You think you're clever, witty, and sophisticated, but you're not. This is not a political issue. OK? This is a technical issue. Analog technologies are being phased out in favor of digital replacements because analog signal transmission is inferior.
Holy crapthrashing christ, not every slashdot story is an invitation for condescending political commentary.
Parent is not "Funny", but rather just obnoxious. Yes, the French can simultaneously:
(a) be cheese-eating surrender-monkeys, and
(b) care about civil liberties.
As far as I can tell, these qualities are not mutally exclusive.
People hate communism because (a) it always fails due to fundamental and essentially unavoidable implementation issues (i.e., people won't work without some sort of motivation, etc.), and (b) the manner in which it fails provides power and wealth to those at the top, at the expense of the citizens. This leads to oppressive dictators running a facist regime under the guise of 'communism'.
Y'know what else people hate? Turning every single slashdot story into an opportunity for political commentary.
Nearly all popular linux distributions now come on more than one CD (even if you ignore the source code) and the default installations are WAY bigger than that of Windows XP.
I guess you haven't noticed, but the moon is not rich with resources. It costs a fortune to go there, and it's got nothing worth bringing back. There is no reason for NASA to return, and I think they know this.
Also, we are not heading for the "Dark Ages". Things get better gradually, and religion is slowly losing ground.
No, what I have done is shown that you can't decide "diesel vs hybrid" on the basis of a flawed comparison between a compact Lupo and a family-sized petrol-hybrid.
Here's an unflawed comparison: You can get a well-built, reliable, four-dour sedan in the form of the VW Jetta GL TDI (0-60: 7.7s, 36/47 mpg, ~$21,000) for almost $10,000 less than the Honda Accord Hybrid (0-60: 7.5s, 29/37 mpg, ~$30,000). The VW is much cheaper, practically just as fast, and features significantly better fuel economy. There's no doubt some critical flaw in this comparison, so go ahead and tell me what it is.
Why yes, that's exactly what you said. Don't try and change the subject when you're wrong.
Ok: I was completely incorrect about a 4.9s 0-60 time being more than twice as fast as any hybrid, as evidenced by the 7.5s 0-60 time of the Honda Accord Hybrid.
I'll ignore the fact that, in terms of car performance, 7.5 seconds is nowhere near 4.9 seconds. I'll also ignore the fact that the fuel economy, which is the single most important selling point of hybrids, is worse on the Honda Accord Hybrid than some gasoline-engined cars that actually perform better than the Accord.
He should also have considered emissions, life expectancy, repair costs, reliability, operation in cold conditions, torque, power, and 100s of other possible differences. But listing all possible differences was not necessary. The two differences I did list were enough to demolish his argument.
"Demolish his argument"? All you've done is suggest that it's essentially impossible to compare any two cars, because at least a few of their "hundreds" of attributes will differ.
The Honda Accord hybrid does 0-60 in 7.5 seconds. Hmm?
You mean the 29 city / 37 highway Honda Accord Hybrid? That one? Didn't you just get done telling me that 40mpg highway is not exciting? And this particular hybrid can't even manage that. It sounds like my example car, the federal Lotus Elise, is much faster and more fuel efficient.
For several reasons, both cultural and practical, such cars are not feasible in the United States. We drive bigger cars, and bigger means heavier and heavier means lesser gas mileage.
"Practical" reasons for driving something like an H2? Doubt it. If there was any reason at all why only very large cars were practical to drive in the States, the reason would be the existence of other very large cars, and there's something about arguments like that that just don't convince me.
Hybrid automotives are still in their young stages. The technology will evolve and improve over time.
You may want to take a look at this post. Hybrid 'technology' isn't here to stay.
Diesel has a significantly higher energy density than petrol. So it's a mistake to compare the "mileage" in "miles per gallon" between petrol-hybrid and diesel.
That's correct about the difference in energy density -- but diesel and gasoline are very similar in cost and availability, so it's in a person's best interest to take advantage of the greater energy density of diesel if they're concerned about covering miles in the cheapest way possible. Because diesel is not volatile like gasoline, diesel engines can use higher compression and operate with much greater efficiency.
Once again, you can't compare "miles per gallon" when the physical mass is completely different.
But you can compare miles-per-gallon when performance is completely different? Doesn't sound fair to me. It's possible to design a 150mpg car, but it's 0-60 time would be even longer than that of a Prius (if that's possible).
You can buy a car today that'll do over 40mpg (highway) with a 0-60 time less than 5 seconds, which is twice as fast as any hybrid. Hmm.
That beats the Lupo's once-off record of 75mpg.
The 75mpg from a Lupo isn't a "record", it's normal operation.
If they were a fad, why would auto manufacturers care? Sales are sales; they don't care about your reason for buying a car. If Hollywood folks set trends and people like to emulate them, hey, might as well give people what they want. That's just good business.
The fact that there are more than a couple hybrids on the market is not evidence that they are not a fad.
And a light low displacement gasoline car will still perform better with a hybrid component than without; use the electric motor as a turbo and as a low rpm boost.
