The feds have NO interest whatsoever in providing skill training, no matter what their propaganda tells you. At the FCI where I was, inmates typically slept till lunch, signed false pay sheets claiming 40 hours worked. They thought they were getting over, but it's actualy the feds, who can provide "proof" of "gainfully employed inmates."
But it's a scam. The BOP/DOJ has a vested interest in the 75% recidivism rate...it keeps the beds full and the $30,000 a year per inmate flowing nicely. Most inmates sleep till lunch, play basketball or softball in the afternoon, and watch TV and gamble all night.
Look, my unit had nine televisions (big flat screens, full cable, Netflix movies twice a week) and four toilets for 150 guys. Total in the facility? 1,800 inmates in regular population housed in 6 units, with a total of 48 toilets and 108 televisions. What's wrong with this picture?
Skills training my ass. Try getting a job with nothing on your resume but "data entry and basic Office." And that's for the tech/UNICOR jobs! It's like a health club..once they have you, they want you to keep coming back. Again and again. No skills? You're probably going to reoffend.
FPI (UNICOR) is the prison industries. Read: slave labor for government profit. At the facility I was at there was a data processing factory, fixing bad OCR scans by entering Postscript commands.
However, anyone with any computer skills was forbidden from working there, so my job was Captain's Crew...cleaning the sidealks for half hour every day. Nice use of my MCSE, no?
Ok, I run wifi via an Airport Extreme and Optimum Boost (30mbps down, $10 a month extra.)
I have four Airport Expresses with AirTunes and PandoraJam sending either "radio" (AirTunes) or Pandora to each Express, each hooked up to its own stereo/wireless speakers.
I can send different content to each Express, which I don't think a Roku/Grace device can do. So what's the advantage? Serious question, not being rhetorical....
Hoo boy some of the cases I've seen are so egregious they would spin your head. One example:
Limo driver picks up client at JFK. Puts suitcases in the trunk. DEA and FBI surround and stop the limo on the Van Wyck Expressway 3 miles out of the airport. Client hustles out of limo, runs away, never seen again. Suitcases contain 20 kilos methamphetamine, 10 kilos tar heroin.
Limo driver, totally innocent refused 10 year plea bargain, as anyone would. Jury finds him guilty of conspiracy...he gets 35 years in the feds, then will be deported, even though he's had his green card for 15 years.
This is the US justice system. CSI, Law and Order are worse than fiction....they are propaganda.
I agree.. According to Scalia, punishment must be both cruel AND unusual to qualify. So, if we waterboard two guys, it's no longer unusual...therefore ok.
A definition from Law.com:
"cruel and unusual punishment n. governmental penalties against convicted criminal defendants which are barbaric, involve torture and/or shock the public morality. They are specifically prohibited under the Eighth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. However, nowhere are they specifically defined. Tortures like the rack (stretching the body inch by inch) or the thumbscrew, dismemberment, breaking bones, maiming, actions involving deep or long-lasting pain are all banned. But solitary confinement, enforced silence, necessary force to prevent injury to fellow prisoners or guards, psychological humiliation and bad food are generally allowed. In short, there is a large gray area, in which "cruel and unusual" is definitely subjective based on individual sensitivities and moral outlook. The U.S. Supreme Court has waffled on the death penalty, declaring that some forms of the penalty were cruel and prohibited under the Furman case (1972), which halted executions for several years, but later relaxed the prohibition. The question remains if the gas chamber, hanging or electrocution are cruel and unusual. For instance, hanging is certainly cruel but was not unusual at the time the Bill of Rights was adopted."
Indeed so, exceeding it would be an Apprendi issue.
But, relevant conduct can be the difference between spending time in a camp or a penitentiary. also, the BOP can slap a "greatest severity offense" Public Safety Factor on you, and that affects your whole life.
Sound fair, for something of which you were found not guilty?
Anyone ever hear of relevant conduct as the feds consider it? Basically it means that your custody can be affected by behavior for which the charges have been dismissed, or even charges for which you were acquitted.
