repeat that to me when you get diverticulitis and you live in the society that the right wing advocates for: "i'm sorry, you don't have enough in your checking account. you can wait in that room over there, it won't be long now"
i'm not knocking real chronological teenagers, there's plenty of 13 year olds who can follow this logic. i'm calling people who can't grasp this concept cognitive teenagers
freedom, according to a cognitive teenager, is the ability to do anything you want without any concern for the consequences: drive while texting, blast your music at 3 am, not have health insurance and let some other sap pay for it when you break your arm
cognitive adults understand that there is no such thing as freedom without responsibility
thanks for being a financially irresponsible freeloader off of me, asshole. i was underwriting your health against accidents you apparently believe you can never have the last ten years with my premiums. you're not welcome
you won't be able to freeload anymore, thank you, us supreme court
because you are paying for it in the most retarded, ass backwards wasteful way possible, designed to enrich rent seeking parasitical health insurance corporations, not designed to enrich your health
countries more advanced than the usa (the ones with universal healthcare) pay LESS and live LONGER
riddle me this batman: why do more modern countries than the usa, the ones with universal healthcare, spend LESS and live LONGER?
but if you really want to go out when you still have some oomph in you, go ahead, go to your garage and swallow your shotgun, you have my blessing
oh, i'm sorry, do i sound cruel?
i believe i'm responding to a comment that just basically advocated for "grandma's joints sound creaky, might as well leave her out in the snow"
i understand that the right wing is basically advocating cruelty, meanness, ignorance, and selfishness to the point of self-destruction
but i won't let you define the rules of the american society i am proud to be a part of, which considers human dignity a lot higher than you do
says me, says the majority of americans, and says the us supreme court
we don't like your "freedom" to be live short brutal ignorant lives. we advocate for education for all, healthcare for all, and yes, we are going to fucking pay for it, because i wish to live in a rich society of healthy, educated people who actually are able to exercise their freedoms
go to move to somalia if you wish to have the society you desire, because the society you desire is most certainly unamerican and anti-freedom
us liberals are going to force abortions, hold lotteries on what old people to take out the back to shoot, and have people with failing organs fight gladiatorial style on tv for the benefit of a new liver/ lung/ heart/ etc. that's what obamacare is all about!
the federal government oversteps its bounds, wastes money, and abrogates its responsibilities
it's also better than any other choice of system out there for healthcare
when you tell me a better system (and no, shrinking the government and creating a power vacuum that is filled by corporations who aren't even beholden to your rights in theory is not a better system), i will consider your concerns valid. but as it is, you frame your concerns in a vacuum, as if they have meaning without considering the alternatives. the alternatives are worse. so go with the feds
life is mostly not about choices that are a perfect choice versus a terrible choice
a lot of the times in life the choices are between various shades of suckage. the federal mandate on health insurance just happens to be the best compromise out of many bad compromises. welcome to reality. it's not always simple or pretty
you have abrogated your financial responsibility to take care of your health
if you get cancer, or have a heart condition, or something that is a cost higher than you can afford under your salary, you are shifting the cost to take care of you onto me
are you saying it is impossible for you to have a health crisis you can't afford?
why don't you just use your brain cells, bang some rocks together, and realize you have a responsibility to have health insurance so you don't freeload off of me
freedom according to some people, apparently you, is freedom to freeload and smooch off of more responsible people
well no, fuck you
you have to get health insurance
because i'm not your wet nurse, you irresponsible asshole
grow up
become a responsible adult, and stop talking about freedom and choice. you don't represent and stand for that. you stand for parasitism
how do you explain healthcare per capita costs in the usa, with rent seeking health insurance companies sucking off our life blood (literally), and healthcare per capita costs in more modern countries, where people live longer, healthier, and with far less cost per capita?
