I don't think a coffee maker connected to outlook ads any value whatsoever! As a PM you should reject that idea all together and give a better example of time spent working produces something actually usefull.
So? You still can use the cpu under your desk _in addition_ to the ones on the network. I don't see much problems there. I'm not sure I get the "desktop use" you talk about. You might mean the spariat look of the os and lack of "desktop-apps" (spreadsheet/browsers...) but it's just a matter of time before those show up. If you ask me, the user should be pretty oblivious to where his program's running or saving files.
Also, about the 70s concepts, it's rather known that linux views of network aren't what they could be (again, networking on a thing like plan9's much more powerfull imho). Let's not compare cars to OSs.
> When I switched my main machine from Windows to SuSE/KDE, most things worked in nearly identical ways.
That's because Linux is trying really hard to mimic Windows-isms in order to "gain users shares". Not very inventive, but what's to expect from a 1970s OS anyway? Take a look at Plan9 ( www.cs.bell-labs.com/plan9dist ), a real innovative OS that did not catch on. Its take on networking and window managers is WAY above average and really inventive. Then you might think that there's a different way, a better way, at doing things.
For a new OS to pick up though, you need intellectual curiosity from users, and courage from managers...the fact that there's not much change in the OS space is not a good sign.
Also, Rob Pike's "Systems Software Research is Irrelevant" talk seems appropriate for this topic.
The article's not refering to the sonic boom (usually happens above the ocean anyway), but to the actual engine noise. The concorde had the loudest engine around, and I think it was a problem for most airport noise regulation.
Anything else shows you're immature and trying to be "different" when really you're just another idiot.
Stand out of the crowd by what you do, not what you look like. Anything else is just juvenile.
You are being so intolerant, moralistic, and narrow-minded.
Why would you assume you understand the reasons why people get tatoos or piercing? I am appalled at the number of people who feel free to judge others freedom towards their own bodies.
It seems strange to hear that Rob Pike, a real original thinker who basically re-invented unix with plan9 (at least the network/gui side), is now doing "fine tuning" at google.
I hope they have him work on some secret project where he will be able to put his imagination at work because 'fine tuning' doesn't sound so exciting...
good code = little comments http://www.lysator.liu.se/c/pikestyle.ht ml is a great model of how to write comments
I'd suggest reading code from old unix sources, or plan9, or any program written by good programmers and you'll see that you have something when comments are almost gone.
> Why am I not staying in CS? No jobs, no money, > no interest. > It used to be that this was a field where you > could really innovate and have fun with it; > anymore, I don't see that.
If you want to innovate, you probably need to do something you like, that's true. Having said that, there is a lot of innovation to do in CS, and everywhere actually.
Also, discovering anything in Math is probably the hardest things around, good luck with that.
"Each time someone dies, it is Jules Verne's fault. He is responsible for the desire for interplanetary voyages, good only for boyscouts or for amateur underwater fishermen. If the faboulous sums wasted on these conquests were spent on biological research, nobody on our planet would die anymore. Therefore I repeat, each time someone dies, it is Jules Verne's fault."
given that they really have no way to prove who checked what record, i don't think they should refuse entry to the students whose record has been visited.
most likely, all cheater visited their own record, but not all record visited belong to cheaters...
harvard choose to take the risk of refusing entry to someone who did nothing wrong but had his record checked by a friend...
(1) almost everybody said they thought saddam hussein had wmd.
(2) the bush adminstration said they knew saddam hussein had wmd.
case (1) calls for more information, case (2) for war.
a slight difference in language and a huge difference in response.
welcome to the (horrifying) consequences of spin, media wars, politics, and oil business (read cheney's energy doc and you'll understand why the usa is in irak).
From plan9 (unix done better) developer and Pike's buddy Dave Presotto a.k.a. "a strange man who needs no introduction" (also avail at the plan9 faq and comp.os.plan9).
Subject: What Unix Problems Were Too Deep to Fix?
This is best described by Dave Presotto's 9fans post (from 7 May 2003):
Before Plan 9, we were running lots of Unices held together by a few networks, a remote file system (different uid's on each Unix), and a bunch of remote execution commands. We hated it since it was much harder to manage and use than our old single mutiuser machine. We wanted an environment that not only put together a lot of boxes and made them look like one but which also would make use of the new technologies that were appearing (SMP's, heterogeneous architectures, juke boxes,...).
The thought was that the new environment wouldn't change from Unix except where we thought it would make our goal easier to build. The kernel had to go. The single monitor view of the Unix kernel was a real pain for making good use of the SMP's. Therefore, we started that from scratch. That didn't mean that the kenrel interface had to change though. That was a separate topic. Lots of others have rewritten the kernel from the ground up while maintaining something that looked more like a Unix.
