An AC says, "So, security is warranted on airplanes, because of the extra casualties one can inflict with a small bomb."
I can put a much larger bomb into a light plane, and crash it into a crowded shopping mall, or better yet, just throw it out the window and be ready to bomb again tomorrow. Hell, in the average Walmart parking lot, you can take out 300 people at once, and think of the lovely gasoline fires you'll get from bombing a parking lot full of cars.
Restricting your terrorist activities to commercial aircraft shows a lack of imagination.
Hell, maybe you've met -- his name is Carroll and he runs the network at a local dentist's office. -- Techware BBS is alive and well -- telnet://techware.dynip.com will get you there.
Long story short, I once got a cop fired for shennanigans outside his jurisdiction; a neighbour later told me that his Navy discharge papers said "for the good of the service". Goes to show how some small towns need to be a bit more selective about who they hire as cops.:/ Small town wages are not so high that $19k is a bad wage, but yeah, so long as drugs are illegal, prices will be artificially high and protection money will follow apace, with police corruption marching in step. The "war on drugs" primarily benefits the drug lords, whoever those might be.
An AC says, "pfft Just wait. If Obama is elected you can expect this every time you check in to stand in line to wait for your 'appointment' with the district assistant physician's assistant."
Facetious as the comment is, I've watched America change during my lifetime, from "who I am, where I go, and how I get there is none of your damned business" to "Komrade! Your papers please!!" for public transport, gov't buildings, and what's next? ID required for children entering a public schoolhouse?? some already require ID for parents!
We are becoming the very thing we fought against during the Cold War. Welcome to the backside of the Iron Curtain, Amerikan style.
Pulling you over to see if you have your *operating permit* (not your ID, which is another matter even tho they've become functionally identical) -- yeah, they can. But as someone else corrected me, this is like requiring ID *before* you can be a PASSENGER in a vehicle, regardless of whether the pilot/driver has am operator's license or not (as distinguished from an ID).
Sucks regardless. What's next, Komrade -- ID papers required just to set foot on the public sidewalk? Because after all, you COULD be carrying a bomb!
Please re-read the comment -- I said *equivalent* to being arrested, since theoretically, law enforcement can only ask for ID if they intend to detain you. TSA are not exactly cops, but they ARE a gov't security agency of sorts -- which is a pretty good description of a police force. If it walks like a duck...
That's a good point -- after all we are PASSENGERS in airliners. And as you say, a driver's LICENSE was not originally *intended* as ID, but rather, as certification that you know how to operate the danged thing.
And come to think of it, private pilots in private planes are not required to cough up ID before taking off, either.
You don't have to either show an ID or be subject to search every time you drive your car. You don't have to prove your identity nor that you're not carrying contraband. That's the difference.
I'm reminded of a story that came over the wires of United Press International, on September 10, 1980 (the teletype printed it during my shift while I was DJing, so I saw it with my own eyes):
======== Police in Laurel, Mississippi report receiving a call from a woman who told them she had been attacked by a band of elves. Investigating officers were dubious to begin with and the woman didn't help her credibility by pointing to a blank wall whenever she was talking about the window the alleged elves came through.
When one of the officers pointed out that there was no window where the woman kept pointing, she reportedly told them the elves had taken it with them. =========
It appears the TSA believes that if we just get rid of all those windows, no more elves, er, I mean terrorists will come through them!!
Wow, Searcy, Arkansas -- I know someone else who lives there, an old BBS buddy. Small world!
I sure agree with you that small town life is waaaay better'n big city life in many significant ways... too bad the Good Ol' Boy network can ruin parts of that life. Gotta also agree that payoffs and protection money aren't necessarily such a bad policy for illicit businesses that will exist anyway, and that generally harm no one.
Don't think I've ever run into a serious meth-head myself. Wonder how much of your local problem (which I doubt is unique) comes from cops being allowed to confiscate drugs, and that only a little bit is needed for "evidence" -- IOW, sheer opportunity, since if they didn't get to keep 'em, at least there'd be more of a barrier than "go behind the counter and pick some up".
If as you say the local media is not going to do anything, you'd have to go a lot bigger -- state or national. 20-20 for media coverage; FBI if there's reason to believe that anything crosses state lines. If not, how are your state police? highway patrol? anything not tied into local police departments??
Trouble is, it's all just human nature -- those in charge use their power to STAY in charge, and the rest of us -- well, either you shoot back or you keep your head down; and if you're the only one shooting back, it'll just get you killed.
