BUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA *ga sp* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Dude... You have so little clue you make my sides hurt. So what you're saying is that if I make a part for a car, it will just work on any car because "there's a standard for making a car?"
Who is your crack dealer and what flavors does he sell? It must be some good shit.
* DeputySpade wipes a tear from his eye
Man... that's damned funny.
Oh, and I would challenge the 'plumbing layout' thing, too. In certain subdivisions there are 3 or so configurations, but that's just for THAT SUBDIVISION, not for houses in general.
I should add that nobody codes for the window manager, they code for the libraries and you can run KDE apps on GNOME, and GNOME apps on KDE as long as you have the libraries installed.
If it took him 18 years to get through public school, that's about the command of the english language I'd expect. k through 12 is actually 13 years. K stands for Kindergarten. It is not a variable.
Um... The engine design specs are far from l33t s33cr3tz, d00d. Anybody with a micrometer and some wrenches can acquire the design specs. Torque specs, hardness of bolts, materials, it's all available. Anybody with a slab of aluminum and a heavy-duty machine shop could reproduce an exact replica of an LS1. There's nothing stoping them from drawing what they find on a napkin and selling it, either. If I sold you the specs of my engine and a drawing of it you could machine a replica from those drawings. This is the whole concept behind the aftermarket performance parts industry.
Funny how linux doesn't have a single decent gui newsreader that'll combine binaries from newsgroups like Newsbin on Windows. Probably because we don't need one for warez right?
No. It's because we have perl scripts that do it for us while we sleep.
Every one of you who replied to me are absolutely 100% right. You're right that the BS-A has no legal ground, that they have no right to come in and audit your shit and that they have no evidence that you've done anything to violate your license or any copyright.
HOWEVER Having headed down the road of closed min^H^H^Hsource software and having clicked I agree (WHILE IT MAY NOT BE LEGALLY BINDING) you have invited them to come and make your life hell. You may be able to tell the to go get bent. You may be able to beat them in court and who knows, maybe even bill them for your lost time and productivity, but you still invited them into your universe and therefore they will use every means at their disposal to waste your time, waste your money, and make bad PR for you until you pay them to go away or pay shit-tons of money in legal fees and spend shit-tons of time to beat them in court. My point was not that they are right, just, justified, or in anyway anything other than extortionist thugs the likes of which can be found on any elementary schoolyard threatening to beat up kids if they don't give up their lunch money. My point which you misunderstood was that YOU (the "you" who clicked "I Agree") INVITED THIS TROUBLE! I wish people would look at the EULA and realise what trouble they're inviting by even entertaining the notion of entering such a "contract." _THAT_ would be the big win for OSS.
Once you've got this trouble on your hands, the one thing you really want to do is get rid of it with the least possible expense, time, and other resources wasted. That probably means coming to some sort of deal where you dig out every physical license you can find and coming to some settlement about the rest. Neither the real cost of an overnight switch to OSS nor the cost of the extra hassle you will endure from the BS-A if you do so will be less than the cost of doing so at your leisure without these thugs breathing down your neck. My advice would, of course, be to get out from under these license agreements before the BS-A ever gets ahold of you. All chest-thumping, politics, ideals, and other BS aside, the bottom line for the kinds of entities the BS-A is approaching (businesses, not private parties) is avoiding dumping huge barrels of cash into the toilet over this nonsense. The reality of it is that it will probably be cleaner/faster/easier to come to a settlement than to taunt the BS-A. That's a business decision, not one based on justness of their claims, legality of their actions, or anyones ideals about software licensing.
It will not "become financially impossible for them to continue" because if they find a single instance of a single product that you can't produce a license for they make you pay their legal fees or pony up the $$ (at a severe markup) for the license. This isn't even about having an illegal copy, even. This is about being able to produce the physical piece of shiny holographic paper with the word 'license' on it. Failure to do so will result in you funding their next attack.
where one is required to retain all receipts in order to prove ownership? I don't need a receipt to show that I own the shirt I'm wearing.
Unlike the shirt on your back and the couch under your buns, you do not OWN the software you are running. You are using a copy with permission from the owner. Furthermore, the BS A isn't coming looking for recipts. They're coming looking for licenses (permission slips.)
BTW... I should mention that your life with the BSA does not neccessarily end when the audit is over. You don't just 'change back.' as part of your settlement (Yes, there will likely be a settlement of some sort one way or the other) you will likely sign a contract with the BSA which will NOT make you happy.