Ken and Rob thought up the idea of building everything around a single file system protocol. They also added the idea of a subjective namespace to try to unify all the binding ideas of Unix. This name space is the one thing underlying Plan 9. We could have done the same thing to a Unix kernel (with an infinite amount of sweating) but the result would have been the same from the user standpoint, i.e., a system that looks very different. The ease which with it can be done can be witnessed by the number of failed/stalled attempts to add the Plan 9 namespace to Linux...
Also, we were tired of the general kitchen sink nature of Unix, especially of System V. If there were 3 projects or groups to do a single thing (like character processing, shared memory, networking,...) they all eventually got jammed in. We wanted something simpler to work with.
Lastly, we had all developed an extreme allergy to code filled with #if, #ifdef, #else, #elseif. Getting rid of that cruft by sticking differences into separate files/routines required a hell of a lot of rewriting.
So the result was a different kernel, with a different design philosophy, a similar but different interface, but mostly the same old commands.
If you think that Unix was just a single track in comparison, you're sadly mistaken. We just made more of a bend than others did.
We are guilty of rewriting commands just for the sake of doing it. The reason there was sometimes legitimate, to match our different kernel interfaces or whatever. However, it was just as often so we wouldn't have to worry about Unix licenses. ===
This EvilWM reminds me of 2 window managers that simplicity-oriented people might enjoy:
- 9wm
- w9wm (9wm with workspaces.)
Those are suppose to emulate the Plan 9 window manager 8-1/2. It's mouse oriented.
I used it for a while. It's light on the system. The code is probably above average since it was written by a bell-labs researcher.
Here's the link to the source if anyone's interested: (9wm) http://packages.qa.debian.org/ 9/9wm.html (w9wm - multiple desktops) http://openbsd.rutgers.edu/
There's a typo on their membership benefit and it's rather embarassing....their bootable member card does not contain a BCC linux but a BBC linux!!!!
The LNX-BBC is a mini Linux-distribution, small enough to fit on a CD-ROM that has been cut, pressed, or molded to the size and shape of a business card (or membership card - neat idea).
More info on this interesting project here: http://www.lnx-bbc.org//ja
It seems to me that the cable companies will only be able to monitor the volume of information exchange from my machine.
Want to stop me from sending music files? Movies?Whatever?
I'll crypt the thing and they won't know what it is and won't be able to stop it.
They have to understand they won't be able to have as much control as they did before. Computers programmers will be able to write programs that go around any restriction... that's what a computer do : anything programmers want to !
Computers are an amazingly powerfull tool in people's hand, and they let people do what they want.
The solution for controllers is to go straight to the hardware, which MS/Palladium & co understood...Hopefully to late.
From www.gnu.org...a take on "addicted to love" by Robert Palmer. --------------------
As you sing this, it may help the effect to imagine a dozen women, all of whom resemble Bill Joy, dressed in black and dancing sinuously.
Addicted To vi (with apologies to Robert Palmer)
You press the keys with no effect, Your mode is not correct. The screen blurs, your fingers shake; You forgot to press escape. Can't insert, can't delete, Cursor keys won't repeat. You try to quit, but can't leave, An extra "bang" is all you need.
You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"-- Oh yeah? You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die You know you're gonna have to face it; You're addicted to vi!
You edit files one at a time; That doesn't seem too out of line? You don't think of keys to bind-- A meta key would blow your mind. H, J, K, L? You're not annoyed? Expressions must be a Joy! Just press "f", or is it "t"? Maybe "n", or just "g"?
Oh--You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"-- Oh yeah? You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die You know you're gonna have to face it; You're addicted to vi!
Might as well face it, You're addicted to vi!
You press the keys without effect, Your life is now a wreck. What a waste! Such a shame! And all you have is vi to blame.
Oh--You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"-- Oh yeah? You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die You know you're gonna have to face it; You're addicted to vi!
Might as well face it, You're addicted to vi!
Copyright 1989, by Chuck Musciano. All Rights Reserved
Or you can simply use Debian GNU/Linux and contribute by helping them documenting/testing/coding. There is non-commercial distribution of Linux that avoid this financial problem. Debian is one - and a great one too.
Slashdot Mirror
I don't think a coffee maker connected to outlook ads any value whatsoever! As a PM you should reject that idea all together and give a better example of time spent working produces something actually usefull.
> its not designed for desktop use at all.
So? You still can use the cpu under your desk _in addition_ to the ones on the network. I don't see much problems there.
I'm not sure I get the "desktop use" you talk about. You might mean the spariat look of the os and lack of "desktop-apps" (spreadsheet/browsers...) but it's just a matter of time before those show up. If you ask me, the user should be pretty oblivious to where his program's running or saving files.