"Passengers who refuse to show ID, citing the rights" still will be accommodated if they "assist transportation security officers in ascertaining their identity." This is similar to the Fourth Amendment case law on ID, which is also widely
misunderstood by the lay public. You have every right not to carry ID, but you do not have the right to withhold your identity from law enforcement if they have a legitimate reason for knowing it (e.g., because you've been lawfully arrested). The TSA is merely clarifying that, "you have no right to fly anonymously," not that "you no longer have the right to invoke your right to fly without ID.
[emphasis mine]
So... refusing to identify yourself at the airport is equivalent to refusing to identify yourself when you're arrested.
Let's stop piddlefucking around and admit that planes are now airborne maximum security prisons. Because that's exactly how their "security" is treating passengers.
TFA says, "Young people are being influenced by what they see and what they hear."
Okay, for the purpose of argument, let's allow as how that's true. Given that, what sort of influence is thereby exerted when children watch adults burn video games, books, or any other "bad" stuff??
Sometimes it comes down to which one do you most want to keep OUT of office, rather than which one you want IN office. Increasingly, I find myself voting AGAINST a candidate rather than FOR his rival. That's not how it's supposed to work, of course, but that puts my vote to SOME use, rather than no use at all. Exercising the write-in and minor-candidate options may feel good, but if there's no chance in hell of electing the best candidate, better to try to skew the realistic candidate choices toward the one that's least-worst.
Generally this boils down to "which one is least likely to raise taxes, or otherwise cause shrinkage of my NET income?" Because money is freedom. With money, at the very least you can vote with your feet and LEAVE the bad venue. Without money, you're stuck wherever you're at (short of riding the rails to some other nowhere).
That severely sucks, but I've seen police corruption before, and yeah, there is effectively nothing you can do about it, at least not by yourself. If you can get news media interested or a sufficiently large contingent of proactive citizens (of sufficiently assertive demeanor, and sufficiently willing to arm themselves as needed to intimidate the cops) -- then maybe something would change, but not necessarily for the better. Sometimes the new guard are worse than the old guard.
Increasingly hard to remember in the face of current nanny/big-brother states, but the U.S. Second Amendment was meant to arm citizens AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT in the event that said gov't needed taking down.
Just curious, where do you live? Hope you and your sister can find a way out.
And what if a treaty includes a term like, oh, say "Your Constitution is no longer valid" ?? Does our Constitution state that it cannot be invalidated by a treaty with a foreign power?
Your sig is a good example of the question that now arises: how do we tell the patriots from the tyrants?
As far as the average revolution is concerned, "tyrant" == "whoever is presently in power", and "patriot" == "whoever wants to be in power". (Witness that the French and Russian Revolutions were much more historically typical than was the American version.)
I don't know about the rules for voting registration, but they CAN'T turn you away from the voting booth just because they "can't find you in their records". In that case you cast a "provisional ballot". I know, I do it every year, because we have no local polling place, and I usually forget to vote absentee, so I trot on over to the most convenient poll and use that instead.
An AC says, ========= Keep in mind that in the planes on 9/11 large blocks of tickets were purchased for people who never showed up, specifically to cut down on the number of people who were on-board and could oppose the terrorists. -- Not sure if it was true for the one where the passengers fought back, but certainly it was true for the other three. =========
So what?? if there are as few as 4 or 5 adult passengers for each box-cutter-armed terrorist, that's more than enough to swarm the perps and take them down. Smack 'em upside the head with your lunch tray, Uncle Bob's cane, your mom's purse. Fling your coat into his face and knock him over while he's tangled up in it. Weapons are all around you, and you need not even go hand to hand with the perp. Remember, they do NOT have guns anymore. They have to actually take hold of you do to hurt you.
Yeah, one or two innocents may get hurt or killed; and you may have to decide to sacrifice one or two innocents in the name of saving everyone else. But it beats letting the wolves have their way with the entire flock, and maybe putting the whole plane in the ground.
"Democracy, that ultimate triumph of quantity over quality." -- Peter H. Peel
I've been saying the same thing for some time, and mind you I was raised in the era when we all took Civics class and were all taught to revere Democracy and the value of every man's vote. But I look around and see what amounts to mob rule; I see good people who can't get elected because the mob believes what bad people say, and elects the bad people instead (how else do you explain some of the destructive shit our elected officials pull??)
Democracy only seems to work WELL when the population is 1) relatively small, and 2) all about equally well-educated. Otherwise, as some historians have pointed out, it invariably tends toward corruption, mob rule, and collapse.
Slashdot Mirror
An AC says, "So, security is warranted on airplanes, because of the extra casualties one can inflict with a small bomb."