Sure. Great idea. The BSA would never think to assert that you were trying to destroy evidence by deleting software which you were using illegaly. whatever you do, do not blow away all your closed min^H^H^Hsource software until AFTER the BSA bullshit is settled. You will only cause further complications (read: loose more $$)
It amazes me that no matter how many times this comes up, people still don't get it. READ the EFFEN UELA! When you accept the EULA from MS, Oracle, or whatever closed min^H^H^H source software, BSA participating company you purchase from, you agree to let the copyright holder _OR_ANY_DESIGNATED_ASSIGNEE_ come in and audit your system for license violations. And as for the idea every seems to have about simply making a quick switch to OSS, DON'T! if the BSA comes back tomorrow and can't find ANY software under their jurisdiction on ANY machine, they will assume that you blew it all away to cover up the fact that you were using it illegally. They will then want you to prove that you didn't try to destroy evidence! Trust me. I've been through this before.
Why does everyone assume he is trying to subsidize "his friends" in the armaments industry or "his friends" in the oil industry? For your information, he doesn't know ANY of those people. I do. They are _MY_ friends in the armaments and oil industries. He is subsidising them because I told him to.
Um... Do you REALLY think that a company with needs as specialized as Wally World's would use an off-the-shelf Red Hat install for data warehousing? WTF? Um... earth to whoever you are, the cost of such minor customization as configuring and compiling a decent kernel would be such a miniscule part of a technology overhaul that they are NOT worth mentioning here. Please mod your own post down so others will not have to wince when they read it.
One of the most clear-headed and on-topic posts yet. Many here seem to be missing the point. The point wasn't that the specific business mentioned in the article would be "good" to associate yourself with, it was that getting a business of that magnitude on-board would drive the proverbial stake through the heart of the typical Anti-OSS FUD from redmond.
Somebody PLEASE mod this up! This hits the nail right on the head. Wal Mart drives the cliche "Mom & Pop" business out because they move in to an area where people's situations are so economically precarious that they will JUMP at the chance to save $.30 on a loaf of bread. Wal Mart exists precisely because it benefits it's shoppers for it to exist. They guy who washes dishes at the local steak house has to make a choice between buying a can of soup for $.97 at the local family-owned grocer or $.64 at Wal Mart, and as condescending as you anti-wal*mart zealots are being, you have to grant that even the dish washer has basic math skills.
Also, I find it hard to believe that there are many communities in which the ONLY place to aquire the essentials is Wal Mart. I find it hard to believe that Wal Mart is driving out EVERY retailer so that a community is left with NO choice for it's essentials other than Wal Mart. If I am right about this it means something very important. It means that Wal Mart can not raise their prices to an unreasonably inflated level because their competition would then draw the business of our friend the dish washer. Am I wrong about this? Are there many communities in which the only place to buy bread, canned food, milk, gas, oil, clothing, etc... is Wal Mart? I am picturing in my head the layout of the communities surrounding the last dozen or so Wal Mart stores I've been to. None of them match that description.
But in a time where stock prices have plummeted, the low end of the economic scale has to increase efficiancy as well.
What do stock prices have to do with bending over and taking it from some store manager? ((the stock market) != (the economy)). If you are working hours without being paid for them it's because you are
A) an idiot or
B) a masochist.
If you didn't _WANT_ to be treated this way by your employer you would document the situation and either take it over his head to someone who CARES if the store gets sued, or take it to the local newspapers/newsletters/billposters while you looked for other work. After all, being out of work isn't that much worse than working without getting paid.
Somebody mod this post up. This is a big debate about whether to stop fighting one ugly giant and befriend another... OSS _IS_ a big ugly giant. If the OSS folks have their way, people will stop paying for the development of operating systems, office suites, web servers, etc. Heck, I can find an OSS equivalent for nearly any comercial CSS (Closed Source Software) product out there. It strikes me as ironic that the dialogue is swirling around Microsoft stomping businesses out of existance and Wal*Mart stomping businesses out of existance and whether attacking one or befriending the other is the better course for promoting OSS so that _IT_ can stomp businesses out of existance.
Slashdot Mirror
...and can never be NeXTStep until they have the underlying runtime implemented.
Gnustep.org, baby! Check out the progress page.
* DeputySpade inhales sharply
a sp*
BUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
*g
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Dude... You have so little clue you make my sides hurt. So what you're saying is that if I make a part for a car, it will just work on any car because "there's a standard for making a car?"
Who is your crack dealer and what flavors does he sell? It must be some good shit.
* DeputySpade wipes a tear from his eye
Man... that's damned funny.
