This is the first reasonable response I've seen : why are so many others claiming there's prior art, it's a stupid patent etc. etc.
This is a GOOD patent : it will make it harder (expensive) for the gov. to use that technology.
We should patent key escrow, serialised CPUs, closed-source development, closed comms protocols and all those other things we love to hate. And then sit on the patents.
For extreme examples (kiddyporn labelled as teletubbies) that might have a chance. But for 99.9% of web pages, it won't be anywhere near as clearcut. Are artistic old masters porn ? Is a bomb a chemical experiment ? Is a discussion of encyrption technology maths ?
Libraries have years of experience in cataloguing stuff and still make it difficult to find cross-subject categories. What chance do lawyers have to make an enforceable law ?
Or do I see another lawyer-enriching scheme coming up here ?
This seems unworkable unless rating accuracy is somehow enforced.. and that means somebody, somewhere has to rate my pages anyway, to check I'm not lying. Back to NetNanny...
A: It's not controlled by one company, and fragmentation can occur. Why do they keep coming out with this one ? Surely GM, of all people, would understand the advantages and even necessity of not being tied to a single vendor ?
I think WinCE is an optional runtime environment that might be used by games developers, and then ships on their boot CD. Probably more likely to be used for a browser than a game. And not in ROM.
Do your US politicians really write letters like that ? It doesn't look like the sort of thing I'd expect from one government rep. to another.. far too direct and not nearly deniable enough.
I'd check out the credentials a bit before going into the deep end..
A similar case was fought in the UK a couple of years ago : the out-of-court settlement permitted the links, but required them to go to specific parts of the articles (headlines) and to indicate on the linking page who owned the real articles.
Not only PCs will be affected.. how difficult will it be to put VCR, DVD and set-top-box applications (satellite decode etc., not just internet gateway) on a PS2 ?
Only because Windows buyers are accustomed to a monopoly supplier. BSD people shouldn't have too much trouble with multiple variants, I think..
What about all the suppliers of automobiles ? All slightly different, but all pretty well drop-in replacements. Most people consider this choice to be good - the days of 'any colour you like as long as it's black' are forgotten.
Matthew points to the open-sourcing of the scripts that slashdot runs on, claiming this defends slashdot from a backdoor method of biasing postings.
I don't think it offers anything of the sort : we've no way of determining whether the sources provided are, in fact, the ones that run.
I'm not suggesting that slashdot actually performs any obscure filtering, or that the scripts provided aren't the ones that run. But I don't think providing those sources offer any guarantee of impartiality : I just see them as a friendly and idealistic gesture that's welcomed by the community that slashdot serves.
What if I buy a machine with software already installed ? These are shipped ready-to-run, and don't present all the EULA screens that the setup programs offer. Nobody could prove I even saw a license agreement, let alone approved it.
What if I borrow a machine ? A EULA might forbid resale of the software, but not temporary use by another person of that machine.
IANAL, but I didn't think you could enforce a contract that wasn't approved by both parties.
Why should commercial rivalry be considered 'mature' ?
It sounds like the politics of the playground to me.
Re:So what's the solution?
on
BO2K cracked
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· Score: 2
Do all the package maintenance tools want to run as root ? As far as I know, rpm does. What about the others ?
If there's a culture of using root access to do any significant operation on a machine, it becomes much easier to convince a user to use root for every job, and hence to run any arbitrary install script from the net as root.
Package admin should demand only as much access as is necessary ; if run as a normal user, they should install only with that user's rights (modifying ~/bin, ~/lib etc.)
He doesn't threaten - just points out that the paying customers are struggling to be able to use the hardware to best suit their needs, while the competition has the tools and resources to reverse-engineer in minimal time.
In a product development cycle, that reverse-engineering time is irrelevant when set against tooling, purchasing, and marketing.
So, just as with dead-end copy-protection schemes, secret designs offer no barrier to the competition while disadvantaging the paying customer.
I'm the poster, and yes, I did post twice accidentally (/. threw an error), changing it slightly on the repost. And I moderated down someone else's duplicate the other day, so I'm not sore.. but thanks for the defence.
Another barrier to encryption is the use of virus sweepers; some sysadmins are now paranoid about mail viruses, and process all the mail through some filter that gives them a warm fuzzy feeling (and probably little else).
These systems can't work with encrypted mail (obviously).. as a result, we've just been asked to remove both encrypters and decrypters from our systems.
Makes you wonder whether the antiencryption spooks are behind the mail viruses, doesn't it ?
Another barrier to encryption is the use of virus sweepers; some sysadmins are now paranoid about mail viruses, and process all the mail through some filter that gives them a warm fuzzy feeling (and probably little else).
These systems can't work with encrypted mail (obviously).. as a result, we've just been asked to remove both encrypters and decrypters from our systems.
The illustration ESR uses of a company selling fitting software for sawmills is relevant here, but I think he missed a point in that example.
There may be no advantage for the company he spoke to in opening their sources. But that company has potential customers who might have written their own software. Since many sawmills compete only within a fixed geographical area, they may feel that they have little to lose by giving that application away, and much to gain from all the usual arguments.
So where does that leave our software supplier ?
It's not sufficient to consider whether your product should be open-sourced - you also need to consider the effects on your business of someone else open-sourcing a replacement.
Slashdot Mirror
This is the first reasonable response I've seen : why are so many others claiming there's prior art, it's a stupid patent etc. etc.
This is a GOOD patent : it will make it harder (expensive) for the gov. to use that technology.
We should patent key escrow, serialised CPUs, closed-source development, closed comms protocols and all those other things we love to hate.
And then sit on the patents.
Nazis ?
