Eh, Void Linux originally started with systemd but currently uses runit, so there's that option. And I've gotten OpenRC to run on Slackware, so that's another option if push comes to shove.
Well one of the main reasons Volkerding was/is considering systemd is boot time, and udev being phased out in favor of systemd. Slackware's init has been tested so it works, but it's a bit slower than the competition.
"Concerning systemd, I do like the idea of a faster boot time (obviously), but I also like controlling the startup of the system with shell scripts that are readable, and I'm guessing that's what most Slackware users prefer too. I don't spend all day rebooting my machine, and having looked at systemd config files it seems to me a very foreign way of controlling a system to me, and attempting to control services, sockets, devices, mounts, etc., all within one daemon flies in the face of the UNIX concept of doing one thing and doing it well. To the typical end user, if this results in a faster boot then mission accomplished."
Although I think he should really consider runit over systemd, because Void Linux uses it and it boots really fast. It's probably the fastest booting binary distribution. Of course a customized Gentoo install could probably beat it. IMO Void sort of embodies that same ideals that Slackware does (i.e. a simple and effective system that puts the administrator in control rather than the corporation) but it uses modern tools that do that and it's rolling release, while Slackware is more focused stability.
Pretty much. ChromeOS is a better platform for those users.
Unix by design does not give you safety rails. It's quite easy to screw up your system with rm or chmod as root. And that's because it assumes the admin and users are competent enough.
Unix graphics stack is less developed. In fullscreen mode with Unix, you pretty much just can't see the other stuff; it's just under what's full screen, but still there. In fact, ChromeOS uses a different graphics stack, called Freon.
Modern desktop features like default applications are built into the OS in a sane way in Windows and ChromeOS. Unix never supported that, so it's kind of hacked into the OS. That's why we get crap like DBus activation, which will load a notification daemon outside your service manager (unless you use systemd, because dbus talks to systemd) even though the user closed it as to "not confuse users", and guess what? If you have 2 notification daemons, it's a guess as to which one gets started.
If you want to use Linux but don't want to use systemd, you're forced to use a niche distro like Devuan, Gentoo or Slackware. Or you're forced to try to hack it out of your installation, which is error prone and can impact future updates. Of course, neither of these is an option for somebody who wants a usable, reliable Linux installation without systemd.
Just FYI Ubuntu 14.04 is a LTS release and uses upstart, and still has support for ~2 years, so somebody can use that.
That being said, I don't see anything wrong with Gentoo or Slackware, other than time required to compile things? It's not difficult, just time-consuming. Gentoo by nature is designed to give you as much choice as possible. I fail to see how they're unreliable. You know, ChromeOS is based on Gentoo, just saying. Also, personally, I use Void Linux and I'd say it's pretty rock solid. See chair analogy for Linux distros.
The thing about Linux is there are a lot of distributions out there. Just because the most popular distributions do things you don't like, doesn't mean you have to stick with them.
There are plenty of distributions that don't use systemd. See link, but quite a few of them are based on Slackware and Gentoo. I use Void Linux personally.
My main dislike is just the scope creep, lack of choice (you used to be able to choose what login manager, device manager and system logger you wanted), and the mentality of systemd developers where they believe that one solution is just "better" and everyone should go with that route.
Void Linux. It shares the same KISS principle with Slackware, but uses Runit as its service manager and init system, uses a binary package system and it's rolling release.
That being said, what's wrong with Slackware? Sure, Slackware is one of the oldest distributions, but so what? It works and isn't rife with systemd, GNOME, snap stuff, etc. The only thing that bothers me about Slackware is that it takes a long time to resolve dependencies and compile stuff.
That sounds a lot like the "winsxs" folder, which is currently eating up 25% of the total space on my Windows machine, for no good reason. Having the same "feature" on Linux really doesn't thrill me.
Well, I don't quite think the way Windows deals with shared libraries is correct, because it's pretty tough on SSDs. However, as far as I know, snaps install themselves into your home directory, so in the worst case you could just delete the libraries if you're not using the program anymore. Windows is far worse, where there's a good chance you won't be able to boot into windows anymore if you tamper with the winsxs folder (outside of using dism.exe to clean up installation files and whatnot).
I totally agree with you. I think it's really stupid that waiters and pizza delivery drivers are expected to make money of tips as part of their wage, because often they get shafted by customers. Servers can pay less than minimum wage because of tips.