Not necessarily true. Viewed in a simplistic way, performance may increase, but turbocharging changes the revability and other characteristics of an engine in a way that may be undesirable. Also, the performance of electric turbochargers is pitiful compared to exhaust-gas turbochargers.
In addition to all of this, adding more moving parts and electrical components to a car will invariably reduce reliability, at least early in production.
But saying that hybrid electric cars are a fad is flat wrong.
For not being a fad, they seem to have disproportionate popularity in places like Hollywood. Orlando Bloom, Robin Williams, Salma Hayek, Penelope Cruz, Charlize Theron, Morgan Freeman, Julie Delpy and Tim Robbins all have one and make it a point to be seen driving it.
A loud car now days is usually one that is poorly assembled or has a modification to boost the sound.
And that's my problem. Very few cars made today make a good noise.
Do the people in your neighborhood like the "sexy" sound you car makes going down the road? I would say probably not.
I suppose they'd only like it if they appreciate or respect the character of classic cars.
After all you only want to hear your engine and not the other guy driving down the road.
Incorrect. I'm not a poser or a show-off. I just happen to like the sound of a good engine. Very little is more exciting that the sight/sound of an exotic car encountered on the road, and I wish it would happen more often.
A person buying a hybrid diesel car is definitely not concerned with performance. If they were, they'd get a light low-displacement gasoline-engined car for the best of everything.
Hopefully you wouldn't laugh at, say, a 1920s Bugatti or Duesenberg. Technically, they're very inferior to cars being built now, but it sure isn't their practicality or level of engineering that makes people love them today.
If you think people are going to start ignoring classic cars because new cars are technically superior, you're going to be surprised.
The gas-electric hybrid sounds good, until one realizes that they're heavier, more complex, and therefore substantially more expensive than an equivalent gasoline-engined car.
If you want great gas mileage, diesels are unbeaten. Driving normally, [British motoring journalist] Jeremy Clarkson got 75mpg out of a Volkswagen Lupo diesel.
Slashdot Mirror
You think you're clever, witty, and sophisticated, but you're not. This is not a political issue. OK? This is a technical issue. Analog technologies are being phased out in favor of digital replacements because analog signal transmission is inferior.
Holy crapthrashing christ, not every slashdot story is an invitation for condescending political commentary.
Parent is not "Funny", but rather just obnoxious. Yes, the French can simultaneously:
(a) be cheese-eating surrender-monkeys, and
(b) care about civil liberties.
As far as I can tell, these qualities are not mutally exclusive.
People hate communism because (a) it always fails due to fundamental and essentially unavoidable implementation issues (i.e., people won't work without some sort of motivation, etc.), and (b) the manner in which it fails provides power and wealth to those at the top, at the expense of the citizens. This leads to oppressive dictators running a facist regime under the guise of 'communism'.
Y'know what else people hate? Turning every single slashdot story into an opportunity for political commentary.
Nearly all popular linux distributions now come on more than one CD (even if you ignore the source code) and the default installations are WAY bigger than that of Windows XP.
Also, they work properly.
Far from it, Mr. AC.
Do you have any idea how very, very tired and used-up jokes like that are? Evidently no.
Evidently the day when Internet denizens don't turn every single possible news story into political commentary will never come. This makes me sad.
I guess you haven't noticed, but the moon is not rich with resources. It costs a fortune to go there, and it's got nothing worth bringing back. There is no reason for NASA to return, and I think they know this.
Also, we are not heading for the "Dark Ages". Things get better gradually, and religion is slowly losing ground.
the attitude that gave us Betamax, Minidiscs and now Memory Sticks
Ugh... Memory Sticks are defects in and of themselves.
Dear semiconductor industry: No more types of flash memory, please. We have enough, and most of them suck.
Why would it need to be?
This hammer I bought hasn't built my new house for me! What the hell!
No, what I have done is shown that you can't decide "diesel vs hybrid" on the basis of a flawed comparison between a compact Lupo and a family-sized petrol-hybrid.
Here's an unflawed comparison: You can get a well-built, reliable, four-dour sedan in the form of the VW Jetta GL TDI (0-60: 7.7s, 36/47 mpg, ~$21,000) for almost $10,000 less than the Honda Accord Hybrid (0-60: 7.5s, 29/37 mpg, ~$30,000). The VW is much cheaper, practically just as fast, and features significantly better fuel economy. There's no doubt some critical flaw in this comparison, so go ahead and tell me what it is.
Why yes, that's exactly what you said. Don't try and change the subject when you're wrong.
Ok: I was completely incorrect about a 4.9s 0-60 time being more than twice as fast as any hybrid, as evidenced by the 7.5s 0-60 time of the Honda Accord Hybrid.
I'll ignore the fact that, in terms of car performance, 7.5 seconds is nowhere near 4.9 seconds. I'll also ignore the fact that the fuel economy, which is the single most important selling point of hybrids, is worse on the Honda Accord Hybrid than some gasoline-engined cars that actually perform better than the Accord.
