The way you'd like to have it distributed won't work at all
yes, after 2 months and more lawsuits to stop it than I care to count, it's obvious this method is doomed to failure. I mean, why even try, after all The current model SUCKS at that; the artists get cheated and gypped.
You're missing a point somewhere, I made it a while back in a different thread. There is value in having attention paid to you. When that value is gained without any effort (on the part of the music artist in this case) then the excess value created through freely sharing digital music is left to be recouped by the artist. THIS is the right we need to protect, the ability to capitalize on the value. NOT the ability to control an infinite product.
However, illegally copying/stealing music is not the way to do it. That will simply encourage the government to pass stricter laws to stop you.
Exactly, and when our laws require that 25% of the 18-25 year-olds in this country go to jail for copyright infringement, it will be obvious to everyone (and not just the gifted souls who can pick points out an idiot's rantings) that our current IP laws are a pile of shit.
MP3.com is not bad. I prefer streaming music, since I have my own pipe and limited disk space. Try here and here for starters. --
That's funny, I could have sworn I went to college and studied how media companies worked. Wow, I guess I really did waste that 100k. Chomp, chomp, troll-daddy.
But nobody agreed to pay you before you posted, dumbass.
Which is like, what, um, how about, anybody who does anything creative, maybe? But I thought artists had a *right* to profit? No, wait, I meant those companies that buy out artists...
Yes, I did, I just said so. Does that matter? No. Is that my point? Yes.
No one will pay you to explain why you're too incompetent to understand capitalism, but bands can make millions of off their music.
No one's paying you either, so give me the freebies, eh? And then I'll explain to you how capitalism destroyed the free press and, unchecked, how it will destroy free speech. Capitalsim works great, given normal patterns of supply and demand. Take those away, and enforce price support with the pointy end of a gun, and that's not the kind of capitalism I want around.
Basic copyright laws? Are you aware how our economic system works wrt IP?
I think they need to be rewritten to some degree. They are not all bad, just like patents aren't all bad, but as I hope that links demonstrates, they are being taken too far. The rules as they are written today are NOT promoting the arts and sciences as well as they might. Too much selfishness has created an imbalance of rights. It's time to take the power back.
When you download songs off of Napster, the artist gets no money. No matter how much you pay for diskspace, bandwith, etc. When you buy a CD or legal mp3s, the artist gets money. How hard is that to understand?
It's not money, per se, but value. How much did it cost 20, 10, hell, even 2 years ago to give 100,000,000 million people access to your music? How much can it cost today? We need to protect the right to capitalize on that value, but to equate it anacronistically directly to money is flawed. That's why we need to rewrite the crufty copyright laws that we are now subject to.
I think they are justified in wanting some compensation for their work, considering it's people's method of earning a living.
Well dangit, I want some compensation for my work of posting to/. This is my method of earning a living. I'm justified, it's copyrighted, where's my damn check!
Some laws need to broken. Some need to be smashed so hard their teeth rattle. And please spare me the little kiddy not wantin' to pay for CDs spiel, I've heard it, it doesn't apply here. Please explain to me how having 600,000 songs at my fingertips is wrong when I'm paying for bandwidth, diskspace, and promotion. (equivelent to reproduction, distrubution, and promotion in the old world)
let's not paint to bright a picture of copyright violations, eh emmett?
I don't want the information about my last Doctor visit to be free. I don't want the information about where I live or my favoutite porno movie to be free for every John Q. Nobody to claim rights to and play with until his hearts content.
Of course not, but it wants to be, so you have to fight against it. The problem we have here (if you consider Napster a problem) is that it's not only the information that wants to be free, but an overwhelming number of people who also want it to be free. So while it might be easy for a bank to fight against the natural inclination of information to propogate, after all only an few try to steal money digitally (and it's easier with a gun anyway), it becomes quite a bit more difficult for the RIAA. Especially with information that already is everywhere (CDs), but now it can get everywhere else (Internet).
So it does want to be free. It just is, and just being is quite a good way to be free, if you can follow a sentence with three tenses of the same verb describing a word with multiple correct translations.
