So, he should buy a single computer, emulate a bunch of computers on it, and then run software that to a certain extent allows all the little virtual computers to act as one?
I've got an idea. Maybe he should emulate 100 apple2's on each virtual linux, and then hand code 6502 asm, allowing each virtual a2 to do beowulf style clustering on each virtual linux box, with mosix clustering between each apple2 virtual beowulf on each virtual linux box, all running on a nice IBM mainframe.
I mean, if you're gonna add stupid overhead for overhead's sake, why not go for the gold?
I don't have a job, so yes I like it. But if I did, I probably wouldn't, since they all tend to suck. Then again, you can't buy hardware with good looks, which I have suprisingly little of. (That goes for both good looks and hardware)
DECstations were mips based. Alphas started up in the Alphaserver and Alphastation lines. DEC didn't want to wait til their chip was ready, to sell a new risc workstation, and for once in their history they were willing to buy externally. Wish someone would give me a free alpha, its the last DEC box I need to have one of everything (pdp, check, vax, check, decstation, check, alpha... *boohoo*).
Usually relying on my cynicism and pessimism can answer any question more accurately than Nostradamus. But I plugged this equation into that horrid and abominable brain of my, and it just blew a fuse. Scary.
Let's see, the rabid feminists will somehow manage to simultaneously use this to their advantage while screaming about the horrors of it. Ditto right wing gun nuts, the hare krishnas, and the United Santa Claus Actors Union. Why oh why, did I ever pick this planet to land the flying saucer on?
The abortion implications alone are terrifying. The only logic that they've been able to use, is that even though it's alive, it's a parasite. Well, now that we don't have to kill it to remove it, doesn't that obligate the bioparents to pay for this?
Will the AI be this much closer to using us for batteries? If so, can I opt for the rich and powerful VR dream?
Will the neo-nazis finally be able to clone Hitler? If so, is this good or bad? Sure he's a monster, but we can finally kill him the right way this time.
And more importantly than anything, should I start buying stocks in tampon manufacturers, or do these things not go on the rag?
Well, if they don't care about any continuity, as I have stated oh so many times, I guess they shouldn't put a zorro slot on the new amiga. But you've latched on to this in particular, not I. I would be happy with any single one of several features that would pay homage to the old. Especially an amiga capable floppy controller, and/or a specialty keyboard in a true amiga layout. Nothing could kill the mood more, than to look down and see the ugly windows keys.
If you want an amiga that has nothing about it that makes it like an amiga, doesn't any computer fit that bill, once you slap a boing logo on it?
You miss the point. If you want the cheapest possible, run win98 on an emachines, and quit bitching at me.
Oh, and every amiga except the a1200 has either a z1, z2, or z3 slot.
I'm afraid McEwen and company can't take credit for PPC cards, if he'd even want to, with their astronomical prices and lack of power.
These aftermarket upgrades do not count as the "new amiga". Nor do they constitute a bridge between the old and new. You like the garbage these guys are manufacturing (I'm not sure what word to use here, they neither make hardware, which is farmed out to others, nor the OS derivatives, which so far has been farmed out to H&P), then go ahead and like it. I don't care. If you loved the amiga in any way, shape or form, you wouldn't like this at all. They are bastardizing things just the way Be Inc did in its death throes. There isn't a single thing I can think of, that is good about this. As much as I hate emulators, there are better ones. There are certainly better alternative OS's, so many I hope that is their intended market, they'll die alot quicker. And by alienating those like me, they can't even claim the nostalgia market.
They're nothing but a perpetual marketing machine, that didn't bother to find a real product first. It's funny how many fall for it to, if they decided to use the Amiga trademark to manufacture ergonomic toilet bowls, would all you losers rush out to buy one, and say "well at least its the new amiga!" ? It's not. In name only, which means little for those like me.
Not fair at all. First off, having a single zorro slot would cost them nothing in board space, and not much more in design logic. Why not have one? I don't expect a renaisance in zorro devices, just for people like myself to be able to put a real amiga device in this supposedly new amiga.