Also, about the 70s concepts, it's rather known that linux views of network aren't what they could be (again, networking on a thing like plan9's much more powerfull imho). Let's not compare cars to OSs.
> When I switched my main machine from Windows to SuSE/KDE, most things worked in nearly identical ways.
That's because Linux is trying really hard to mimic Windows-isms in order to "gain users shares". Not very inventive, but what's to expect from a 1970s OS anyway?
Take a look at Plan9 ( www.cs.bell-labs.com/plan9dist ), a real innovative OS that did not catch on. Its take on networking and window managers is WAY above average and really inventive. Then you might think that there's a different way, a better way, at doing things.
For a new OS to pick up though, you need intellectual curiosity from users, and courage from managers...the fact that there's not much change in the OS space is not a good sign.
Also, Rob Pike's "Systems Software Research is Irrelevant" talk seems appropriate for this topic.
The article's not refering to the sonic boom (usually happens above the ocean anyway), but to the actual engine noise.
The concorde had the loudest engine around, and I think it was a problem for most airport noise regulation.
Anything else shows you're immature and trying to be "different" when really you're just another idiot. Stand out of the crowd by what you do, not what you look like. Anything else is just juvenile.
You are being so intolerant, moralistic, and narrow-minded.
Why would you assume you understand the reasons why people get tatoos or piercing? I am appalled at the number of people who feel free to judge others freedom towards their own bodies.
Hi,
I don't care *that* much what cpu is inside my mac, but I do care about the actual OS (solid, useable) and THE LOOK OF THE MACHINE.
I, for one, hope Apple will not just become a software vendor only because they design the most beautiful machines today. Design matters.
(writing from an imac g5).
People need to get the joke that it's George Bush writing: i.e. he will mispell Syria.
It seems strange to hear that Rob Pike, a real original thinker who basically re-invented unix with plan9 (at least the network/gui side), is now doing "fine tuning" at google. I hope they have him work on some secret project where he will be able to put his imagination at work because 'fine tuning' doesn't sound so exciting...
Some IDE do this for javadoc for example (I know Eclipse does), but I see your point.
good code = little commentst ml is a great model of how to write comments
http://www.lysator.liu.se/c/pikestyle.h
I'd suggest reading code from old unix sources, or plan9, or any program written by good programmers and you'll see that you have something when comments are almost gone.
If you want to go somewhere, goto is the best way to get there. K Thompson
> Why am I not staying in CS? No jobs, no money,
> no interest.
> It used to be that this was a field where you
> could really innovate and have fun with it;
> anymore, I don't see that.
If you want to innovate, you probably need to do something you like, that's true.
Having said that, there is a lot of innovation to do in CS, and everywhere actually.
Also, discovering anything in Math is probably the hardest things around, good luck with that.
"Each time someone dies, it is Jules Verne's fault.
He is responsible for the desire for interplanetary voyages, good only for boyscouts or for amateur underwater fishermen. If the faboulous sums wasted on these conquests were spent on biological research, nobody on our planet would die anymore. Therefore I repeat, each time someone dies, it is Jules Verne's fault."
Salvador Dali
given that they really have no way to prove who checked what record, i don't think they should refuse entry to the students whose record has been visited.
most likely, all cheater visited their own record, but not all record visited belong to cheaters...
harvard choose to take the risk of refusing entry to someone who did nothing wrong but had his record checked by a friend...
(1) almost everybody said they thought saddam hussein had wmd.
(2) the bush adminstration said they knew saddam hussein had wmd.
case (1) calls for more information, case (2) for war.
a slight difference in language and a huge difference in response.
welcome to the (horrifying) consequences of spin, media wars, politics, and oil business (read cheney's energy doc and you'll understand why the usa is in irak).
-justine
and rob's better window manager: www.cs.bell-labs.com/who/rob/lec5.pdf
From plan9 (unix done better) developer and Pike's buddy Dave Presotto a.k.a. "a strange man who needs no introduction" (also avail at the plan9 faq and comp.os.plan9).
...).
...
...) they all eventually got jammed in. We wanted something simpler to work with.
Subject: What Unix Problems Were Too Deep to Fix?
This is best described by Dave Presotto's 9fans post (from 7 May 2003):
Before Plan 9, we were running lots of Unices held together by a few networks, a remote file system (different uid's on each Unix), and a bunch of remote execution commands. We hated it since it was much harder to manage and use than our old single mutiuser machine. We wanted an environment that not only put together a lot of boxes and made them look like one but which also would make use of the new technologies that were appearing (SMP's, heterogeneous architectures, juke boxes,
The thought was that the new environment wouldn't change from Unix except where we thought it would make our goal easier to build. The kernel had to go. The single monitor view of the Unix kernel was a real pain for making good use of the SMP's. Therefore, we started that from scratch. That didn't mean that the kenrel interface had to change though. That was a separate topic. Lots of others have rewritten the kernel from the ground up while maintaining something that looked more like a Unix.
