If you are going to do nothing else, show them how to integrate a linux box into their windows network. At the end of this, you want them to be confident enough to install linux dual-boot at the place of work.
So you are going to need to show them that it is possible to mix'n'match windows and linux.
1)Winbind (Mandrake 8.2 comes with winbind mostly setup - see http://mandrakeuser.org/connect/csamba5.html) or at least samba and joining a samba box to a windows domain. Something like LinNeighborhood for accessing shares.
2)Rdesktop or vnc or X on cygwin The chances are they are going to have windows servers around, so make sure they know they can get into them from linux. From the other side, make sure they know they can get into their linux boxes from windows and run graphical apps, either with vnc or by running X on cygwin. (Need I mention rdesktop and vnc are standard on Mandrake...)
Show them why unix is better in some regards:
3)Please choose a decent distro. Please don't show them how to resolve dependencies on packages with rpm, but show them the right tool for installing software (apt or urpmi).
4)Show them how to effortlessly setup a firewall. Mail server, web server, proxy server.
Give them something they can apply on windows: 5)Show them that they can run PHP on IIS, and apache on windows (for better security). Show them cygwin.
6)Give them something to tie it all together. Maybe write a small php webpage that can send email to a windows domain account, or something that queries a db (or both).
7)Remind them that they should not be running X on their servers (aka you have a choice not to run a GUI).
8)Remind them not to hit CTRL-ALT-DEL when they want to log in locally;-)
9)Show them the really good gui tools around, things like Kdevelop, OpenOffice, Evo, Konqueror,Gimp etc
10)Show them your favourite command-line features. Bash-completion, vi (they don't need to use it, but show them that a console editor can do syntax-highlighting), mc, lynx, ssh (with password-less key-based logins), X ssh-tunnelled.
11)Show them how easy it is to change hardware (like an ethernet card change with kudzu or similar) with a single reboot and virtually no downtime.
12)Give them CDs for the distro you used, and another CD with similar stuff for windows (cygwin, apache, mysql, mysqlfront etc).
I think your problem is going to be fitting it all into 2 days!
> LDAP - install Mozilla with Ldap support. Install RedHat OpenLDAP and start it. Try LDAP from mozilla - it doesn't work. LDAP implementation in Mozilla is just a demo feature.
Either you have a problem with the data in your LDAP database (you did populate it with some valid data, did you? Try the migration scripts), or you haven't told Mozilla where your base dn is in your db. Have you got anything else working with your ldap server. Try ldapsearch from the commandline and check!
This is most definitely not a demo feature. Auto-completion has worked since about 0.9.6, and the address book has worked with multiple LDAP servers since 0.9.9. Plus, using the quick search bar, it's much faster to search than anything before...
>Calendar - it is not included in the current mozilla distro and being downloaded separatetly it doesn't compile with the latest curtrent mozilla builds.
This is like saying PGP doesn't ship with Outlook. The very reason I pointed these add-ons out is the fact that they are not distributed in the releases, and thus aren't common knowledge. If you are running nightlies, you shouldn't be complaining about anything now working (you should be reporting the bugs and help fixing them). The calendar works for me with 0.9.9 on win2k and linux (installing with xpi).
>Drag-n-Drop - very often breaks.
Most likely dependant on the mail server. Have you tried this with OE? You have to create seperate folders, then select all the mail in a folder, then drag-and-drop it, do it with the next folder, and it still breaks. Mozilla wins this one hands down.
>Spell checking - OO's one is not good. Why ispell is dropped?
OO.o's spell checker is pretty good. It will (apparently) be forming part of the new aspell (which doesn't compile on windows). There was a valid reason why ispell could not be used (licensing?, not sure).
Mozilla does have GPG encryption (pretty good, although there are some issues, for example signed mails in list digests cause some problems with auto-checking signatures), spell checking (using the OpenOffice.org myspell spell chacker, so you can use any dictionary from OO.o).
