It's not beta yet? Sounds like a technical definition to me -- Mozilla is most definitely in Beta. They've already release 11 milestones for the public to use, comment, and bug report on. How is that not a beta? Because it's not "beta-quality"? That's pretty obvious.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Exactly -- it doesn't need to do everything at first. But it does need to do something, and to do it well. Once it's established my trust as a useable browser, then we can move forward.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Why is that when someone complains about an Open Source project, people tell them to go do it themselves?
That's a horrible attitude. It's not unreasonable to expect that a company like AOL, with the resources that it has, could put together a browser that works reasonably well. I too have used Mozilla M11, and it just doesn't cut the cheese for me -- the interface is cute, but it crashes quite a bit and the dialogs repaint funny, and the text is too small, and it's a little bit slow, and... it's just not ready for consumption yet
So let's hear the bitching - It's not whining, it's criticism, and I think it's rightfully placed. If Mozilla can't give us a browser before the world ends, then we will go somewhere else, but to tell you the truth, I'm starting to feel strung along.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
That's not what he asked for. Who cares if it compiles -- He wants something that WORKS. Not something that's going to work, or something that will work really really well someday down the road -- something that works and works well and works now.
Yeah, it's a little greedy, but dammit Microsoft has a browser that does all that. IE5 is a freakin' good browser and right now Netscape/Mozilla can't touch it.
I don't want them to do a crappy job on Mozilla, but I want the job done. If they can't deliver on their promises then forget 'em. I'll end up buying Opera or something...
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Is that true? Where is Mozilla being developed? If the source is being held on a domestic (to the US) server, then strong crypto can't be exported in it. How is Mozilla getting around this?
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
It is an open source project, after all. And didn't we just find out that Linux is now the official OS of The People's Republic of China? Maybe they were right about Stallman all along.
PS: This was a joke:)
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
And speaking of interfaces: What gives? I like what they've done on some of them, but does anyone else think that time could be better spent on the innards of the program, rather than the shell around it?
Hey, I'm greatful that it's being worked on at all, but where's the priority?
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Absolutely -- I'm a little tired of hearing OSS advocates telling me that IE can't touch Mozilla, because Mozilla will be awesome real real soon. Well, guess what? Real real soon is too long. I need something to do my browsing with now. Netscape is still working for me (most of the time) but it doesn't have much life left in it.
Under Windows (at work) I use IE5 because it is a really really good browser and, moreover, it is available now at the same price as Mozilla.
Don't get me wrong; I love Open Source. But I won't sacrifice my ability to use my computer productively at the alter of free software. I need something I can work with. I've got a great OS, I just need a browser to go with it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Yes it did, but the original report neglected to mention that, upon calling Sega, it was found that they weren't actually leaving the console industry, but that they were just refocusing their primary objective -- that being software and content delivery using the Internet.
You can't always believe what Slashdot links to.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
It's a shame, because they make good system, but it's also not a loss, because they do make good software as well.
I can't tell you how much time I spent playing Virtua Fighter for the PC. They did a real knockup job on it. Same thing for the Sonic port. I don't know what they've got planned for the Internet, but I can't wait to see it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
This is stupid! We don't even know what the Transmeta chip does for sure! How can anyone say "It will make or break Java" -- Java is doing just fine right now. Every day more developers jump on the Java-wagon, so how could Transmeta's chip break it? Only if *everyone* ran the Transmeta chip, and if said chip could run different architechtures *simultaneously*, which I rather doubt it could.
And why would Sun have to loosed up? They're handling Java pretty well -- What do you want them to do, GPL it??
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
This is truly excellent. Not only does Linux now have an excellent "RAD" tool, but it also has an excellent Java tool. Think we'll be seeing a lot more Java tools geared to the Linux-world? Can Freshmeat handle the stress? Has the whole world gone mad?? Tune in next week...
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Um, not to be a bitch, but in the linus WAV file, he says:
"Hello, this is Leenus Torvalds and I pronounce leenux as leenux."
