OK, if you must. Every geopolitical reference I have ever seen refers to Mexico being part of "North America" while Belize, Guatemala and points south are considered "Central America" until you get to the border between Panama and Colombia, south of which everything is "South America".
I'm sure someone can chime in and correct me as to whether or not Guatemala is part of North America. I say no.
Or did you just decide to get rid of Central America to make a point? "Check a map"?? Hey, how about we make Morocco part of Europe? After all, it's just a hop away from Spain!
Whatever. By your own assertion you don't even have a debugger (you can download a graphical debugger and a kernel-mode debugger for free from Microsoft) and you didn't do a memdump of these crashes (you can do that, you know) to back up your claims that somehow Cygwin/XFree86 are causing a segfault simply by drawing stuff on the screen. I'd theorize that it's doing a lot more than that.
You can cause bluescreens in any number of ways in XP. I can also cause Linux to go into a kernel panic if I want to. But when it all comes down to "well, I can't see the code, so this is what must be happening" you've got a pretty thin argument.
No, fuckhead. The drawing primitives that live in the multi-user driver subsystem are not part of the fucking kernel. They may run in ring 0, but that's not the point. "Widgets" are not drawn next to the VM paging code, no matter how much you may want that to be the case.
Yep, you can do that. See my reply to another message regarding win32k.sys.
A good resource for dirty kernel tricks is at www.sysinternals.com.
Of course, the fact that you can do it shouldn't mean you should, but IMO that was a bad call in Microsoft's part. In fact, that's the main reason for the whole driver certification thing that was introduced with W2K.
Technically, win32k.sys is not the kernel. It's a mix of user space stuff (graphics and so on) and driver hooks (may have been in W9x, I really don't remember even if it was there). It's closer to the kernel ring than, say, GDI.
NTOSKRNL.EXE and ntdll.dll are what makes up the Win32 kernel, at least for NT4, W2K and XP.
So if you know so much, enlighten me on how doing anything in XFree86 can cause a blue screen.
If you knew much at all you'd know that X doesn't have bluescreens. If you knew what you were talking about I'd say you'd be calling that by it's name instead of "bluescreens".
The kernel level rendering was a guess on my part
Guess == FUD. My guess was that you were spreading FUD, which is not an uncommon occurance. So I called you on it. You can "guess" and say you're making an "informed guess" but you can't say "XP sucks, it crashes every time I close a window, and the drawing code is in the kernel".
As I have no access to winXP source, I couldn't investigate.
Spare me the open source lament, please.
I don't think I got my money's worth there either, at the time they were a microsoft heavy school
I was talking about the problems I perceive WRT the competing desktop/window managers and you made the all-inclusive argument that it's a nightmare to do anything at all in Windows. Why? Because I said that the Windows GUI is less of a moving target?
I can't say that Windows is "so much better" in many aspects because I've never tried to implement a distributed application in Linux, for example. But I have written GUIs for both (well, all three of them I guess).
I dunno. I developed for Windows from 3.1 to 2000 inclusive, and my biggest complaint was the shiftiness of the platform - stuff kept changing on me with each Service Pack or Office install.
Well, there's development and then there's development. If you target Office, well, all bets are off. But I'm talking about the OS. Shifty? I have had damn few things break with version changes, much less service packs. But some stuff does break, yes. The sheer volume of software that runs in Windows makes it impossible for everything to be perfect every time the OS needs to be updated. But let's be honest - no software breaks from one version of Linux to another? If you code to the least common denominator, yes. But the same is true about Windows. You take your chances.
That said, the architecture of KDE is very nice indeed. Assuming you aren't too much of a MS bigot, read some code and see for yourself:)
Contrary to popular belief, I do know what I'm talking about =) Yes, KDE is cool. Although I admit to being partial to Gnome. And yes, I've written code for both of them, in C and lately Python (even used Kylix there for a while).
I'm not questioning their technical merits, I'm bitching (I guess) about the fact that it's impossible to target two moving platforms.
No I'm a professional Software Enginner with a BSE in Computer Engineering pursuing an MS in Computer Science who learned it in a graduate level Windows Programming class from a guy with a PhD.
Which left you with the idea that you can cause a ring-0 fault by drawing evil rectangles on a window.
I dunno which school you went to, but you sure as heck didn't get your money's worth.
but we are talking about existing barriers to entry
Exactly.
This is only partially true.
I don't like absolutes, but 99% is still better than 60%. For example, the basic Windows "widgets" have not changed since Windows 3.1. In fact, IIRC I changed only two lines of code (from the GUI part) in an application I had back then to convert it to 32-bit. Apps written for Windows 3.1 run today in Windows XP and Server 2003 with no more than a tweak using the compatibility tool. No recompile, no code changes required.
