This is something I confess to not really understanding. The IBM java SDK is as good as the Sun one (probably the only other full fast implementation) why don't they release this as open source. I'd always presumed they couldn't open source is due to Java trademark rules but then if harmony is allowed to do it that can't be the reason.
Or does the IBM Java SDK contain code they don't own and they can't be bothered to rewrite it?
I suppose one of the things that bugs me is that microsoft killed java on the desktop then cloned it with dot-net, failed to innovate at all and now SUN is their best friend.
IBM on the other hand has done massive amounts to promote the java platform and their only crime is that they created a more popular ide platform/appserver and hence make more money out of java. But sun dislikes them and I feel holds back the whole java platform on linux just to thwart IBM's growth, they could work with IBM to grow the enterprise java market and thwart the proprietary dotnet take u. Particularly with IBM moving out of hardware.
I can only really see the Sun-Microsoft relationship as desperation setting in.
Re:Is it just me, or couldn't posts about Dev thin
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Eclipse 3.1 Released
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· Score: 1
IBM is making a lot of money from Global Services that relies on giving away (open sourcing) a lot of code. Personally i don't have a problem with IBM making money from this. I also thought that SUN should open source java in a GPL compatible way before it hit the headlines.
I don't believe that Java would fall apart if they released a GPL compatible version and let Jakarta Apache style projects develop instead of the current comitee-heavy/code-light JCP process. Compare the quality and ease of use of Apache Jakarta projects with the heavy handed and poor-performance riddled j2EE-EJB framework.
In fact I think Sun could make MORE money from java if they opened it up, particularly in the longer term.
Looking at the software stack, the idea is to make money at the top of the stack and give away the base for free. Sun chose to open up solaris more than java. But the OS is already a commodity item it's too late to get people hooked into using you "OS platform" it's not long before even banks start refering to legacy solaris. It wasn't too late to get people hooked into using the "java platform" which is quite high up the software stack.
Java is a break even business model for Sun because Sun isn't taking advantage of java in the way that IBM is. And eclipse versus netbean is just one of the key areas that sun is struggling due to it's lack of open-ness and IMO poor design decisions. I was half expecting SUN to write a 3rd crossplatform GUI toolkit after swing.
Re:Is it just me, or couldn't posts about Dev thin
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Eclipse 3.1 Released
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· Score: 1
I really meant java desktop development was stifled. After microsoft killed their java implementation Sun could have atleast made it viable on the linux platform and relaxed the requirements to distribute a 15 meg platform with your clientside app on windows.
"I use NetBeans by choice and I know a lot of others that do as well." Fair enough. I have great difficulty persuading my colleagues to even use FREE tools/apps written in swing. I don't find swing apps are generally very responsive or nice to use. But who knows, once i used Emacs and now I use VI.
"These people seem to think they are backing netbeans." True, though the last SUN employee i talked to was using eclipse and said he'd run netbeans when it stopped crashing. That hasn't encouraged me to try it again.
"Easy, if IBM developed Java, they would have kept it to themselves..."
True.
"I'm sure the IBM PR department are very happy to know they're doing a good job."
Yes, although people on IBM payroll are contributing a lot these days to open source and real code sometimes too, not just endless over complicated specifications written by comitees.
"Right, cause RedHat and SuSE don't include java in their distros and IBM doesn't sell any products that bundle Java?"
This is distro tack on stuff. Unless java was opened up it will never be used for key projects like gnome and mainstream apps - for one thing debian will never bundle it. Most of the redhat suse stuff is tack on enterprise server stuff, not related to the desktop platform.
"I'm sure the CEO of a multi billion dollar corporation has just been holding back until some random guy on slashdot...."
No of course not, i was just ranting. Mind you, he has a lot more to lose in stock options than me.
Re:Is it just me, or couldn't posts about Dev thin
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Eclipse 3.1 Released
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· Score: 1, Flamebait
I agree it does sound like a load of marketing gibberish. I have a better description:
Popular like java itself - but open and not stifled by SUN licensing. Cross platform GUI - but not crap like SUNs AWT or slow like Swing. Powerful development tools similar to Netbeans - only unlike SUNs netbeans people use it that aren't forced to by their employers. Similar to Netbeans only - only unlikes SUNs netbeans has major industry backing and is becoming the java development platform standard.
I sometimes wonder what life would be like if IBM/OTI had developed java, maybe they wouldn't have crippled java's linux possibilities in the way sun has.
By now we could have had a major modern linux development language and environment and linux could be ahead of windows in terms of migrating to a more modern platform/language.
