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Rambus Destroyed Evidence In Anti-trust Trial
Marasmus writes "CNN is reporting that memory-chip maker Rambus has been found guilty of destroying evidence which was 'critical' to the anti-trust case brought by the U.S. government. Interestingly, the Judge has denied the FTC's request to move on to the penalty phase of the trial. Destruction of evidence in an anti-trust case normally yields a forfeiture of trial, but Rambus 'will have the burden of proving its innocence" instead.'
they just kept them in memory...and turned the power off.
postmodernsideshow.com
The article doesn't explain what reasoning the judge gave for not switching right to the penalty phase, but requiring the less-onerous "proving their innoncence". This seems unusual.
From the article: "Rambus has maintained that its document destruction was part of the company's regular document retention policy."
So what exactly is their policy? Does the government regulate this, or do individual companies simply decide a policy? Anderson tried to use this as a defense as well, during the Enron scandal, if I remember correctly. A policy of "don't retain potentially incriminating documents" wouldn't surprise me, considering Rambus' alleged past behaviour. Are these policies about as useful as corporate codes of conduct that companies such as Nike have? If they don't already, should the FTC set down guidelines?
take your sig and shove it
Some people say they illegally destroyed the documents, and Rambus said they legally destroyed the documents. Other than that, the article is useless.
Very popular slashdot journal for adul
Quality of article notwithstanding, the case is interesting because it touches pretty much every computer sold today since pretty much everything uses either DDR or RIMMs. Then there are the human factors like the skullduggery on the part of RAMBUS, their once "gonna take over the world" position, their "relationship" with Intel, etc, etc.
maybe if the patent office was smart enough to ensure anti-trust cases like this wouldn't happen in the first place...
Hmmm, I wonder if Enron could get away with saying the same thing at trial. "I'm sorry, your honor, but we always destroy our evidence, it's our normal business practice."
...The MS anti-trust and now RAMBUS (which I had no idea was anyone's 'darling')?
Has the government prosecutors lost their teeth or is this just fuel to the idea that this was an arrangement that was bought and paid for? This does not sound like justice to me... justice for all that follows the rules and all that? This is very disturbing.
Yeah I guess you have your priorities in order.
The credibility of American business went into the shitter ever since Enron was caught for it's sleazy practices. I predict in the next five or more years there will a shakedown on sleazy business. At least, let's hope. Part of the western recession is due to the discovery of unethical business tactics. America's business credibility relies on the way the courts handle corporations that choose sleazy tactics.
So first they enter into a consortium, and don't show they have certain patents, and now they don't show evidence? I sense a pattern there, but I can't seem to find one for the judges decision.
-- Waht? Tehr's a preveiw buottn?
How does someone read the news for nerds web site and not know who Rambus is??
http://www.google.com/search?q=rambus
And the fact that they went into JEDEC meetings to help define an open standard and then patented things being developed there. The RAMBUS saga is about abuse of the processes used to develop new standards. Rambus has yet to be properly dealt with for that, and that make an update on their case "News for Nerds" as much as anything.
The usual standard in criminal cases is that the prosecution must prove its case beyond a reasonable doubt: i.e., they must prove you are guilty. You are not obliged to prove you are innocent -- something which, really, is virtually impossible to do: how do you prove a negative ("I didn't do it!")?
DFL
Never send a human to do a machine's job.
Abstract - A process by which documents, which encompasses the plurality of both physical and "virtual" assembledges of characters or images, are converted into a non usable format either via the physical process of shredding, disassembly via the use of prehensile appendages, use of the 'delete' or 'rm' utilities, editing with Microsoft Word, or any other method that would make said document unreadable to any law enforcement agency.
Have a heart. The Shredder and the Fax were made by the same company, and the secretary accidently mistook one for the other.
Tom
OK, so it's your regular retention policy to shred documents that incriminate you... big surprise. And when did the shredding begin? As soon as the IP claim was filed. Very sleazy.
Can I bum a sig? I left mine at the office.
