Its not really that you are out to cache memory for DMA. But if the processor does anything with data in that same memory, and caching is not explicitly turned off for that range, then data in those mem locations will float up and down the processor cache hierachy(sp).
For example, if you create a bunch of triangles or textures in memory, you could then could pass them to the card, but the memory used has been cached by virtue of being used by the processor. In the other direction, you read some block from a HD, which uses DMA, and then a program processes it, like play an mp3 or whatever. In this case YOU WANT the mp3 data to be cacheable for sure or else the processing might take forever. A full round trip might be that you read from HD though DMA, then process, then send sound to sound card through DMA and send other stuff to 3d card though DMA too. If you are a real bastard you might be able to read form HD and send to sound card without processing, using DMA both ways.
As for AGP being the only thing that takes disparate physical memory chunks and makes them whole for hardware, I dont think this is true. For starters this was a classic problem for any DMA type controller for virtual memory systems.
The problem is that a program would allocate and/or read/write to/from what looked like a contiguous virtual memory block for it. But real physical memory which backed the virtual memory would more than likely be very fragmented. So how do you do DMA at all if you have a 2/4K page size and you want a 64K bloack read or written?
Sir, do you really believe that the "loyal" linux advocates who participate in this great forum would not have contributed to the hardship of this or any other sympathetic comercial venture buy simply not buying the products, with or with-out an economic downturn.
You, sir, are a blind, unaware, over-emotional ass.
Sir, do you really not believe that the "loyal" linux advocates who participate in this great forum would not have contributed to the hardship of this or any other sympathetic comercial venture buy simply not buying the products, with or with-out an economic downturn.
You, sir, are a blind, unaware, over-emotional ass.
I like Linus and the GNU, GPL, FSF, and the IETF.
I dont want to all this nice stuff degrade into a pile of protectionistic crap. You guys sound jst like Sun, Oracle, Microsoft, you name it, youselves.
got to love how all the mindless Linux advocate reteric get bunped and the constructive criticism gets nothing marked as troll.
Like anyone who has an idea for improving anything or trying to point out potential community weaknesses has GOT to be a troll.
"You are a Heritic and an unsightly evil troll. No one need hear your thoughts." You sound like communist china bastards. They know that most people have thier threshold set to 2 or more. So they get you down to one and dont care. Is the point of moderators really supress views. I dont think so.
If Slashdot is to be a corner stone of the linux community. And the direction of linux is driven the linux community. And if all you can stand to hear are complaints about appearent opposition (reality not withstanding), and self praise. We then run the risk of be coming anemic, selfcentered, isolationist community that eventually crumbles under the weight of its own hurbis. How many tale have been written abou the downfall of great communities, organizations, armies and governments that acted like that.
"Perhaps the fact that people with actual SKILL are getting work done using mySQL rather than MSSQL is pissing you off a little? If so, GET OVER IT!"
- Anonymous Coward on 04:22 PM July 2nd, 2001 CST (#252)
is he saying that the guy who runs Dell's customer database and pos system on Tandem (now compaq) Himilaya servers is just a puss because cant figure out My-fucking-SQL.
I like Linus and the GNU, GPL, FSF, and the IETF.
I dont want to all this nice stuff degrade into a pile of protectionistic crap. You guys sound jst like Sun, Oracle, Microsoft, you name it, youselves.
got to love how all the mindless Linux advocate reteric get bunped and the constructive criticism gets nothing marked as troll.
Like anyone who has an idea for improving anything or trying to point out potential community weaknesses has GOT to be a troll.
"You are a Heritic and an unsightly evil troll. No one need hear your thoughts." You sound like communist china bastards. They know that most people have thier threshold set to 2 or more. So they get you down to one and dont care. Is the point of moderators really supress views. I dont think so.
If Slashdot is to be a corner stone of the linux community. And the direction of linux is driven the linux community. And if all you can stand to hear are complaints about appearent opposition (reality not withstanding), and self praise. We then run the risk of be coming anemic, selfcentered, isolationist community that eventually crumbles under the weight of its own hurbis. How many tale have been written abou the downfall of great communities, organizations, armies and governments that acted like that.
and you people are attacking / defending products STILL, even in this thead. We are just saying that the quote was irresponsible and written to be misleading, why dont you talk about that.
if the web site was all there was to the world of software, then your argument would be king. But its not.
Do you want your bank or our government running on MySQL? Do you use a bank? Why use a bank? Do you like it?
Imagine missle defense systems, corporate accounting, stock market exchanges, the census, payroll systems, medical labs, hospitals, refineries, home builders, personel staffing, retail, distribution and a gazillion other things of which im sure you can think of more, that support your king of the world view. And do you think that it is JUST an issue of skill with MySQL.
You dont know what the fuck you are talking about.