I wasn't suggesting it for ChromeOS usage as I am aware of the EOL policy. I was suggesting installing GalliumOS on it as it's a derivative of Xubuntu and fine-tuned for Chromebooks. But you could install any flavor of Linux on it really. Lubuntu's also a good option.
Yeah, I agree with you. I don't understand why he doesn't just buy a laptop with those specs, as laptops are better productivity devices. It's not clear to me why he specifically needs a tablet with those specs.
Or you could just buy an Intel-based Chromebook, which probably has the majority of its hardware supported OOTB on most Linux distributions, because ChromeOS is running a Linux kernel under the hood. It is possible they're using special drivers, but I find that unlikely, considering the number of people that have gotten Linux to work on Chromebooks. GalliumOS is proof of this.
I don't think that's entirely true. I think it's more that a lot of people prefer a fanless Chromebook and that it's expensive to have the power of a Celeron or i3 in a fanless CPU (think HP Chromebook 13). Surfing the web doesn't require that high of an octane score anyways. Most of the Chromebooks with the Braswelll CPUs you listed have ~8k octane score, which is acceptable, but not super fast.
Yeah, except as the other poster had said, meat and fat don't cause problems, so you'd need to fill him with pancakes. There's nothing wrong with a diet full of bacon, except maybe the salt.
Honestly, sometimes I wish Ancel Keys had never been born. It's really hard to find whole fat yogurt these days because everyone thinks fat-free is better, and they're just lying to themselves when they say it tastes better without the fat, because it doesn't.
Yep. Basically routers have limited memory, so when the queue for an outgoing interface gets full, what happens to packets? They get dropped. And adding more memory doesn't solve the problem because then you just get bigger backlogs. Packets will still get dropped at some point.
Also there's the nature of wireless transmission, which doesn't allow for collision detection. So wireless transmission uses collision avoidance. So when you're sending a packet, that's time when someone else couldn't send a packet. The way my teacher described the basic concept of wireless transmission is "playing with time".
I agree with you. I think some amount of creativity is needed to create an API, but I guess the question is what amount of creativity dictates that a work should be protected under copyright.
But he has a B.S. in Mathematics. I would think he would know what a recursive definition is, or at least proof via induction. I think it just doesn't make sense because there's no base case.
I think it's a failure of the system. Normally you want people who have no bias whatsoever about the case so they can produce an opinion based on the facts, or what the lawyers and witnesses and such say. But this backfires here, because here you have people who have no idea how this stuff works. IIRC there was one guy who actually worked with computers, a network manager, and Oracle didn't like him for some reason, so he was out.
Yeah, we should have added a base case somewhere. I'm pretty sure Alsup is looking at from the stance of Mathematical proof of Induction, and that's why he said "That doesn't make any sense."
Yeah, I was riding my university bus and this one guy said he wasn't voting for anybody because they're all bad. I was like, Bernie's bad? What he had to say about Bernie is that he's a good guy but his policies are impossible to implement. That's not true though. It will cost a lot in taxes, but that doesn't mean impossible to implement. It really annoyed me because by not voting, he's not doing anything. One candidate shows up who's actually trying to change things for the better, and people say oh that's too idealistic that's impossible. Change isn't going to happen if you don't do anything.
Yeah the scope creep is really frightening. It's like they want to put systemd in everything, so you can run systemd while you run systemd. It's why I'm using Void Linux. I just don't agree with their scope creep as a way to try to unify the Linux ecosystem. Even if Ubuntu is using systemd, they have their own snap format and Redhat was a new format if I'm informed correctly. Neither really want to use software controlled by the other, so there's not really going to be any unification. Also, as stated, I don't really like the attitude of the devs. It is a pretty normal use case that you want to look at the logs when a computer crashed. Regardless of whether systemd works or not, for these two reasons, I'm avoiding it.
I'm currently using Void Linux which uses runinit, and it seems to work pretty well. I'm using the LXQt flavor and my system boots in 2 seconds. And I can add or delete services with a simple ln or rm. No scope creep for me!
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Eh, Void Linux originally started with systemd but currently uses runit, so there's that option. And I've gotten OpenRC to run on Slackware, so that's another option if push comes to shove.
Well one of the main reasons Volkerding was/is considering systemd is boot time, and udev being phased out in favor of systemd. Slackware's init has been tested so it works, but it's a bit slower than the competition.