So we're all wrong I guess. I say it as "LIE-nux" because the Americanization of the name Linus is "LIE-nus" and I live in Massachusetts, so that sounds about right to me.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
ZDNet and Slashdot's post didn't have any errors in it -- they were just confusing. It's not talking about the current version of StarOffice, or the current version of Office2000. It's talking about the web-enabled version of the two. And no, you don't have that yet.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
You're still being stupid - if MS was to release Office as a web-edition it would not be in the current form.
They'd make it into a client-server system using something like ActiveX or Java (or something similar).
It's going to be small - and there's no reason to think you'd have to download the plugin (or however they set it up) more than once. What you're doing is spreading FUD... About Microsoft. You're just as bad as anyone else.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
On top of the reply above this, I'd point out that a lot of new Microsoft programs are incredibly stable -- more so than a lot of OSS programs I know of.
Outlook 2000 is a very streamlined program. Redesigned from the ground up, I can't remember ever having it crash on me.
Visual Studio 6.0 is another great one. This is probably my favorite Windows program (aside from my DVD player). It doesn't crash and, although KDevelop is quite kickass, there really isn't any IDE out there as good as VS6.
So I guess what I'm saying is that Microsoft's applications are actually pretty good. It's their operating systems the bite.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Okay, I hate Hungarian notation too. In all the windows code I write for my job, I use variable and function names that describe purpose, not value types Having said that, while I don't care for Hungarian notation, it does provide programmers who use it with a consistant basis of information about code they've never seen.
It's not about the specific technique used, it's a matter of picking something that everyone understands and sticking to it. Consistancy is very important in large projects.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Proving once again that "The Network is the Bicycle", Sun is releasing it's newest machine, aptly dubbed The eBike
The eBike runs on multiple platforms using Sun's own Java technology. Currently, virtual machines exists for both concrete and pavement, with a port for dirt in the works.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Good point. Coding techniques have a lot to do with how "maintainable" a program is. If everybody is doing it their way, no one is doing it the right way. The right way, in this case, is anything that has some adherence to a standard.
I think it's funny when people call Microsoft's code "sloppy" -- Very few people outside of MS have actually seen MS code. Microsoft, AFAIK, has a system by which their programmers all write code. On top of Hungarian Notation, they use a very specific structure in their design process.
Most open source software, by comparison, doesn't have a design process. At least, not a formal one. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but in the long run it can really be a killer. The Linux kernel itself doesn't suffer from this, because Linus has done a wonderful job of maintaining all the code that goes into it -- a lot of other OSS projects don't fare so well.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Hmm. I don't care either way, but MS was never really decent. Did you watch "Pirates of Silicon Valley" ? It was pretty accurate.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Re:Didnt they use any non Cygnus patches in Cygwin
on
Red Hat Buying Cygnus?
·
· Score: 1
Huh? No it isn't. What they're saying is that if you want your changes to be included into their source tree, you have to sign your copyright over to the FSF (or Cygnus).
You're still perfectly welcome to develop your own code and do whatever the hell you want with it under your own copyright.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
If by "easy development tools" you mean Visual Basic, well you're right, we don't have anything quite that good yet. However, if you mean something more like Visual C++, I suggest you check out KDevelop; it's a very handy, color-coded IDE. The online help could use some work, but otherwise it's wonderful.
Incidentally, making the compiler 10% faster, does not make Linux 10% faster. It just makes linux compile 10% faster. I doubt RedHat buying Cygnus would make a huge difference in the compiler development -- Cygnus is more than capable in what they're doing.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
First of all, Cygnus is the most active developer of everyone's favorite compiler, so don't say that they blew Linux off -- they helped write the damn compiler for it. What did you expect them to do? Release their own distro? They're a compiler company, and they aren't tied to any one platform. I think they're doing a fine job.