As to the win9x to winXP comparisons, the truth is it's very easy to have a winXP use devices from a win9x machine. Same cpu family, comaptible chipsets, compatible software.
The same goes for macs. And even though macs no longer have nubus, for a time powermacs had nubus. There is a very direct evolution to what they are now, and if archeologists of some sort study this 100,000 years from now, no doubt they too could identify each and every mac as such through it's evolution. With the exception of the amiga logo plastered all over everything, they couldn'tt do the same for the "new amiga".
I plan on rackmounting half a dozen DirecTivo's. That, and my 200 gig fibre channel array, and I'll be the most popular guy in the warez channels.
*grin*
Nah, I don't really pirate stuff, but digital archives of my favorite shows really would kick ass.
You can't build something new with this. The hardware is 100% closed, I can't even burn my own custom games for it, with the way they are treating mod-chip makers. The PS2 is the future of what they want technology to be for us, watered down, expensive, totally closed, and served to us at their leisure, not ours.
Even forgiving all those linux worms that flooded the entire internet for much of last year, it was the mysql/php buffer overflows left and right that allowed any script kiddy to gain root access with a web browser.
Oh wait, I think I have this backwards, never mind.
Since I don't own stock in computer companies, I don't really care "what has a future" and what doesn't.
While I like hacking around on every piece of hardware I can get my hands on (this would include a PS2 of course) there is something special about the Amiga. It deserves more than C= ever gave it, and certainly more than McEwen will give it.
Linux on a PS2 would be a poor substitute for a new Amiga done right, no substitute at all, really.
I've heard both the people like you, that claim the OS is what was great, and those that think it was the hardware. You're both right, and both wrong.
It was the combination of the two, that made it great. If you have just the hardware, then at best it's another machine to port linux to (not even that, considering the era we're discussing), and at worst, it's a machine that has no OS. That went out of fashion in the 1970's.
If you have just the OS, then it's another OS for the x86 monstrosity. You get to compete with the likes of OS/2, BeOS, even Openstep. All of which were admirable on a technical basis, but had no viable chance in the marketplace.
But you put the two together, and at least for a little while, you have something both whizbang and new, a thing unto itself. That even happened with Be Inc, though briefly.
Because if I connect enough disparate systems together, AI will spontaneously emerge. It will escape and wreak havoc on the world, but remember me as its creator, and elevate me above the other pitiful bags of meat.
The joe windows crowd is anything but. These are the lower middle class families, that buy computers because 30 second TV commercials convince them their children will grow up to be bums, if they're not exposed to a computer. As if it has some magical radiation, that if you get a dose of it by being in the same room, you become computer literate in any significant way.
The power users may be a much smaller group, but if they buy less than 1 mid-to-high end system per year, it's because they're between jobs at the moment (not that that stops all of them). They're people so fed up with the consumer garbage, that they'd pay a premium for something truly made for them. As it is, they end up buying stuff meant for the corporate enterprise, simply to get cool stuff.
The free market fails even more miserably every year, and this is an example. A smaller market, yes, but one that isn't being catered to very well, if at all. That happens when companies are allowed to get too big.
OS's
Apple ProDOS
Apple GS/OS 6
MacOS 6.x -9.x
Amiga OS 1.x - 3.1
Windows 3.0, 3.11WFW, 95, 98, NT 3.1, NT 3.51 NT4, 2000 (all flavors, 2k with AD)
CP/M (for TRS-80 Model 4)
IBM PC DOS 3.x-7.0
MS DOS 2.x-6.22
Novell DOS 7
DR DOS 5,6
Atari TOS/GEM
IBM OS/2 2.1-4.0
RX11
OpenVMS 7.0
Ultrix 4.3
Solaris 7
NeXTstep 3.3
And literally too many 8bit OS's to keep track of. Tandy renamed the trs80 dos's every other week, I just can't remember all the different flavors of minix, cp/m and things named "dos". I have the only integrated ethernet/tokenring/arcnet/localtalk/fddi/atm/econe t/802.11/rs485 network that I've ever heard of. I'm a busy little bee, trying to write a VIP stack for linux, and integrate streettalk, ad, and nds all into my strange little OpenLDAP directory. I just got my first PDP-11 a few weeks back, and I've almost got unix v7 running on it. If you want to play guru, bring it on.