"Concerning systemd, I do like the idea of a faster boot time (obviously), but I also like controlling the startup of the system with shell scripts that are readable, and I'm guessing that's what most Slackware users prefer too. I don't spend all day rebooting my machine, and having looked at systemd config files it seems to me a very foreign way of controlling a system to me, and attempting to control services, sockets, devices, mounts, etc., all within one daemon flies in the face of the UNIX concept of doing one thing and doing it well. To the typical end user, if this results in a faster boot then mission accomplished."
Although I think he should really consider runit over systemd, because Void Linux uses it and it boots really fast. It's probably the fastest booting binary distribution. Of course a customized Gentoo install could probably beat it. IMO Void sort of embodies that same ideals that Slackware does (i.e. a simple and effective system that puts the administrator in control rather than the corporation) but it uses modern tools that do that and it's rolling release, while Slackware is more focused stability.
Pretty much. ChromeOS is a better platform for those users.
Unix by design does not give you safety rails. It's quite easy to screw up your system with rm or chmod as root. And that's because it assumes the admin and users are competent enough.
Unix graphics stack is less developed. In fullscreen mode with Unix, you pretty much just can't see the other stuff; it's just under what's full screen, but still there. In fact, ChromeOS uses a different graphics stack, called Freon.
Modern desktop features like default applications are built into the OS in a sane way in Windows and ChromeOS. Unix never supported that, so it's kind of hacked into the OS. That's why we get crap like DBus activation, which will load a notification daemon outside your service manager (unless you use systemd, because dbus talks to systemd) even though the user closed it as to "not confuse users", and guess what? If you have 2 notification daemons, it's a guess as to which one gets started.
If you want to use Linux but don't want to use systemd, you're forced to use a niche distro like Devuan, Gentoo or Slackware. Or you're forced to try to hack it out of your installation, which is error prone and can impact future updates. Of course, neither of these is an option for somebody who wants a usable, reliable Linux installation without systemd.
Just FYI Ubuntu 14.04 is a LTS release and uses upstart, and still has support for ~2 years, so somebody can use that.
That being said, I don't see anything wrong with Gentoo or Slackware, other than time required to compile things? It's not difficult, just time-consuming. Gentoo by nature is designed to give you as much choice as possible. I fail to see how they're unreliable. You know, ChromeOS is based on Gentoo, just saying. Also, personally, I use Void Linux and I'd say it's pretty rock solid. See chair analogy for Linux distros.
The thing about Linux is there are a lot of distributions out there. Just because the most popular distributions do things you don't like, doesn't mean you have to stick with them.
There are plenty of distributions that don't use systemd. See link, but quite a few of them are based on Slackware and Gentoo. I use Void Linux personally.
My main dislike is just the scope creep, lack of choice (you used to be able to choose what login manager, device manager and system logger you wanted), and the mentality of systemd developers where they believe that one solution is just "better" and everyone should go with that route.
Void Linux. It shares the same KISS principle with Slackware, but uses Runit as its service manager and init system, uses a binary package system and it's rolling release.
That being said, what's wrong with Slackware? Sure, Slackware is one of the oldest distributions, but so what? It works and isn't rife with systemd, GNOME, snap stuff, etc. The only thing that bothers me about Slackware is that it takes a long time to resolve dependencies and compile stuff.
That sounds a lot like the "winsxs" folder, which is currently eating up 25% of the total space on my Windows machine, for no good reason. Having the same "feature" on Linux really doesn't thrill me.
Well, I don't quite think the way Windows deals with shared libraries is correct, because it's pretty tough on SSDs. However, as far as I know, snaps install themselves into your home directory, so in the worst case you could just delete the libraries if you're not using the program anymore. Windows is far worse, where there's a good chance you won't be able to boot into windows anymore if you tamper with the winsxs folder (outside of using dism.exe to clean up installation files and whatnot).
I totally agree with you. I think it's really stupid that waiters and pizza delivery drivers are expected to make money of tips as part of their wage, because often they get shafted by customers. Servers can pay less than minimum wage because of tips.
I wasn't suggesting it for ChromeOS usage as I am aware of the EOL policy. I was suggesting installing GalliumOS on it as it's a derivative of Xubuntu and fine-tuned for Chromebooks. But you could install any flavor of Linux on it really. Lubuntu's also a good option.
