That's why the police should use enough force to inflict physical damage on the enemy even if they can't reel them in. Massive use of riot control agents and plastic bullets would be a good start.
Take the fight to the enemy.
If the police kill more people this will become an even bigger mess. I think the police realize this as they are avoiding anything too heavy handed.
By 'riot control agents' do you mean chemical warfare agents? They can't use them because they can kill.
You don't have to be a moron to disrespect authority that mistreats you. The police routinely stop and search kids, they routinely stop cars and they routinely threaten anyone who dares question them. They also killed two totally innocent people recently and it looked like this was the third.
The police pushed too far so certain people pushed back. Remember the first two things that were destroyed? A police car, and another police car.
You assume they are intelligent and planned this out.
They are just taking advantage of the immediate lack of law enforcement and acting on anger at the police and the system as a whole. And while they are at it they want some free stuff.
It is about class. It's about a class of people who were sick with the police abusing them.
The police have abused their anti-terror powers beyond all reason and they have killed two innocent people in recent history not counting the recent shooting which is still unknown.
Just some people who have had their pockets turned out by the police twice a week for as long as they can remember. Just some people who have been threatened with violence from the police whenever they dared answer back. The same people who saw the police kill two innocent people and totally get away with it in recent history.
These people have been trained by the police to hate the police. They saw the latest police shotting as an execution and it made them angry as hell. Once the first two police cars were burnt out the rest realised the police were powerless so they went on a looting spree.
who are these people? I mean, white? black? muslim?
It's not race, it's social class. They are all the people who are old enough to have been seriously pissed off by the police, the system, and each other, and young enough to not realise that breaking everything within reach doesn't really help.
So mostly 16 to 21 and from the kind of areas where the police victimise innocent people and threaten the victims of crime.
I know, I lived a short walk away from where the police started all this.
I'm serious. But feel free to outsource if you don't want to run it yourself. There is nothing wrong with doing what you are good at and giving the other things to someone else to manage.
There is always a balance between tagging ham as spam and letting spam though. Anyone sensible accepts that it's better to let some spam though than risk losing a genuine mail.
I really don't think there is any truth in what you say.
Lot of people manage this stuff so we know it's possible. I've been doing it for many years. I'll bet your setup could be easily fixed. It sounds like you are applying the CPU expensive checks like spamassassin before the cheap checks like DNSBLs and greylisting.
If you really can't handle it outsource it. There are lots of people who will manage mail for you for very little money.
You have to have a good idea what you are doing to set it up but after that it looks after itself until the next rebuild 2 years later.
However if you don't want to set it up or don't know how all the parts work or how they work together it's better to pay someone who does or outsource the whole thing. There is nothing wrong with any company concentrating on what makes it money and outsourcing the rest.
The only thing that sounds interesting that I don't have, is spam/ham folders... something worth investigating.
If you wrote the rest of that page that should be easy enough to add. Put in a learn/spam and learn/ham in your imap store and a script to feed the mail to sa-learn ( or equivilent. )
It seems to work for me but I find some users dump spam in ham and some won't use it at all.
Stinks to have to deal with people who are too cheap to use software that follows published standards. Glad I don't have to, and just drop all packets from netblocks of all the top spamming countries like China, Russia, etc.
Few global businesses can ignore such a large number of potential customers.
It would be nice if they could set their mailers up right though. Sadly you have to work with what you are given in a lot of cases.
Really? Try working with clients who work with Chinese companies. Having that stack basically obliterates the ability to receive any mail from China in Chinese. I had months of arguing over emails that did not arrive, because the other server was not setup to do a retry(as postgrey asks for a 5 min "cooldown")
Seen it, and yes misconfigured mailers are a pain. Their mailer is broken if it won't retry and it really should not be allowed on the internet. However in practise that mail is making my company money so I NEED it. Postgrey whitelists work assuming you can actually predict what IP they are connecting from. I actually use p0f with postgrey so only connections from windows machines get greylisted, that way I get something like 90% of the benefit of greylisting with only about 30% of the pain. ( Not an anti-windows rant, that setup just happens to work well. )
What you don't seem to grok is that you seem to know what you're doing. The guy who asked the question is certainly not going to know how to use all those things.