Um, yes. I've read comments by article submitters that confirm that what they submitted looked nothing like what was actually posted (even though they got credit). I'm not going to go look for specific examples and humor you, but they're out there.
Now, some people have theorized that the "editors" mix and match similar submissions (which I'm sure they get all the time) and then present them as what was originally submitted. Some stories certainly look that way. For example, disjointed sentences or different writing styles from one paragraph to the next. Is that evil? No. Censorship? Nope. A bad idea? Yep. You DO NOT mess with the submissions. They screw up enough already by adding their "editorial" bylines at the end (which usually are there just to fan the flames).
Evidence? I have none. But you can always chuck it to the submitter if you feel insulted by my "insinuations" about Slashdot.
The WinNT kernel and its derivatives contain all the code to draw buttons, scrollbars, and other gui widgets
Ya wanna back that up with some cold hard facts, or are you just another uninformed teenager zealot who r0xx0rz with Linux and only uses Windows to play cool games*?
* which sorta implies that you don't know what you're talking about
I can't believe it. You mean the fact that there are two competing desktop environments for Linux is not the absolute best thing that can happen?? I mean, what's the problem? Code apps for two different widget/whatever sets? Who doesn't have the time to do that??
But woe to the poor soul that even remotely mentions that this is probably not such a good thing.
"Competition" and "choice" are words frequently used in these contexts. And while I agree with that to a certain extent, I think most zealots are blind to the fact that Windows is a stable, unified platform that can be leveraged without fear of one's products becoming obsolete or broken with the next release of Gnome or KDE.
And in the end, I think, it all comes down to X being so "wonderful". Wonderfully outdated and quirky and out of place in a desktop environment. What Linux and BSD need is something like Cocoa (or Carbon or whatever it's called) in OS X. Yes, X is part of the Unix legacy. No, it's not needed anymore except in a server, multi-user environment. Desktops ain't that.
Software vendors will not jump on the bandwagon on technical merit alone. There has to be stability and uniformity.
Seeing that you got First Post and it was modded +5 with alacrity, you might want to try buying lottery tickets or drinking expired milk. This is your lucky day mon!
Is that, since Apple is somehow loved by/. because they ripped a "free" OS, this story will be filled with apologetic comments regarding how "well, they DID invent the trashcan icon" and "I bet they won't really enforce it" and even "who cares, OS X rocks!!1!".
This is repeated every single time Apple behaves like a corporation (since that's what it is) instead of a lovable gang of fashionable geeks. Yet Microsoft is evil when they do things like these, but Apple is just... well, being Apple.
And BTW, why didn't the SNORT hole make it to the/. front page? Two serious vulnerabilities in one week too much for the frail ego? God forbid IE develops yet another hole that changes my wallpaper at the behest of evil hackers in Lithuania. I'd be reading about it for the next five weeks.
Slashdot Mirror
OK, if you must. Every geopolitical reference I have ever seen refers to Mexico being part of "North America" while Belize, Guatemala and points south are considered "Central America" until you get to the border between Panama and Colombia, south of which everything is "South America".
I'm sure someone can chime in and correct me as to whether or not Guatemala is part of North America. I say no.
Or did you just decide to get rid of Central America to make a point? "Check a map"?? Hey, how about we make Morocco part of Europe? After all, it's just a hop away from Spain!
Luv yer first-world tunnel vision there. Guatemala is not in North America, but Mexico is.
And my OS can beat up your OS. We should have started there.
You can cause bluescreens in any number of ways in XP. I can also cause Linux to go into a kernel panic if I want to. But when it all comes down to "well, I can't see the code, so this is what must be happening" you've got a pretty thin argument.
Awww, shucks. Does that mean I don't get flowers?
Now, do me a favor and FOAD, mmkay?
I demand an explanation!!!
A good resource for dirty kernel tricks is at www.sysinternals.com.
Of course, the fact that you can do it shouldn't mean you should, but IMO that was a bad call in Microsoft's part. In fact, that's the main reason for the whole driver certification thing that was introduced with W2K.
NTOSKRNL.EXE and ntdll.dll are what makes up the Win32 kernel, at least for NT4, W2K and XP.
If you knew much at all you'd know that X doesn't have bluescreens. If you knew what you were talking about I'd say you'd be calling that by it's name instead of "bluescreens".
The kernel level rendering was a guess on my part
Guess == FUD. My guess was that you were spreading FUD, which is not an uncommon occurance. So I called you on it. You can "guess" and say you're making an "informed guess" but you can't say "XP sucks, it crashes every time I close a window, and the drawing code is in the kernel".