Instead the entire java platform needs to be rewritten from scratch under a license that doesn't cripple it's chances of getting mass adoption on what is probably destined to be Windows major competition on the desktop.
Let me finish by saying "WAKE UP SCOTT MCNEALY SOLARIS IS DIEING - Be a lead player in Java adoption on the desktop by releasing java under a GPL compatible license. You're strategy of keeping java under a non-linux friendly license is helping IBM/Redhat and the longer you leave it the less likely java will ever become a major desktop platform"
Taking code from a GPL'ed library, though, for example, and integrating that into your $10K+ enterprise application, will most likely not be noticed, even though it is just as illegal.
Thats not actually true it's perfectly legal to interate GPL'd code into your enterprise application without GPL'ing the whole app. The GPL only applies to redistribution and I would guess most enterprise application development is web based these days and is therefore never distributed.
Matthew writes "An increasing numbers of computer users now understand that cookies are being used to spy on their surfing habbits and profile them without their knowledge. Consumer groups and knowledgeable web users feel that the changing use of cookies by Marketers to spy on users and profile their web browsing habbits is harming the usability of the web the trust on which it is based. These consumers want to persuade companies making antispyware programs to destroy all cookies used by marketers to profile users and not to sell out to marketers or spyware companies. Some consumers think that providing marketers with more information about users opinions on 3rd party cookie profiling and spying might change their attitudes towards cookies. Others are already busy experimenting with torture methods suitable for convincing those marketeers that didn't see reason."
I see broadcom ethernet adapters in a machine and i normally just fit a proper ethernet card - Just to make sure it doesn't drop the interface during high traffic peaks or cause intermittent kernel panics.
I associate "broadcom" with "dodgy" in my mind. Redhat, Suse, Solaris - i've seen them all fail sending high traffic rates over a broadcom adaptor and forums are usually full of details about how they don't release specs and that the drivers are expected to work around numerous undocumented hardware bugs.
It replaced them both yes. But they cleared did not merge the code bases in any meaningful sense. 2k was based on the NT code base.
NT was a proper OS developed by x-VMS developers that were hired by microsoft to make a modern non crappy version of windows that could be compatible with OS2 and then when it became clear OS2 was dead, win32 became the primary API. 2K was just NT with a few fixes and improvements (like plug and play) the core of the OS and all the basic VMS like design of the kernel is the same as NT.
Other than lack of plug and play in NT the other issue was that being a modern OS (unlike 9x) it didn't allow direct hardware access. this caused quite a few 9x programs not to run. By the time 2k was released most of these apps had been fixed so it was possible to ditch the crappy 9x line (which they didn't do for some bizzare reason, instead they released win ME)
So the two lines are like this:
(VMS ->) NT -> 2K -> XP DOS -> 3.1 -> 95 -> 98 -> ME
I believe only stuff sitting above the win32 API were really shared beween 9x and NT not the underlying OS.
Some of this (like the VMS stuff) comes from history OS lessons - though it is well documented on the web.
Because i have XP at work and the swap usage is buggy. it's swaps out running apps in favour of disk caching if you work with many a few thousands files it can become very slow even with a gig ram and yes i've tried all the registry tweaks.
Sure I can reconfigure all the GUI options or i can just install 2k and get it configured sensibly out of the box and get the added performance bonus.
Most normal users never upgrades their OS and a lot of geeks prefer 2k to XP.
I suppose they have to release something new in Longhorn, they could make the window borders even bigger and more ugly and cripple the performance a bit more but with all the things they've dropped from longhorn they need some killer feature like copying firefox tabs to justify forcing another pointless upgrade on the corporate world.
You can't ask the phone book for class A drugs and get a valid number you can ask a torrent search site for a particular copyrighted film and get the right torrent.
Therefore the phone book is not helping you engage in an illegal activity but the torrent site might be.
Heh. By aspect I suppose I meant end-to-end business not a particular "department". Obviously you don't sack people if profit making business processes rely on them...
Slashdot Mirror
it is WAY better than Google's start page too - you can actually drag the various sections
Err, you can do that on googles page too. Just click "personalise"
I think by and large they are talking about financial systems not back office stuff like domain controllers.
Thanks, I didn't realise that IBM were redistributing SUNs libs. That would certainly explain the mysterious licensing restrictions!
because in the end Sun makes the JVM
This is something I confess to not really understanding. The IBM java SDK is as good as the Sun one (probably the only other full fast implementation) why don't they release this as open source. I'd always presumed they couldn't open source is due to Java trademark rules but then if harmony is allowed to do it that can't be the reason.