Not only that, but the calendar is progressing well (email invitations are apparently next on the list, then hopefully server support), the Google-searchbar-like Easysearch is cool. There is also a Jabber based instant messaging plugin (with white-board support).
Plus, it supports a whole bunch of other features even more fundamental that a lot of other mail clients don't support. Here are some of my favourites:
Fast IMAP performance (roughly twice as fast as OE, Kmail, Evo, and Sylpheed)
Internationalisation (so that the rest of the world can also use it)
Quick search bar (in both mail and address book)
LDAP auto-completion (rocks for a (li|u)n(u|i)x-based mail server running something like OpenLDAP)
Drag-and-drop of mail folders to and from an IMAP server
The fact that it has sane operation in a network, for example, in windows you can have your mozilla profile on a network drive (home dir on a samba server for example), so that your mail client doens't put your mail in your windows profile to be dragged around the network if you log into different machines (OE sucks in this regard, it caches ALL your mail from IMAP servers in your message store, and you can't set it to put it's message store on a network drive).
You can use it cross-platform. My dad runs Win2k/Mandrake 8.2 dual boot, and has his mail and address book accessible from both sides. How cool is that?
IMHO, except for the lack of scheduling ability (which will hopefully be addressed by the Mozilla Calendar post 1.0), Mozilla is already the best mail client around for typical users (ie people who don't know what a command line is).
Mandrake will not try and release Gnome2 and KDE3, since they have learnt from their mistake with shipping KDE2 with 7.2. This instead will be a rock-solid release, and since Star Office 6.0 will only be released in late April/early May, there is not point in waiting for it. Instead, however, you can get an OpenOffice 641c build (but better than the SUN-compiled versions since it is compiled with gcc 3.0.4, ie the Insert->Frame bug is not there in the Mandrake RPMs), working out-the-box (no./setup -net to do) with multi-lingual builds and multi-lingual spell-checking (see the myspell-(lang) RPMs.
Since we run about 6 linux servers (including a samba domain controller, openldap server, postfix on our mail host etc) and 50 Windows 2000 desktops (all fully licensed), and the one SQL 2000 box we need.
Linux desktops are coming soon.
Maybe/. posters should do some research on the country before posting comments like this.
There are lots of businesses that pirate software, and that is exactly why open source needs to be pushed as a legal alternative (not really a cheaper alternative) to free (as in beer) (possibly proprietary) software.
With things like winbind in samba-2.2.3 (to integrate authentication with an existing windows infrastructure), evolution 1.0.1(a mail/PIM client windows users would be happy with), mozilla 0.9.8 (a really good browser) and OpenOffice.org build 641, out the box printing without having to worry about installing print drivers (via CUPS) you have everything most desktop users need for business use - for free.
People need to stop saying it won't work and just try it!
And of course, the chances are, we aren't going to use Redhat for it, but Mandrake.
But the guy was complaining about 2.4 and then goes and re-reinstalls his machine with Redhat 6.2. Why not just intall the Mandrake-supplied 2.2.19smp and reboot????
Of course, if he had been running Slackware, he could have done the same, but he seems to be implying there is something wrong with mandrake, when he didn't even try the easiest option...
We are a small company in South Africa, and we run vritually everything on Open Source software. on the server side we have:
3 Linux Mandrake boxes:
1)Samba PDC and main fileserver (also NFS), openldap server,
2)Postfix/UW-IMAP/amavis virus scanning mail server, apache web and webmail, Star Schedule Calendar server.
3)Samba/CUPS printserver, intranet server
The only proprietary software here is the Star Schedule server, which we are looking at replacing.
1 Windows 2000 Server/MSSQL 7 server/IIS
This box is for the ERP/Project Management software we use (don't blame me, management didn't even consult IT).
On the desktops we run mostly Windows 2000 or Windows NT with Star Office, GIMP, and Netscape. We will be deploying Mozilla and OpenOffice to replace Netscape and StarOffice.