Oh, and I would challenge the 'plumbing layout' thing, too. In certain subdivisions there are 3 or so configurations, but that's just for THAT SUBDIVISION, not for houses in general.
I should add that nobody codes for the window manager, they code for the libraries and you can run KDE apps on GNOME, and GNOME apps on KDE as long as you have the libraries installed.
Oh, and what the fuck is 'funtability'?
18 years of a public schooling system that works?
If it took him 18 years to get through public school, that's about the command of the english language I'd expect. k through 12 is actually 13 years. K stands for Kindergarten. It is not a variable.
Um... The engine design specs are far from l33t s33cr3tz, d00d. Anybody with a micrometer and some wrenches can acquire the design specs. Torque specs, hardness of bolts, materials, it's all available. Anybody with a slab of aluminum and a heavy-duty machine shop could reproduce an exact replica of an LS1. There's nothing stoping them from drawing what they find on a napkin and selling it, either. If I sold you the specs of my engine and a drawing of it you could machine a replica from those drawings. This is the whole concept behind the aftermarket performance parts industry.
HERE is scanner and software for under 500 bucks that will scan a GM, Ford or Chrystler.
If you just want one for your particular model, it's only 300 bucks.
Funny how linux doesn't have a single decent gui newsreader that'll combine binaries from newsgroups like Newsbin on Windows. Probably because we don't need one for warez right?
No. It's because we have perl scripts that do it for us while we sleep.
Every one of you who replied to me are absolutely 100% right. You're right that the BS-A has no legal ground, that they have no right to come in and audit your shit and that they have no evidence that you've done anything to violate your license or any copyright.
HOWEVER
Having headed down the road of closed min^H^H^Hsource software and having clicked I agree (WHILE IT MAY NOT BE LEGALLY BINDING) you have invited them to come and make your life hell. You may be able to tell the to go get bent. You may be able to beat them in court and who knows, maybe even bill them for your lost time and productivity, but you still invited them into your universe and therefore they will use every means at their disposal to waste your time, waste your money, and make bad PR for you until you pay them to go away or pay shit-tons of money in legal fees and spend shit-tons of time to beat them in court. My point was not that they are right, just, justified, or in anyway anything other than extortionist thugs the likes of which can be found on any elementary schoolyard threatening to beat up kids if they don't give up their lunch money. My point which you misunderstood was that YOU (the "you" who clicked "I Agree") INVITED THIS TROUBLE! I wish people would look at the EULA and realise what trouble they're inviting by even entertaining the notion of entering such a "contract." _THAT_ would be the big win for OSS.
Once you've got this trouble on your hands, the one thing you really want to do is get rid of it with the least possible expense, time, and other resources wasted. That probably means coming to some sort of deal where you dig out every physical license you can find and coming to some settlement about the rest. Neither the real cost of an overnight switch to OSS nor the cost of the extra hassle you will endure from the BS-A if you do so will be less than the cost of doing so at your leisure without these thugs breathing down your neck. My advice would, of course, be to get out from under these license agreements before the BS-A ever gets ahold of you. All chest-thumping, politics, ideals, and other BS aside, the bottom line for the kinds of entities the BS-A is approaching (businesses, not private parties) is avoiding dumping huge barrels of cash into the toilet over this nonsense. The reality of it is that it will probably be cleaner/faster/easier to come to a settlement than to taunt the BS-A. That's a business decision, not one based on justness of their claims, legality of their actions, or anyones ideals about software licensing.
It will not "become financially impossible for them to continue" because if they find a single instance of a single product that you can't produce a license for they make you pay their legal fees or pony up the $$ (at a severe markup) for the license. This isn't even about having an illegal copy, even. This is about being able to produce the physical piece of shiny holographic paper with the word 'license' on it. Failure to do so will result in you funding their next attack.
yes, even we Linux customers...
I use Linux. I am not a customer.
where one is required to retain all receipts in order to prove ownership? I don't need a receipt to show that I own the shirt I'm wearing.
Unlike the shirt on your back and the couch under your buns, you do not OWN the software you are running. You are using a copy with permission from the owner. Furthermore, the BS A isn't coming looking for recipts. They're coming looking for licenses (permission slips.)
This can always be changed back after the audit.
BTW... I should mention that your life with the BSA does not neccessarily end when the audit is over. You don't just 'change back.' as part of your settlement (Yes, there will likely be a settlement of some sort one way or the other) you will likely sign a contract with the BSA which will NOT make you happy.