HOWEVER, regardless of a company's retention policy, it is illegal to destroy documents related to a government investigation once the company is aware an investigation will occur or is likely to occur. This is what got Arther Anderson in trouble, they knew an investigation was coming and then destroyed documents. This is also why a written policy is important, and that it be strictly observed. That way in court it is easy to defend the statement we destroy all documents older than X months automatically. We did not destroy them because an investigation was coming.
'will have the burden of proving its innocence"
== "sponsor" a few more senators to help smooth things out... Funny how incredibly rich corporations are treated slightly differently to normal people, huh?
Code, Hardware, stuff like that.
4337?
Destruction of evidence in an anti-trust case normally yields a forfeiture of trial,
its sad to me that there's a standard procedure for this kind of violation, though after the last couple of years, not at all surprising.
The article includes a graph that shows a steep drop-off of their stock price.
The very first thing you do is to look at the numbers on the axes of the graph. The vertical axis of the graph is price of one stock share in dollars, but the graph goes from $15.43 down to $13.86, so that steep drop-off wasn't as steep as the graph makes it look. If you plot the same numbers on a graph that goes from $16 down to $0, it's not nearly as dramatic. The stock price fell by about 10.6%, while the graph makes it look more like 100%.
To learn more about tricky graphs and other misleading charts, read How to Lie with Statistics, a truly great and fun book.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I think in this case, it was a VALID patent, but is bad business ethics on the part of rambus to not tell JEDEC(?) they had patents on it.
LFS. Have you built your system today?
And summary judgement/straight to penalty is more harsh then a trial where they still might be able to prevail despite their actions.
No, please just keep trolling slashdot... leave (us the) fark alone. Fark mods just delete your posts anyway and no-one will see them. Here, at least your stupidity is still on display for conspiracy theorists looking to see what views 'geek illuminati' is trying to supress.
Slashdot destroys 2 to 5 sites a day.
They get trolled quite a bit.
That's real KARMA.
I wish I was aeet.
(Double Damn you 20 second rule)
Does anyone else think that maybe the US gov't is encouraging the big-name companies based in the US to play by a different set of rules in order to maintain market share? Note that Worldcom had tremendous overseas assets, as did Enron. Rambus had one of the largest market shares in its field and an original patent. Microsoft is still on 90(+)% of consumer computers worldwide, and AOL has not had to abide by its promises to open up the IM market under the rules established for the merger with Time-Warner. Granted, all the aforementioned companies are heavy political donators, but it seems that the US government of the last 25 years (since the Chrysler bailout in the late 70s) has encouraged a trust mentality among larger companies that allows them several get-out-of-jail-free cards as long as they stay profitable and maintain market share. I'd like to hear y'alls opinions/comments on this...
As long as there is a Second Amendment, there will always be a First Amendment.
It's seems obvious that they did wrong in adjusting their patents during and after the JEDEC process, without disclosing their patent knowledge or intents to the body at large. I can just hear the conversation: "Let's sit in on this standards body, write down their ideas, quielty patent them, wait for them to be implemented, hire lots of lawyers, and start suing everybody!!"
If they had been (or are) allowed to get away with their behavior in regards to that standards body, it undermines the ability of all companies to cooperatively design and create standards in good faith.
Maybe rambus can patent destroying evidence, oh wait Enron and Worldcome beat them to it.....
Unless you were Ellen Feiss and you were writing a paper on your dad's PC and it goes berzerk and the paper just disappears. And then you have to write it over again and it's not as good.
Liquor
Sanity is a highly overrated commodity.
Palladium has an interest to not only corporate America but also microsoft since they can destroy any document at will and have the encrypted filesystem hide any evidence that it even existed. The doj can never bother them again.
http://saveie6.com/
Nothing says "We're innocent" like destroying evidence
They operate out in the open, and they are what was called in the federalist papers "monied interests".
You have 3 options:
Become a monied interest yourself
Do nothing
Fight the system
Good luck with the do nothing/fight the system option.