I kid you not. Here's a true scenario:
A man gets caught with five grams of crack. (FIve year mandatory minimum in the feds, until the crack/powder disparity is corrected.) That's five years for about a sugar packet of rock. But when he is arrested,the cop says" hey you look like the guy that hosed down that McDonald's with an AK47, killing 35 schoolkids!"
Of course, you aren't, you go to trial, and after 30 seconds of deliberation, the jury acquits you of the mass murder charge. But you still go away for the crack.
Here's the kicker: when you go to prison, the Bureau of Prisons (BOP) considers the murders "relevant conduct" and sends you to a very nasty pen, puts extreme violence on your record, and puts a Public Safety Factor on you, because of the "relevant conduct"...of which you were acquitted. Due process? Hah!!
What makes you think "truth" has anything to do with the US justice system?
As any decent (cough) criminal attorney will tell you, it's not whether you did it or not, it's what the prosecutor can prove. And, with Grand Juries (now there's a fair concept...no defense..) indicting anything a prosecutor throws at them, prosecutors know that if they can prove falsehood (not hard) then their conviction rate goes up, they get elected to public office and...
Sigh...again, these guys are very good at what they do. Mail me and I'll be more than happy to give you the whole, real story, with court docs if you like. I admitted nothing at any time, did not write the/. review (lasica did...), and truthfully and actually did 52 months (60 less good time) for damaging a single porta potty with a rifle target I had placed next to it. No "school." no road sign. With my work in mind, does this sound logical? Mail me.
Cause the car wash vacuum is way too powerful and they never clean my ashtrays properly. And they skimp on the ArmorAll. And I should pay $150 for that?
Well, the offense must be federal, but yes. Let's say you have an argument with a DEA agent over a parking spot and smack him in the mouth. If he charges you with assaulting a fed agent, and you happen to be carrying a legal pistol, you could have 924(c) added. Technically.
And that is why rapper TI is a stone rat. 12 months for machine guns and silencers? Rat!
You're tougher than you think. Fed prison is nothing like the propaganda on tv...it's really just tedious and boring, and for a geek the worst thing is no computers. You'd survive...I did.
Did I commit the offenses for which I was indicted? No, I did not.
But I plead guilty of one count to avoid a life sentence. Therefore, in the eyes of the law, I am as guilty as if a jury decided I was. My point: plea bargaining on grossly overindicted cases is insanely unfair. Basically, I am now a convicted felon, even though I actually committed no crime.
No...the life sentence would have come from seven counts of 924(c). Machine guns/silencers have a 30 year mandatory for only one count. I had seven counts on my indictment of 924(c).
Felon in possession is 922(g). 924(c) does not require a previous felony conviction.
And even the staff at the FCI had never seen a case like mine. Mail me if you really want to discuss. B)
Very good points. Did I do what I was indicted (and imprisoned) for? Of course not.
Am I guilty? (which is a different question.) of course...I pleaded guilty to the offense. That's why plea bargains are ridiculous. You want to gamble with your life?
But wait...there's more! Did you know your custody and sentence in the Feds can be affected not only by dismissed conduct by by conduct for which you were duly acquitted? Look up "relevant conduct" in the federal statutes and be prepared to be shocked.
Absolutely correct, sorry if I was confusing. State is state, and often give much lighter sentences, and early parole EXCEPT for severe violent felonies, which can bring death.
The fed murder statute 18 USC 1111 is really reserved for federal agents, congressmen and presidents or heinous terrorism, like mcveigh.
Jeez, where to start. Where, exactly did I say I was "tried?" a plea is specifically to avoid trial, n'est ce pas? And no one "pleads guilty at trial" because a trial is a process to determine guilt or non guilt.
So, listen carefully. When a normal person is faced with the likelihood of life when judged by people too stupid to get out of jury duty, or five years as a plea bargain, almost everyone picks the latter, even if not guilty.
As for mens rea, how could I have it if the event never took place?
