"Qt, which is normally distributed with all distributions of Linux and GNU/Linux (Debian distributes Qt2), falls under this exception."
Disctributed != Standard Component
And QT is by no means a standard component. Even if you think it is, others will disagree making the legal situation ambiguous. Hence Debian's reluctance.
"So what? Isn't that what your beloved Capitalism is all about?! Free competetion means that you also must remain competetive with regard to salary or else be crushed under the hordes of people who're willing to work for less pay."
That's why competition should never be completely free. That's why I am not a libretarian.
"My whole point was that the BFS does much of what Reiser is hoping to do, a well-established on-disk data structure has been designed for it and is already in widespread use (and this datastructure was designed for multithreaded access from the kernel), and there's even some GPL'ed Linux code to use it.
So why not integrate the BFS into Linux?"
Well, that would depend on which is superior.
"Just because "It's Not Invented Here" doesn't mean it's not a good technology. Remember, Linux didn't even invent Unix."
I don't care where it was invented. I just think that the ReiserFS has had more development than the BFS port. But what do I know.
"And I specifically meant to point out the similarities between BFS and ReiserFS in being journaled high-performance filesystems with integrated database properties."
Yeah. I saw that. But you had my BeOS Advocacy sirens blaring when I read that. But I didn't see much of a comparison.
Umm. I can do the same thing in netscape and ncftp.
"...and you ran it as root, you'd delete pretty much everything on your system."
Why would I do a stupid thing like that? Give me *some* credit, will you?
I just thought there was something special about IRC clients, like maybe letting many people on IRC know my IP address when I run as root or something.
This is the way I see it. And this isn't only about the Gnutella Worm, its about viruses in general. In any truely free system (free as in free speech, of course), you can not fully prevent one person from causing harm onto another. You can restrict the system, create more restrictions and secure, but then some freedom is lost. That is because freedom relies upon people who choose not to cause harm onto other people.
In a specific sense, this guy who created the worm is only exploiting the freedom he was granted. Thus people start locking down and all of us loose a certain amount of freedom.
There is a very good reason why we dislike people who pull these kind of stunts. It is because we know that if we invested that kind time annd effort in creating a virus or worm, we could do it. But we don't. Because we want to keep our freedom on the internet. Because we know that no one ever said we couldn't cause harm to other people's systems. Because as long as we have freedom, we *know* we can cause harm. But we don't because we are moral beings.
The Power of Freedom is directly our ability to influence others and ourselves. If you can't see this---if you only see the internet and other users of the internet as some sort of game, then you do not deserve the little freedom we have left.
Time for a little maturity (speaking from a 17 year old:)
"Most "ordinary" people I know, don't even have a clue what an operating system is..."
Gasp. Horror.
"...and a close friend of mine has been designing webpages for a couple of years and up until quite recently, he didn't even know that there were any other parts of the Internet than the web and email."
Let me guess: either Geocities, Yahoo! or TriPod.
This I understand. People who pretend to know their stuff but have never bothered---this makes me very angry. I will try to explain how the internet works and the various services it offers but they don't care---at least until they actually found a need or want to use it, *then* they are interested.
But know that not knowing what an operating system is like not knowing what some weird artery is in the body or not knowing the formula of any given organic molecule. Computer Jargon is highly specific---even if half the world uses them.
"We have no marketing department, our sales department is an FTP server in North Carolina and our programming department spans _seven_continents_. Am I getting through?"
(Emphasis added by me, of course.)
You are getting through quite well if you are the programmer from Antartica.
But really, are there GNU/Linux developers in Antartica or are we just talking about Tux.
I often find myself asking people on the street about programming multithreading. I must *really* be dumb because the stupidity of my question causes blank stares.
I am interested. I will have to read that paper you linked to when I boot into my GNU/Linux partition (with a postscript viewer).
"I argue with you because you show potential. I won't even bother to discuss FP with most of the other people on this board. Many of them truely thing that Perl is a really good language. Its not even worth trying to argue with someone that burried."
I can understand your point of view, amongst much of the language zealotry. But I hope you can still share your thoughts. What intrigued me was the following:
""Referential transparency" does not exist when there are side effects. Referential transparency allows transparent threading of your application. Think about have your app automatically run on 4 CPUs, without any code rewriting. Referential transparency also allows more simplistic proof of the properties of your code."
Are there any papers you can reference about this?
WHY HAS SLASHDOT sided with stealing? Why does slashdot hate American business? Why do slashdot moderators mod up the posts that defend Slashdot's official bias, and mod down posts that go against slashdot and in favor of the laws of our civil society? Moderating should only judge the "quality" of a post, not whether or not the opinions expressed are consistant with the moderator's. Sheesh. F ALL OF YOU!!
Well my post was moderated up (the root of this thread) and I do not side with breaking laws.