However, simply because the RIAA in very general terms supports copyright, does not mean copyright is bad. I'm sure the Nazi party had/has a few ideas I'd very generally support too, despite their overall evil.
I'll point out that it is my opinion most humans are fools. Humans are not inheriently evil, they are inheriently selfish.
Here we disagree. Not only are most people not fools, but there's a good bet that half of them are smarter than you, in one way or another. Are five year-olds inherently selfish, or is it perhaps a learned behaviour? Two-year olds? Who needs to be selfish when you never want for food? Does that make evolutionary sense? Or is it economoic logic?
Grown up already (Frieza type flame coming on...
on
Gnutella v.56 Out?
·
· Score: 2
Hey, I put (flame in the tag).
And what exactly was your argument again, oh yeah..
Frankly, I don't necessarily see why there should be any defined expiration of the copyright.
and you we're saying? -- o.k. flames aside (for now).
I am defending the public perception of the people who code gnutella. If you are one of them, why are you doing this? I'm not, probably won't be. I did buy a CVS book this weekend, so we'll see. These people are doing this because they want too. The only things they need from you are praise, hopes, and bug reports. And cash when they sell it. This shit you can shove back up your ass.
Your original flames against the people building the program..
"GnutellaNet sure seems to be collapsing under it's own weight" (takes notice) "It's been over a week since I've had anything successfully download." (then move on, slowpoke) "I have been running it, but am quickly starting to realize that there isn't much point to it, anymore" (so go away) "once people leech the stuff" (what?!) "thus reducing the potential load on my machine" (would that be the load of all the developement tools?) "I know that the pages about the program, claim that it's a tool for filesharing. But be realistic. " (yes, maybe we should) "There are a million easier ways to share files, that are far more reliable. " (And you're not using them..because..? {emphasis mine}) "I'll email it to him. " (good, you do that. (power building {he's at 150K, Cap'n!)) "Or I'll toss it onto something like FilesAnywhere. " (so you won't even link for me, eh?) "The only reason that I can think of, that people love stuff like this, is it's so much more anonymous than even an FTP site." (true, perhaps SSN's would be better as logins, twit (wonders if it's worth it {250K, I'm gettin' out of here, Cap'n}) "On Gnutella, et al, nobody has to identify themselves at all." (some would call it freedom) "Just as a minor point, some cable systems use DHCP, and apparently PacBell DSL is starting to use it as well." (so minor as to be matched only by your usefulness)
and then the kickers.
"------ Count me grateful to MS. If they make it too easy to use, I'll have to get a real job."
(insult everyone who thinks for a living, a weak joke perhaps,...chuckle...)
It's a tool, and so are you. So when I said you were an "idiot", I wasn't joking. Idiots abound in this thing we call the Net. It is my duty to help point out to other would-be idiots, what one looks like, and how, precisely, they should be treated.
Did I say *idiot*, I meant complete fuckin' idiot, the kind of idiot that drools about lickin' grandma. The kind of shit-slurping dumbass that defends known felons. Didn't realize that, about your precious NT. Not only are they sick fuckin' thievin' bastards up there in Redmond, they're convicted criminals. And they still advertise on fuckin'TV DURING THE BIGGEST FUCKING COLLEGE BASKETBALL GAME OF THE YEAR!. So contortitionists like you can suck themselves off to that oh'so' grooovy beat. Fuck you and the bits you rode in on. Unicorn, your a thorn in my fine crusty ass, the only mythical thing about you is your intelligence and grasp of reality, find another virgin and maybe you can join the rest of us. The ones who don't take it up the ass all day and like it, begging for more, harder, bigger. How did you get around mommy's protection lock anyway? Aren't the Teletubbies on! Ohh, Inky-dinky-winky, he's my faavorite!.
Q:Smarter, better, nicer A:All words I'd rather give to pile of whale dung that just raped my sister, shot my dog in the head, and got its MCSE, than to you.
Now, if you weren't such an idiot, you would realize...(continued)
..and that's all I got to say about that, 'cept for the.sig, which you also don't understand.