Just because/you/ know a good way to do something with a bunch of complicated tools doesn't mean that most other people do.
Agreed. If the poster doesn't know about the various parts involved and doesn't want to spend significant time learning them then outsourcing the lot is a better alternative.
If you want to run your own mail server you will have a problem, you will need a reverse ip resolution for your domain. Without this, your outgoing mail will be marked as spam, many big companies do so, for example Google. Without this your mail will go directly to spam folder. Good luck with your ISP.
Quite right, forward and reverse DNS should match and a static IP is a must. However setting reverse DNS should not be a problem on any business connection, a dedicated, or a virtual machine. Even some domestic ISPs let you set your reverse DNS.
As a guy who ran email servers for a small organization, let me say enjoy it while you can, because email admin is a never-ending pain in the butt. The spam management, the 24x7x365 server monitoring for security issues, the blacklisting and DNS issues, and that people get really bitchy when their email service is disturbed in any way.
I also manage such things. I don't know why you say it's a never-ending pain because that's just not my experience. I use BIND, Postfix+Postgrey, DNSBLs, Spamassassin, ClamAV, SPF, Cyrus, Roundcube, and Nagios monitoring everything. Every now and then I get someone panicking because he hasn't got mail for 4 hours, and every now and then I have to investigate where a specific mail went wrong. Every 2 years or so I rebuild the systems on a newer distro and in the mean time I apply updates as needed. I have learn/spam and learn/ham folders that all users can dump spam and ham in and spamassassin is trained from those. It is work to look after these things but I would not call it a never ending pain in the butt. Most of the time it just works.
I totally agree about people getting bitchy when their email is disrupted in any way. I did have to go to work on xmas day once to reboot a crashed mail server. Guess it serves me right for using an old dell server for a critical service.
Yeah, it's all their fault. Any excuse for an American not to use common sense, right?
The ratings agencies should have pointed out that lending money to people who can't pay it back is stupid. Also the bankers should not have unconditionally trusted the ratings agencies.
Because if you have a degree in economics you would then realize that comparing debt size is not adaquite since some countries have a higher GDP than others. Rather a GDP to assets ratio is used. In that ratio the US is fine compared to...
Japan
Been in recession for decades.
Greece
Needed 2 bail outs from Europe and going though a massive austerity program that has caused civil unrest.
Ireland
Economy collapsed, needed a bail out.
Spain
Property market collapsed. Economy in real trouble. May need a bail out shortly.
Italy
In real trouble and may need a bail out too. Also marred by corruption.
A credit rating has NOTHING to do with how much you borrow, it has to do with how well you pay your debts. And the US has always payed its debts. It really is not that complex. Borrow lots and pay the interest every single time and you people want to lend you more. Borrow a little and don't pay the interest and people won't want to lend to you anymore.
Isn't this covered in economics 101?
The US has always payed its debts but that doesn't mean it always will. If you borrow more and more soon you can't pay back the capital, eventually you can't even pay back the interest.
People, companies, governments should borrow as little as possible. It's irresponsible to sell the future for the present.
There are plenty of good people on WP, just ask for help if someone is being a bully.
By which time I've already lost the time I spent contributing and my goodwill. At that point I'm not going to sink more time into wikipedia by looking for someone to help fight back against the injustice, I'm going to give up on the whole thing and find something more useful to do.
The only changes I'm willing to make now are ones that take less than a couple of minutes. That's spelling and minor rephrasing and even then I seriously consider not bothering as even minor self-evident changes can lead to hysterical protests and all kinds of bizarre accusations.
Slashdot Mirror
I don't break the law so I am all for it being used on everyone who does. Why aren't you?
Because it's a myth that the innocent have nothing to fear.
That's why the police should use enough force to inflict physical damage on the enemy even if they can't reel them in. Massive use of riot control agents and plastic bullets would be a good start.
Take the fight to the enemy.
If the police kill more people this will become an even bigger mess. I think the police realize this as they are avoiding anything too heavy handed.