I think this bias is in your mind. People are smart and can usually detect an insightful comment even if it is opposing their personal views. Give people the benefit of the doubt and you find that people are smarting than you might think. At least it will resolve your stress.
You people only want to use Napster to listen to music by artists who want their music on Napster, right?
This way, they can prevent people from sharing music from artists who want nothing to do with Napster.
This way you are happy, the RIAA is happy, Metallica is happy, Everyone's happy.
BTW: Anyone who calls a non-Metallica song, Metallica is an idiot. It is just a rouse to subvert the system. Just like: the next time you go to download sourcecode to some program, you get to decide between Metallica1.c Metallica2.c, etc. That is just dumb and defeats the purpose of filenames!
Unles you don't care what Metallica or any other artist wants; only that you want to listen to their music for free. *gasp* Could it be?
<li>If, in a GNOME article, someone mentions KDE, mark it off-topic. The same goes if the reverse happens.</li> <li>If, in a GNOME article, someone mentions Microsoft, mark it troll. The same goes for KDE articles.</li> <li>If, in any article, someone mentions that the Slashdot have a bias towards GNOME, then mark it off-topic. These messages should go to the Slashdot team and not to public in general.</li> </ol>
"I mean dont get me wrong I like gnome alot but KDE has alot more going for it in terms of applications and install base so what gives?"
I would say they are about equal. But I would wait for *real* statistics before I come to any conclusions so what gives?
"I mean I know the whole QPL shit was a problem for most of the Zealots but gnome is still really damn buggy and a fresking resource Hog, Hell compare to kde 1.9 I just dont see why slash has the bias it has"
That was a run on sentence. The QPL *was* a problem, not anymore. Gnome *was* buggy, not anymore. Why do you have such a bias?
And the people at slashdot, Rob, Hemos, etc. can you please add an entry to the FAQ of something like "Why does slashdot like GNOME better, whaa whaa?" so that the KDE advocates will stop reminding us about this problem? Pleaaaase?
"It seems to me that GNOME is just another step in the total GUIness of linux. Sure it's nice, it can do alot of stuff for you, but it's a huge resource hog, and all in all, it seems to me to be reminiscent of some of the bloat that i switched to linux to get away from."
Okay. I have to ask if A: you read the article; or B: have tried the new release of GNOME? If you haven't then I would suggest you look before you rant.
According to the article, the resources required by GNOME have gone *down*.
But if your rant was about GUIs in general then, yeah that's your opinion. Quite frankly, the GUI is the modern interface and is more sophisticated than the command-line.
And how is this about Microsoft? It has *nothing* to do with Microsoft!! Look, you are using GNU/Linux, browsing the web with Netscape or Lynx, typing your documents with Emacs or Vi, and TeX, and doing mail with Mutt or Netscape Mail. Microsoft doesn't affect you anymore! They are our past. They are gone! Why must you dwell!
Mozilla could begin a bad trend. Where we have configure all our apps for consistancy.
"Yeah and an even more informed Mac user would actually spend some time making the native UI for Mozilla, instead of sniveling about how it's not supported. Unfortunately, Mac users just want things done for them, and have no initiative to better an application for their own fucking operating system."
Haven't you been paying attention? Computers aren't toys. They are *for* lazy people. Real men write letters by hand and calculate spreadsheets with abacuses. Lazy people use their computer for these things.
If Mac people want things done for them, heck I, a Gnu/Linux user, want things done for me. Like a cron daemon to run scripts and for my logs to be rotated. I also want my apps to be consistant without me getting off my butt to do it. I don't want to write XML by hand to code such a thing. And then have it be slightly but noticable off.
I like GNOME. Because it changes themes of *all* gtk apps. When I install Mozilla, it will change themes of all gtk apps *but* Mozilla. That isn't so bad in the GNU/Linux world, because we are used to that. But on the Maacintosh, they already have consistancy. Why would they want to give that up for some dissident they don't need? I certainly won't.
Perhaps someone on the Mac platform will embed the rendering component into a native Mac app like they will being doing with GNOME and (I think) KDE. That is the optimal solution IMHO.
So yeah, I *am* lazy. That's one of the reason I use GNU/Linux. So I can have my tasks done for me.
Slashdot Mirror
Laws matter in the end. That is what your "GPL Zealots" are trying to say.
Ignore them, and the KDE Project will keep getting nipped in the but on this.
"Qt, which is normally distributed with all distributions of Linux and GNU/Linux (Debian distributes Qt2), falls under this exception."
Disctributed != Standard Component
And QT is by no means a standard component. Even if you think it is, others will disagree making the legal situation ambiguous. Hence Debian's reluctance.
"So what? Isn't that what your beloved Capitalism is all about?! Free competetion means that you also must remain competetive with regard to salary or else be crushed under the hordes of people who're willing to work for less pay."