Also: Cygwin is freely downloadable, you don't have to pay $99 for it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Slashdot Mirror
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
That's a horrible attitude. It's not unreasonable to expect that a company like AOL, with the resources that it has, could put together a browser that works reasonably well. I too have used Mozilla M11, and it just doesn't cut the cheese for me -- the interface is cute, but it crashes quite a bit and the dialogs repaint funny, and the text is too small, and it's a little bit slow, and... it's just not ready for consumption yet
So let's hear the bitching - It's not whining, it's criticism, and I think it's rightfully placed. If Mozilla can't give us a browser before the world ends, then we will go somewhere else, but to tell you the truth, I'm starting to feel strung along.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Yeah, it's a little greedy, but dammit Microsoft has a browser that does all that. IE5 is a freakin' good browser and right now Netscape/Mozilla can't touch it.
I don't want them to do a crappy job on Mozilla, but I want the job done. If they can't deliver on their promises then forget 'em. I'll end up buying Opera or something...
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
PS: This was a joke :)
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Hey, I'm greatful that it's being worked on at all, but where's the priority?
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Under Windows (at work) I use IE5 because it is a really really good browser and, moreover, it is available now at the same price as Mozilla.
Don't get me wrong; I love Open Source. But I won't sacrifice my ability to use my computer productively at the alter of free software. I need something I can work with. I've got a great OS, I just need a browser to go with it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
You can't always believe what Slashdot links to.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
I can't tell you how much time I spent playing Virtua Fighter for the PC. They did a real knockup job on it. Same thing for the Sonic port. I don't know what they've got planned for the Internet, but I can't wait to see it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
And why would Sun have to loosed up? They're handling Java pretty well -- What do you want them to do, GPL it??
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
"Hello, this is Leenus Torvalds and I pronounce leenux as leenux."
So we're all wrong I guess. I say it as "LIE-nux" because the Americanization of the name Linus is "LIE-nus" and I live in Massachusetts, so that sounds about right to me.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
ZDNet and Slashdot's post didn't have any errors in it -- they were just confusing. It's not talking about the current version of StarOffice, or the current version of Office2000. It's talking about the web-enabled version of the two. And no, you don't have that yet.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
They'd make it into a client-server system using something like ActiveX or Java (or something similar).
It's going to be small - and there's no reason to think you'd have to download the plugin (or however they set it up) more than once. What you're doing is spreading FUD... About Microsoft. You're just as bad as anyone else.
-----------
"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Outlook 2000 is a very streamlined program. Redesigned from the ground up, I can't remember ever having it crash on me.
Visual Studio 6.0 is another great one. This is probably my favorite Windows program (aside from my DVD player). It doesn't crash and, although KDevelop is quite kickass, there really isn't any IDE out there as good as VS6.
So I guess what I'm saying is that Microsoft's applications are actually pretty good. It's their operating systems the bite.
-----------
"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
It's not about the specific technique used, it's a matter of picking something that everyone understands and sticking to it. Consistancy is very important in large projects.
-----------
"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
The eBike runs on multiple platforms using Sun's own Java technology. Currently, virtual machines exists for both concrete and pavement, with a port for dirt in the works.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
I think it's funny when people call Microsoft's code "sloppy" -- Very few people outside of MS have actually seen MS code. Microsoft, AFAIK, has a system by which their programmers all write code. On top of Hungarian Notation, they use a very specific structure in their design process.
Most open source software, by comparison, doesn't have a design process. At least, not a formal one. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but in the long run it can really be a killer. The Linux kernel itself doesn't suffer from this, because Linus has done a wonderful job of maintaining all the code that goes into it -- a lot of other OSS projects don't fare so well.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
You're still perfectly welcome to develop your own code and do whatever the hell you want with it under your own copyright.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Incidentally, making the compiler 10% faster, does not make Linux 10% faster. It just makes linux compile 10% faster. I doubt RedHat buying Cygnus would make a huge difference in the compiler development -- Cygnus is more than capable in what they're doing.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
First of all, Cygnus is the most active developer of everyone's favorite compiler, so don't say that they blew Linux off -- they helped write the damn compiler for it. What did you expect them to do? Release their own distro? They're a compiler company, and they aren't tied to any one platform. I think they're doing a fine job.
Also: Cygwin is freely downloadable, you don't have to pay $99 for it.
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"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."