economies of scale, for one
our system is about paying economic parasites, not taking care of your health. with this decision, they have lost power and we, the american people, have gained it. it is but a first step in a long journey to financial common sense, and we will drag the economic parasites and propagandized morons along kicking and screaming and howling into the modern world
to cheaper health costs, longer and healthier lives
you look at other modern countries with universal healthcare. you give me one good reason why we can't or should not have that
so when you break your arm, and you have no insurance, and you go to the hospital, and avoid the bill because you don't have a $50,000 healthcare fund in your checking account and you live paycheck to paycheck like most americans, the rest of us will have to pay that $3,000 to fix your arm
to people like you, freedom means freedom from responsibility
you're a freeloader
go ahead, vote for romney. and if enough vote for romney for the same reason, that they don't want to take responsibility for financing their own healthcare, then this country is doomed to ever increasing healthcare costs
i however have faith that most americans are more intelligent and responsible than you are, and with single payer, we will eventually bring our healthcare costs in line with most other modern countries in this world, who have unviersal healthcare, and spend far less per capita than the usa does. because how they finance their healthcare system is predicated on common sense and economies of scale, and not predicated on satisfying corporate rent seeking parasites like healthcare corporations, whose talking points you apparently swallow hook line and sinker like a good little faithful propagandized moron
and speaking of getting jobs to americans: if we detach healthcare from hiring decisions, if we free small companies form this burden of having to provide healthcare, can you imagine the hiring spree they would go on?
already, those under 26 are being hired more regularly because the hiring company doesn't have to worry about providing healthcare for an untested college grad. less of a burden, less of a gamble, more people to hire
i just understand it is simply a mindless beast for generating capital. the mindless beast must be harnessed, or it runs roughshod over your society
the choices in this world are not between ayn rand capitalism and stalinesque communism. these are absurd extremes that do not represent real world choices, only bloviating propaganda that no one serious really believes, except for committed WHARGARBBBLE victims like our friend the free market fundamentalist troll roman_mir
the real choices, for thinking people, is moderation: capitalism with social safety nets, or socialism with a capitalist engine grafted on
but don't let prudence, moderation, and careful thought, interfere with your partisan hysteria
exactly. it's a religion based on myths that depends upon human beings behaving in ways they never have and never will. there is no such thing as a self-regulating marketplace. to be truly free and fair, a marketplace must be regulated. if it is not, the biggest players abuse the smaller ones. always have, always will. in societies with strong governments and regulated marketplaces where the largest players still get away with murder, this is a corruption of our government by those large players that is an argument for curing the sick patient, our government, rather than removing it and handing over the car keys to the sickness that is our enemy: entrenched rent seeking parasitical financial interests
this is a brutal, ignorant, mindlessly selfish way to view life
there's another word for their behavior: it's unamerican
american society will respect human dignity and provide for the common good. who says? me. a proud american, who loves my fellow americans. god bless america. as in it's PEOPLE. not it's MONEY
the self-interested short term thinking freeloading sociopaths can go to hell, they aren't real americans, and they don't represent american society, and they aren't going to define the rules by which our great nation operates. if they do, we'll become like haiti: a few ultrarich and a sea of poor. most of these idiots are just too stupid and propagandized to realize what buying the healthcare insurance industry talking points means for them
the american people won today. rent seeking insurance corporations lost. go ahead republicans, bloviate all you want, we know who funds your war chests. but what you have to decide now is whether you want to continue whoring out your conscience for these maggots and financial parasites, or if you want to stand up for the american people. choose wisely. we're like an elephant (snicker), we don't forget
look at the healthcare costs per capita in countries with universal healthcare. now look at ours
there's lots of economic reasons why single payer means costs go down. not least of which is that the politics and the rules of healthcare are no longer dictated by parasitical entities that exist to make money, rather than take care of your well-being. they're called health insurance corporations, they are the war chest behind all the bloviating words out of republican mouths right now, because they know what this supreme court ruling represents: the american people win, they lose
temporary. single payer system means savings eventually out of simple economics. short term thinking versus long term thinking. look at the per capita costs of healthcare in countries with universal healthcare. now look at our costs. do you see?
the freeloaders in question are those who can afford health insurance but think freedom means they don't have to be financially responsible for their healthcare. that it is their choice to not get insurance, then freeload off the rest of us when they show up at the hospital with a broken arm, then avoid the bill
some ignorant, selfish assholes, aka, republicans, equate irresponsibility with freedom
well now, fuck those ignorant freeloading fucks. not says me, says the supreme court
you NEED health insurance. if you think you don't, you are a freeloading asshole off the backs of responsible americans. grow a fucking brain already you dumb selfish fucks, or we'll drive you kicking and screaming into the realm of you taking responsibility for your own healthcare. stop being a freeloader, that's not what freedom means!