Openldap provides a convenient shared address book, and allows use to use linux on the desktops as conveniently as Windows boxes joined to the domain. Password authentication on linux is done with pam_smb, account info by ldap -> one account and one password. Star Schedule povides calendaring, although it is not that robust. We migth migrate to phpgroupware.....
There are a few people who have MS Office (since they claim they can't send (Star|Open)Office to other companies... we will see about that soon...
Other proprietary software we use is Pro/Engineer and Wave (from Ricardo). Pro/E does not run on linux (yet), but Wave does.
There are a lot of people who have been relying on Star Schedule Server, and a lot of people who would like to see an open source groupware tool. The only component really missing is a calendar server (LDAP serves well as a source of shared contacts), but a single protocol would be better.
The openoffice groupware whiteboard project is attempting to implement this, but we don't really have any coders (we are mainly admins and users!). If you really want to see open source groupware that you can bet your business on, yo need to jump in a start coding! Any language that can do xml-rpc is sufficient. If you can hacl Mozilla's Zulu calendar client so it compiles, even better!
In most cases, unless you are using software noone else uses, you can sort things out by using urpmi. If urpmi knows about software you newly downloaded rpm is dependant on, it will take care of it, and ask you when it doen't know for sure.
OK, so maybe it's not GPL'd (I haven't seen it in openoffice) but Star Schedule (server and client) is the only affordable cross platform calendering tool available. There are issues with the Windows versions (adding multiple people to events causes the StarSchedule client to crash - the linux version i fine), but maybe if more people complained about this (the bug report seems to have disappeared from Sun's forums after the REAL millenium) maybe they would fix it.
Note that the Star Schedule server is only available on the CD (not by download) but runs on windows, linux or solaris
If Star Schedule were under the GPL, it might be easier to make other clients (ie a connector for outlook) or make an exchange compatability mode.
Also, I don't think people should bash Evolution until it hits 1.0, I assume that Helix will be adding a client for Exchange.
The other point is to remember that we don't need an Exchange replacement. We only need to do calendaring and task sharing (and maybe even integrate that with project management). IMAP is for email and LDAP is for contacts => you can use any client for your mail and contacts.
Slashdot Mirror
1) LSB is formed
2) SuSE claims to implements it, nobody else uses propoganda
2a)First official draft of LSB released
3)All of the sudden Mandrake likes the LSB.
3a)Official realease of LSB1.0
4) SuSE forms United Linux with Caldera and some others.
5)Official release of LSB test suite
6)Mandrake 9.0 released as the first certified LSB-compliant distro.
If you are going to do nothing else, show them how to integrate a linux box into their windows network. At the end of this, you want them to be confident enough to install linux dual-boot at the place of work.
...)
;-)
So you are going to need to show them that it is possible to mix'n'match windows and linux.
1)Winbind
(Mandrake 8.2 comes with winbind mostly setup - see http://mandrakeuser.org/connect/csamba5.html) or at least samba and joining a samba box to a windows domain. Something like LinNeighborhood for accessing shares.
2)Rdesktop or vnc or X on cygwin
The chances are they are going to have windows servers around, so make sure they know they can get into them from linux. From the other side, make sure they know they can get into their linux boxes from windows and run graphical apps, either with vnc or by running X on cygwin. (Need I mention rdesktop and vnc are standard on Mandrake
Show them why unix is better in some regards:
3)Please choose a decent distro. Please don't show them how to resolve dependencies on packages with rpm, but show them the right tool for installing software (apt or urpmi).
4)Show them how to effortlessly setup a firewall. Mail server, web server, proxy server.
Give them something they can apply on windows:
5)Show them that they can run PHP on IIS, and apache on windows (for better security). Show them cygwin.
6)Give them something to tie it all together. Maybe write a small php webpage that can send email to a windows domain account, or something that queries a db (or both).
7)Remind them that they should not be running X on their servers (aka you have a choice not to run a GUI).