Or does the IBM Java SDK contain code they don't own and they can't be bothered to rewrite it?
Could be related to to the sudden increase in popularity. Lot's of people mean lot's of change requests means some breakages- atleast initially.
Probably they had to rewrite half of gecko just to get the slashdotters off their back about the page layout bug.
"Buy this monitor and you will be able to view any content, buy our competitors non-MS compliant monitor and some stuff won't play. Your choice."
See, that wasn't hard.
By-the-by there was an article on the register today about the IBM-Sun relationship.
/appserver and hence make more money out of java. But sun dislikes them and I feel holds back the whole java platform on linux just to thwart IBM's growth, they could work with IBM to grow the enterprise java market and thwart the proprietary dotnet take u. Particularly with IBM moving out of hardware.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/06/30/ibm_java/
I suppose one of the things that bugs me is that microsoft killed java on the desktop then cloned it with dot-net, failed to innovate at all and now SUN is their best friend.
IBM on the other hand has done massive amounts to promote the java platform and their only crime is that they created a more popular ide platform
I can only really see the Sun-Microsoft relationship as desperation setting in.
IBM is making a lot of money from Global Services that relies on giving away (open sourcing) a lot of code. Personally i don't have a problem with IBM making money from this. I also thought that SUN should open source java in a GPL compatible way before it hit the headlines.
I don't believe that Java would fall apart if they released a GPL compatible version and let Jakarta Apache style projects develop instead of the current comitee-heavy/code-light JCP process. Compare the quality and ease of use of Apache Jakarta projects with the heavy handed and poor-performance riddled j2EE-EJB framework.
In fact I think Sun could make MORE money from java if they opened it up, particularly in the longer term.
Looking at the software stack, the idea is to make money at the top of the stack and give away the base for free. Sun chose to open up solaris more than java. But the OS is already a commodity item it's too late to get people hooked into using you "OS platform" it's not long before even banks start refering to legacy solaris. It wasn't too late to get people hooked into using the "java platform" which is quite high up the software stack.
Java is a break even business model for Sun because Sun isn't taking advantage of java in the way that IBM is. And eclipse versus netbean is just one of the key areas that sun is struggling due to it's lack of open-ness and IMO poor design decisions. I was half expecting SUN to write a 3rd crossplatform GUI toolkit after swing.
I really meant java desktop development was stifled. After microsoft killed their java implementation Sun could have atleast made it viable on the linux platform and relaxed the requirements to distribute a 15 meg platform with your clientside app on windows.
"I use NetBeans by choice and I know a lot of others that do as well."
Fair enough. I have great difficulty persuading my colleagues to even use FREE tools/apps written in swing. I don't find swing apps are generally very responsive or nice to use. But who knows, once i used Emacs and now I use VI.
"These people seem to think they are backing netbeans."
True, though the last SUN employee i talked to was using eclipse and said he'd run netbeans when it stopped crashing. That hasn't encouraged me to try it again.
"Easy, if IBM developed Java, they would have kept it to themselves..."
True.
"I'm sure the IBM PR department are very happy to know they're doing a good job."
Yes, although people on IBM payroll are contributing a lot these days to open source and real code sometimes too, not just endless over complicated specifications written by comitees.
"Right, cause RedHat and SuSE don't include java in their distros and IBM doesn't sell any products that bundle Java?"
This is distro tack on stuff. Unless java was opened up it will never be used for key projects like gnome and mainstream apps - for one thing debian will never bundle it. Most of the redhat suse stuff is tack on enterprise server stuff, not related to the desktop platform.
"I'm sure the CEO of a multi billion dollar corporation has just been holding back until some random guy on slashdot...."
No of course not, i was just ranting. Mind you, he has a lot more to lose in stock options than me.
I agree it does sound like a load of marketing gibberish. I have a better description:
Popular like java itself - but open and not stifled by SUN licensing.
Cross platform GUI - but not crap like SUNs AWT or slow like Swing.
Powerful development tools similar to Netbeans - only unlike SUNs netbeans people use it that aren't forced to by their employers.
Similar to Netbeans only - only unlikes SUNs netbeans has major industry backing and is becoming the java development platform standard.
I sometimes wonder what life would be like if IBM/OTI had developed java, maybe they wouldn't have crippled java's linux possibilities in the way sun has.
By now we could have had a major modern linux development language and environment and linux could be ahead of windows in terms of migrating to a more modern platform/language.