(aaaaahhh) --
Re:Everybody take a breather
on
Microsoft Loses
·
· Score: 1
Exactly, that's why people need to learn the difference between free and free. We NEED new words. --
Re:Everybody take a breather
on
Microsoft Loses
·
· Score: 2
So you believe that because the company is so large it should be outlawed?
It's not about being large. It's about being large and stepping on little guys. It's about *abusing* being large, instead of *using* being large (i.e. limiting the market to make your products look better vs. making better cheaper products utilizing economies of scale)
Think about it, whats the chance that Internet would be what it is today if Microsoft had not made the browser free?
No chance, DAMMIT! Oh, you think it's in good shape.. compared with nothing else I guess it is. I can see you haven't surfed without IE for a while. Oh what's that, you switched a while back after *certain* sites didn't work right with Netscape? How free was that browser after all, eh? Compared with what looked possible even 5 years ago...who's to say. I'll bet we'll know M$'s true influence in 5 years without them, but by then you'll have your own customized Mozilla with your shopping bots, news bots, and an OS that doesn't crash and only needs restarting for new kernels (and perhaps not even then;), so maybe that's not fair. But, then again, fair and Microsoft have never been comfortable in each other's presense.
have rarely seen anyone outside of geekdom and academia that had so much obvious bias against Microsoft than Judge Jackson.
Which is to say "I rarely see anyone outside of the people who know better, someone who knows better."
This is a good day for all involved as we can now move this industry forward unfettered by a M$ tax or an 800lb gorilla smashing anyone who moved faster than they did. Like Homer and the Japanese agree, Crisitunity is a wonderful thing.
It came up during the last round of M$'s ass-reaming that there have been put into place special procedures to hop straight to the Supreme Court for anti-trust appeals, thus closing that time loophole rich corps get to use. Don't have a link, too busy celebrating...and working.:-)
M$ lost $70 billion today of its worth today. I think Nelson said it best. Haw-haw!!
Windows users have just as much choice with their computers as you do with yours
I am one, so that does make sense. (Egads!, you mean it's possible to use more than one OS!;)
How about this for throat forcing...I'm about to cascade some machines. I am replacing P-133s with pII-500s (new ones). I'm planning on moving the p133s to Linux, so you think I can call Dell, say "Hey, I've already got NT licences for those boxes I'm getting, can I just transfer MY bought and paid for licenses to the new machines? I'm deleting the old ones? How much does that knock off the price? Oh, and I'd like to do the same for that Office package you've included" Now, do you think it is Dell or Microsoft that prohibits such action? --
Click on Solitaire, and pick your style. I didn't find the editor in under 10 seconds, but I'm sure one is out there.
That "high application barrier to entry" is one formed from both business strategy and marketing, from the looks of your comment, it's the marketing that is more powerful.
>A world dominated by Linux will be no better than a world dominated by Windows.
Exactly! This is a point that many people are missing
Umm, I thought the big problem with Windows was the company behind it forcing its software around everyone's throats. At least that's my big problem. That's no a possibility with Linux, people have choice. So I'll disagree with this point. That being said, the original point "lack of peripheral drivers" is valid, but I would hope with a thin client they would be using their own hardware and using true open source to build the drivers, would probably work. Heck, hackers almost turned the i-opener into something useful.
Slashdot Mirror
The way you'd like to have it distributed won't work at all
yes, after 2 months and more lawsuits to stop it than I care to count, it's obvious this method is doomed to failure. I mean, why even try, after all The current model SUCKS at that; the artists get cheated and gypped.
You're missing a point somewhere, I made it a while back in a different thread. There is value in having attention paid to you. When that value is gained without any effort (on the part of the music artist in this case) then the excess value created through freely sharing digital music is left to be recouped by the artist. THIS is the right we need to protect, the ability to capitalize on the value. NOT the ability to control an infinite product.
--
However, illegally copying/stealing music is not the way to do it. That will simply encourage the government to pass stricter laws to stop you.