By 'riot control agents' do you mean chemical warfare agents? They can't use them because they can kill.
So, LA: lots of rioting, stores got looted. London: lots of rioting, stores got looted. Remind me again what gun control has to do with this?
If the UK police didn't get to play with guns 2 of the last 3 people they killed would not be dead. The riots would never had happened.
Or maybe the police are beating some of these people to death and covering up for each other.
Morons basically.
You don't have to be a moron to disrespect authority that mistreats you. The police routinely stop and search kids, they routinely stop cars and they routinely threaten anyone who dares question them. They also killed two totally innocent people recently and it looked like this was the third.
The police pushed too far so certain people pushed back. Remember the first two things that were destroyed? A police car, and another police car.
You assume they are intelligent and planned this out.
They are just taking advantage of the immediate lack of law enforcement and acting on anger at the police and the system as a whole. And while they are at it they want some free stuff.
It is about class. It's about a class of people who were sick with the police abusing them.
The police have abused their anti-terror powers beyond all reason and they have killed two innocent people in recent history not counting the recent shooting which is still unknown.
Just some people who have had their pockets turned out by the police twice a week for as long as they can remember. Just some people who have been threatened with violence from the police whenever they dared answer back. The same people who saw the police kill two innocent people and totally get away with it in recent history.
These people have been trained by the police to hate the police. They saw the latest police shotting as an execution and it made them angry as hell. Once the first two police cars were burnt out the rest realised the police were powerless so they went on a looting spree.
who are these people? I mean, white? black? muslim?
It's not race, it's social class. They are all the people who are old enough to have been seriously pissed off by the police, the system, and each other, and young enough to not realise that breaking everything within reach doesn't really help.
So mostly 16 to 21 and from the kind of areas where the police victimise innocent people and threaten the victims of crime.
I know, I lived a short walk away from where the police started all this.
Not sure if serious.
I'm serious. But feel free to outsource if you don't want to run it yourself. There is nothing wrong with doing what you are good at and giving the other things to someone else to manage.
There is always a balance between tagging ham as spam and letting spam though. Anyone sensible accepts that it's better to let some spam though than risk losing a genuine mail.
I really don't think there is any truth in what you say.
Lot of people manage this stuff so we know it's possible. I've been doing it for many years. I'll bet your setup could be easily fixed. It sounds like you are applying the CPU expensive checks like spamassassin before the cheap checks like DNSBLs and greylisting.
If you really can't handle it outsource it. There are lots of people who will manage mail for you for very little money.
You have to have a good idea what you are doing to set it up but after that it looks after itself until the next rebuild 2 years later.
However if you don't want to set it up or don't know how all the parts work or how they work together it's better to pay someone who does or outsource the whole thing. There is nothing wrong with any company concentrating on what makes it money and outsourcing the rest.
The only thing that sounds interesting that I don't have, is spam/ham folders ... something worth investigating.
If you wrote the rest of that page that should be easy enough to add. Put in a learn/spam and learn/ham in your imap store and a script to feed the mail to sa-learn ( or equivilent. )
It seems to work for me but I find some users dump spam in ham and some won't use it at all.
Stinks to have to deal with people who are too cheap to use software that follows published standards. Glad I don't have to, and just drop all packets from netblocks of all the top spamming countries like China, Russia, etc.
Few global businesses can ignore such a large number of potential customers.
It would be nice if they could set their mailers up right though. Sadly you have to work with what you are given in a lot of cases.
Really? Try working with clients who work with Chinese companies. Having that stack basically obliterates the ability to receive any mail from China in Chinese. I had months of arguing over emails that did not arrive, because the other server was not setup to do a retry(as postgrey asks for a 5 min "cooldown")
Seen it, and yes misconfigured mailers are a pain. Their mailer is broken if it won't retry and it really should not be allowed on the internet. However in practise that mail is making my company money so I NEED it. Postgrey whitelists work assuming you can actually predict what IP they are connecting from. I actually use p0f with postgrey so only connections from windows machines get greylisted, that way I get something like 90% of the benefit of greylisting with only about 30% of the pain. ( Not an anti-windows rant, that setup just happens to work well. )
What you don't seem to grok is that you seem to know what you're doing. The guy who asked the question is certainly not going to know how to use all those things.