He should also have considered emissions, life expectancy, repair costs, reliability, operation in cold conditions, torque, power, and 100s of other possible differences. But listing all possible differences was not necessary. The two differences I did list were enough to demolish his argument.
"Demolish his argument"? All you've done is suggest that it's essentially impossible to compare any two cars, because at least a few of their "hundreds" of attributes will differ. The Honda Accord hybrid does 0-60 in 7.5 seconds. Hmm?
You mean the 29 city / 37 highway Honda Accord Hybrid? That one? Didn't you just get done telling me that 40mpg highway is not exciting? And this particular hybrid can't even manage that. It sounds like my example car, the federal Lotus Elise, is much faster and more fuel efficient.
Let's go with '10 yoctoseconds', since that's the correct term.
My parent post is modded down why? /. needs to find some non-confused mods.
Yeah, and shows about gruesome murder, too! Because we all know copyright infringement is worse than murder!
For several reasons, both cultural and practical, such cars are not feasible in the United States. We drive bigger cars, and bigger means heavier and heavier means lesser gas mileage.
"Practical" reasons for driving something like an H2? Doubt it. If there was any reason at all why only very large cars were practical to drive in the States, the reason would be the existence of other very large cars, and there's something about arguments like that that just don't convince me.
Hybrid automotives are still in their young stages. The technology will evolve and improve over time.
You may want to take a look at this post. Hybrid 'technology' isn't here to stay.
Diesel has a significantly higher energy density than petrol. So it's a mistake to compare the "mileage" in "miles per gallon" between petrol-hybrid and diesel.
That's correct about the difference in energy density -- but diesel and gasoline are very similar in cost and availability, so it's in a person's best interest to take advantage of the greater energy density of diesel if they're concerned about covering miles in the cheapest way possible. Because diesel is not volatile like gasoline, diesel engines can use higher compression and operate with much greater efficiency.
Once again, you can't compare "miles per gallon" when the physical mass is completely different.
But you can compare miles-per-gallon when performance is completely different? Doesn't sound fair to me. It's possible to design a 150mpg car, but it's 0-60 time would be even longer than that of a Prius (if that's possible).
You can buy a car today that'll do over 40mpg (highway) with a 0-60 time less than 5 seconds, which is twice as fast as any hybrid. Hmm.
That beats the Lupo's once-off record of 75mpg.
The 75mpg from a Lupo isn't a "record", it's normal operation.
If they were a fad, why would auto manufacturers care? Sales are sales; they don't care about your reason for buying a car. If Hollywood folks set trends and people like to emulate them, hey, might as well give people what they want. That's just good business.
The fact that there are more than a couple hybrids on the market is not evidence that they are not a fad.
And a light low displacement gasoline car will still perform better with a hybrid component than without; use the electric motor as a turbo and as a low rpm boost.
Not necessarily true. Viewed in a simplistic way, performance may increase, but turbocharging changes the revability and other characteristics of an engine in a way that may be undesirable. Also, the performance of electric turbochargers is pitiful compared to exhaust-gas turbochargers.
In addition to all of this, adding more moving parts and electrical components to a car will invariably reduce reliability, at least early in production.
But saying that hybrid electric cars are a fad is flat wrong.
For not being a fad, they seem to have disproportionate popularity in places like Hollywood. Orlando Bloom, Robin Williams, Salma Hayek, Penelope Cruz, Charlize Theron, Morgan Freeman, Julie Delpy and Tim Robbins all have one and make it a point to be seen driving it.
Leonardo DiCaprio has THREE.
A loud car now days is usually one that is poorly assembled or has a modification to boost the sound.
And that's my problem. Very few cars made today make a good noise.
Do the people in your neighborhood like the "sexy" sound you car makes going down the road? I would say probably not.
I suppose they'd only like it if they appreciate or respect the character of classic cars.
After all you only want to hear your engine and not the other guy driving down the road.
Incorrect. I'm not a poser or a show-off. I just happen to like the sound of a good engine. Very little is more exciting that the sight/sound of an exotic car encountered on the road, and I wish it would happen more often.
A person buying a hybrid diesel car is definitely not concerned with performance. If they were, they'd get a light low-displacement gasoline-engined car for the best of everything.
...and I believe you forgot "higher initial cost than pure diesel".
Hopefully you wouldn't laugh at, say, a 1920s Bugatti or Duesenberg. Technically, they're very inferior to cars being built now, but it sure isn't their practicality or level of engineering that makes people love them today.
If you think people are going to start ignoring classic cars because new cars are technically superior, you're going to be surprised.
The gas-electric hybrid sounds good, until one realizes that they're heavier, more complex, and therefore substantially more expensive than an equivalent gasoline-engined car.
If you want great gas mileage, diesels are unbeaten. Driving normally, [British motoring journalist] Jeremy Clarkson got 75mpg out of a Volkswagen Lupo diesel.
The hybrid-engine cars of today are a silly fad.