of a mix of people from all races and all areas of the country (admittedly not a fair mix at times)who try to represent their people in government, Yugoslavia is ruled predominantly by the majority in Serbia. How many Kosovar Albanian cabinet ministers are there in the Milosovic government? How many Kosovar Albanians are there in the Government at all? Is there any representation at all?
From what I see the situation in Kosovo is like Canada ruling Quebec (one of our Provinces)with no provincial government made up of the French minority (majority in the province, however)and no representation in the Federal Government (Kosovo lost that remember). That's not right nor is it fair. The Serb government has NO juridiction over a people who they do not represent - I don't remember any elections taking place recently, do you? (Trick question - No one in Slobo's government was elected - he's a Facist dictator). Hell, that alone is reason to bomb him but I digress.
When the Kosovar Albanians dared to do publicly what you are doing right now (express your opinion and/or distaste with the actions of "their" government), the were met with repression and progroms. They were forced form their homes and made to flee. Some were lined up and shot. With no other recourse (no impartial civil law, no elected representatives in the government etc) they took up arms to defend themselves (as the Americans did for almost identical reasons in 1775 and the French an few years later). When the West tries to do the right thing and prevent a gneocide, Serb apologist whine about NATO's repression!
All because Slobo wants to keep a field where the Serbs lost a battle 610 years ago - I guess that's why he seems to hate Albanians/Muslims so.
Considering the above your comparison makes no sense whatsoever.
check out this, its a Yugoslav Gov't site
http://www.gov.yu/kosovo_facts/enter1.html
Accoding to this only 16% of the Kosovars are Serbs, yet they wish to dictate their will on the rest of the population (mostly Albanians and Muslims). Again this is Kosovo, not the rest of Yugoslavia.
I've had the source for the 3 early versions of the Windows client for a year (MFC yeach). Although the UI is completely different now, most of the math and functionality is the same, as I understand it. If many of you had been paying attention last May, you could have gotten it too. I'll try to dig it up and e-mail it to anyone who asks and posts their email here.
BTW This is in no way funded by the government - SETI was made into and acedemic and private consortium about 6 years ago when all the funding was cut. Besides if the you read the FAQ or the Scentific explanation you can probably figure most of it out anyway, if you know anything about software design and engineering.
Serbia and Montenegro
I thought we were talking about Kosovo, not all of what is left of Yugoslavia? By they way, if Slobo is so right in what he is doing, why is the president of Montenegro basically against what Slobo is doing in Kosovo? Even parts of his own country don't agree (at least the parts with a relatively free press and open society).
Besides, you missed the point - 90%, 50%, 14% or whatever - The Yugoslav government under Milocovic does not have the right to force people off of their land and out of their homes based soley on their ethnicity, for revenge for a battle that was lost 610 years ago. End of story.
Send in the troops to go after the KLA? Sure. But since when does that give them the right to murder and expel everyone who is NOT Serb?
For a country and a people who often pride themselves on fighting Hitler and Facism in WWII ( and love to point out how the Croats collaborated and massacre Serbs during the same time), I find it odd that they are now acting exactly like the Nazis when it comes to the Kosovars. This wouldn't have anything to do with the Kosovars being Muslims now would it? Sounds like a bigoted progrom to me...
The main difference - I agree with the NATO bombing because of what the Yugoslav government is doing, not because of who or what they are. I could care less if they were Serbs or Croats, green or purple. If the tables were turned, I'd say bomb the Kosovars.
Are the Serbs going to prevent another Krajina by killing all the Albanians in Kosovo? (I beleive the commander of that Croat army unit is before the Hague). If it was wrong for the Croats to do it in Krajina, it's wrong for the Serbs to do it in Kosovo (or Pale, or Sreberniza or where ever else they've done it in the last 10 years).