I used to be as derisive and arrogant about the law till I learned what Fed law really is. I mean neither harm nor disrespect, just suggesting caution and awareness.
You perfectly illustrate why rolling the dice with a jury of "peers" like yourself is insane. Who cares about evidence, due process, Rules of Criminal Procedure or mens rea? "Shit, I can eliminate reasonable doubt with a 20 line/. post!"
And I'm sure you would have refused a plea and gone to trial looking at a life bid.
Look I had never been arrested before either. Tin foil hat? No, a very costly education. I hope you never have to face one.
Know any good federal lawyers? How, exactly do you plan to "shop around" while in a fed lockup? Surely you know there are no computers, right? I hired three that had great reps. They cost six figures and achieved squat. I could have done the whole thing pro se and gotten the same result.
I'm amazed at how arrogant ppl are about this. Unless you've been through it, you have NO idea.
Ok...free clue. All porta potties are involved in interstate commerce. I kid you not. According to my judge in my 2255 collateral attack Gonzalez v Raich (9th circuit med marijuana case) allow the Feds to regulate pretty much any non commercial intrastate activity they choose to regulate. IANAL but I spent the last three years studying fed law and THAT is my point about posting...if they want you, they will have you.
FTR, I was accused of blowing it up with an explosive rifle target. In the deep woods. In a hunting area. With a legal, registered gun. Sound like a five year bid to you?
Slashdot Mirror
Oh, before anyone comments on the math:
Each unit (building) was made up of two sub-units. Four toilets per sub-unit, 8 per unit.
Wanna see the place?
The feds have NO interest whatsoever in providing skill training, no matter what their propaganda tells you. At the FCI where I was, inmates typically slept till lunch, signed false pay sheets claiming 40 hours worked. They thought they were getting over, but it's actualy the feds, who can provide "proof" of "gainfully employed inmates."
But it's a scam. The BOP/DOJ has a vested interest in the 75% recidivism rate...it keeps the beds full and the $30,000 a year per inmate flowing nicely. Most inmates sleep till lunch, play basketball or softball in the afternoon, and watch TV and gamble all night.
Look, my unit had nine televisions (big flat screens, full cable, Netflix movies twice a week) and four toilets for 150 guys. Total in the facility? 1,800 inmates in regular population housed in 6 units, with a total of 48 toilets and 108 televisions. What's wrong with this picture?
Skills training my ass. Try getting a job with nothing on your resume but "data entry and basic Office." And that's for the tech/UNICOR jobs! It's like a health club..once they have you, they want you to keep coming back. Again and again. No skills? You're probably going to reoffend.
Step 3: Profit!
I just came home from a lovely four year stay at a fed prison. Yes, you can eventually make $.25 an hour, but you have to work up to that.
See federal (BOP) pay scales here.
FPI (UNICOR) is the prison industries. Read: slave labor for government profit. At the facility I was at there was a data processing factory, fixing bad OCR scans by entering Postscript commands.
However, anyone with any computer skills was forbidden from working there, so my job was Captain's Crew...cleaning the sidealks for half hour every day. Nice use of my MCSE, no?
What am I missing here?
Ok, I run wifi via an Airport Extreme and Optimum Boost (30mbps down, $10 a month extra.)
I have four Airport Expresses with AirTunes and PandoraJam sending either "radio" (AirTunes) or Pandora to each Express, each hooked up to its own stereo/wireless speakers.
I can send different content to each Express, which I don't think a Roku/Grace device can do. So what's the advantage? Serious question, not being rhetorical....
Hoo boy some of the cases I've seen are so egregious they would spin your head. One example:
Limo driver picks up client at JFK. Puts suitcases in the trunk. DEA and FBI surround and stop the limo on the Van Wyck Expressway 3 miles out of the airport. Client hustles out of limo, runs away, never seen again. Suitcases contain 20 kilos methamphetamine, 10 kilos tar heroin.