Exactly, and when our laws require that 25% of the 18-25 year-olds in this country go to jail for copyright infringement, it will be obvious to everyone (and not just the gifted souls who can pick points out an idiot's rantings) that our current IP laws are a pile of shit.
MP3.com is not bad. I prefer streaming music, since I have my own pipe and limited disk space. Try here and here for starters.
--
That's funny, I could have sworn I went to college and studied how media companies worked. Wow, I guess I really did waste that 100k. Chomp, chomp, troll-daddy.
But nobody agreed to pay you before you posted, dumbass.
Which is like, what, um, how about, anybody who does anything creative, maybe? But I thought artists had a *right* to profit? No, wait, I meant those companies that buy out artists...
--
Your posts are misinformed and full of bullshit. They have no value. Compare this to a beautiful work of music.
You mean like this one.
You did not expect compensation when you posted
Yes, I did, I just said so. Does that matter? No. Is that my point? Yes.
No one will pay you to explain why you're too incompetent to understand capitalism, but bands can make millions of off their music.
No one's paying you either, so give me the freebies, eh? And then I'll explain to you how capitalism destroyed the free press and, unchecked, how it will destroy free speech. Capitalsim works great, given normal patterns of supply and demand. Take those away, and enforce price support with the pointy end of a gun, and that's not the kind of capitalism I want around.
--
Basic copyright laws? Are you aware how our economic system works wrt IP?
I think they need to be rewritten to some degree. They are not all bad, just like patents aren't all bad, but as I hope that links demonstrates, they are being taken too far. The rules as they are written today are NOT promoting the arts and sciences as well as they might. Too much selfishness has created an imbalance of rights. It's time to take the power back.
When you download songs off of Napster, the artist gets no money. No matter how much you pay for diskspace, bandwith, etc. When you buy a CD or legal mp3s, the artist gets money. How hard is that to understand?
It's not money, per se, but value. How much did it cost 20, 10, hell, even 2 years ago to give 100,000,000 million people access to your music? How much can it cost today? We need to protect the right to capitalize on that value, but to equate it anacronistically directly to money is flawed. That's why we need to rewrite the crufty copyright laws that we are now subject to.
--
I think they are justified in wanting some compensation for their work, considering it's people's method of earning a living.
/. This is my method of earning a living. I'm justified, it's copyrighted, where's my damn check!
Well dangit, I want some compensation for my work of posting to
--
People use Napster to break the laws.
Some laws need to broken. Some need to be smashed so hard their teeth rattle. And please spare me the little kiddy not wantin' to pay for CDs spiel, I've heard it, it doesn't apply here. Please explain to me how having 600,000 songs at my fingertips is wrong when I'm paying for bandwidth, diskspace, and promotion. (equivelent to reproduction, distrubution, and promotion in the old world)
let's not paint to bright a picture of copyright violations, eh emmett?
How bright is this?
Keep the music flowing.
--
I don't want the information about my last Doctor visit to be free. I don't want the information about where I live or my favoutite porno movie to be free for every John Q. Nobody to claim rights to and play with until his hearts content.
Of course not, but it wants to be, so you have to fight against it. The problem we have here (if you consider Napster a problem) is that it's not only the information that wants to be free, but an overwhelming number of people who also want it to be free. So while it might be easy for a bank to fight against the natural inclination of information to propogate, after all only an few try to steal money digitally (and it's easier with a gun anyway), it becomes quite a bit more difficult for the RIAA. Especially with information that already is everywhere (CDs), but now it can get everywhere else (Internet).
So it does want to be free. It just is, and just being is quite a good way to be free, if you can follow a sentence with three tenses of the same verb describing a word with multiple correct translations.
--
However, simply because the RIAA in very general terms supports copyright, does not mean copyright is bad. I'm sure the Nazi party had/has a few ideas I'd very generally support too, despite their overall evil.
If you're not familar with it.
Sorry, those are the rules.
--
I'll point out that it is my opinion most humans are fools. Humans are not inheriently evil, they are inheriently selfish.