Just because /you/ know a good way to do something with a bunch of complicated tools doesn't mean that most other people do.
Agreed. If the poster doesn't know about the various parts involved and doesn't want to spend significant time learning them then outsourcing the lot is a better alternative.
If you want to run your own mail server you will have a problem, you will need a reverse ip resolution for your domain. Without this, your outgoing mail will be marked as spam, many big companies do so, for example Google. Without this your mail will go directly to spam folder.
Good luck with your ISP.
Quite right, forward and reverse DNS should match and a static IP is a must. However setting reverse DNS should not be a problem on any business connection, a dedicated, or a virtual machine. Even some domestic ISPs let you set your reverse DNS.
As a guy who ran email servers for a small organization, let me say enjoy it while you can, because email admin is a never-ending pain in the butt. The spam management, the 24x7x365 server monitoring for security issues, the blacklisting and DNS issues, and that people get really bitchy when their email service is disturbed in any way.
I also manage such things. I don't know why you say it's a never-ending pain because that's just not my experience. I use BIND, Postfix+Postgrey, DNSBLs, Spamassassin, ClamAV, SPF, Cyrus, Roundcube, and Nagios monitoring everything. Every now and then I get someone panicking because he hasn't got mail for 4 hours, and every now and then I have to investigate where a specific mail went wrong. Every 2 years or so I rebuild the systems on a newer distro and in the mean time I apply updates as needed. I have learn/spam and learn/ham folders that all users can dump spam and ham in and spamassassin is trained from those. It is work to look after these things but I would not call it a never ending pain in the butt. Most of the time it just works.
I totally agree about people getting bitchy when their email is disrupted in any way. I did have to go to work on xmas day once to reboot a crashed mail server. Guess it serves me right for using an old dell server for a critical service.
Do you realize that Obama...
Blaming people isn't going to help the situation, the debt problem is systemic and not the result of any single person or any party.
All political parties and the greater part of the population have been ignoring the building debt crisis for far too long.
Yeah, it's all their fault. Any excuse for an American not to use common sense, right?
The ratings agencies should have pointed out that lending money to people who can't pay it back is stupid. Also the bankers should not have unconditionally trusted the ratings agencies.
Because if you have a degree in economics you would then realize that comparing debt size is not adaquite since some countries have a higher GDP than others. Rather a GDP to assets ratio is used. In that ratio the US is fine compared to...
Japan
Been in recession for decades.
Greece
Needed 2 bail outs from Europe and going though a massive austerity program that has caused civil unrest.
Ireland
Economy collapsed, needed a bail out.
Spain
Property market collapsed. Economy in real trouble. May need a bail out shortly.
Italy
In real trouble and may need a bail out too. Also marred by corruption.
A credit rating has NOTHING to do with how much you borrow, it has to do with how well you pay your debts. And the US has always payed its debts. It really is not that complex. Borrow lots and pay the interest every single time and you people want to lend you more. Borrow a little and don't pay the interest and people won't want to lend to you anymore.
Isn't this covered in economics 101?
The US has always payed its debts but that doesn't mean it always will. If you borrow more and more soon you can't pay back the capital, eventually you can't even pay back the interest.
People, companies, governments should borrow as little as possible. It's irresponsible to sell the future for the present.
Party politics aside the US government is borrowing too much money.
It has little chance of ever paying the national debt back without truly drastic measures.
There are plenty of good people on WP, just ask for help if someone is being a bully.
By which time I've already lost the time I spent contributing and my goodwill. At that point I'm not going to sink more time into wikipedia by looking for someone to help fight back against the injustice, I'm going to give up on the whole thing and find something more useful to do.
The only changes I'm willing to make now are ones that take less than a couple of minutes. That's spelling and minor rephrasing and even then I seriously consider not bothering as even minor self-evident changes can lead to hysterical protests and all kinds of bizarre accusations.