Sure. Great idea. The BSA would never think to assert that you were trying to destroy evidence by deleting software which you were using illegaly. whatever you do, do not blow away all your closed min^H^H^Hsource software until AFTER the BSA bullshit is settled. You will only cause further complications (read: loose more $$)
It amazes me that no matter how many times this comes up, people still don't get it. READ the EFFEN UELA! When you accept the EULA from MS, Oracle, or whatever closed min^H^H^H source software, BSA participating company you purchase from, you agree to let the copyright holder _OR_ANY_DESIGNATED_ASSIGNEE_ come in and audit your system for license violations. And as for the idea every seems to have about simply making a quick switch to OSS, DON'T! if the BSA comes back tomorrow and can't find ANY software under their jurisdiction on ANY machine, they will assume that you blew it all away to cover up the fact that you were using it illegally. They will then want you to prove that you didn't try to destroy evidence! Trust me. I've been through this before.
Hasn't the NRA been saying that for years?
Why does everyone assume he is trying to subsidize "his friends" in the armaments industry or "his friends" in the oil industry? For your information, he doesn't know ANY of those people. I do. They are _MY_ friends in the armaments and oil industries. He is subsidising them because I told him to.
Best post ever. (Or, at least it appears to be at 2:30am)
Certainly best flame-retardant ever.
C'mon, people, have your fascination with weapon technology totally evacuated your humanity?
:D
Um... Yes.
well said.
Um... Do you REALLY think that a company with needs as specialized as Wally World's would use an off-the-shelf Red Hat install for data warehousing? WTF? Um... earth to whoever you are, the cost of such minor customization as configuring and compiling a decent kernel would be such a miniscule part of a technology overhaul that they are NOT worth mentioning here. Please mod your own post down so others will not have to wince when they read it.
One of the most clear-headed and on-topic posts yet. Many here seem to be missing the point. The point wasn't that the specific business mentioned in the article would be "good" to associate yourself with, it was that getting a business of that magnitude on-board would drive the proverbial stake through the heart of the typical Anti-OSS FUD from redmond.
Somebody PLEASE mod this up! This hits the nail right on the head. Wal Mart drives the cliche "Mom & Pop" business out because they move in to an area where people's situations are so economically precarious that they will JUMP at the chance to save $.30 on a loaf of bread. Wal Mart exists precisely because it benefits it's shoppers for it to exist. They guy who washes dishes at the local steak house has to make a choice between buying a can of soup for $.97 at the local family-owned grocer or $.64 at Wal Mart, and as condescending as you anti-wal*mart zealots are being, you have to grant that even the dish washer has basic math skills.
Also, I find it hard to believe that there are many communities in which the ONLY place to aquire the essentials is Wal Mart. I find it hard to believe that Wal Mart is driving out EVERY retailer so that a community is left with NO choice for it's essentials other than Wal Mart. If I am right about this it means something very important. It means that Wal Mart can not raise their prices to an unreasonably inflated level because their competition would then draw the business of our friend the dish washer. Am I wrong about this? Are there many communities in which the only place to buy bread, canned food, milk, gas, oil, clothing, etc... is Wal Mart? I am picturing in my head the layout of the communities surrounding the last dozen or so Wal Mart stores I've been to. None of them match that description.
But in a time where stock prices have plummeted, the low end of the economic scale has to increase efficiancy as well.
What do stock prices have to do with bending over and taking it from some store manager? ((the stock market) != (the economy)). If you are working hours without being paid for them it's because you are
A) an idiot or
B) a masochist.
If you didn't _WANT_ to be treated this way by your employer you would document the situation and either take it over his head to someone who CARES if the store gets sued, or take it to the local newspapers/newsletters/billposters while you looked for other work. After all, being out of work isn't that much worse than working without getting paid.
Somebody mod this post up. This is a big debate about whether to stop fighting one ugly giant and befriend another... OSS _IS_ a big ugly giant. If the OSS folks have their way, people will stop paying for the development of operating systems, office suites, web servers, etc. Heck, I can find an OSS equivalent for nearly any comercial CSS (Closed Source Software) product out there. It strikes me as ironic that the dialogue is swirling around Microsoft stomping businesses out of existance and Wal*Mart stomping businesses out of existance and whether attacking one or befriending the other is the better course for promoting OSS so that _IT_ can stomp businesses out of existance.
Update 15 minutes :)" Hazah! I'm getting married! :)
30 seconds later: Subj: "Yes", message body: "Dork. You made me cry.
Fine job, man... Fine job. Don't worry. Marriage only sucks HALF as bad as everyone says.
No... SHE will be getting mail asking if she wants HIS penis to grow 12 inches.