Here we disagree. Not only are most people not fools, but there's a good bet that half of them are smarter than you, in one way or another. Are five year-olds inherently selfish, or is it perhaps a learned behaviour? Two-year olds? Who needs to be selfish when you never want for food? Does that make evolutionary sense? Or is it economoic logic?
--
tell me how.
--
Hey, I put (flame in the tag).
..
..because..? {emphasis mine})
...chuckle...)
.sig, which you also don't understand.
And what exactly was your argument again, oh yeah
Frankly, I don't necessarily see why there should be any defined expiration of the copyright.
and you we're saying?
--
o.k. flames aside (for now).
I am defending the public perception of the people who code gnutella. If you are one of them, why are you doing this? I'm not, probably won't be. I did buy a CVS book this weekend, so we'll see. These people are doing this because they want too. The only things they need from you are praise, hopes, and bug reports. And cash when they sell it. This shit you can shove back up your ass.
Your original flames against the people building the program..
"GnutellaNet sure seems to be collapsing under it's own weight" (takes notice)
"It's been over a week since I've had anything successfully download." (then move on, slowpoke)
"I have been running it, but am quickly starting to realize that there isn't much point to it, anymore" (so go away)
"once people leech the stuff" (what?!)
"thus reducing the potential load on my machine" (would that be the load of all the developement tools?)
"I know that the pages about the program, claim that it's a tool for filesharing. But be realistic. " (yes, maybe we should)
"There are a million easier ways to share files, that are far more reliable. " (And you're not using them
"I'll email it to him. " (good, you do that. (power building {he's at 150K, Cap'n!))
"Or I'll toss it onto something like FilesAnywhere. " (so you won't even link for me, eh?)
"The only reason that I can think of, that people love stuff like this, is it's so much more anonymous than even an FTP site." (true, perhaps SSN's would be better as logins, twit (wonders if it's worth it {250K, I'm gettin' out of here, Cap'n})
"On Gnutella, et al, nobody has to identify themselves at all." (some would call it freedom)
"Just as a minor point, some cable systems use DHCP, and apparently PacBell DSL is starting to use it as well." (so minor as to be matched only by your usefulness)
and then the kickers.
"------ Count me grateful to MS. If they make it too easy to use, I'll have to get a real job."
(insult everyone who thinks for a living, a weak joke perhaps,
"I work with NT on a daily basis, because that's what the world uses. But it's just a tool."
It's a tool, and so are you. So when I said you were an "idiot", I wasn't joking. Idiots abound in this thing we call the Net. It is my duty to help point out to other would-be idiots, what one looks like, and how, precisely, they should be treated.
Did I say *idiot*, I meant complete fuckin' idiot, the kind of idiot that drools about lickin' grandma. The kind of shit-slurping dumbass that defends known felons. Didn't realize that, about your precious NT. Not only are they sick fuckin' thievin' bastards up there in Redmond, they're convicted criminals. And they still advertise on fuckin'TV DURING THE BIGGEST FUCKING COLLEGE BASKETBALL GAME OF THE YEAR!. So contortitionists like you can suck themselves off to that oh'so' grooovy beat. Fuck you and the bits you rode in on. Unicorn, your a thorn in my fine crusty ass, the only mythical thing about you is your intelligence and grasp of reality, find another virgin and maybe you can join the rest of us. The ones who don't take it up the ass all day and like it, begging for more, harder, bigger. How did you get around mommy's protection lock anyway? Aren't the Teletubbies on! Ohh, Inky-dinky-winky, he's my faavorite!.
Q:Smarter, better, nicer
A:All words I'd rather give to pile of whale dung that just raped my sister, shot my dog in the head, and got its MCSE, than to you.
Now, if you weren't such an idiot, you would realize...(continued)
..and that's all I got to say about that, 'cept for the
(aaaaahhh)
--
Exactly, that's why people need to learn the difference between free and free. We NEED new words.
--
So you believe that because the company is so large it should be outlawed?
It's not about being large. It's about being large and stepping on little guys. It's about *abusing* being large, instead of *using* being large (i.e. limiting the market to make your products look better vs. making better cheaper products utilizing economies of scale)
Think about it, whats the chance that Internet would be what it is today if Microsoft had not made the browser free?