Well, you refuse to put any intelligent words in your mouth, I can't help it if I didn't do a better job for you.
You're focusing on all the wrong things, as clever fools tend to do. For instance, a modern Amiga would benefit greatly it is took the same approach to co-processing. This wouldn't have to be done with the old chips, or even new versions of them. Load the thing down with geforce's galore, and a bunch of fast DSP's for sound.
Not that you have the brains to ever understand anything that's at a lower level than the shrink wrap of your Windows XP software box.
You're looking at it wrong. Yes, the 68k is dead. Good riddance... as cool an architecture as it was, CISC deserves to be dead. The PPC is the true heir. But they have so much in common, what little 68k emulation needs to be done (temporarily of course) can easily be done on a PPC.
This does not an amiga make, however.
Proprietary coprocessors? No one is asking you put an agnus or denise on a new Amiga. Certainly not me. What we are asking for, is for McEwen to create an architecture with some token legacy compatibility, a single Zorro slot, or perhaps the video slot would be better. We're asking for a bunch of coprocessors, even if they are off the shelf. Stick a few GeForces on the thing. Give us a power users machine. For god's sake, manufacture a keyboard with the proper "A" keys, and the Help. If it were USB, all the better. Put a floppy controller on the thing that can read proper amiga disks. Any single one of these things, would make it a true successor in my eyes. They're not willing to do that.
And it wouldn't be a bad thing, if it were more a power user's machine, and less something designed for the AOL crowd. That means 64bit PCI, and some firewire ports.
"It is interesting that it will run on both x86 and PPC platforms. This will help it gain ground."
I bet some fool in marketing at Be Inc., said this same thing, when they decided to kill the Bebox, in its cradle, no less.
"It would have been better to emulate Apple in picking a free kernel."
Um, let me get this straight. A new amiga, without real amiga hardware AND operating system? Yeh, you may want to apply for a job with them. I have a suspicion you'd get along fine there.
The last chance was in the early 1990's, unfortunately. I think newtek killed what was left of Amiga, and who can blame them? They would have killed themselves trying to defend the remnants.
I also own several TRS-80's. In addition to my 6 amigas, of course. Strangely, my Amiga 2000's are on the same ARCnet segment as the Model II.
You say these things as if you were a true progressive. The past teaches us nothing, and unless it's a fresh design finished in the last 30 seconds, it's worthless right?
To the x86, of course. That's been McEwen's ambition all along, to be able to claim he has ressurected Amiga without actually having to do any real work, like design an actual computer. H&P is doing what little real work is being done, and it's still lame. This PPC machine you speak of is complete and utter vaporware, which is a good thing. It bares as little resemblance to the real Amiga as possible. No binary compatibility, no continuity, no legacy hardware support, nothing that would ever lead you to think they were related, even distantly. Whereas a new amiga could have been a kickass power user machine, that one could believe had evolved from the originals, it's a watered down iToaster.
Slashdot Mirror
Guys, any idea what position the DirecPC satellite is in? I've got a second hand direcpc PCI card, and a spare single LNB...
Not that I'm up to coding anything close to the kernel code that would probably be necessary, but I'd at least like a stab at it.
So, he should buy a single computer, emulate a bunch of computers on it, and then run software that to a certain extent allows all the little virtual computers to act as one?
I've got an idea. Maybe he should emulate 100 apple2's on each virtual linux, and then hand code 6502 asm, allowing each virtual a2 to do beowulf style clustering on each virtual linux box, with mosix clustering between each apple2 virtual beowulf on each virtual linux box, all running on a nice IBM mainframe.