so they get $100 worth of care and stay healthy and stay working, rather than $100,000 worth of care later when they are already sick, because they don't have the financial resources to attend to their healthcare
sanity prevails
thank you justice roberts, you have a human conscience
the sophistry and demagoguery is so thick on this issue i have to clarify my statement. i am sorry i appear as an enemy of obamacare, when i am actually weeping for joy that the supreme court upheld it
clarification:
the freeloaders i had in mind when i wrote my statement are those selfish ignorant fucks who believe that freedom means they don't have to get insurance. that we have to pay for their care because they think they have a choice not to be financially responsible for their healthcare
freeloaders are NOT poor people who are too poor to afford healthcare. they have no choice. it is society's obligation, just as you say, to provide basic care for these people, for many reasons, not least of which is the public health is public health: when my neighbor is sick, i will be sick soon too
i am sorry for not clarifying my comment, here is what i really meant:
the public opinion of what minority section of society?
the public opinion of those who want to freeload off the rest of us because they think freedom means they don't have to pay for their healthcare, we do?
when someone uninsured shows up at the hospital with a broken arm, then avoids the bill or declares bankrupcty, we bail out the hospital from bankrupcty and you pay the bill
the only thing that has changed is that irresponsible people, people who think freedom means not to taking responsible for their healthcare, now have to do that, and stop freeloading off of us
your argument is the same kind of argument as "if gays can marry, soon you can marry dead people and animals!"
or "if marijuana is legal, soon meth and coke will be too!"
it's bullshit fearmongering. your point of view depends upon the fact that people don't think and can't tell the difference between different subject matter and weigh them separately
Slashdot Mirror
you want to be treated by doctors, not quacks
no regulation means any asshole can say he knows what is wrong with you, charge you, waste your time, kill you
can you put a price tag on that?
repeat that to me when you get diverticulitis and you live in the society that the right wing advocates for: "i'm sorry, you don't have enough in your checking account. you can wait in that room over there, it won't be long now"
they're teenagers
i'm not knocking real chronological teenagers, there's plenty of 13 year olds who can follow this logic. i'm calling people who can't grasp this concept cognitive teenagers
freedom, according to a cognitive teenager, is the ability to do anything you want without any concern for the consequences: drive while texting, blast your music at 3 am, not have health insurance and let some other sap pay for it when you break your arm
cognitive adults understand that there is no such thing as freedom without responsibility
because you can never break your arm
(rolls eyes)
thanks for being a financially irresponsible freeloader off of me, asshole. i was underwriting your health against accidents you apparently believe you can never have the last ten years with my premiums. you're not welcome
you won't be able to freeload anymore, thank you, us supreme court
because you are paying for it in the most retarded, ass backwards wasteful way possible, designed to enrich rent seeking parasitical health insurance corporations, not designed to enrich your health
countries more advanced than the usa (the ones with universal healthcare) pay LESS and live LONGER
what is your preferred method?
"i'm sorry, you don't have enough in your checking account. why don't you go wait in that room and let the diverticulitis claim you. it won't be long"
is this the society you advocate for?
so freedom doesn't include the freedom to live?
riddle me this batman: why do more modern countries than the usa, the ones with universal healthcare, spend LESS and live LONGER?
but if you really want to go out when you still have some oomph in you, go ahead, go to your garage and swallow your shotgun, you have my blessing
oh, i'm sorry, do i sound cruel?
i believe i'm responding to a comment that just basically advocated for "grandma's joints sound creaky, might as well leave her out in the snow"
i understand that the right wing is basically advocating cruelty, meanness, ignorance, and selfishness to the point of self-destruction
but i won't let you define the rules of the american society i am proud to be a part of, which considers human dignity a lot higher than you do
says me, says the majority of americans, and says the us supreme court
we don't like your "freedom" to be live short brutal ignorant lives. we advocate for education for all, healthcare for all, and yes, we are going to fucking pay for it, because i wish to live in a rich society of healthy, educated people who actually are able to exercise their freedoms
go to move to somalia if you wish to have the society you desire, because the society you desire is most certainly unamerican and anti-freedom
you're not very bright
cable tv is an unnecessary luxury
healthcare is absolute necessity
us liberals are going to force abortions, hold lotteries on what old people to take out the back to shoot, and have people with failing organs fight gladiatorial style on tv for the benefit of a new liver/ lung/ heart/ etc. that's what obamacare is all about!