Being a peer is a state of mind and how you chose to view others. Its wonderful that so many have dedicated so much of their free time to this whole thing. I think i the whole paradigm is a great idea. But what do the poepl who write Linux software do for money, and how many of those jobs to make money are centered around corporate software.
And, toward you argument, if free (beer) software wins then how do you suppose we all eat.
I think open source should have liscences that protect the already opensource part of the software, to the degree that the original developer intended. Which is free in a completely different sense than your voluteer only view.
But if you dont give some more latitude for the original developer to say how he wants something to be open, you create two irreconsilable worlds.
The reality is that comercial software is needed, and sometimes people need to spend 24/7 on something, and earn a living from it. On the other hand voluteer is needed sometimes because there are some things that the comercial software industry could never justify doing.
What happens in 10 years from now when there are two huge code bases of irreconsilable software. This issue is being able to use them to gether. Not if its free (beer) or not, which is noble as well.
Thank god for the LGPL right now, or ther would be no Serious Sam and things like it. Surely you have to like what they did, even though its commercial. The only people you aer hurting are the little guys, the big guys have the money either to steal it and not care because of leagal budgets, or the money to recreate whatever was done on the regular GPL.
But requarless of that the main point wa the the quote was irisponsible at some level and it has to be obvious.
MySQL has a different purpose than SMSQLServer and is for a different market, but to say that he couldnt possibley defend his argument, well.... you sound like a nut too.
Who thinks for an enterprise standpoint the MySQL is even close to the same class as Oracle, SQLServer, or hell even Sybase or DB2 for that matter.
I MySQL is great for what it does do, but jeez. I believe that it is too easy to interpret the MySQL is technically superior view of the quote as that, even if that was not what was intended. And the poster's main point that the quote was irresponsible FUD stands. Even of all you choose to do is tear up the poster on high school level debate tactics.
sorry, you sound like a nut too. oh wait I said that already.
Slashdot Mirror
Its not really that you are out to cache memory for DMA. But if the processor does anything with data in that same memory, and caching is not explicitly turned off for that range, then data in those mem locations will float up and down the processor cache hierachy(sp).
For example, if you create a bunch of triangles or textures in memory, you could then could pass them to the card, but the memory used has been cached by virtue of being used by the processor. In the other direction, you read some block from a HD, which uses DMA, and then a program processes it, like play an mp3 or whatever. In this case YOU WANT the mp3 data to be cacheable for sure or else the processing might take forever. A full round trip might be that you read from HD though DMA, then process, then send sound to sound card through DMA and send other stuff to 3d card though DMA too. If you are a real bastard you might be able to read form HD and send to sound card without processing, using DMA both ways.
As for AGP being the only thing that takes disparate physical memory chunks and makes them whole for hardware, I dont think this is true. For starters this was a classic problem for any DMA type controller for virtual memory systems.
The problem is that a program would allocate and/or read/write to/from what looked like a contiguous virtual memory block for it. But real physical memory which backed the virtual memory would more than likely be very fragmented. So how do you do DMA at all if you have a 2/4K page size and you want a 64K bloack read or written?
How is this a troll?
I feel the same way. Most of the apps written in Java that I have used can be very slow. Especially alot of the IDEs.
JCreator for instance is written in C and is very fast. That Sun IDE thing is very slow to me.
Mark this down!
Its offtopic!
mod this up please, informative :-)
mod this down :-)
mod this down please :-)
hahahhahaha
that should really piss everyone off.
you are a Troll for laughing.
how dare you laugh, damn troll!
Mod this up. :-)
Funny.
Is my 20 seconds up, or do i have to keep typing like this...
:-)
Damn those double negatives!
Should read:
Sir, do you really believe that the "loyal" linux advocates who participate in this great forum would not have contributed to the hardship of this or any other sympathetic comercial venture buy simply not buying the products, with or with-out an economic downturn.
You, sir, are a blind, unaware, over-emotional ass.
Sir, do you really not believe that the "loyal" linux advocates who participate in this great forum would not have contributed to the hardship of this or any other sympathetic comercial venture buy simply not buying the products, with or with-out an economic downturn.
You, sir, are a blind, unaware, over-emotional ass.
This one I like. But, what are the prices? where can you get them?
Is this what people are talking about when they say "kharma whore"?
Ignorant asses! Dont mod this down. This is a popular saying at SJG and IO, the ISP spawned form SJG.
Fnord.
mod this up!!!
/. party line
it follows the
btw,
I like Linus and the GNU, GPL, FSF, and the IETF.
I dont want to all this nice stuff degrade into a pile of protectionistic crap. You guys sound jst like Sun, Oracle, Microsoft, you name it, youselves.
STOP IT
got to love how all the mindless Linux advocate reteric get bunped and the constructive criticism gets nothing marked as troll.