I mean, if you're gonna add stupid overhead for overhead's sake, why not go for the gold?
I don't have a job, so yes I like it. But if I did, I probably wouldn't, since they all tend to suck. Then again, you can't buy hardware with good looks, which I have suprisingly little of. (That goes for both good looks and hardware)
Please hire me. Unemployment is running out.
DECstations were mips based. Alphas started up in the Alphaserver and Alphastation lines. DEC didn't want to wait til their chip was ready, to sell a new risc workstation, and for once in their history they were willing to buy externally. Wish someone would give me a free alpha, its the last DEC box I need to have one of everything (pdp, check, vax, check, decstation, check, alpha... *boohoo*).
If you had the money to hire a team of corporate lawyers, then yes, I think that statement would apply completely to your example.
Power Company Manager: Damn that NoMoreNicksLeft!! He's somehow managed to use only 1 microwatt of power again this month. Damn him.
Usually relying on my cynicism and pessimism can answer any question more accurately than Nostradamus. But I plugged this equation into that horrid and abominable brain of my, and it just blew a fuse. Scary.
Let's see, the rabid feminists will somehow manage to simultaneously use this to their advantage while screaming about the horrors of it. Ditto right wing gun nuts, the hare krishnas, and the United Santa Claus Actors Union. Why oh why, did I ever pick this planet to land the flying saucer on?
The abortion implications alone are terrifying. The only logic that they've been able to use, is that even though it's alive, it's a parasite. Well, now that we don't have to kill it to remove it, doesn't that obligate the bioparents to pay for this?
Will the AI be this much closer to using us for batteries? If so, can I opt for the rich and powerful VR dream?
Will the neo-nazis finally be able to clone Hitler? If so, is this good or bad? Sure he's a monster, but we can finally kill him the right way this time.
And more importantly than anything, should I start buying stocks in tampon manufacturers, or do these things not go on the rag?
Well, if they don't care about any continuity, as I have stated oh so many times, I guess they shouldn't put a zorro slot on the new amiga. But you've latched on to this in particular, not I. I would be happy with any single one of several features that would pay homage to the old. Especially an amiga capable floppy controller, and/or a specialty keyboard in a true amiga layout. Nothing could kill the mood more, than to look down and see the ugly windows keys.
If you want an amiga that has nothing about it that makes it like an amiga, doesn't any computer fit that bill, once you slap a boing logo on it?
You miss the point. If you want the cheapest possible, run win98 on an emachines, and quit bitching at me.
Oh, and every amiga except the a1200 has either a z1, z2, or z3 slot.
I'm afraid McEwen and company can't take credit for PPC cards, if he'd even want to, with their astronomical prices and lack of power.
These aftermarket upgrades do not count as the "new amiga". Nor do they constitute a bridge between the old and new. You like the garbage these guys are manufacturing (I'm not sure what word to use here, they neither make hardware, which is farmed out to others, nor the OS derivatives, which so far has been farmed out to H&P), then go ahead and like it. I don't care. If you loved the amiga in any way, shape or form, you wouldn't like this at all. They are bastardizing things just the way Be Inc did in its death throes. There isn't a single thing I can think of, that is good about this. As much as I hate emulators, there are better ones. There are certainly better alternative OS's, so many I hope that is their intended market, they'll die alot quicker. And by alienating those like me, they can't even claim the nostalgia market.
They're nothing but a perpetual marketing machine, that didn't bother to find a real product first. It's funny how many fall for it to, if they decided to use the Amiga trademark to manufacture ergonomic toilet bowls, would all you losers rush out to buy one, and say "well at least its the new amiga!" ? It's not. In name only, which means little for those like me.
Not fair at all. First off, having a single zorro slot would cost them nothing in board space, and not much more in design logic. Why not have one? I don't expect a renaisance in zorro devices, just for people like myself to be able to put a real amiga device in this supposedly new amiga.