Untrue. A judge has rule that they destroyed evidence. The wording makes a big diffence in legal matters.
They're Ram-Busssssted!
You catch enchiladas by picking them up behind the head and holding them underwater until they don't kick anymore -VeGas
$$$$$exyGal's obsession with fans (scroll down to the end of the porn links):
http://slashdot.org/~$$$$$exyGal/journal
Ekrout's obsession with fans:
http://slashdot.org/~ekrout/journal
Notice that Eric Krout compares his # of fans to the same type of people in both cases!
it definitely isn't flamebait...it's true and i think many many people around the world would agree.
But hey, don't let facts get in the way of a perfectly good rant.
I think this decision has some broader implications which the people commenting have so far missed. This means there might be some legal requirement by other companies to keep information which may prove necessary for purposes not yet known.
For example, could it be argued that ISPs must keep complete logs of user traffic in the event of legal action taken against a user? Or that companies must retain versions of software builds for X years to prove they didn't "steal" intellectual property in building their system?
Granted, that is a big difference from keeping documents which were used in the process of conducting business (e.g. patents, SEC filings, shareholder meetings). Is this the first ruling of its kind? (I'm guessing no.) Any legal experts have any insight into where else this sort of ruling can be applied in a broader sense?
Saddam maintains that Iraq has no WOMD, but says if USA attacks, then he'll destroy entire Iraq cities with biological/chemical weapons so that those people's death's will be on GWB's head as punishment for attacking?????
And the rest of the world is *still* being that stupid!!!!!
Let's see... there were THREE OR FOUR motions filed today against Rambus by the FTC... only ONE of them stuck.
John Danforth sez:
"All the court said was that two years before the investigation started, we weren't careful about preserving evidence, There is no destruction of evidence that has happened."
Rambus wasn't found GUILTY of anything. Just that the potential "evidence" may have been lost, and in absence of it, Rambus will have to find another way to defend themselves. Should be easy for their legal team.
The most important was the DEFAULT JUDGEMENT the FTC was seeking. Denied.
If you ask me, "Adverse assumptions" means "Presumed guilty", but that's another matter. Adverse does NOT mean *GUILTY AS CHARGED* as the sensationalistic slashdot article hints towards.
So let's see... how's Rambus doing these days with all this litigation?
Rambus sues infineon...
Infineon beats Rambus in court on SDRAM patents after judge payne is convinced by Infineon's lawyers to remove their only defense from being admissible as evidence of their claims defining a "bus" (covered by the Markman ruling, which was in Rambus' favor).
Court finds Rambus guilty of FRAUD on SDRAM because they have no evidence to support otherwise. Rambus couldn't define a bus according to how their own 1990 patent stated, so they're robbed.
The FTC files its case against Rambus based on this FRAUD VERDICT.
Infineon files motion to make this fraud ruling relevant to DDR so they don't have to pay royalties there either. Payne denies the request since Rambus wasn't part of JEDEC when DDR was being developed, much less ratified as a standard. Infineon tried to show that SDRAM and DDR are so similar that it should cover both, but the judge wasn't convinced based on the evidence they presented. Motion denied.
An appeal on the fraud verdict is filed and the CAFC gets the case. THEY CLEAR Rambus 100% based on the fact that Infineon was guilty of some tomfoolery of their own, and TWO OTHER COMPANIES DID THE SAME THING (IBM and HP) while in JEDEC, actively stating they WILL NOT reveal their patents that are relevant to SDRAM. They also bring up the fact that JEDEC's notetaking and policy making sucks, since their own policies were so broad they were unenforcable.
So now, you have Rambus.. a company not guilty of fraud, and free to sue.
The FTC all of a sudden changes their entire case around to shift towards "willful document destruction" as plan B. All of a sudden, a nebulous suspicion about a 180 person company (of which ONLY FOUR are lawyers, btw) comes to light, making them look like the "next Enron", causing their stock price to drop. EVEN THOUGH RAMBUS WON TODAY BY THWARTING THE BIGGEST PROBLEM THEY HAD: The default judgement.