Limo driver, totally innocent refused 10 year plea bargain, as anyone would. Jury finds him guilty of conspiracy...he gets 35 years in the feds, then will be deported, even though he's had his green card for 15 years.
This is the US justice system. CSI, Law and Order are worse than fiction....they are propaganda.
I agree.. According to Scalia, punishment must be both cruel AND unusual to qualify. So, if we waterboard two guys, it's no longer unusual...therefore ok.
A definition from Law.com:
"cruel and unusual punishment
n. governmental penalties against convicted criminal defendants which are barbaric, involve torture and/or shock the public morality. They are specifically prohibited under the Eighth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. However, nowhere are they specifically defined. Tortures like the rack (stretching the body inch by inch) or the thumbscrew, dismemberment, breaking bones, maiming, actions involving deep or long-lasting pain are all banned. But solitary confinement, enforced silence, necessary force to prevent injury to fellow prisoners or guards, psychological humiliation and bad food are generally allowed. In short, there is a large gray area, in which "cruel and unusual" is definitely subjective based on individual sensitivities and moral outlook. The U.S. Supreme Court has waffled on the death penalty, declaring that some forms of the penalty were cruel and prohibited under the Furman case (1972), which halted executions for several years, but later relaxed the prohibition. The question remains if the gas chamber, hanging or electrocution are cruel and unusual. For instance, hanging is certainly cruel but was not unusual at the time the Bill of Rights was adopted."
Indeed so, exceeding it would be an Apprendi issue.
But, relevant conduct can be the difference between spending time in a camp or a penitentiary. also, the BOP can slap a "greatest severity offense" Public Safety Factor on you, and that affects your whole life.
Sound fair, for something of which you were found not guilty?
While we're on the subject of the "law..."
Anyone ever hear of relevant conduct as the feds consider it? Basically it means that your custody can be affected by behavior for which the charges have been dismissed, or even charges for which you were acquitted.
I kid you not. Here's a true scenario:
A man gets caught with five grams of crack. (FIve year mandatory minimum in the feds, until the crack/powder disparity is corrected.) That's five years for about a sugar packet of rock. But when he is arrested,the cop says" hey you look like the guy that hosed down that McDonald's with an AK47, killing 35 schoolkids!"
Of course, you aren't, you go to trial, and after 30 seconds of deliberation, the jury acquits you of the mass murder charge. But you still go away for the crack.
Here's the kicker: when you go to prison, the Bureau of Prisons (BOP) considers the murders "relevant conduct" and sends you to a very nasty pen, puts extreme violence on your record, and puts a Public Safety Factor on you, because of the "relevant conduct"...of which you were acquitted. Due process? Hah!!
Don't believe me?
Want the official Government position?
The US justice system is a fucking travesty, and unfortunately, you don't realize that till you're neck deep in it.
Be careful out there.
What makes you think "truth" has anything to do with the US justice system?
As any decent (cough) criminal attorney will tell you, it's not whether you did it or not, it's what the prosecutor can prove. And, with Grand Juries (now there's a fair concept...no defense..) indicting anything a prosecutor throws at them, prosecutors know that if they can prove falsehood (not hard) then their conviction rate goes up, they get elected to public office and...
Step 3: Profit!
Sigh...again, these guys are very good at what they do. Mail me and I'll be more than happy to give you the whole, real story, with court docs if you like. I admitted nothing at any time, did not write the /. review (lasica did...), and truthfully and actually did 52 months (60 less good time) for damaging a single porta potty with a rifle target I had placed next to it. No "school." no road sign. With my work in mind, does this sound logical? Mail me.
Cause the car wash vacuum is way too powerful and they never clean my ashtrays properly. And they skimp on the ArmorAll. And I should pay $150 for that?
B)
No. Every time I smack you in the mouth it will most definitely hurt.
Stop believing tv propaganda. That shit does not happen in the Feds.
Once again, another example of why jury pools are as shallow as trailer park gene pools.