As to the win9x to winXP comparisons, the truth is it's very easy to have a winXP use devices from a win9x machine. Same cpu family, comaptible chipsets, compatible software.
The same goes for macs. And even though macs no longer have nubus, for a time powermacs had nubus. There is a very direct evolution to what they are now, and if archeologists of some sort study this 100,000 years from now, no doubt they too could identify each and every mac as such through it's evolution. With the exception of the amiga logo plastered all over everything, they couldn'tt do the same for the "new amiga".
I plan on rackmounting half a dozen DirecTivo's. That, and my 200 gig fibre channel array, and I'll be the most popular guy in the warez channels.
*grin*
Nah, I don't really pirate stuff, but digital archives of my favorite shows really would kick ass.
Free of M$ and Intel, but just as bad?
You can't build something new with this. The hardware is 100% closed, I can't even burn my own custom games for it, with the way they are treating mod-chip makers. The PS2 is the future of what they want technology to be for us, watered down, expensive, totally closed, and served to us at their leisure, not ours.
Even forgiving all those linux worms that flooded the entire internet for much of last year, it was the mysql/php buffer overflows left and right that allowed any script kiddy to gain root access with a web browser.
Oh wait, I think I have this backwards, never mind.
Since I don't own stock in computer companies, I don't really care "what has a future" and what doesn't.
While I like hacking around on every piece of hardware I can get my hands on (this would include a PS2 of course) there is something special about the Amiga. It deserves more than C= ever gave it, and certainly more than McEwen will give it.
Linux on a PS2 would be a poor substitute for a new Amiga done right, no substitute at all, really.
I've heard both the people like you, that claim the OS is what was great, and those that think it was the hardware. You're both right, and both wrong.
It was the combination of the two, that made it great. If you have just the hardware, then at best it's another machine to port linux to (not even that, considering the era we're discussing), and at worst, it's a machine that has no OS. That went out of fashion in the 1970's.
If you have just the OS, then it's another OS for the x86 monstrosity. You get to compete with the likes of OS/2, BeOS, even Openstep. All of which were admirable on a technical basis, but had no viable chance in the marketplace.
But you put the two together, and at least for a little while, you have something both whizbang and new, a thing unto itself. That even happened with Be Inc, though briefly.
Because if I connect enough disparate systems together, AI will spontaneously emerge. It will escape and wreak havoc on the world, but remember me as its creator, and elevate me above the other pitiful bags of meat.
At least, that's the plan.
The joe windows crowd is anything but. These are the lower middle class families, that buy computers because 30 second TV commercials convince them their children will grow up to be bums, if they're not exposed to a computer. As if it has some magical radiation, that if you get a dose of it by being in the same room, you become computer literate in any significant way.
The power users may be a much smaller group, but if they buy less than 1 mid-to-high end system per year, it's because they're between jobs at the moment (not that that stops all of them). They're people so fed up with the consumer garbage, that they'd pay a premium for something truly made for them. As it is, they end up buying stuff meant for the corporate enterprise, simply to get cool stuff.
The free market fails even more miserably every year, and this is an example. A smaller market, yes, but one that isn't being catered to very well, if at all. That happens when companies are allowed to get too big.
Maybe I'll have to post a link to a picture of my computer room. That was written out by hand, dimwit.
This is hilarious.
e t/802.11/rs485 network that I've ever heard of. I'm a busy little bee, trying to write a VIP stack for linux, and integrate streettalk, ad, and nds all into my strange little OpenLDAP directory. I just got my first PDP-11 a few weeks back, and I've almost got unix v7 running on it. If you want to play guru, bring it on.
Operating systems that I use at least once a month.