Like anyone who has an idea for improving anything or trying to point out potential community weaknesses has GOT to be a troll.
"You are a Heritic and an unsightly evil troll. No one need hear your thoughts." You sound like communist china bastards. They know that most people have thier threshold set to 2 or more. So they get you down to one and dont care. Is the point of moderators really supress views. I dont think so.
If Slashdot is to be a corner stone of the linux community. And the direction of linux is driven the linux community. And if all you can stand to hear are complaints about appearent opposition (reality not withstanding), and self praise. We then run the risk of be coming anemic, selfcentered, isolationist community that eventually crumbles under the weight of its own hurbis. How many tale have been written abou the downfall of great communities, organizations, armies and governments that acted like that.
oh, i forgot elitist, snobs
"Perhaps the fact that people with actual SKILL are getting work done using mySQL rather than MSSQL is pissing you off a little? If so, GET OVER IT!"
- Anonymous Coward on 04:22 PM July 2nd, 2001 CST (#252)
is he saying that the guy who runs Dell's customer database and pos system on Tandem (now compaq) Himilaya servers is just a puss because cant figure out My-fucking-SQL.
I like Linus and the GNU, GPL, FSF, and the IETF.
I dont want to all this nice stuff degrade into a pile of protectionistic crap. You guys sound jst like Sun, Oracle, Microsoft, you name it, youselves.
FUCKING WAKE UP
got to love how all the mindless Linux advocate reteric get bunped and the constructive criticism gets nothing marked as troll.
Like anyone who has an idea for improving anything or trying to point out potential community weaknesses has GOT to be a troll.
"You are a Heritic and an unsightly evil troll. No one need hear your thoughts." You sound like communist china bastards. They know that most people have thier threshold set to 2 or more. So they get you down to one and dont care. Is the point of moderators really supress views. I dont think so.
If Slashdot is to be a corner stone of the linux community. And the direction of linux is driven the linux community. And if all you can stand to hear are complaints about appearent opposition (reality not withstanding), and self praise. We then run the risk of be coming anemic, selfcentered, isolationist community that eventually crumbles under the weight of its own hurbis. How many tale have been written abou the downfall of great communities, organizations, armies and governments that acted like that.
that was my email address
and you people are attacking / defending products STILL, even in this thead. We are just saying that the quote was irresponsible and written to be misleading, why dont you talk about that.
You sound like defensive insecure weenies.
pnatural: chriskog@io.com
if the web site was all there was to the world of software, then your argument would be king. But its not.
Do you want your bank or our government running on MySQL? Do you use a bank? Why use a bank? Do you like it?
Imagine missle defense systems, corporate accounting, stock market exchanges, the census, payroll systems, medical labs, hospitals, refineries, home builders, personel staffing, retail, distribution and a gazillion other things of which im sure you can think of more, that support your king of the world view. And do you think that it is JUST an issue of skill with MySQL.
You dont know what the fuck you are talking about.
Being a peer is a state of mind and how you chose to view others. Its wonderful that so many have dedicated so much of their free time to this whole thing. I think i the whole paradigm is a great idea. But what do the poepl who write Linux software do for money, and how many of those jobs to make money are centered around corporate software.
And, toward you argument, if free (beer) software wins then how do you suppose we all eat.
I think open source should have liscences that protect the already opensource part of the software, to the degree that the original developer intended. Which is free in a completely different sense than your voluteer only view.
But if you dont give some more latitude for the original developer to say how he wants something to be open, you create two irreconsilable worlds.
The reality is that comercial software is needed, and sometimes people need to spend 24/7 on something, and earn a living from it. On the other hand voluteer is needed sometimes because there are some things that the comercial software industry could never justify doing.
What happens in 10 years from now when there are two huge code bases of irreconsilable software. This issue is being able to use them to gether. Not if its free (beer) or not, which is noble as well.
Thank god for the LGPL right now, or ther would be no Serious Sam and things like it. Surely you have to like what they did, even though its commercial. The only people you aer hurting are the little guys, the big guys have the money either to steal it and not care because of leagal budgets, or the money to recreate whatever was done on the regular GPL.
But requarless of that the main point wa the the quote was irisponsible at some level and it has to be obvious.
I take back my praise for you guys chilling out.
MySQL has a different purpose than SMSQLServer and is for a different market, but to say that he couldnt possibley defend his argument, well.... you sound like a nut too.
Who thinks for an enterprise standpoint the MySQL is even close to the same class as Oracle, SQLServer, or hell even Sybase or DB2 for that matter.
I MySQL is great for what it does do, but jeez. I believe that it is too easy to interpret the MySQL is technically superior view of the quote as that, even if that was not what was intended. And the poster's main point that the quote was irresponsible FUD stands. Even of all you choose to do is tear up the poster on high school level debate tactics.
sorry, you sound like a nut too. oh wait I said that already.