That's why competition should never be completely free. That's why I am not a libretarian.
"My whole point was that the BFS does much of what Reiser is hoping to do, a well-established on-disk data structure has been designed for it and is already in widespread use (and this datastructure was designed for multithreaded access from the kernel), and there's even some GPL'ed Linux code to use it.
So why not integrate the BFS into Linux?"
Well, that would depend on which is superior.
"Just because "It's Not Invented Here" doesn't mean it's not a good technology. Remember, Linux didn't even invent Unix."
I don't care where it was invented. I just think that the ReiserFS has had more development than the BFS port. But what do I know.
"And I specifically meant to point out the similarities between BFS and ReiserFS in being journaled high-performance filesystems with integrated database properties."
Yeah. I saw that. But you had my BeOS Advocacy sirens blaring when I read that. But I didn't see much of a comparison.
"Russia is a great example of place where you can get away with paying great people peanuts, all the while looking like a saint."
That is a very evil thing to say.
Many Americans are loosing jobs to factories relocating to Mexico and China.
I thinking people need to starting thinking about employees as people. And the Golden Rule.
My comment was intended to be neutral.
No offense meant or taken.
Subject: What would Hans Reiser think about cheese?
(Long advocacy comment about cheese here.)
Umm. I can do the same thing in netscape and ncftp.
"...and you ran it as root, you'd delete pretty much everything on your system."
Why would I do a stupid thing like that? Give me *some* credit, will you?
I just thought there was something special about IRC clients, like maybe letting many people on IRC know my IP address when I run as root or something.
Compatability with Excel spreadsheets is the main reason, I heard.
Do you use spreadsheets alot?
Why, again is it stupid? I know it is stupid but, why?
Actually it is a good exercise. It seems that after a while people would learn to be more careful.
This is the way I see it. And this isn't only about the Gnutella Worm, its about viruses in general. In any truely free system (free as in free speech, of course), you can not fully prevent one person from causing harm onto another. You can restrict the system, create more restrictions and secure, but then some freedom is lost. That is because freedom relies upon people who choose not to cause harm onto other people.
In a specific sense, this guy who created the worm is only exploiting the freedom he was granted. Thus people start locking down and all of us loose a certain amount of freedom.
There is a very good reason why we dislike people who pull these kind of stunts. It is because we know that if we invested that kind time annd effort in creating a virus or worm, we could do it. But we don't. Because we want to keep our freedom on the internet. Because we know that no one ever said we couldn't cause harm to other people's systems. Because as long as we have freedom, we *know* we can cause harm. But we don't because we are moral beings.
The Power of Freedom is directly our ability to influence others and ourselves. If you can't see this---if you only see the internet and other users of the internet as some sort of game, then you do not deserve the little freedom we have left.
Time for a little maturity (speaking from a 17 year old :)
Signal 11. Don't let the Trolls bother you. Note they are all the same person (you never really know who the ACs are).
Ayeee. Look what has happened to Slashdot...
"Most "ordinary" people I know, don't even have a clue what an operating system is..."
Gasp. Horror.
"...and a close friend of mine has been designing webpages for a couple of years and up until quite recently, he didn't even know that there were any other parts of the Internet than the web and email."
Let me guess: either Geocities, Yahoo! or TriPod.
This I understand. People who pretend to know their stuff but have never bothered---this makes me very angry. I will try to explain how the internet works and the various services it offers but they don't care---at least until they actually found a need or want to use it, *then* they are interested.
But know that not knowing what an operating system is like not knowing what some weird artery is in the body or not knowing the formula of any given organic molecule. Computer Jargon is highly specific---even if half the world uses them.
"We have no marketing department, our sales department is an FTP server in North Carolina and our programming department spans _seven_continents_. Am I getting through?"
(Emphasis added by me, of course.)
You are getting through quite well if you are the programmer from Antartica.
But really, are there GNU/Linux developers in Antartica or are we just talking about Tux.
I often find myself asking people on the street about programming multithreading. I must *really* be dumb because the stupidity of my question causes blank stares.
Probably because I am an American.
:)
I am interested. I will have to read that paper you linked to when I boot into my GNU/Linux partition (with a postscript viewer).
"I argue with you because you show potential. I won't even bother to discuss FP with most of the other people on this board. Many of them truely thing that Perl is a really good language. Its not even worth trying to argue with someone that burried."
I can understand your point of view, amongst much of the language zealotry. But I hope you can still share your thoughts. What intrigued me was the following:
""Referential transparency" does not exist when there are side effects. Referential transparency allows transparent threading of your application. Think about have your app automatically run on 4 CPUs, without any code rewriting. Referential transparency also allows more simplistic proof of the properties of your code."
Are there any papers you can reference about this?