As I have no access to winXP source, I couldn't investigate.
Spare me the open source lament, please.
I don't think I got my money's worth there either, at the time they were a microsoft heavy school
I guess it sux to be you.
I can't say that Windows is "so much better" in many aspects because I've never tried to implement a distributed application in Linux, for example. But I have written GUIs for both (well, all three of them I guess).
Well, there's development and then there's development. If you target Office, well, all bets are off. But I'm talking about the OS. Shifty? I have had damn few things break with version changes, much less service packs. But some stuff does break, yes. The sheer volume of software that runs in Windows makes it impossible for everything to be perfect every time the OS needs to be updated. But let's be honest - no software breaks from one version of Linux to another? If you code to the least common denominator, yes. But the same is true about Windows. You take your chances.
That said, the architecture of KDE is very nice indeed. Assuming you aren't too much of a MS bigot, read some code and see for yourself :)
Contrary to popular belief, I do know what I'm talking about =) Yes, KDE is cool. Although I admit to being partial to Gnome. And yes, I've written code for both of them, in C and lately Python (even used Kylix there for a while).
I'm not questioning their technical merits, I'm bitching (I guess) about the fact that it's impossible to target two moving platforms.
Or are you suggesting that this is not the same cycle followed by anyone who writes commercial software?
Minus the "kill market bundling" part, of course. That I'll ignore as classic "m$ is evil" ramblings.
Which left you with the idea that you can cause a ring-0 fault by drawing evil rectangles on a window.
I dunno which school you went to, but you sure as heck didn't get your money's worth.
Exactly.
This is only partially true.
I don't like absolutes, but 99% is still better than 60%. For example, the basic Windows "widgets" have not changed since Windows 3.1. In fact, IIRC I changed only two lines of code (from the GUI part) in an application I had back then to convert it to 32-bit. Apps written for Windows 3.1 run today in Windows XP and Server 2003 with no more than a tweak using the compatibility tool. No recompile, no code changes required.
If that isn't stable, I don't know what is.
Now, some people have theorized that the "editors" mix and match similar submissions (which I'm sure they get all the time) and then present them as what was originally submitted. Some stories certainly look that way. For example, disjointed sentences or different writing styles from one paragraph to the next. Is that evil? No. Censorship? Nope. A bad idea? Yep. You DO NOT mess with the submissions. They screw up enough already by adding their "editorial" bylines at the end (which usually are there just to fan the flames).
Evidence? I have none. But you can always chuck it to the submitter if you feel insulted by my "insinuations" about Slashdot.
Dude, RTFA. They're not selling them.
Ya wanna back that up with some cold hard facts, or are you just another uninformed teenager zealot who r0xx0rz with Linux and only uses Windows to play cool games*?
* which sorta implies that you don't know what you're talking about
But woe to the poor soul that even remotely mentions that this is probably not such a good thing.
"Competition" and "choice" are words frequently used in these contexts. And while I agree with that to a certain extent, I think most zealots are blind to the fact that Windows is a stable, unified platform that can be leveraged without fear of one's products becoming obsolete or broken with the next release of Gnome or KDE.
And in the end, I think, it all comes down to X being so "wonderful". Wonderfully outdated and quirky and out of place in a desktop environment. What Linux and BSD need is something like Cocoa (or Carbon or whatever it's called) in OS X. Yes, X is part of the Unix legacy. No, it's not needed anymore except in a server, multi-user environment. Desktops ain't that.
Software vendors will not jump on the bandwagon on technical merit alone. There has to be stability and uniformity.
Criticism of Slashdot is not tolerated around... um... Slashdot.
Seeing that you got First Post and it was modded +5 with alacrity, you might want to try buying lottery tickets or drinking expired milk. This is your lucky day mon!
They pulled an Enron!
Wow. Thanks for making my point.
As I loaded the front page and saw the Apple patent (patents are bad, remember?) there was a plain-text ad at the top that linked to:
c omd ex.h tme q_se arch.asp
http://www.invention.com
http://www.litmanlaw.
http://www.gilmanresearch.com/pages/944483/in
http://www.isc-online.com/forms/inventorinfor
http://www.qualitypatent.com
How low can you go!
This is repeated every single time Apple behaves like a corporation (since that's what it is) instead of a lovable gang of fashionable geeks. Yet Microsoft is evil when they do things like these, but Apple is just... well, being Apple.
And BTW, why didn't the SNORT hole make it to the /. front page? Two serious vulnerabilities in one week too much for the frail ego? God forbid IE develops yet another hole that changes my wallpaper at the behest of evil hackers in Lithuania. I'd be reading about it for the next five weeks.
Flamebait and offtopic. We aim to please.