Yeah, I agree with you. I don't understand why he doesn't just buy a laptop with those specs, as laptops are better productivity devices. It's not clear to me why he specifically needs a tablet with those specs.
Or you could just buy an Intel-based Chromebook, which probably has the majority of its hardware supported OOTB on most Linux distributions, because ChromeOS is running a Linux kernel under the hood. It is possible they're using special drivers, but I find that unlikely, considering the number of people that have gotten Linux to work on Chromebooks. GalliumOS is proof of this.
I don't think that's entirely true. I think it's more that a lot of people prefer a fanless Chromebook and that it's expensive to have the power of a Celeron or i3 in a fanless CPU (think HP Chromebook 13). Surfing the web doesn't require that high of an octane score anyways. Most of the Chromebooks with the Braswelll CPUs you listed have ~8k octane score, which is acceptable, but not super fast.
Yeah, except as the other poster had said, meat and fat don't cause problems, so you'd need to fill him with pancakes. There's nothing wrong with a diet full of bacon, except maybe the salt.
Honestly, sometimes I wish Ancel Keys had never been born. It's really hard to find whole fat yogurt these days because everyone thinks fat-free is better, and they're just lying to themselves when they say it tastes better without the fat, because it doesn't.
Yep. Basically routers have limited memory, so when the queue for an outgoing interface gets full, what happens to packets? They get dropped. And adding more memory doesn't solve the problem because then you just get bigger backlogs. Packets will still get dropped at some point.
Also there's the nature of wireless transmission, which doesn't allow for collision detection. So wireless transmission uses collision avoidance. So when you're sending a packet, that's time when someone else couldn't send a packet. The way my teacher described the basic concept of wireless transmission is "playing with time".
I think manufacturers are choosing which Chromebooks to support and which ones not to support. I actually don't think it's a technical issue.
Most Broadwell Chromebooks use M.2 SSDs, so you can easily buy a new SSD, open up your Chromebook, and put a 256GB drive in there.
Perhaps it is, but you can install custom firmware, and thus Linux on a lot of Chromebooks.
See list.
I'm typing this on a Toshiba Chromebook 2 2015 that's running Void Linux.
I agree with you. I think some amount of creativity is needed to create an API, but I guess the question is what amount of creativity dictates that a work should be protected under copyright.
I think sleep deprivation is on the list for some jobs. At least, I know it's on the list for TSA.
But he has a B.S. in Mathematics. I would think he would know what a recursive definition is, or at least proof via induction. I think it just doesn't make sense because there's no base case.
I think it's a failure of the system. Normally you want people who have no bias whatsoever about the case so they can produce an opinion based on the facts, or what the lawyers and witnesses and such say. But this backfires here, because here you have people who have no idea how this stuff works. IIRC there was one guy who actually worked with computers, a network manager, and Oracle didn't like him for some reason, so he was out.
Yeah, we should have added a base case somewhere. I'm pretty sure Alsup is looking at from the stance of Mathematical proof of Induction, and that's why he said "That doesn't make any sense."
Yeah, I was riding my university bus and this one guy said he wasn't voting for anybody because they're all bad. I was like, Bernie's bad? What he had to say about Bernie is that he's a good guy but his policies are impossible to implement. That's not true though. It will cost a lot in taxes, but that doesn't mean impossible to implement. It really annoyed me because by not voting, he's not doing anything. One candidate shows up who's actually trying to change things for the better, and people say oh that's too idealistic that's impossible. Change isn't going to happen if you don't do anything.
Yeah the scope creep is really frightening. It's like they want to put systemd in everything, so you can run systemd while you run systemd. It's why I'm using Void Linux. I just don't agree with their scope creep as a way to try to unify the Linux ecosystem. Even if Ubuntu is using systemd, they have their own snap format and Redhat was a new format if I'm informed correctly. Neither really want to use software controlled by the other, so there's not really going to be any unification. Also, as stated, I don't really like the attitude of the devs. It is a pretty normal use case that you want to look at the logs when a computer crashed. Regardless of whether systemd works or not, for these two reasons, I'm avoiding it.
I'm currently using Void Linux which uses runinit, and it seems to work pretty well. I'm using the LXQt flavor and my system boots in 2 seconds. And I can add or delete services with a simple ln or rm. No scope creep for me!
Yep, systemd is a bummer. Them EEE tactics. But Gentoo and Slackware have not succumbed. Currently trying out Void Linux.