A good Haiku liked
By Moderators who
Mark it off-topic
WHY HAS SLASHDOT sided with stealing? Why does slashdot hate American business? Why do slashdot moderators mod up the posts that defend Slashdot's official bias, and mod down posts that go against slashdot and in favor of the laws of our civil society? Moderating should only judge the "quality" of a post, not whether or not the opinions expressed are consistant with the moderator's. Sheesh. F ALL OF YOU!!
Well my post was moderated up (the root of this thread) and I do not side with breaking laws.
I think this bias is in your mind. People are smart and can usually detect an insightful comment even if it is opposing their personal views. Give people the benefit of the doubt and you find that people are smarting than you might think. At least it will resolve your stress.
You people only want to use Napster to listen to music by artists who want their music on Napster, right?
This way, they can prevent people from sharing music from artists who want nothing to do with Napster.
This way you are happy, the RIAA is happy, Metallica is happy, Everyone's happy.
BTW: Anyone who calls a non-Metallica song, Metallica is an idiot. It is just a rouse to subvert the system. Just like: the next time you go to download sourcecode to some program, you get to decide between Metallica1.c Metallica2.c, etc. That is just dumb and defeats the purpose of filenames!
Unles you don't care what Metallica or any other artist wants; only that you want to listen to their music for free. *gasp* Could it be?
<li>If, in a GNOME article, someone mentions KDE, mark it off-topic. The same goes if the reverse happens.</li>
<li>If, in a GNOME article, someone mentions Microsoft, mark it troll. The same goes for KDE articles.</li>
<li>If, in any article, someone mentions that the Slashdot have a bias towards GNOME, then mark it off-topic. These messages should go to the Slashdot team and not to public in general.</li>
</ol>
Just trying to disern the signal from the noise.
"Why is /. so Gnome enthused?"
Why are you asking us?
"I mean dont get me wrong I like gnome alot but KDE has alot more going for it in terms of applications and install base so what gives?"
I would say they are about equal. But I would wait for *real* statistics before I come to any conclusions so what gives?
"I mean I know the whole QPL shit was a problem for most of the Zealots but gnome is still really damn buggy and a fresking resource Hog, Hell compare to kde 1.9 I just dont see why slash has the bias it has"
That was a run on sentence. The QPL *was* a problem, not anymore. Gnome *was* buggy, not anymore. Why do you have such a bias?
And the people at slashdot, Rob, Hemos, etc. can you please add an entry to the FAQ of something like "Why does slashdot like GNOME better, whaa whaa?" so that the KDE advocates will stop reminding us about this problem? Pleaaaase?
"It seems to me that GNOME is just another step in the total GUIness of linux. Sure it's nice, it can do alot of stuff for you, but it's a huge resource hog, and all in all, it seems to me to be reminiscent of some of the bloat that i switched to linux to get away from."
Okay. I have to ask if A: you read the article; or B: have tried the new release of GNOME? If you haven't then I would suggest you look before you rant.
According to the article, the resources required by GNOME have gone *down*.
But if your rant was about GUIs in general then, yeah that's your opinion. Quite frankly, the GUI is the modern interface and is more sophisticated than the command-line.
And how is this about Microsoft? It has *nothing* to do with Microsoft!! Look, you are using GNU/Linux, browsing the web with Netscape or Lynx, typing your documents with Emacs or Vi, and TeX, and doing mail with Mutt or Netscape Mail. Microsoft doesn't affect you anymore! They are our past. They are gone! Why must you dwell!
(Okay, I'll calm down now.)
Without the internet, how would they know what these things are in the first place?
(whats with this "more informed user" crap?)
Mozilla could begin a bad trend. Where we have configure all our apps for consistancy.
"Yeah and an even more informed Mac user would actually spend some time making the native UI for Mozilla, instead of sniveling about how it's not supported. Unfortunately, Mac users just want things done for them, and have no initiative to better an application for their own fucking operating system."
Haven't you been paying attention? Computers aren't toys. They are *for* lazy people. Real men write letters by hand and calculate spreadsheets with abacuses. Lazy people use their computer for these things.
If Mac people want things done for them, heck I, a Gnu/Linux user, want things done for me. Like a cron daemon to run scripts and for my logs to be rotated. I also want my apps to be consistant without me getting off my butt to do it. I don't want to write XML by hand to code such a thing. And then have it be slightly but noticable off.
I like GNOME. Because it changes themes of *all* gtk apps. When I install Mozilla, it will change themes of all gtk apps *but* Mozilla. That isn't so bad in the GNU/Linux world, because we are used to that. But on the Maacintosh, they already have consistancy. Why would they want to give that up for some dissident they don't need? I certainly won't.
Perhaps someone on the Mac platform will embed the rendering component into a native Mac app like they will being doing with GNOME and (I think) KDE. That is the optimal solution IMHO.
So yeah, I *am* lazy. That's one of the reason I use GNU/Linux. So I can have my tasks done for me.