So now, what's Rambus left with? Well, even if they DID shred documents, they can only hold it against 'em for SDRAM if they're found guilty. DDR has NOT been in dispute EVER except for the brief time Infineon tried to weasel their way out of it on the SDRAM ticket.
Rambus filed for a summary judgement on DDR, which is ALL they need to win this case. They have the CAFC on their side (WHICH HAS JURISDICTION over the ALJ), which says "Hey, we're not guilty of fraud, and a higher court than you said so."
There is NO WAY the FTC will get anything major out of this. If you ask me, it's frivolous and a waste of taxpayer dollars to even investigate.
tell it like it is, brotha'
it's pathetic when you have to pretend to be a chick to get attention. although i have to admit, the $$$$$exyGal journal is fertile trolling ground, as the pathetic losers who befriended "her" try to convince themselves that they are not pathetically reaching out for female contact. oh, wait, let's not forget their best argument, "even if she's not a girl, she still has all these porn links". oh yeah, like you can't find porn on the internet yourself, dumbass. face it, $$$$$exyGal retards, you've been krouted
well, fark does give boobie links. i'm willing to cut down on trolling here if i see more boobie links, less dupes, and the complete silencing of michael.
wait... and no more blatant ibook ads by taco, and the addition of the (-5 friend whore) moderation option, and a spelling checker being put to use, and getting rid of cowboyneal options in the polls.
hmm, hold on, i'm not done. how about some fact checking in stories, and making the moderation record visible again, and less blatant opinions by the editors (or stop pretending it's a news site).
i have a few more ideas...
Why, if you're "Rich", you can live overseas as a fugitive for years, then buy a pardon!
Destruction of evidence in an anti-trust case normally yields a forfeiture of trial, ...
So what is the punishment for creation of evidence in an anti-trust trial (the videotape M$ made)?
rocks Rambus!!
--------
Starwars Galaxies - free webmail, boards, dbases
Not to troll, but my posts have been deleted from Slashdot before (when posting anonymously). Not that I usually post anon, but sometimes there is a good reason to.
Saddam agreed to disarm Iraq's WMD assets under the Gulf War cease-fire, and agreed to produce evidence that he in fact destroyed various bio and chem weapons, and then got hit with 17 UN resolutions demanding the same..
and now he's alternately saying he destroyed them as ordered and that he never had them to destroy. Never mind that he's used them on his own people. But fucks like you still just gotta defend him for that. Maybe you don't like the Kurds either? Maybe they remind you too much of Jews or Christians or something? Or maybe just cos they're brown?
Either way, he does have to provide proof of destruction, that's what the whole armistice in 91 was about.
I apologise for the delay in making this intelligent post... When I attempted to post it, Slashdot said:
.By the time I add all this crap to the post, I'm sure that the aforementioned two minutes will have elapsed successfully.moron
I wish there was such a thing. I can only hope more municipalities will follow the lead of Porter Townhip.
Fuck off, we don't want you deporting them over here. Keep them yourself.
Rambus went on to explain that they had a standing policy to destroy all incriminating evidence when it comes to their attention. "It is part of our lawsuit-based business model and corporate culture," the spokesperson said.
Just what we need, a memory company that can't remember stuff it was supposed to hold on to....
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
...and you work for?
"Alacrity" is a cool word. I remember it being used in a 50 year old book about Chess. The author was explaining how, as a beginner Chess player, you wanted to probably play 1.e4 and then just leave it there for a while. You wouldn't want to keep moving the pawn around.
But it goes on to say this is not set in stone: "Of course if Black moves its Queen to d5, the pawn will capture her with alacrity!"
Furry cows moo and decompress.
And which department of Rambus do YOU work in?
"There are laws that enslave men, and laws that set them free. " - Sean Connery as King Arthur
Actually a merger with Intel seems more natural.
My momma told me to not play with alacrity or I might get myself alactrocuted.
Most likely a Rambus coporate shill.