8)Remind them not to hit CTRL-ALT-DEL when they want to log in locally
9)Show them the really good gui tools around, things like Kdevelop, OpenOffice, Evo, Konqueror,Gimp etc
10)Show them your favourite command-line features. Bash-completion, vi (they don't need to use it, but show them that a console editor can do syntax-highlighting), mc, lynx, ssh (with password-less key-based logins), X ssh-tunnelled.
11)Show them how easy it is to change hardware (like an ethernet card change with kudzu or similar) with a single reboot and virtually no downtime.
12)Give them CDs for the distro you used, and another CD with similar stuff for windows (cygwin, apache, mysql, mysqlfront etc).
I think your problem is going to be fitting it all into 2 days!
> LDAP - install Mozilla with Ldap support. Install RedHat OpenLDAP and start it. Try LDAP from mozilla - it doesn't work. LDAP implementation in Mozilla is just a demo feature.
...
Either you have a problem with the data in your LDAP database (you did populate it with some valid data, did you? Try the migration scripts), or you haven't told Mozilla where your base dn is in your db. Have you got anything else working with your ldap server. Try ldapsearch from the commandline and check!
This is most definitely not a demo feature. Auto-completion has worked since about 0.9.6, and the address book has worked with multiple LDAP servers since 0.9.9. Plus, using the quick search bar, it's much faster to search than anything before
>Calendar - it is not included in the current mozilla distro and being downloaded separatetly it doesn't compile with the latest curtrent mozilla builds.
This is like saying PGP doesn't ship with Outlook. The very reason I pointed these add-ons out is the fact that they are not distributed in the releases, and thus aren't common knowledge. If you are running nightlies, you shouldn't be complaining about anything now working (you should be reporting the bugs and help fixing them). The calendar works for me with 0.9.9 on win2k and linux (installing with xpi).
>Drag-n-Drop - very often breaks.
Most likely dependant on the mail server. Have you tried this with OE? You have to create seperate folders, then select all the mail in a folder, then drag-and-drop it, do it with the next folder, and it still breaks. Mozilla wins this one hands down.
>Spell checking - OO's one is not good. Why ispell is dropped?
OO.o's spell checker is pretty good. It will (apparently) be forming part of the new aspell (which doesn't compile on windows). There was a valid reason why ispell could not be used (licensing?, not sure).
Not only that, but the calendar is progressing well (email invitations are apparently next on the list, then hopefully server support), the Google-searchbar-like Easysearch is cool. There is also a Jabber based instant messaging plugin (with white-board support).
Plus, it supports a whole bunch of other features even more fundamental that a lot of other mail clients don't support. Here are some of my favourites:
IMHO, except for the lack of scheduling ability (which will hopefully be addressed by the Mozilla Calendar post 1.0), Mozilla is already the best mail client around for typical users (ie people who don't know what a command line is).
Mandrake will not try and release Gnome2 and KDE3, since they have learnt from their mistake with shipping KDE2 with 7.2. This instead will be a rock-solid release, and since Star Office 6.0 will only be released in late April/early May, there is not point in waiting for it. Instead, however, you can get an OpenOffice 641c build (but better than the SUN-compiled versions since it is compiled with gcc 3.0.4, ie the Insert->Frame bug is not there in the Mandrake RPMs), working out-the-box (no ./setup -net to do) with multi-lingual builds and multi-lingual spell-checking (see the myspell-(lang) RPMs.
Since we run about 6 linux servers (including a samba domain controller, openldap server, postfix on our mail host etc) and 50 Windows 2000 desktops (all fully licensed), and the one SQL 2000 box we need.
/. posters should do some research on the country before posting comments like this.
Linux desktops are coming soon.
Maybe
There are lots of businesses that pirate software, and that is exactly why open source needs to be pushed as a legal alternative (not really a cheaper alternative) to free (as in beer) (possibly proprietary) software.
they have been in the official KDE release since 2.2.2. Koffice is in the process of being translated. Mozilla and OpenOffice will be next.