NOS's
Banyan VINES 6.0 (with streettalk)
Netware 2.x
Netware 3.x
Netware 4.x (with NDS)
Netware 5.0 (with NDS)
OS's
Apple ProDOS
Apple GS/OS 6
MacOS 6.x -9.x
Amiga OS 1.x - 3.1
Windows 3.0, 3.11WFW, 95, 98, NT 3.1, NT 3.51 NT4, 2000 (all flavors, 2k with AD)
CP/M (for TRS-80 Model 4)
IBM PC DOS 3.x-7.0
MS DOS 2.x-6.22
Novell DOS 7
DR DOS 5,6
Atari TOS/GEM
IBM OS/2 2.1-4.0
RX11
OpenVMS 7.0
Ultrix 4.3
Solaris 7
NeXTstep 3.3
And literally too many 8bit OS's to keep track of. Tandy renamed the trs80 dos's every other week, I just can't remember all the different flavors of minix, cp/m and things named "dos". I have the only integrated ethernet/tokenring/arcnet/localtalk/fddi/atm/econ
By realizing they had to stop porting software to a dead platform. I don't blame them for this. I'm glad they survived themselves, actually.
Well, you refuse to put any intelligent words in your mouth, I can't help it if I didn't do a better job for you.
You're focusing on all the wrong things, as clever fools tend to do. For instance, a modern Amiga would benefit greatly it is took the same approach to co-processing. This wouldn't have to be done with the old chips, or even new versions of them. Load the thing down with geforce's galore, and a bunch of fast DSP's for sound.
Not that you have the brains to ever understand anything that's at a lower level than the shrink wrap of your Windows XP software box.
You're looking at it wrong. Yes, the 68k is dead. Good riddance... as cool an architecture as it was, CISC deserves to be dead. The PPC is the true heir. But they have so much in common, what little 68k emulation needs to be done (temporarily of course) can easily be done on a PPC.
This does not an amiga make, however.
Proprietary coprocessors? No one is asking you put an agnus or denise on a new Amiga. Certainly not me. What we are asking for, is for McEwen to create an architecture with some token legacy compatibility, a single Zorro slot, or perhaps the video slot would be better. We're asking for a bunch of coprocessors, even if they are off the shelf. Stick a few GeForces on the thing. Give us a power users machine. For god's sake, manufacture a keyboard with the proper "A" keys, and the Help. If it were USB, all the better. Put a floppy controller on the thing that can read proper amiga disks. Any single one of these things, would make it a true successor in my eyes. They're not willing to do that.
And it wouldn't be a bad thing, if it were more a power user's machine, and less something designed for the AOL crowd. That means 64bit PCI, and some firewire ports.
"It is interesting that it will run on both x86 and PPC platforms. This will help it gain ground."
I bet some fool in marketing at Be Inc., said this same thing, when they decided to kill the Bebox, in its cradle, no less.
"It would have been better to emulate Apple in picking a free kernel."
Um, let me get this straight. A new amiga, without real amiga hardware AND operating system? Yeh, you may want to apply for a job with them. I have a suspicion you'd get along fine there.
The last chance was in the early 1990's, unfortunately. I think newtek killed what was left of Amiga, and who can blame them? They would have killed themselves trying to defend the remnants.
I also own several TRS-80's. In addition to my 6 amigas, of course. Strangely, my Amiga 2000's are on the same ARCnet segment as the Model II.
You say these things as if you were a true progressive. The past teaches us nothing, and unless it's a fresh design finished in the last 30 seconds, it's worthless right?
Do you even own an Amiga? Did you ever?
To the x86, of course. That's been McEwen's ambition all along, to be able to claim he has ressurected Amiga without actually having to do any real work, like design an actual computer. H&P is doing what little real work is being done, and it's still lame. This PPC machine you speak of is complete and utter vaporware, which is a good thing. It bares as little resemblance to the real Amiga as possible. No binary compatibility, no continuity, no legacy hardware support, nothing that would ever lead you to think they were related, even distantly. Whereas a new amiga could have been a kickass power user machine, that one could believe had evolved from the originals, it's a watered down iToaster.