I can put a much larger bomb into a light plane, and crash it into a crowded shopping mall, or better yet, just throw it out the window and be ready to bomb again tomorrow. Hell, in the average Walmart parking lot, you can take out 300 people at once, and think of the lovely gasoline fires you'll get from bombing a parking lot full of cars.
Restricting your terrorist activities to commercial aircraft shows a lack of imagination.
In that case... might this be an investment in a new lock for the barn door, whilst watching the horse's heels receding into the far distance??
Yeah... let's go spend a relaxing afternoon at the neighbourhood witch burning!
And when TFA mentioned "large pores" my first thought was "uh-oh, beware for inkjet users"!
Hell, maybe you've met -- his name is Carroll and he runs the network at a local dentist's office. -- Techware BBS is alive and well -- telnet://techware.dynip.com will get you there.
:/ Small town wages are not so high that $19k is a bad wage, but yeah, so long as drugs are illegal, prices will be artificially high and protection money will follow apace, with police corruption marching in step. The "war on drugs" primarily benefits the drug lords, whoever those might be.
Long story short, I once got a cop fired for shennanigans outside his jurisdiction; a neighbour later told me that his Navy discharge papers said "for the good of the service". Goes to show how some small towns need to be a bit more selective about who they hire as cops.
"The pilot of the plane should have to show ID when asked."
;)
Yeah, just in case he's a terrorist and plans to drop us all into a large building
An AC says, "pfft Just wait. If Obama is elected you can expect this every time you check in to stand in line to wait for your 'appointment' with the district assistant physician's assistant."
Facetious as the comment is, I've watched America change during my lifetime, from "who I am, where I go, and how I get there is none of your damned business" to "Komrade! Your papers please!!" for public transport, gov't buildings, and what's next? ID required for children entering a public schoolhouse?? some already require ID for parents!
We are becoming the very thing we fought against during the Cold War. Welcome to the backside of the Iron Curtain, Amerikan style.
Pulling you over to see if you have your *operating permit* (not your ID, which is another matter even tho they've become functionally identical) -- yeah, they can. But as someone else corrected me, this is like requiring ID *before* you can be a PASSENGER in a vehicle, regardless of whether the pilot/driver has am operator's license or not (as distinguished from an ID).
Sucks regardless. What's next, Komrade -- ID papers required just to set foot on the public sidewalk? Because after all, you COULD be carrying a bomb!
Please re-read the comment -- I said *equivalent* to being arrested, since theoretically, law enforcement can only ask for ID if they intend to detain you. TSA are not exactly cops, but they ARE a gov't security agency of sorts -- which is a pretty good description of a police force. If it walks like a duck...
That's a good point -- after all we are PASSENGERS in airliners. And as you say, a driver's LICENSE was not originally *intended* as ID, but rather, as certification that you know how to operate the danged thing.
And come to think of it, private pilots in private planes are not required to cough up ID before taking off, either.
Hmm. Now that you mention it... wouldn't refusing to show your ID be a criminal act?
Refusing to show your ID is grounds for arrest, but you can't be arrested without showing your ID... my brain hurts.
[sarcasm mark provided for the humour-impaired]
You don't have to either show an ID or be subject to search every time you drive your car. You don't have to prove your identity nor that you're not carrying contraband. That's the difference.
I'm reminded of a story that came over the wires of United Press International, on September 10, 1980 (the teletype printed it during my shift while I was DJing, so I saw it with my own eyes):
========
Police in Laurel, Mississippi report receiving a call from a woman who told them she had been attacked by a band of elves. Investigating officers were dubious to begin with and the woman didn't help her credibility by pointing to a blank wall whenever she was talking about the window the alleged elves came through.
When one of the officers pointed out that there was no window where the woman kept pointing, she reportedly told them the elves had taken it with them.
=========
It appears the TSA believes that if we just get rid of all those windows, no more elves, er, I mean terrorists will come through them!!
Wow, Searcy, Arkansas -- I know someone else who lives there, an old BBS buddy. Small world!
I sure agree with you that small town life is waaaay better'n big city life in many significant ways... too bad the Good Ol' Boy network can ruin parts of that life. Gotta also agree that payoffs and protection money aren't necessarily such a bad policy for illicit businesses that will exist anyway, and that generally harm no one.
Don't think I've ever run into a serious meth-head myself. Wonder how much of your local problem (which I doubt is unique) comes from cops being allowed to confiscate drugs, and that only a little bit is needed for "evidence" -- IOW, sheer opportunity, since if they didn't get to keep 'em, at least there'd be more of a barrier than "go behind the counter and pick some up".