Well, the offense must be federal, but yes. Let's say you have
an argument with a DEA agent over a parking spot and smack him in the mouth. If he charges you with assaulting a fed agent, and you happen to be carrying a legal pistol, you could have 924(c) added. Technically.
And that is why rapper TI is a stone rat. 12 months for machine guns and silencers? Rat!
The law has nothing to do with justice.
You're tougher than you think. Fed prison is nothing like the propaganda on tv...it's really just tedious and boring, and for a geek the worst thing is no computers. You'd survive...I did.
Hmm, sorry I guess I was unclear. My bad.
Did I commit the offenses for which I was indicted? No, I did not.
But I plead guilty of one count to avoid a life sentence. Therefore, in the eyes of the law, I am as guilty as if a jury decided I was. My point: plea bargaining on grossly overindicted cases is insanely unfair. Basically, I am now a convicted felon, even though I actually committed no crime.
Better?
No...the life sentence would have come from seven counts of 924(c). Machine guns/silencers have a 30 year mandatory for only one count. I had seven counts on my indictment of 924(c).
Felon in possession is 922(g). 924(c) does not require a previous felony conviction.
And even the staff at the FCI had never seen a case like mine. Mail me if you really want to discuss. B)
Very good points. Did I do what I was indicted (and imprisoned) for? Of course not.
Am I guilty? (which is a different question.) of course...I pleaded guilty to the offense. That's why plea bargains are ridiculous. You want to gamble with your life?
But wait...there's more! Did you know your custody and sentence in the Feds can be affected not only by dismissed conduct by by conduct for which you were duly acquitted? Look up "relevant conduct" in the federal statutes and be prepared to be shocked.
Hear fucking hear!!
Absolutely correct, sorry if I was confusing. State is state, and often give much lighter sentences, and early parole EXCEPT for severe violent felonies, which can bring death.
The fed murder statute 18 USC 1111 is really reserved for federal agents, congressmen and presidents or heinous terrorism, like mcveigh.
Fed law and court procedures are very different.
Jeez, where to start. Where, exactly did I say I was "tried?" a plea is specifically to avoid trial, n'est ce pas? And no one "pleads guilty at trial" because a trial is a process to determine guilt or non guilt.
So, listen carefully. When a normal person is faced with the likelihood of life when judged by people too stupid to get out of jury duty, or five years as a plea bargain, almost everyone picks the latter, even if not guilty.
As for mens rea, how could I have it if the event never took place?
I used to be as derisive and arrogant about the law till I learned what Fed law really is. I mean neither harm nor disrespect, just suggesting caution and awareness.
Funnily enough, I actually considered that. Had my daughter log in once a month. B)
You perfectly illustrate why rolling the dice with a jury of "peers" like yourself is insane. Who cares about evidence, due process, Rules of Criminal Procedure or mens rea? "Shit, I can eliminate reasonable doubt with a 20 line /. post!"
And I'm sure you would have refused a plea and gone to trial looking at a life bid.
Look I had never been arrested before either. Tin foil hat?
No, a very costly education. I hope you never have to face one.
Oh I did, trust me. Lemme pose this one to you...
Know any good federal lawyers? How, exactly do you plan to "shop around" while in a fed lockup? Surely you know there are no computers, right? I hired three that had great reps. They cost six figures and achieved squat. I could have done the whole thing pro se and gotten the same result.
I'm amazed at how arrogant ppl are about this. Unless you've been through it, you have NO idea.
Oh you are SO right. My lawyerS were useless assholes, and I paid them well. Once again...if the Feds want you, they will have you.
Ok...free clue. All porta potties are involved in interstate commerce. I kid you not. According to my judge in my 2255 collateral attack Gonzalez v Raich (9th circuit med marijuana case) allow the Feds to regulate pretty much any non commercial intrastate activity they choose to regulate. IANAL but I spent the last three years studying fed law and THAT is my point about posting...if they want you, they will have you.
FTR, I was accused of blowing it up with an explosive rifle target. In the deep woods. In a hunting area. With a legal, registered gun. Sound like a five year bid to you?