A spell checker for african languages may be more work.
who have started migrating users to linux desktops.
...
And they're not the only ones
Mandrakebizcases.com
With things like winbind in samba-2.2.3 (to integrate authentication with an existing windows infrastructure), evolution 1.0.1(a mail/PIM client windows users would be happy with), mozilla 0.9.8 (a really good browser) and OpenOffice.org build 641, out the box printing without having to worry about installing print drivers (via CUPS) you have everything most desktop users need for business use - for free.
People need to stop saying it won't work and just try it!
And of course, the chances are, we aren't going to use Redhat for it, but Mandrake.
But the guy was complaining about 2.4 and then goes and re-reinstalls his machine with Redhat 6.2. Why not just intall the Mandrake-supplied 2.2.19smp and reboot????
...
Of course, if he had been running Slackware, he could have done the same, but he seems to be implying there is something wrong with mandrake, when he didn't even try the easiest option
We are a small company in South Africa, and we run vritually everything on Open Source software. on the server side we have:
.....
... we will see about that soon ...
3 Linux Mandrake boxes:
1)Samba PDC and main fileserver (also NFS), openldap server,
2)Postfix/UW-IMAP/amavis virus scanning mail server, apache web and webmail, Star Schedule Calendar server.
3)Samba/CUPS printserver, intranet server
The only proprietary software here is the Star Schedule server, which we are looking at replacing.
1 Windows 2000 Server/MSSQL 7 server/IIS
This box is for the ERP/Project Management software we use (don't blame me, management didn't even consult IT).
On the desktops we run mostly Windows 2000 or Windows NT with Star Office, GIMP, and Netscape. We will be deploying Mozilla and OpenOffice to replace Netscape and StarOffice.
Openldap provides a convenient shared address book, and allows use to use linux on the desktops as conveniently as Windows boxes joined to the domain. Password authentication on linux is done with pam_smb, account info by ldap -> one account and one password. Star Schedule povides calendaring, although it is not that robust. We migth migrate to phpgroupware
There are a few people who have MS Office (since they claim they can't send (Star|Open)Office to other companies
Other proprietary software we use is Pro/Engineer and Wave (from Ricardo). Pro/E does not run on linux (yet), but Wave does.
There are a lot of people who have been relying on Star Schedule Server, and a lot of people who would like to see an open source groupware tool. The only component really missing is a calendar server (LDAP serves well as a source of shared contacts), but a single protocol would be better.
The openoffice groupware whiteboard project is attempting to implement this, but we don't really have any coders (we are mainly admins and users!). If you really want to see open source groupware that you can bet your business on, yo need to jump in a start coding! Any language that can do xml-rpc is sufficient. If you can hacl Mozilla's Zulu calendar client so it compiles, even better!
out the box, and also no uses aspell/pspell for spell checking.
In most cases, unless you are using software noone else uses, you can sort things out by using urpmi. If urpmi knows about software you newly downloaded rpm is dependant on, it will take care of it, and ask you when it doen't know for sure.
So install Linux Mandrake 7.2.
Ships with KDE 2 (KDE 2.1beta2 RPMs available if you need to use KDevelop 1.4).
Will install with no problems on udma66. Will install with minor problems (need to pass kernel options at install) on ata100.
Comes with CUPS, which supports the DJ810 quite well (after updates).
Ships with a stable release of gcc
Try it. You won't look back (I haven't since RH 6.1 - yes I did try 6.2, refuse to use 7.0, might try 7.1!).
If Star Schedule were under the GPL, it might be easier to make other clients (ie a connector for outlook) or make an exchange compatability mode.
Also, I don't think people should bash Evolution until it hits 1.0, I assume that Helix will be adding a client for Exchange.
The other point is to remember that we don't need an Exchange replacement. We only need to do calendaring and task sharing (and maybe even integrate that with project management). IMAP is for email and LDAP is for contacts => you can use any client for your mail and contacts.
BTW, Outlook also sucks (to administer)