(i'm joking, for those who are humor deprived)
the federal government oversteps its bounds, wastes money, and abrogates its responsibilities
it's also better than any other choice of system out there for healthcare
when you tell me a better system (and no, shrinking the government and creating a power vacuum that is filled by corporations who aren't even beholden to your rights in theory is not a better system), i will consider your concerns valid. but as it is, you frame your concerns in a vacuum, as if they have meaning without considering the alternatives. the alternatives are worse. so go with the feds
life is mostly not about choices that are a perfect choice versus a terrible choice
a lot of the times in life the choices are between various shades of suckage. the federal mandate on health insurance just happens to be the best compromise out of many bad compromises. welcome to reality. it's not always simple or pretty
do you have health insurance?
if no, then you are a freeloader
you have abrogated your financial responsibility to take care of your health
if you get cancer, or have a heart condition, or something that is a cost higher than you can afford under your salary, you are shifting the cost to take care of you onto me
are you saying it is impossible for you to have a health crisis you can't afford?
why don't you just use your brain cells, bang some rocks together, and realize you have a responsibility to have health insurance so you don't freeload off of me
freedom according to some people, apparently you, is freedom to freeload and smooch off of more responsible people
well no, fuck you
you have to get health insurance
because i'm not your wet nurse, you irresponsible asshole
grow up
become a responsible adult, and stop talking about freedom and choice. you don't represent and stand for that. you stand for parasitism
how do you explain healthcare per capita costs in the usa, with rent seeking health insurance companies sucking off our life blood (literally), and healthcare per capita costs in more modern countries, where people live longer, healthier, and with far less cost per capita?
economies of scale, for one
our system is about paying economic parasites, not taking care of your health. with this decision, they have lost power and we, the american people, have gained it. it is but a first step in a long journey to financial common sense, and we will drag the economic parasites and propagandized morons along kicking and screaming and howling into the modern world
to cheaper health costs, longer and healthier lives
you look at other modern countries with universal healthcare. you give me one good reason why we can't or should not have that
that's awesome
so when you break your arm, and you have no insurance, and you go to the hospital, and avoid the bill because you don't have a $50,000 healthcare fund in your checking account and you live paycheck to paycheck like most americans, the rest of us will have to pay that $3,000 to fix your arm
to people like you, freedom means freedom from responsibility
you're a freeloader
go ahead, vote for romney. and if enough vote for romney for the same reason, that they don't want to take responsibility for financing their own healthcare, then this country is doomed to ever increasing healthcare costs
i however have faith that most americans are more intelligent and responsible than you are, and with single payer, we will eventually bring our healthcare costs in line with most other modern countries in this world, who have unviersal healthcare, and spend far less per capita than the usa does. because how they finance their healthcare system is predicated on common sense and economies of scale, and not predicated on satisfying corporate rent seeking parasites like healthcare corporations, whose talking points you apparently swallow hook line and sinker like a good little faithful propagandized moron
exactly
and speaking of getting jobs to americans: if we detach healthcare from hiring decisions, if we free small companies form this burden of having to provide healthcare, can you imagine the hiring spree they would go on?