I think this discussion just invoked Godwin's Law.
For extreme examples (kiddyporn labelled as teletubbies) that might have a chance. But for 99.9% of web pages, it won't be anywhere near as clearcut. Are artistic old masters porn ? Is a bomb a chemical experiment ? Is a discussion of encyrption technology maths ?
Libraries have years of experience in cataloguing stuff and still make it difficult to find cross-subject categories. What chance do lawyers have to make an enforceable law ?
Or do I see another lawyer-enriching scheme coming up here ?
This seems unworkable unless rating accuracy is somehow enforced .. and that means somebody, somewhere has to rate my pages anyway, to check I'm not lying. Back to NetNanny...
How's this supposed to work ?
A: It's not controlled by one company, and fragmentation can occur. Why do they keep coming out with this one ? Surely GM, of all people, would understand the advantages and even necessity of not being tied to a single vendor ?
I thought Colossus was first, not Eniac.
I think WinCE is an optional runtime environment that might be used by games developers, and then ships on their boot CD. Probably more likely to be used for a browser than a game. And not in ROM.
Do your US politicians really write letters like that ? It doesn't look like the sort of thing I'd expect from one government rep. to another .. far too direct and not nearly deniable enough.
..
I'd check out the credentials a bit before going into the deep end
A similar case was fought in the UK a couple of years ago : the out-of-court settlement permitted the links, but required them to go to specific parts of the articles (headlines) and to indicate on the linking page who owned the real articles.
Blair spent a whole breakfast-time conference worrying about this issue ? ...
Wow, he must take security and personal liberty really seriously
Programmers don't have a problem - there's always something new needs doing.
The thing that worries the MBAs is 'how are marketing managers going to make any money'
Microsoft already sees consoles as a threat.
That's why they've tried to grab a bit of the market with WinCe on the Dreamcast.
Not only PCs will be affected .. how difficult will it be to put VCR, DVD and set-top-box applications (satellite decode etc., not just internet gateway) on a PS2 ?
Only because Windows buyers are accustomed to a monopoly supplier. BSD people shouldn't have too much trouble with multiple variants, I think..
What about all the suppliers of automobiles ? All slightly different, but all pretty well drop-in replacements. Most people consider this choice to be good - the days of 'any colour you like as long as it's black' are forgotten.
Matthew points to the open-sourcing of the scripts that slashdot runs on, claiming this defends slashdot from a backdoor method of biasing postings.
I don't think it offers anything of the sort : we've no way of determining whether the sources provided are, in fact, the ones that run.
I'm not suggesting that slashdot actually performs any obscure filtering, or that the scripts provided aren't the ones that run. But I don't think providing those sources offer any guarantee of impartiality : I just see them as a friendly and idealistic gesture that's welcomed by the community that slashdot serves.
What if I buy a machine with software already installed ? These are shipped ready-to-run, and don't present all the EULA screens that the setup programs offer. Nobody could prove I even saw a license agreement, let alone approved it.
What if I borrow a machine ? A EULA might forbid resale of the software, but not temporary use by another person of that machine.
IANAL, but I didn't think you could enforce a contract that wasn't approved by both parties.
Why should commercial rivalry be considered 'mature' ?
It sounds like the politics of the playground to me.
Do all the package maintenance tools want to run as root ? As far as I know, rpm does. What about the others ?
If there's a culture of using root access to do any significant operation on a machine, it becomes much easier to convince a user to use root for every job, and hence to run any arbitrary install script from the net as root.
Package admin should demand only as much access as is necessary ; if run as a normal user, they should install only with that user's rights (modifying ~/bin, ~/lib etc.)
You mean he's modest ? ..
Seems good to me
He doesn't threaten - just points out that the paying customers are struggling to be able to use the hardware to best suit their needs, while the competition has the tools and resources to reverse-engineer in minimal time.
In a product development cycle, that reverse-engineering time is irrelevant when set against tooling, purchasing, and marketing.
So, just as with dead-end copy-protection schemes, secret designs offer no barrier to the competition while disadvantaging the paying customer.
Dixons (UK electrical retailer & 'free' ISP) have also announced that there will be a sub-£200 access box on sale before the end of the year.
I haven't found any details of OS/browser, though.
The report was in the (paper) edition of the Guardian, Thursday.
I'm the poster, and yes, I did post twice accidentally (/. threw an error), changing it slightly on the repost. And I moderated down someone else's duplicate the other day, so I'm not sore .. but thanks for the defence.
Another barrier to encryption is the use of virus sweepers; some sysadmins are now paranoid about mail viruses, and process all the mail through some filter that gives them a warm fuzzy feeling (and probably little else).
.. as a result, we've just been asked to remove both encrypters and decrypters from our systems.
These systems can't work with encrypted mail (obviously)
Makes you wonder whether the antiencryption spooks are behind the mail viruses, doesn't it ?
Another barrier to encryption is the use of virus sweepers; some sysadmins are now paranoid about mail viruses, and process all the mail through some filter that gives them a warm fuzzy feeling (and probably little else).
.. as a result, we've just been asked to remove both encrypters and decrypters from our systems.
These systems can't work with encrypted mail (obviously)
The illustration ESR uses of a company selling fitting software for sawmills is relevant here, but I think he missed a point in that example.
There may be no advantage for the company he spoke to in opening their sources. But that company has potential customers who might have written their own software. Since many sawmills compete only within a fixed geographical area, they may feel that they have little to lose by giving that application away, and much to gain from all the usual arguments.
So where does that leave our software supplier ?
It's not sufficient to consider whether your product should be open-sourced - you also need to consider the effects on your business of someone else open-sourcing a replacement.
-adrian