If as you say the local media is not going to do anything, you'd have to go a lot bigger -- state or national. 20-20 for media coverage; FBI if there's reason to believe that anything crosses state lines. If not, how are your state police? highway patrol? anything not tied into local police departments??
Trouble is, it's all just human nature -- those in charge use their power to STAY in charge, and the rest of us -- well, either you shoot back or you keep your head down; and if you're the only one shooting back, it'll just get you killed.
[emphasis mine]
So... refusing to identify yourself at the airport is equivalent to refusing to identify yourself when you're arrested.
Let's stop piddlefucking around and admit that planes are now airborne maximum security prisons. Because that's exactly how their "security" is treating passengers.
TFA says, "Young people are being influenced by what they see and what they hear."
Okay, for the purpose of argument, let's allow as how that's true. Given that, what sort of influence is thereby exerted when children watch adults burn video games, books, or any other "bad" stuff??
"Wikileaks is based in Sweden, ... What exactly is illegal here?"
Stuff that the *Swedish* government doesn't want leaked.
Sometimes it comes down to which one do you most want to keep OUT of office, rather than which one you want IN office. Increasingly, I find myself voting AGAINST a candidate rather than FOR his rival. That's not how it's supposed to work, of course, but that puts my vote to SOME use, rather than no use at all. Exercising the write-in and minor-candidate options may feel good, but if there's no chance in hell of electing the best candidate, better to try to skew the realistic candidate choices toward the one that's least-worst.
Generally this boils down to "which one is least likely to raise taxes, or otherwise cause shrinkage of my NET income?" Because money is freedom. With money, at the very least you can vote with your feet and LEAVE the bad venue. Without money, you're stuck wherever you're at (short of riding the rails to some other nowhere).
That severely sucks, but I've seen police corruption before, and yeah, there is effectively nothing you can do about it, at least not by yourself. If you can get news media interested or a sufficiently large contingent of proactive citizens (of sufficiently assertive demeanor, and sufficiently willing to arm themselves as needed to intimidate the cops) -- then maybe something would change, but not necessarily for the better. Sometimes the new guard are worse than the old guard.
Increasingly hard to remember in the face of current nanny/big-brother states, but the U.S. Second Amendment was meant to arm citizens AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT in the event that said gov't needed taking down.
Just curious, where do you live? Hope you and your sister can find a way out.
And what if a treaty includes a term like, oh, say "Your Constitution is no longer valid" ?? Does our Constitution state that it cannot be invalidated by a treaty with a foreign power?
Your sig is a good example of the question that now arises: how do we tell the patriots from the tyrants?
As far as the average revolution is concerned, "tyrant" == "whoever is presently in power", and "patriot" == "whoever wants to be in power". (Witness that the French and Russian Revolutions were much more historically typical than was the American version.)
I don't know about the rules for voting registration, but they CAN'T turn you away from the voting booth just because they "can't find you in their records". In that case you cast a "provisional ballot". I know, I do it every year, because we have no local polling place, and I usually forget to vote absentee, so I trot on over to the most convenient poll and use that instead.
An AC says,
=========
Keep in mind that in the planes on 9/11 large blocks of tickets were purchased for people who never showed up, specifically to cut down on the number of people who were on-board and could oppose the terrorists. -- Not sure if it was true for the one where the passengers fought back, but certainly it was true for the other three.
=========
So what?? if there are as few as 4 or 5 adult passengers for each box-cutter-armed terrorist, that's more than enough to swarm the perps and take them down. Smack 'em upside the head with your lunch tray, Uncle Bob's cane, your mom's purse. Fling your coat into his face and knock him over while he's tangled up in it. Weapons are all around you, and you need not even go hand to hand with the perp. Remember, they do NOT have guns anymore. They have to actually take hold of you do to hurt you.
Yeah, one or two innocents may get hurt or killed; and you may have to decide to sacrifice one or two innocents in the name of saving everyone else. But it beats letting the wolves have their way with the entire flock, and maybe putting the whole plane in the ground.
I recall reading a recipe for a homemade explosive powder that merely required that you take off your shoe and give it a good whap. *BANG*
"Democracy, that ultimate triumph of quantity over quality." -- Peter H. Peel
I've been saying the same thing for some time, and mind you I was raised in the era when we all took Civics class and were all taught to revere Democracy and the value of every man's vote. But I look around and see what amounts to mob rule; I see good people who can't get elected because the mob believes what bad people say, and elects the bad people instead (how else do you explain some of the destructive shit our elected officials pull??)
Democracy only seems to work WELL when the population is 1) relatively small, and 2) all about equally well-educated. Otherwise, as some historians have pointed out, it invariably tends toward corruption, mob rule, and collapse.