already, those under 26 are being hired more regularly because the hiring company doesn't have to worry about providing healthcare for an untested college grad. less of a burden, less of a gamble, more people to hire
god bless america
sanity prevails
i am a capitalist
i just understand it is simply a mindless beast for generating capital. the mindless beast must be harnessed, or it runs roughshod over your society
the choices in this world are not between ayn rand capitalism and stalinesque communism. these are absurd extremes that do not represent real world choices, only bloviating propaganda that no one serious really believes, except for committed WHARGARBBBLE victims like our friend the free market fundamentalist troll roman_mir
the real choices, for thinking people, is moderation: capitalism with social safety nets, or socialism with a capitalist engine grafted on
but don't let prudence, moderation, and careful thought, interfere with your partisan hysteria
(rolls eyes)
exactly. it's a religion based on myths that depends upon human beings behaving in ways they never have and never will. there is no such thing as a self-regulating marketplace. to be truly free and fair, a marketplace must be regulated. if it is not, the biggest players abuse the smaller ones. always have, always will. in societies with strong governments and regulated marketplaces where the largest players still get away with murder, this is a corruption of our government by those large players that is an argument for curing the sick patient, our government, rather than removing it and handing over the car keys to the sickness that is our enemy: entrenched rent seeking parasitical financial interests
yes
this is a brutal, ignorant, mindlessly selfish way to view life
there's another word for their behavior: it's unamerican
american society will respect human dignity and provide for the common good. who says? me. a proud american, who loves my fellow americans. god bless america. as in it's PEOPLE. not it's MONEY
the self-interested short term thinking freeloading sociopaths can go to hell, they aren't real americans, and they don't represent american society, and they aren't going to define the rules by which our great nation operates. if they do, we'll become like haiti: a few ultrarich and a sea of poor. most of these idiots are just too stupid and propagandized to realize what buying the healthcare insurance industry talking points means for them
the american people won today. rent seeking insurance corporations lost. go ahead republicans, bloviate all you want, we know who funds your war chests. but what you have to decide now is whether you want to continue whoring out your conscience for these maggots and financial parasites, or if you want to stand up for the american people. choose wisely. we're like an elephant (snicker), we don't forget
look at the healthcare costs per capita in countries with universal healthcare. now look at ours
there's lots of economic reasons why single payer means costs go down. not least of which is that the politics and the rules of healthcare are no longer dictated by parasitical entities that exist to make money, rather than take care of your well-being. they're called health insurance corporations, they are the war chest behind all the bloviating words out of republican mouths right now, because they know what this supreme court ruling represents: the american people win, they lose
temporary. single payer system means savings eventually out of simple economics. short term thinking versus long term thinking. look at the per capita costs of healthcare in countries with universal healthcare. now look at our costs. do you see?
exactly
the poor have no choice no matter what
the freeloaders in question are those who can afford health insurance but think freedom means they don't have to be financially responsible for their healthcare. that it is their choice to not get insurance, then freeload off the rest of us when they show up at the hospital with a broken arm, then avoid the bill
some ignorant, selfish assholes, aka, republicans, equate irresponsibility with freedom
well now, fuck those ignorant freeloading fucks. not says me, says the supreme court
you NEED health insurance. if you think you don't, you are a freeloading asshole off the backs of responsible americans. grow a fucking brain already you dumb selfish fucks, or we'll drive you kicking and screaming into the realm of you taking responsibility for your own healthcare. stop being a freeloader, that's not what freedom means!
is they can't get cheap preventive care
now they can
so they get $100 worth of care and stay healthy and stay working, rather than $100,000 worth of care later when they are already sick, because they don't have the financial resources to attend to their healthcare
sanity prevails
thank you justice roberts, you have a human conscience
we'll talk about the citizens united thing later
i am for obamacare
the sophistry and demagoguery is so thick on this issue i have to clarify my statement. i am sorry i appear as an enemy of obamacare, when i am actually weeping for joy that the supreme court upheld it
clarification:
the freeloaders i had in mind when i wrote my statement are those selfish ignorant fucks who believe that freedom means they don't have to get insurance. that we have to pay for their care because they think they have a choice not to be financially responsible for their healthcare
freeloaders are NOT poor people who are too poor to afford healthcare. they have no choice. it is society's obligation, just as you say, to provide basic care for these people, for many reasons, not least of which is the public health is public health: when my neighbor is sick, i will be sick soon too
i am sorry for not clarifying my comment, here is what i really meant:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2945055&cid=40479907
the public opinion of what minority section of society?
the public opinion of those who want to freeload off the rest of us because they think freedom means they don't have to pay for their healthcare, we do?
have been for decades
when someone uninsured shows up at the hospital with a broken arm, then avoids the bill or declares bankrupcty, we bail out the hospital from bankrupcty and you pay the bill
the only thing that has changed is that irresponsible people, people who think freedom means not to taking responsible for their healthcare, now have to do that, and stop freeloading off of us
your argument is the same kind of argument as "if gays can marry, soon you can marry dead people and animals!"
or "if marijuana is legal, soon meth and coke will be too!"
it's bullshit fearmongering. your point of view depends upon the fact that people don't think and can't tell the difference between different subject matter and weigh them separately
of course they can. well, maybe you can't