No chance, DAMMIT! Oh, you think it's in good shape.. compared with nothing else I guess it is. I can see you haven't surfed without IE for a while. Oh what's that, you switched a while back after *certain* sites didn't work right with Netscape? How free was that browser after all, eh? Compared with what looked possible even 5 years ago...who's to say. I'll bet we'll know M$'s true influence in 5 years without them, but by then you'll have your own customized Mozilla with your shopping bots, news bots, and an OS that doesn't crash and only needs restarting for new kernels (and perhaps not even then;), so maybe that's not fair. But, then again, fair and Microsoft have never been comfortable in each other's presense.
--
Yep, yur gonna wanna watch out fer dem derr trolls. They ben' all up in my still, and feedin' 'em only makes it wors'n't'wuz.
--
It just seems to me, that programs like Napster, and Gnutella exist solely so people can set up a warez/mp3 site,
Oh, that's right, you're the idiot who said..
Frankly, I don't necessarily see why there should be any defined expiration of the copyright.
But you are getting closer
I suppose it could be used to share documents that a totalitarian regime frowns upon.
You just haven't figured out what those are yet, have you?
--
Information like this is why I come here.
You should try the grits!
--
have rarely seen anyone outside of geekdom and academia that had so much obvious bias against Microsoft than Judge Jackson.
Which is to say "I rarely see anyone outside of the people who know better, someone who knows better."
This is a good day for all involved as we can now move this industry forward unfettered by a M$ tax or an 800lb gorilla smashing anyone who moved faster than they did. Like Homer and the Japanese agree, Crisitunity is a wonderful thing.
--
It came up during the last round of M$'s ass-reaming that there have been put into place special procedures to hop straight to the Supreme Court for anti-trust appeals, thus closing that time loophole rich corps get to use. Don't have a link, too busy celebrating...and working. :-)
M$ lost $70 billion today of its worth today. I think Nelson said it best. Haw-haw!!
--
Yep, I remember the D's debut. The world wasn't ready. Still couldn't quite hold up to Mr. Show, though.
:).
And if you want to see either, visit this guy (no I don't know him, just google
--
Windows users have just as much choice with their computers as you do with yours
;)
I am one, so that does make sense. (Egads!, you mean it's possible to use more than one OS!
How about this for throat forcing...I'm about to cascade some machines. I am replacing P-133s with pII-500s (new ones). I'm planning on moving the p133s to Linux, so you think I can call Dell, say "Hey, I've already got NT licences for those boxes I'm getting, can I just transfer MY bought and paid for licenses to the new machines? I'm deleting the old ones? How much does that knock off the price? Oh, and I'd like to do the same for that Office package you've included" Now, do you think it is Dell or Microsoft that prohibits such action?
--
Microsoft, with a proprietary product and a stranglehold on the IT world, has billions of dollars to push their agenda.
Linux, with its roots based firmly in the concept of freedom, has an army of people who love it to push their agenda.
Not that I'm arguing, just illustrating.
--
You're a good reason why Windows has a monopoly.
You can't run Word and Solitaire in web pages.
Click on Solitaire, and pick your style. I didn't find the editor in under 10 seconds, but I'm sure one is out there.
That "high application barrier to entry" is one formed from both business strategy and marketing, from the looks of your comment, it's the marketing that is more powerful.
--
>A world dominated by Linux will be no better than a world dominated by Windows.
Exactly! This is a point that many people are missing
Umm, I thought the big problem with Windows was the company behind it forcing its software around everyone's throats. At least that's my big problem. That's no a possibility with Linux, people have choice. So I'll disagree with this point. That being said, the original point "lack of peripheral drivers" is valid, but I would hope with a thin client they would be using their own hardware and using true open source to build the drivers, would probably work. Heck, hackers almost turned the i-opener into something useful.
--
go check it out.
I also got this from one of their pages.
--
now everyone knows why I use a computer to eat instead of the stock market. Sony was up $10+ today.
--