Ken and Rob thought up the idea of building everything around a single file system protocol. They also added the idea of a subjective namespace to try to unify all the binding ideas of Unix. This name space is the one thing underlying Plan 9. We could have done the same thing to a Unix kernel (with an infinite amount of sweating) but the result would have been the same from the user standpoint, i.e., a system that looks very different. The ease which with it can be done can be witnessed by the number of failed/stalled attempts to add the Plan 9 namespace to Linux
Also, we were tired of the general kitchen sink nature of Unix, especially of System V. If there were 3 projects or groups to do a single thing (like character processing, shared memory, networking,
Lastly, we had all developed an extreme allergy to code filled with #if, #ifdef, #else, #elseif. Getting rid of that cruft by sticking differences into separate files/routines required a hell of a lot of rewriting.
So the result was a different kernel, with a different design philosophy, a similar but different interface, but mostly the same old commands.
If you think that Unix was just a single track in comparison, you're sadly mistaken. We just made more of a bend than others did.
We are guilty of rewriting commands just for the sake of doing it. The reason there was sometimes legitimate, to match our different kernel interfaces or whatever. However, it was just as often so we wouldn't have to worry about Unix licenses.
===
This pretty much sums it up.
justine.
This EvilWM reminds me of 2 window managers that simplicity-oriented people might enjoy:
- 9wm
- w9wm (9wm with workspaces.)
Those are suppose to emulate the Plan 9 window manager 8-1/2. It's mouse oriented.
I used it for a while. It's light on the system. The code is probably above average since it was written by a bell-labs researcher.
Here's the link to the source if anyone's interested:
(9wm)
http://packages.qa.debian.org
(w9wm - multiple desktops)
http://openbsd.rutgers.edu/
-ja
Theory:
Human Right Declaration
Practice:
Animal Farm/G.Orwell
G. Orwell...you know, the author of 1984...
Maybe we all should read those two books again.
ja
There's a typo on their membership benefit and it's rather embarassing....their bootable member card does not contain a BCC linux but a BBC linux!!!!
/ja
The LNX-BBC is a mini Linux-distribution, small enough to fit on a CD-ROM that has been cut, pressed, or molded to the size and shape of a business card (or membership card - neat idea).
More info on this interesting project here:
http://www.lnx-bbc.org/
If you are going to say something like this, at least get it right, it's
JA
Want to stop me from sending music files? Movies?Whatever?
They have to understand they won't be able to have as much control as they did before. Computers programmers will be able to write programs that go around any restriction
Computers are an amazingly powerfull tool in people's hand, and they let people do what they want.
The solution for controllers is to go straight to the hardware, which MS/Palladium & co understood...Hopefully to late.
From www.gnu.org...a take on "addicted to love" by
Robert Palmer.
--------------------
As you sing this, it may help the effect to imagine a dozen women, all of
whom resemble Bill Joy, dressed in black and dancing sinuously.
Addicted To vi
(with apologies to Robert Palmer)
You press the keys with no effect,
Your mode is not correct.
The screen blurs, your fingers shake;
You forgot to press escape.
Can't insert, can't delete,
Cursor keys won't repeat.
You try to quit, but can't leave,
An extra "bang" is all you need.
You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"--
Oh yeah?
You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die
You know you're gonna have to face it;
You're addicted to vi!
You edit files one at a time;
That doesn't seem too out of line?
You don't think of keys to bind--
A meta key would blow your mind.
H, J, K, L? You're not annoyed?
Expressions must be a Joy!
Just press "f", or is it "t"?
Maybe "n", or just "g"?
Oh--You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"--
Oh yeah?
You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die
You know you're gonna have to face it;
You're addicted to vi!
Might as well face it,
You're addicted to vi!
You press the keys without effect,
Your life is now a wreck.
What a waste! Such a shame!
And all you have is vi to blame.
Oh--You think it's neat to type an "a" or an "i"--
Oh yeah?
You won't look at emacs, no you'd just rather die
You know you're gonna have to face it;
You're addicted to vi!
Might as well face it,
You're addicted to vi!
Copyright 1989, by Chuck Musciano. All Rights Reserved
Or you can simply use Debian GNU/Linux and contribute by helping them documenting/testing/coding.
There is non-commercial distribution of Linux that avoid this financial problem. Debian is one - and a great one too.
J.