Would you rather stand by and do nothing, like we did in Bosnia? How many bodies and mass graves are they still finding in that country after the war there? What's happening in Kosovo has more to do with irrational Serb nationalism and a battle which took place in 1389 than with anything which happened in 1987-89. Milosovic engineered that to take away Kosovos autonomy because Kosovo contains the Field of Black Birds - the very focal point of Serb nationalism. It also conveniently keeps Slobo the Communist dictator in power.
As for the US and Britain's dirty hands, well, I think they were alot dirtier when they stood by and let the slaughter take place in Bosnia and Rawanda. It's about time they finally did the right thing.
As for name calling, well, chalk that up to frustration with all the Serb apologists I see who keep throwing Molotov coctails at the US consulate in downtown Toronto. I do appologize for that, but at least my agruement isn't "well look what the Croats did...They did it First!Why aren't you going after them! WAAAAAAWAAAAAA!"
What the Croats did was inexcusable, but that doesn't mean NATO should let the Serbs do the same thing. They should certainly learn from their mistakes.
The Ramboullet Treaty is quite fair to both sides, as is the current offer, sponsored in part by Russia. It allows Yugoslavia to remain in tact and NATO/UN would disarm the KLA and best of all, ALL the refugees would be able to return to their homes. If Slobo is serious about peace, he still knows exactly what he can do to stop the bombing. If not, its pretty obvious he's bent on destroying the Albanian population of Kosovo no matter what (kinda like Hitler exterminating Jews, Gypsies and Poles right up to the time the Russians roled in, even though the trains and men could have been beter used on the front)
Nationalism is the last bastion of the idiot.
Now with that off my chest, lets get back to the business at hand the 2.3.0 kernel...
According to the CIA yearbook you're so fond of quoting its 90% - so do you only believe and quote facts you find that agree with your particular viewpoint and ignore everything else as "poppycock"? And besides, so what if its not 90% (which it is). Does that make the Serbs treatment of them any less deplorable? The treaty NATO is trying to enforce would have them disarm the KLA as well, don't forget.
"Even if it were true, that would mean the US would have no authority in New Mexico, S. California, DC, Puerto Rico, or any other place where white folk are in a minority. "
Huh? Buddy, not everything comes down to race/skin colour or religion. Sometimes you have to do the right thing. Up here in Canada we have a province like Kosovo - Quebec is over 80% French
within the province but the French minority only represents 24% of Canada's total population. We've let them vote on separation twice in the last 20 years, and we'll probably let them do it again. If they vote to separate in a fair and free election, then we'll let them go and become their own country(that's the right thing to do isn't it?). If my Prime Minister decides to role in the tanks, and shoot people into ditches simply because they are French in order to keep the "ancestral homeland" of Canadians, I hope NATO bombs my country into the stone age too - we'd deserve it.
I can argue with you all day if you like but the fact remains that the Serbs are committing atrocities in Kosovo (as they did in Bosnia, or is my own brother in on this conspiracy too? He was a Peace Keeper there and saw it all) and are systematically driving the majority ethnic group out of lands and homes they have owned for over 600 years. That is wrong. There is no excuse that can be made to justify the behaviour of the Yugslav governemnt/Serbia in this situation. They had many opportuities to stop this with the Ramboullet Treaty (sp?) but chose not to, for what ever nationalistic reasons. Now they have to pay the piper.
PS. Since Puerto Rico isn't a State, if they decided to become their own country, yes you'd be right...but it would have nothing to do with the colour of their skin or their religion.
Well, I followed your link to discover, HATE propoganda against muslims...fancy that. A fundementalist christian bigot site. Please go away and don't come back.../. is for enlightened, albeit spirited debate on a lot of topics. You represent niether of these. I may not like SqueezeTruck, but at least ST debates back and forth and is fairly intellegent. You, well, your the reason I'm and atheist. If being christian means hating other people, especially if they don't share the same idea about god or happen to be of a slightly darker hue and texture, then no thanks. I'd rather eat my own sh*t than even be mistaken for one of you guys.
BTW, I'm white and formerly christian, in case you were wondering....