Instead the entire java platform needs to be rewritten from scratch under a license that doesn't cripple it's chances of getting mass adoption on what is probably destined to be Windows major competition on the desktop.
Let me finish by saying "WAKE UP SCOTT MCNEALY SOLARIS IS DIEING - Be a lead player in Java adoption on the desktop by releasing java under a GPL compatible license. You're strategy of keeping java under a non-linux friendly license is helping IBM/Redhat and the longer you leave it the less likely java will ever become a major desktop platform"
Surely with decent caching the expensive thing is going to be the bandwidth. certainly over the course of a few years
..and lost.
I'm sure behind closed doors they admit it even in brussels.
Taking code from a GPL'ed library, though, for example, and integrating that into your $10K+ enterprise application, will most likely not be noticed, even though it is just as illegal.
Thats not actually true it's perfectly legal to interate GPL'd code into your enterprise application without GPL'ing the whole app. The GPL only applies to redistribution and I would guess most enterprise application development is web based these days and is therefore never distributed.
Matthew writes "An increasing numbers of computer users now understand that cookies are being used to spy on their surfing habbits and profile them without their knowledge. Consumer groups and knowledgeable web users feel that the changing use of cookies by Marketers to spy on users and profile their web browsing habbits is harming the usability of the web the trust on which it is based. These consumers want to persuade companies making antispyware programs to destroy all cookies used by marketers to profile users and not to sell out to marketers or spyware companies. Some consumers think that providing marketers with more information about users opinions on 3rd party cookie profiling and spying might change their attitudes towards cookies. Others are already busy experimenting with torture methods suitable for convincing those marketeers that didn't see reason."
I see broadcom ethernet adapters in a machine and i normally just fit a proper ethernet card - Just to make sure it doesn't drop the interface during high traffic peaks or cause intermittent kernel panics.
I associate "broadcom" with "dodgy" in my mind. Redhat, Suse, Solaris - i've seen them all fail sending high traffic rates over a broadcom adaptor and forums are usually full of details about how they don't release specs and that the drivers are expected to work around numerous undocumented hardware bugs.
crapola.
Is he including the time taken to boot windows? :)
It replaced them both yes.
But they cleared did not merge the code bases in any meaningful sense. 2k was based on the NT code base.
NT was a proper OS developed by x-VMS developers that were hired by microsoft to make a modern non crappy version of windows that could be compatible with OS2 and then when it became clear OS2 was dead, win32 became the primary API. 2K was just NT with a few fixes and improvements (like plug and play) the core of the OS and all the basic VMS like design of the kernel is the same as NT.
Other than lack of plug and play in NT the other issue was that being a modern OS (unlike 9x) it didn't allow direct hardware access. this caused quite a few 9x programs not to run. By the time 2k was released most of these apps had been fixed so it was possible to ditch the crappy 9x line (which they didn't do for some bizzare reason, instead they released win ME)
So the two lines are like this:
(VMS ->) NT -> 2K -> XP
DOS -> 3.1 -> 95 -> 98 -> ME
I believe only stuff sitting above the win32 API were really shared beween 9x and NT not the underlying OS.
Some of this (like the VMS stuff) comes from history OS lessons - though it is well documented on the web.
Don't blame them that the important features in XPSP2 were badly implemented.
Why does the firewall take up so much ram anyway? Is it because they used an IE controll to render the GUI - I really am interested.
should obviously be "requires >1GB ram"
Because i have XP at work and the swap usage is buggy. it's swaps out running apps in favour of disk caching if you work with many a few thousands files it can become very slow even with a gig ram and yes i've tried all the registry tweaks.
Sure I can reconfigure all the GUI options or i can just install 2k and get it configured sensibly out of the box and get the added performance bonus.
Most normal users never upgrades their OS and a lot of geeks prefer 2k to XP.
I suppose they have to release something new in Longhorn, they could make the window borders even bigger and more ugly and cripple the performance a bit more but with all the things they've dropped from longhorn they need some killer feature like copying firefox tabs to justify forcing another pointless upgrade on the corporate world.
These are good points but if it comes down legally to plausibile deniability i think the torrent sites will have less luck than the phone book.
It's so sad. I saw those hidden chars and tried a few url variations before realising that in fact I wasn't sandra bullock.
Metaphor Error.
You can't ask the phone book for class A drugs and get a valid number you can ask a torrent search site for a particular copyrighted film and get the right torrent.
Therefore the phone book is not helping you engage in an illegal activity but the torrent site might be.
Heh. By aspect I suppose I meant end-to-end business not a particular "department". Obviously you don't sack people if profit making business processes rely on them...